Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

It's important to remember that Lydia was raised old style, and that this is a political event - Lydia asserting dominance over her domain. We don't want to look like we outshine her. We want to be seen and understood to be a trusty and mighty ally, not a rival, not a boss. This is Lydia's night, and it should be Lydia's night.
 
[X] Plan united front
-[X] Call Lydia, offer to make her a dress and maybe some jewelry for the dance
--[X] If she already has a dress, ask her to send a photo, so you'll be coordinated. She's the hostess of the event, you don't want to outshine her
--[X] If she agrees, call her over, and do an all-nighter, going all out with your charms (excellencies, BSM, WHWH, CCC, ATB for quality control, etc). Have Lydia participate in crafting adding her own excellencies
--[X] If Lydia doesn't have a dress selected, then go with the following: The foundation of the outfit is a classic sleek but flowy and not restrictive sleeveless silk dress dyed a bright emerald green. It is classic in that understated elegance way that never goes out of style. But a dress alone does not an outfit make. Alongside the dress comes jewelry, specifically cascade of small brass and emerald teardrop earrings that dangle from the multiple ear piercings that Molly refuses to hide. Additionally her left arm is adorned by a brass and emerald bracelet. Three bands of brass twist around her wrist with six large perfectly clear dark green emeralds appear almost black save for when they catch the light and flash brilliantly green. Her left hand also bares two thick rings, one on pinky and one on index, with emeralds of similar quality. Her right hand and arm are bare. Without really thinking about it the outfit is designed with deliberate asymmetry so that while it looks gorgeous all the time, it is most complete and balanced when Molly has sword in hand, the lines of the brass and the flashing green emeralds a mundane counterpart to her eldritch blade. Also accompanying the dress is a green silk clutch with brass hardware attached to a thin green silk shoulder strap, because for however much elegance Molly has come to appreciate she is still a practical girl and practical girls carry clutches.
-[X] STUNT: "Lydia, hi! So, I wanted to ask - do you have an outfit prepared? I thought that we should go with something coordinated, to show my support to you as the hostess, and so we would look better together. I planned to make my own outfit and jewelry using my magic, and I would be happy to also do the same for you. Do you have time to come over and help me with crafting, or are you busy preparing the dance? I promise Daniel won't get to see you in your dress before the dance" you say, even as the arcane machinery around you lowers the temperature in the room and condenses blocks of ice to trigger your powers.
 
[X] Yog

Adhoc vote count started by Yzarc on Feb 10, 2023 at 7:01 AM, finished with 48 posts and 12 votes.

