Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

So I've been considering something especially seeing things like Lash Enhancements, things that many of the enemies you are going to be facing going forward can also pull, one way or another.

Mechanically the system is creaking at the joints trying to model things that are Methuselah and up, beings that would in a WoD game be 'run away screaming' territory. The thing is we do have a system for things like this and that is Exalted itself. In some ways I've been using pieces of it already, for instance needing a set number of successes to get past a DC. What do you guys think of moving more in that direction as we hit Essence 4? It would mean that the Karin Murphys and the Waldo Butters of the world would no longer have a place in combat, when mortals do show up they would either be in large numbers or with heavy weapons

On the other hand that also allow me a lot more freedom in building characters that are your peers without just massively inflating numbers and needing an excuse to do so. In WoD to make something with 10+ HL for instance you pretty much have to make it massive, but the more more flowing system of Exalted 3rd edition means that HL is replaced with initiative, you have to were down someone's luck, their stamina and their speed to get a killing blow in. It still looks and feels cinematic, but I do not have to make it so the enemies can eat the damage or give them a lot of perfect defenses which carries its own narrative costs. Perfect defenses are meant to be rare and costly

What do you guys think?

I am not planning to change anything starting next update or anything, this would be large conversion, but just in general I wanted to have that out there so you guys can share your thoughts on the idea and if it should be implemented.
For my part I'm concerned about this leading into a power level treadmill that involves a bunch of things crawling out of the woodwork with way more power than makes sense for the setting.

I'm also not sure how it would apply to us. Are we going to be buying abilities built around the assumptions of one system, translating it to another one, then fighting characters native to it?
 
One of the big conceits of EXvsWoD as a setting that I have not considered until recently is what it means that the players are not the only exalts. Like yes there are all sorts of narrative implications, but talking strictly mechanically for the moment, in the only game I saw online that made it to E3 most of the enemies were already other exalts, we are starting to hit a limitation of the system, namely that things built in WoD are no that scary for exalts without bending over backwards.

For my part I'm concerned about this leading into a power level treadmill that involves a bunch of things crawling out of the woodwork with way more power than makes sense for the setting.

I'm also not sure how it would apply to us. Are we going to be buying abilities built around the assumptions of one system, translating it to another one, then fighting characters native to it?

It's not so much a treadmill as the natural as the natural consequence of disturbing the big scary things in the setting. We know there exist things out there that could snuff out canon Harry in the blink of an eye. Well time to go poke them in the eye

Everything would have to be ported over such as it still fulfilled the same general role, though I am sure a few things will have to be refunded as XP and changed. It is not perfect, but it's something we should consider at least.
 
If I understand correctly the assumption of about all the WOD splats is that combat is super dangerous. Which is the reason that HL levels are so relatively low and hard to get more of and 1s minus. It encourages the players avoid combat when possible even when they think that they are likely stronger. It's a big reason for the maskerade. Everyone carefully plotting and only commiting violence when in a position of absolute advantage.

Exalted isn't like that.
 
Bluntly I build a custom monster with 35 wounds and 15 dice of Soak, three distinct special attacks one was a rain of darts which was blocked, the second was the mist that was resisted and the third was the blood getting on its enemies. It landed none of them and died in two rounds without a vote. For something that took me the better part of an hour to make that is a bit of a problem.

I'm no stranger to bosses going down like chumps, I run pathfinder/D&D, save or die is a thing, but the means I have within the confines of the system to make sure if does not happen too often are quite limiting so I'm considering how to get past them.
 
One of the big conceits of EXvsWoD as a setting that I have not considered until recently is what it means that the players are not the only exalts. Like yes there are all sorts of narrative implications, but talking strictly mechanically for the moment, in the only game I saw online that made it to E3 most of the enemies were already other exalts, we are starting to hit a limitation of the system, namely that things built in WoD are no that scary for exalts without bending over backwards.



It's not so much a treadmill as the natural as the natural consequence of disturbing the big scary things in the setting. We know there exist things out there that could snuff out canon Harry in the blink of an eye. Well time to go poke them in the eye

Everything would have to be ported over such as it still fulfilled the same general role, though I am sure a few things will have to be refunded as XP and changed. It is not perfect, but it's something we should consider at least.
That's fair. It is something that needs addressed, those were just my initial thoughts on it.

