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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%

  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%
  • Total voters
    738
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I'd rather vote the last option, but nobody else wants it, and there probably won't be much practical differences between them as we are unlikely to produce enough cyclonic torpedos in time.

[X] Use Exterminatus on any world that is to tough to take and strategically important due to resources, infrastructure or population, estimated 8-20. -Governor Olaf, Governor-General Aelfric, Governor Garp, Lord-Marshal Sigard and Fabricator-General Scott are supporting this proposal.

[X] Propose the Trust creates a centralised agency under the command of the Security Council dedicated to training defence engineers and work crews whose purpose is to rapidly build fortifications on new worlds and assist in the fortification of already held ones. This academy is to draw expertise from all worlds and relevant organisations of the Trust.

Durin said:
the issue with this is that chaos taint is on the soul more then the body, so what you would be doing is attempting to amputate bits of the soul with a rather inpricise instimente, best case result would be something close to a bad lobotomy, usual result would be coma, death would not be to unlikely
in other words messing around with souls is an incredibly difficult, incredibly dangerous art that you have no way of doing safely without relevant paragon trait (such as Saint)
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Well, they have nothing to lose, if they'll volunteer than trying this is a good idea. If we do something wrong, we still get valuable experience and can improve.
Soul surgery is very important. Down that road lay very good perspectives, up to new Emperors/Human Phoenix Lords.
 
True Metal Power said:
Well, they have nothing to lose, if they'll volunteer than trying this is a good idea. If we do something wrong, we still get valuable experience and can improve.
Soul surgery is very important. Down that road lay very good perspectives, up to new Emperors/Human Phoenix Lords.
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it also leads to more psykers falling to Chaos as a result of the despair of having to repeatably attempt to removing a cancer on the souls using a blowtorch. one thing that you would learn is a lot of ways to create fates worse then death
 
Many thanks for the information^^, yeah we have a long rote to the knowledge of the soul. Well one day we leave the 'stone age' and get 'to iron age' at last.
 
Reynal said:
My read on that is more that as far as psychic shit goes while we're finally out of the 'hit with rock' level of the tech tree, we've only advanced to 'make wheel' things. Which is certainly an improvement, but fixing chaos corruption in a living soul is more 'cure cancer'-level shit.
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Hopefully the Siren trade may help us along on the psychic development tree by saving us a lot of trouble learning things from scratch.
 
Artemis1992 said:
We are talking about cultists here.
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Aye, I just wanted to contribute something worthwhile.

Durin said:
The only one you have access to, any God could help if it was wanted to
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1. Presumably the Emperor would be best as a result of being the Anathema?

Durin said:
having a Sirens feeding being interrupted
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2. What happens when that happens?

Durin said:
it also leads to more psykers falling to Chaos as a result of the despair of having to repeatably attempt to removing a cancer on the souls using a blowtorch. one thing that you would learn is a lot of ways to create fates worse then death
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3. Why would psykers despair at that? I mean yeah they're doing harm to the soul but said soul is tainted by Chaos, so the benefits of the armour of contempt would apply, justifying the harm done with the fact that it's hurting Chaos. Or is it a more direct psychic side-effect instead of emotional?
4. Is this something we or the Inquisition can use to reliably torture cultists and daemons with? (Torturing daemons to the point of despair/insanity has canonically been done before by Malleus, including to daemonettes.)
 
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Andres110 said:
3. Why would psykers despair at that? I mean yeah they're doing harm to the soul but said soul is tainted by Chaos, so the benefits of the armour of contempt would apply, justifying the harm done with the fact that it's hurting Chaos. Or is it a more direct psychic side-effect instead of emotional?
4. Is this something we or the Inquisition can use to reliably torture cultists and daemons with? (Torturing daemons to the point of despair/insanity has canonically been done before by Malleus, including to daemonettes.)
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Think Durin mentioned that needlessly damaging someones soul was something everyone else is against. Since we have no idea how long it would take and our knowledge with psychic stuff is the equivelent of discovering the wheel. At least with the Sirens we know we would be getting result and the humans wouldn't be tortured for experiements that could take an untold time to work.
 
Andres110 said:
2. What happens when that happens?
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Psycic density.

The person looses a good chunk of their soul what's left becomes psycily dense.

And no we can't exploit that it lobotomises them the Siren's hate it when that happens and the Trust thinks that's even worse than just feeding them the soul wholesale.

Andres110 said:
3. Why would psykers despair at that? I mean yeah they're doing harm to the soul but said soul is tainted by Chaos, so the benefits of the armour of contempt would apply, justifying the harm done with the fact that it's hurting Chaos. Or is it a more direct psychic side-effect instead of emotional?
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Or maybe they're getting depressed at repeatedly torturing people's souls directly and not getting any where.

People do do that and these are souls they are directly operating on much more personal then the Sirens. Even if they are chaos cultists this isn't going to have great consequences mentally.

Add in chaos resonance and its a nurgle tea party.
 