Even if we did have more exalts around, or do in the future, I think support for letting the appropriate non-exalted setting elements stay relevant is probably a good thing.
 
Anyway this is all relatively long term, don't let it worry you too much. I will figure out how to make this 'sausage' of a quest so that you guys can have fun and engage with the story. There's a lot more I'd like to explore about this world and these characters and I can only hope you guys feel the same while we work out the kinks.
 
@uju32, any chance you can swap in one of the custom clone charms instead of SGI?

[X] uju32
No disrespect meant to anyone's work.

I understand exactly how much effort is involved in some of these things.
But Im hesitant about the system mastery of other people to do homebrew when there's no pressing need I can see.
Especially since I dont understand whats supposed to be wrong with the current one.

It would be one thing if we didnt already have IDU, or werent willing to buy IDU.
But we already have it.
The rest is just talk to the QM, submit a thematic template for your fomor, and go from there.

I dont like the narrative message of Molly making akuma of herself either; akuma sell themselves for power, while fomor have power bestowed upon them, wittingly or not.
But thats a relatively minor niggle.
Ok, here's my reasoning:
1) I agree that countermagic should be bought. Everyone should have countermagic against human magic, because that's the msot common foe (and I think denarians would also be mostly human magic). Eventually everyone gets all the types, but for now - human + 1 other. Molly takes vampire countermagic against Reds. Lydia gets spirit countermagic because she deals with the ghosts. Tiffany also gets spirit because denarians might count as such, and because she might be helping Dresden. Might switch that to fae. Olivia gets fae because dealing with minor fae is likely what she's going to be doing offscreen to help the community.
2) Molly gets Sinner Boiling Stare. That's because Sandstrike Blast is obsoleted by Principle-Invoking Onslaught, and that charm is too damn useful not to buy later.
3) Molly also gets Alchemy 5. This is in line with my logic that we should balance new capabilities and increased survivability. Alchemy 5 is the capabilities part. It also synergies with getting everyone upgrades. Because at 5 dots you can grant permanent supernatural boosts.
4) Molly also gets Shadow Spite Curse. This is an extension of counterspelling (a solaroid boost to it), a strong defensive charm, and a way to negate Nemesis (because it was ruled that this will highlight all of Nemesis everywhere at the time). It's also the charm I want for the signature. I consider it better than the clone charm effect, even with additional rulings.
5) Lyida gets Ghost-Warding Glyph, which allows her to protect properties from restless dead (they need to pass a willpower roll against difficulty 7 and roll 5 or more successes (at Lydia's E4) to enter). She also boosts her familiar to 2 points, which doesn't actually have much of an effect due to Speaker to Crow and Hound, but is necessary to later boost it further. I may easily be persuaded to get something else instead.
6) Last gets Lore of Light 2, here I agree with Uju
7) Olivia gets a psychoportation boost, which improves her mobility, especially in an urban environment
1) I totally agree about counterspelling and how everyone should have it.
Especially with Peabody and his sponsors on our radar; there's a significant number of mindcontrolled wizards to worry about when we go to root him out. We should probably ensure that everyone has human countermagic before March.

I will spend 3xp extra on allowing Molly to also counterspell Vampire Magic, which would give the three girls all four types of counterspelling for when Dresden is not around.

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2) Principle Invoking Onslaught is a great charm we should buy. But Molly is Firearms 0.

Sandstrike Blast currently rolls Dex 4 + Athletics 2 at DC5, and has an AoE mode that allows you to spend 1m to blow up an area of 20 yards radius at E4, dealing 10L to everyone inside(Agg with Transcendent Anathema). Principle Invoking Onslaught rolls Dex 4 + Firearms 0 at DC6, and doesnt come close in damage until you break out the Davy Crocketts.

We get PIO for use when we dont need to aim, and for the armykiller effects of pocket nukes when wielded by a shintai and her backup clones. Its not a viable tool in a close range fight, or indoors.

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3) We bought Alchemy 4 last turn IIRC.
Maybe next turn if we have the free XP after Unbound Eschaton Shintai. But it would probably be a better investment to spend that 12 XP on raising another Path(Fortune? Divination? Enchantment?) to 3-dots than raising Alchemy to 5.

======
4) SGI > Shadow Spite Curse. IMO.

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5) I've long wanted to max out the Familiar.
Because at Familiar 4, her Familiar Midnight gets a Charm, and at Familiar 5 it gets 2x more Charms, for a total of 3x Charms.
But Its had to wait, and I think it still has to wait.

Inhabited homes have thresholds in the Dresdenverse to keep restless ghosts out.
I dont think Glyph to ward homes is a priority. Maybe if it works against other undead, then we prioritize getting it before the next time we need to go to Hell and tag it on people's foreheads.

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7)The lessons of the Wicked City with regards to external penalties and debuffs are something you need to remember.
Counterspelling is Wits + Occult, and Olivia has 8 dice. Great for a mortal, but running with a Solaroid?
I still think she should bank her XP for a turn and then spend next turn when she has 20-something XP to play with.
 
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Right, we are so close to hitting E4, and this which potentially opens up a very useful charm.
UNSURPASSED DEVIL-CRAFT
Cost: —; Mins: Essence 4; Type: Permanent
Keywords: Heretical, Stackable
Duration: Permanent
Prerequisite Charms: Any two of the following:
Demonic Primacy of Essence, Dread Panoply of the Silent Wind, Sun-Heart Furnace Soul, Tool-Transcending Constructs

The Infernals cannot wait for age to ripen their
creative genius—they have worlds to conquer! The
warlock adds one bonus success to all rolls to craft infernal relics and hellforged wonders. Additionally, she reduces by one dot each the minimum craft, Lore, Medicine and Occult requirements to build or repair artifacts, to a minimum requirement of one dot for any Ability normally required for the task. This Charm may be purchased agaiat Essence 5+.

We just got a Workshop, wouldn't it be perfect if we had a charm that could push it even further beyond?
 
So I've been considering something especially seeing things like Lash Enhancements, things that many of the enemies you are going to be facing going forward can also pull, one way or another.

Mechanically the system is creaking at the joints trying to model things that are Methuselah and up, beings that would in a WoD game be 'run away screaming' territory. The thing is we do have a system for things like this and that is Exalted itself. In some ways I've been using pieces of it already, for instance needing a set number of successes to get past a DC. What do you guys think of moving more in that direction as we hit Essence 4? It would mean that the Karin Murphys and the Waldo Butters of the world would no longer have a place in combat, when mortals do show up they would either be in large numbers or with heavy weapons

On the other hand that also allow me a lot more freedom in building characters that are your peers without just massively inflating numbers and needing an excuse to do so. In WoD to make something with 10+ HL for instance you pretty much have to make it massive, but the more more flowing system of Exalted 3rd edition means that HL is replaced with initiative, you have to were down someone's luck, their stamina and their speed to get a killing blow in. It still looks and feels cinematic, but I do not have to make it so the enemies can eat the damage or give them a lot of perfect defenses which carries its own narrative costs. Perfect defenses are meant to be rare and costly

What do you guys think?

I am not planning to change anything starting next update or anything, this would be large conversion, but just in general I wanted to have that out there so you guys can share your thoughts on the idea and if it should be implemented.
In general it makes sense - we are operating on the level where few mortals have any place. I fear that the change will break the setting at low level. We have been fighting stuff like MIkaboshi's superweapon prototypes and such, but the setting also has young white court vampires, and a lot of it is urban fantasy at the core of it. Even as the Wheel of Ages is turning, there's no apocalypse yet. Mortals in some places at least still matter.

But in general, it makes sense - the system has been creaking as we went on, and it shows, and I feel your pain.
I think we should go ahead and bite the bullet for a clone Charm. We just barely avoided getting one on the last XP vote, and there isn't any good reason to put it off further, IMO, even if I'm not a huge fan of the mechanic in general.

We also need a good ranged attack option. Sandstrike Blast is a solid choice for that. It's cheap to activate, lasts for an entire scene, and has single target and AoE modes allowing it to be used in different situations.