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Red Bovine said:
And why would they do that? It's needlessly cruel and has been confirmed to not accomplish anything.
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To investigate the many different ways you can make it less cruel or more cruel, depending on the situation and intended goals. More effective top-tier torture techniques would be useful for the Inquisition (note: torture works in 40k) and they may find a way to weaponise it. We might end up with the psychic equivalent of phosphex.
 
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Andres110 said:
To investigate the many different ways you can make it less cruel or more cruel, depending on the situation and intended goals. More effective top-tier torture techniques would be useful for the Inquisition (note: torture works in 40k) and they may find a way to weaponise it.
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Like the dark eldar before them regardless we're at the hit stuff with rock stage lets save the advanced surgery until we're sure we're poking around in a soul and not a liver.

As for torture works in 40K... practicalities mate.

More likely that torture can only be done on cultists, its not like you should be talking to them.
 
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Andres110 said:
To investigate the many different ways you can make it less cruel or more cruel, depending on the situation and intended goals. More effective top-tier torture techniques would be useful for the Inquisition (note: torture works in 40k) and they may find a way to weaponise it. We might end up with the psychic equivalent of phosphex.
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...You know how many people were seriously against the whole feeding cultists to Sirens and likely the only reason people voted for it was solely due to the fact that there were many benefits to be gained while it being an actually more merciful thing than suffering a fate worse than death? Well it's outright stated that fucking with someone soul like that is in fact a fate worse than death.

Which is pretty damn fucked up on a lot of levels and seriously inhumane just to find more horrible ways to torture someone than what was previously possible. That is just an absolutely disgusting idea and this is coming from someone who voted to do the siren trade.
 
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Red Bovine said:
Well it's outright stated that fucking with someone soul like that is in fact a fate worse than death.
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So we'll just limit the weapon's use to cultists, daemons, orks, and dark eldar.

Red Bovine said:
Which is pretty damn fucked up on a lot of levels and seriously inhumane just to find more horrible ways to torture someone than what was previously possible.
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Eh. They're cultists/daemons. They deserve it.
 
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Andres110 said:
Eh. They're cultists/daemons. They deserve it.
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some of them yeah, some of them just happened to be in the wrong place and the wrong time and caught a lethal dose of spiritual corruption. Hence why we are ok with consigning them to oblivion, but not torturing them pointlessly.

It's also worth mentioning, this kind of rip apart a soul to see what happens isn't really useful, and doing that sort of thing a lot is bad for the mental stability of the psykers involved. We don't have the tools to build the tools to build the tools to detect the spectrum that we would have to monitor to get much out of this sort of destructive spiritual analysis.

as for the idea of getting better torture methods, the Inquisition has that covered. they can already break any mortal unfortunate enough to be captured alive, and trying to interrogate demons is a terrible idea.
 
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Andres110 said:
Aye, I just wanted to contribute something worthwhile.


1. Presumably the Emperor would be best as a result of being the Anathema?


2. What happens when that happens?


3. Why would psykers despair at that? I mean yeah they're doing harm to the soul but said soul is tainted by Chaos, so the benefits of the armour of contempt would apply, justifying the harm done with the fact that it's hurting Chaos. Or is it a more direct psychic side-effect instead of emotional?
4. Is this something we or the Inquisition can use to reliably torture cultists and daemons with? (Torturing daemons to the point of despair/insanity has canonically been done before by Malleus, including to daemonettes.)
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1. yes, though any god heavily opposed to Chaos would do
2. see Adeptus Astra Telepathica research and add permanent pychic pain and brain damge
3. a mix of the two, to work on someones soul at this level you have to emphasize with them somewhat, if you want to gain any information out fo it anyway
4. it may work, though torturing deamons is really unreliable as any information they give is untrustworthy and the only other use they have is the sort of thing that gets you executed for good reason,
Andres110 said:
Hopefully the Inquisition in all its Inquisitionness is less squeamish than others.
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yes but they want a purpose other then if we do this a lot we may learn something, and learning how to safely remove Warp taint is not on the cards, even if you had a level of pychic knowledge equal to the Eldar it would require a paragon trait to succeed.

you could not weaponsize it in combat, it would be far easier and more effective to just use Warpfire
and creating a technological version would require Eldar elvel psy-tech so is not on the cards

in other words this would be a cruel and time consuming project with no real benefit other then possibly learning something and getting better at torturing deamons, which is not exactly something that can be done often especially as summoning deamons has an automatic death sentence in the Imperial Trust that there are no exceptions to. and getting one would be a harder diplomatic hit then the recent trade if it is even possible
 
I like how Andre's responsce reminds me of my teacher from vietnam in middle school.

'Why did you kill people?' asked a autistic child in oir class innocently.

'Why not? They deserved it.' said the teacher straight face before retracting it to 'Um...Re-read the chapter. Lets start over. You there start with the prologue.'

Ohhh my. War is hell indeed peeps. An apparently so is 40k.
 
How exactly does a Siren eating a humans soul look like?

Do they just control your mind with fancy aura glowings before the subject loses more and more cognitive ability?
 
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