The weapon Charm would be great, too, but we would need the Firearms skill to make that worthwhile.
We strongly need a ranged combat charm, yes, but I'm not sure if Sandstrike Blast is a solid choice. Principle Invoking Onslaught is more expensive, yes, but it's also much more versatile. In long term we need both Sinner Boiling Stare and it. Sandstrike Blast is made rather redundant by PIO. I went with SBS this turn, but I can switch to PIO if people think it's better short term.

In regards to the clone charm, as one of those who voted for it - I wanted it badly for AP economy and safety it provided, but at least several people were very strongly against it, and so I decided to table it, to avoid making anyone strongly unhappy.
 
2) Principle Invoking Onslaught is a great charm we should buy. But Molly is Firearms 0.

Sandstrike Blast currently rolls Dex 4 + Athletics 2 at DC5, and has an AoE mode that allows you to spend 1m to blow up an area of 20 yards radius at E4, dealing 10L to everyone inside(Agg with Transcendent Anathema). Principle Invoking Onslaught rolls Dex 4 + Firearms 0 at DC6, and doesnt come close in damage until you break out the Davy Crocketts.

We get PIO for use when we dont need to aim, and for the armykiller effects of pocket nukes when wielded by a shintai and her backup clones. Its not a viable tool in a close range fight, or indoors.
PIO is not limited to firearms:
Created weapons must be complex devices made of
machined parts; all guns qualify, as would a bando-
lier of grenades, a flamethrower, or even a chainsaw; a
sword, pitchfork, or spear would not.
Complex devices made of machined parts. Grenades would be what, athletics or brawl? Chainsaws and such would be melee (not that we'll need them a lot). There are also turrets with auto aiming.
3) We bought Alchemy 4 last turn IIRC.
Maybe next turn if we have the free XP after Unbound Eschaton Shintai. But it would probably be a better investment to spend that 12 XP on raising another Path(Fortune? Divination? Enchantment?) to 3-dots than raising Alchemy to 5.
At 5 dots you can give people scene-long discipline access up to 2 dots. That's a lot, and expands our arsenal by a lot. But I'll think of switching. Maybe take Mana Manipulation instead. Or Prayer Eating.
Inhabited homes have thresholds in the Dresdenverse to keep restless ghosts out.
I dont think Glyph to ward homes is a priority. Maybe if it works against other undead, then we prioritize getting it before the next time we need to go to Hell.
With Rosie about to move out of her parents house, and lots of Order of Cauldron stuff going in the background, I think this might be useful. But I'll think about it. The charm I really want is Quarry Revelation Technique, but we cannot afford it.
7)The lessons of the Wicked City with regards to external penalties and debuffs are something you need to remember.
Counterspelling is Wits + Occult, and Olivia has 8 dice.
I still think she should bank her XP for a turn and then spend next turn when she has 20-something XP to play with.
Olivia also has a lot of DC adjusters, those 8 dice are not a problem.
 
One of the big conceits of EXvsWoD as a setting that I have not considered until recently is what it means that the players are not the only exalts. Like yes there are all sorts of narrative implications, but talking strictly mechanically for the moment, in the only game I saw online that made it to E3 most of the enemies were already other exalts, we are starting to hit a limitation of the system, namely that things built in WoD are no that scary for exalts without bending over backwards.



It's not so much a treadmill as the natural as the natural consequence of disturbing the big scary things in the setting. We know there exist things out there that could snuff out canon Harry in the blink of an eye. Well time to go poke them in the eye

Everything would have to be ported over such as it still fulfilled the same general role, though I am sure a few things will have to be refunded as XP and changed. It is not perfect, but it's something we should consider at least.

Dude just use the scion 2e system. It is designed to run anything from mortals to actual fairly strong gods. It has a lot of enemies and stuff pre built and it is similar enough that it won't be hard to do a conversion.

It has a robust crafting system, it has a lot of fun mythological splats for dragons, wizards and even saints which i think are better than this system.

Genuinely i can send you a few books in the dms if you need to read them.
 
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Especially since I dont understand whats supposed to be wrong with the current one.
At this point the baseline charm you're working off of has been so heavily modified that it barely qualifies as the same. That being the case I don't see why we shouldn't just make something more suited to this game entirely if we're already going that far.
 
[X] Plan Occult Study for Defense
-[X] Molly, 39 XP, 1 XP banked
--[X] Shadow Spite Curse (••), 6 XP
--[X] Ox-Body Technique (•) 3: 3xp
--[X] Counterspell: Vampire, 3 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Human, 3 XP
--[X] Principle Invoking Onslaught (•••), 12 XP
--[X] Ablation of Brass and Fire (••••), 12 XP
-[X] Lydia, 12 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Spirit, 3 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Human, 3 XP
--[X] Occult 3, 6 XP
-[X] Lash, 11 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Spirit, 3 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Human, 3 XP
--[X] Lore of Light 2, 5 XP
-[X] Olivia, 12 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Human, 3 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Fae, 3 XP
--[X] Occult 4, 6 XP


Ok, after some feedback:
1) Switched Sinner Boiling Stare for Principle Invoking Onslaught. It's more versatile, scene-long, and we can have some aimbots helping us when using firearms. It's also not limited to firearms. Grenades are possible. Giving us tons and tons of options.
2) Dropped Alchemy 5 (despite wanting it), taking Ablation of Brass and Fire instead. This makes the charm buy list almost entirely defensive. I don't like it much (I want new things to be able to do, not just new ways to prevent dying, especially given how we rarely have issues with dying in a fight)
3) For Lydia dropped the warding, instead taking Occult 3. Occult is useful in general four our circlemates to have, and it's what's being rolled in the counterspelling
4) Similar with Olivia, dropped psychoporation in favor of Occult 4. More dice is good. And it works narratively, as she witnessed a lot of magic she couldn't have seen before.
 
Dude just use the scion 2e system. It is designed to run anything from mortals to actual fairly strong gods. It has a lot of enemies and stuff pre built and it is similar enough that it won't be hard to do a conversion.

It has a robust crafting system, it has a lot of fun mythological splats for dragons, wizards and even saints which i think are better than this system.

Genuinely i can send you a few books in the dms if you need to read them.

Huh, never looked into that. 3E Exalted does not have infernals yet so it's not like it's that much better at modeling what I need it to. I'll check out Scion. Thanks for the suggestion
 
PIO is not limited to firearms:
Man-portable weapons.

You can make a reasonable argument for machineguns, chainguns and grenades, for missile launchers and recoilless rifles, maybe even mortars. The Davy Crockett is a recoilless rifle weapon, and SADM is a backpack.
Not for turrets. Man-portable turrets are not a thing.

Chainsaws are terrible improvised weapons; DC8 compared to DC 6 for a sword.

Throwing is an Athletics roll at DC6, but with a much shorter range than any other ranged option; Strength*5 yards range is 20 yards at Strength 4, which is shorter than the range of a heavy pistol.
And grenades appear to have a 10 foot/3 yard AoE(not sure if its radius or diameter) in M20.

Sandstrike Blast has a range of 60 yards for its single target mode, and is line of sight for its AoE mode.
Sinner-Boiling Stare is line of sight, but costs Essence per use IIRC.

At 5 dots you can give people scene-long discipline access up to 2 dots. That's a lot, and expands our arsenal by a lot. But I'll think of switching. Maybe take Mana Manipulation instead. Or Prayer Eating.
Not really a priority for the empress of a five billion person magitechnological civilization.
Remember, these are mostly personal stuff, or for people in her war party.
If she needs to supply significant numbers of people, she's going to Sanctuary.

With Rosie about to move out of her parents house, and lots of Order of Cauldron stuff going in the background, I think this might be useful. But I'll think about it. The charm I really want is Quarry Revelation Technique, but we cannot afford it.
This is Craft territory.
Or more likely just temporarily borrowing a set of portable wards from Sanctuary for her aparment until we buy somewhere permanent in Chicago, and raise permanent wards there.

Olivia also has a lot of DC adjusters, those 8 dice are not a problem.
In sustained combat, I think they would.
But not going to argue over it.
 
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What do you guys think?

I am not planning to change anything starting next update or anything, this would be large conversion, but just in general I wanted to have that out there so you guys can share your thoughts on the idea and if it should be implemented.
I'm not sure brewing stuff for WoD won't be easier than moving to 3e.
Exalted 3e seems to be pretty far off from WoD, way, way further than Ex2e.

There seems to be 3 main problems in direct confrontation:

-General durability of enemies
-Damage output of enemies
-Effective chance of attack landing

If there is no system change than the main thing I see that needs to change is how Molly is treated - she is not the PC, she is the Dark Lord, the Big Boss, the Monster against whom almost everyone else struggles. And so should be treated as such in combat. Demons, undead, fey they are not the supernaturals here - they are Hunters. And should act as such.

So if someone doesn't have a plan and suddenly comes upon Molly or she crashes a party? They are fucked. As we have seen repeatedly. Short of Red Kind and others in his weight class most people don't stand a chance.

So I'd say turn most encounters where someone tries to fight Molly into semi-puzzles and fights against Hunter cells - as in every group that is coming to fight Molly and knows what they are doing should have a Tactic ready to get enough dice to stand a chance at touching her. And Molly is the Big Bad Wolf that is trying to find the trap before it closes.

I'd say the confrontation in Las Vegas where opponents were using a multi pronged plan and trying to use RPGs against Molly was the best in this sense. Add some system side mechanical support for similar tricks and it will add some decent decision making to combat - as wasting Crown Question on finding enemy plans may in fact be their plan all along if they have multple backups.

And since opponnets are still supernatural they may incorporate magic and other abilities into their tactics. So you can have something like a precognitive leading a bunch of combatants into positioning Molly to get smashed by a rocket hammer wielded by a roided out minotaur.
 
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In fairness I understand the meta reasoning but isn't part of the very basis of exalted certain groups are just fucked if they fight exalted? Which should be valid going forward in quest right? Like others aren't going to artificially be made stronger right and the amount of people that can be considered worthy foes has decreased in universe right?
 
In fairness I understand the meta reasoning but isn't part of the very basis of exalted certain groups are just fucked if they fight exalted? Which should be valid going forward in quest right? Like others aren't going to artificially be made stronger right and the amount of people that can be considered worthy foes has decreased in universe right?

Yes, hence why random red court fledglings would not get stats, I'd just skip to them being disassembled. The point is to allow me more freedom at a level where it makes sense to roll dice while when you win you just win.
 
-[X] Molly, 39 XP
--[X] Shadow Spite Curse (••), 6 XP
--[X] Ox-Body Technique (•) 3: 3xp
--[X] Counterspell: Vampire, 3 XP
--[X] Counterspell: Human, 3 XP
--[X] Sinner Boiling stare (•••), 12 XP
--[X] Alchemy 5, 12 XP

No clone charm.

Pass.

we are starting to hit a limitation of the system, namely that things built in WoD are no that scary for exalts without bending over backwards.

I mean, I think that's the point?

This isn't supposed to be a system where you have scary things trying to kill you, you are the scary thing trying to kill them.

I see no reasons to change that, no need to give Sauron a death star, thank you very much.

In regards to the clone charm, as one of those who voted for it - I wanted it badly for AP economy and safety it provided, but at least several people were very strongly against it, and so I decided to table it, to avoid making anyone strongly unhappy.

This was in regard to specifically SGI, we are allowed homebrew, so this problem is done with.
 
[X] Magic & Clones
-[X] Molly (42 XP)
--[X] By Rage Recast, Energy Projection (6 XP)
--[X] Increase Alchemy to 5 Dot (3 XP)
--[X] Buy Mana Manipulation to 3 Dots (13 XP)
--[X] Splintered Gale Incarnation (20 XP)
-[X] Lydia (11 XP)
--[X] Arms of Iron (6 XP)
--[X] Excellence of the Tireless Psychopomp, Perception (3 XP)
--[X] Increase Occult to 2 Dots (2 XP)
-[X] Tiffany (11XP)
--[X] Counterspell: Spirit (3 XP)
--[X] Counterspell: Human, (3 XP)
--[X] Lore of Light 2 (5 XP)
-[X] Olivia (10 XP 1 Banked)
--[X] Virtue P'o 5 (7 XP)
--[X] Counterspell: Human (3 XP)

Molly
Actual range option that we can fire multiple times without spending essence. Multi-Magic potions, potions of actual potence that allow permanent changes, Items of supernatural providence. The ability to make all is poison and warp storms and similar large-scale Mana manipulations like that can grant large scale benefits to allies and harsher penalties to enemies.
Lydia
Arms of iron lets Lydia outright block certain kinds of attacks bullets larger explosives and similar with her hands and her brawl skill and makes her punches considerably more powerful. Perception Excellency just allows her to see more and more effectively use her Pierce the Veil charm.
Olivia
More fuel for hell weaving more fuel for Black Wind paired with her difficulty reducers strong counter spell User it's just a large benefit to her.
 
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So I've been considering something especially seeing things like Lash Enhancements, things that many of the enemies you are going to be facing going forward can also pull, one way or another.

Mechanically the system is creaking at the joints trying to model things that are Methuselah and up, beings that would in a WoD game be 'run away screaming' territory. The thing is we do have a system for things like this and that is Exalted itself. In some ways I've been using pieces of it already, for instance needing a set number of successes to get past a DC. What do you guys think of moving more in that direction as we hit Essence 4? It would mean that the Karin Murphys and the Waldo Butters of the world would no longer have a place in combat, when mortals do show up they would either be in large numbers or with heavy weapons

On the other hand that also allow me a lot more freedom in building characters that are your peers without just massively inflating numbers and needing an excuse to do so. In WoD to make something with 10+ HL for instance you pretty much have to make it massive, but the more more flowing system of Exalted 3rd edition means that HL is replaced with initiative, you have to were down someone's luck, their stamina and their speed to get a killing blow in. It still looks and feels cinematic, but I do not have to make it so the enemies can eat the damage or give them a lot of perfect defenses which carries its own narrative costs. Perfect defenses are meant to be rare and costly

What do you guys think?

I am not planning to change anything starting next update or anything, this would be large conversion, but just in general I wanted to have that out there so you guys can share your thoughts on the idea and if it should be implemented.
Id point out that there's a certain narrative conflict thats hard to resolve.

I mean, its worth remembering that while Dresden got them into position and gave them steel weapons, it was Toot-Toot and the Za-Guard that killed Summer Lady Aurora. Similarly, Murphy killed Summer Lady Maeve. Thomas killed a Denarian in hand to hand. A mob of ghosts took down the Corpsetaker. Lacuna almost killed Winter Knight Dresden.

Butcher makes a point of trying to make the little guy, and the "little guy" still present a significant threat here.
Reconciling those two imperatives is gonna be hard.
Bluntly I build a custom monster with 35 wounds and 15 dice of Soak, three distinct special attacks one was a rain of darts which was blocked, the second was the mist that was resisted and the third was the blood getting on its enemies. It landed none of them and died in two rounds without a vote. For something that took me the better part of an hour to make that is a bit of a problem.

I'm no stranger to bosses going down like chumps, I run pathfinder/D&D, save or die is a thing, but the means I have within the confines of the system to make sure if does not happen too often are quite limiting so I'm considering how to get past them.
I'll PM you later
 
Id point out that there's a certain narrative conflict thats hard to resolve.

I mean, its worth remembering that while Dresden got them into position and gave them steel weapons, it was Toot-Toot and the Za-Guard that killed Summer Lady Aurora. Similarly, Murphy killed Summer Lady Maeve. Thomas killed a Denarian in hand to hand. A mob of ghosts took down the Corpsetaker. Lacuna almost killed Winter Knight Dresden.

Butcher makes a point of trying to make the little guy, and the "little guy" still present a significant threat here.
Reconciling those two imperatives is gonna be hard.

I'll PM you later
The big difference between Exalted and other big scary monsters is that all those big scary monsters that the Exalted thing is being supernatural skilled. Molly doesn't win sword fights because she is faster or stronger. It is because she is just that good. Which is a problem for all mortal competition on a meta level.

A big scary werewolf or skinwalker or even fairy queen Harry can win by his super clever plan and the monster making a mistake. (Botch) Molly doesn't make mistakes.
 
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