  • [X] Plan united front
    -[X] Call Lydia, offer to make her a dress and maybe some jewelry for the dance
    --[X] If she already has a dress, ask her to send a photo, so you'll be coordinated. She's the hostess of the event, you don't want to outshine her
    --[X] If she agrees, call her over, and do an all-nighter, going all out with your charms (excellencies, BSM, WHWH, CCC, ATB for quality control, etc). Have Lydia participate in crafting adding her own excellencies
    --[X] If Lydia doesn't have a dress selected, then go with the following: The foundation of the outfit is a classic sleek but flowy and not restrictive sleeveless silk dress dyed a bright emerald green. It is classic in that understated elegance way that never goes out of style. But a dress alone does not an outfit make. Alongside the dress comes jewelry, specifically cascade of small brass and emerald teardrop earrings that dangle from the multiple ear piercings that Molly refuses to hide. Additionally her left arm is adorned by a brass and emerald bracelet. Three bands of brass twist around her wrist with six large perfectly clear dark green emeralds appear almost black save for when they catch the light and flash brilliantly green. Her left hand also bares two thick rings, one on pinky and one on index, with emeralds of similar quality. Her right hand and arm are bare. Without really thinking about it the outfit is designed with deliberate asymmetry so that while it looks gorgeous all the time, it is most complete and balanced when Molly has sword in hand, the lines of the brass and the flashing green emeralds a mundane counterpart to her eldritch blade. Also accompanying the dress is a green silk clutch with brass hardware attached to a thin green silk shoulder strap, because for however much elegance Molly has come to appreciate she is still a practical girl and practical girls carry clutches.
    -[X] STUNT: "Lydia, hi! So, I wanted to ask - do you have an outfit prepared? I thought that we should go with something coordinated, to show my support to you as the hostess, and so we would look better together. I planned to make my own outfit and jewelry using my magic, and I would be happy to also do the same for you. Do you have time to come over and help me with crafting, or are you busy preparing the dance? I promise Daniel won't get to see you in your dress before the dance" you say, even as the arcane machinery around you lowers the temperature in the room and condenses blocks of ice to trigger your powers.
    [X] There are lots of people from lots of history in attendance. This calls for classics. The foundation of the outfit is a classic sleek but flowy and not restrictive sleeveless silk dress dyed a bright emerald green. It is classic in that understated elegance way that never goes out of style. But a dress alone does not an outfit make. Alongside the dress comes jewelry, specifically cascade of small brass and emerald teardrop earrings that dangle from the multiple ear piercings that Molly refuses to hide. Additionally her left arm is adorned by a brass and emerald bracelet. Three bands of brass twist around her wrist with six large perfectly clear dark green emeralds appear almost black save for when they catch the light and flash brilliantly green. Her left hand also bares two thick rings, one on pinky and one on index, with emeralds of similar quality. Her right hand and arm are bare. Without really thinking about it the outfit is designed with deliberate asymmetry so that while it looks gorgeous all the time, it is most complete and balanced when Molly has sword in hand, the lines of the brass and the flashing green emeralds a mundane counterpart to her eldritch blade. Also accompanying the dress is a green silk clutch with brass hardware attached to a thin green silk shoulder strap, because for however much elegance Molly has come to appreciate she is still a practical girl and practical girls carry clutches.
    [X] Go for the whole dark, magnificent lady look, but add something very cutsy and obvious as well. You're thinking a dark slinky dress, kick ass boots, and perhaps a nice flower decoration in your hair. Have some fun with it if you can, and over the top is a must!
    [X] Dress as a devil ;)
 
Last edited:
Vote closed, off to the spirit ball we go.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Feb 10, 2023 at 7:06 AM, finished with 48 posts and 12 votes.

  • [X] Plan united front
    -[X] Call Lydia, offer to make her a dress and maybe some jewelry for the dance
    --[X] If she already has a dress, ask her to send a photo, so you'll be coordinated. She's the hostess of the event, you don't want to outshine her
    --[X] If she agrees, call her over, and do an all-nighter, going all out with your charms (excellencies, BSM, WHWH, CCC, ATB for quality control, etc). Have Lydia participate in crafting adding her own excellencies
    --[X] If Lydia doesn't have a dress selected, then go with the following: The foundation of the outfit is a classic sleek but flowy and not restrictive sleeveless silk dress dyed a bright emerald green. It is classic in that understated elegance way that never goes out of style. But a dress alone does not an outfit make. Alongside the dress comes jewelry, specifically cascade of small brass and emerald teardrop earrings that dangle from the multiple ear piercings that Molly refuses to hide. Additionally her left arm is adorned by a brass and emerald bracelet. Three bands of brass twist around her wrist with six large perfectly clear dark green emeralds appear almost black save for when they catch the light and flash brilliantly green. Her left hand also bares two thick rings, one on pinky and one on index, with emeralds of similar quality. Her right hand and arm are bare. Without really thinking about it the outfit is designed with deliberate asymmetry so that while it looks gorgeous all the time, it is most complete and balanced when Molly has sword in hand, the lines of the brass and the flashing green emeralds a mundane counterpart to her eldritch blade. Also accompanying the dress is a green silk clutch with brass hardware attached to a thin green silk shoulder strap, because for however much elegance Molly has come to appreciate she is still a practical girl and practical girls carry clutches.
    -[X] STUNT: "Lydia, hi! So, I wanted to ask - do you have an outfit prepared? I thought that we should go with something coordinated, to show my support to you as the hostess, and so we would look better together. I planned to make my own outfit and jewelry using my magic, and I would be happy to also do the same for you. Do you have time to come over and help me with crafting, or are you busy preparing the dance? I promise Daniel won't get to see you in your dress before the dance" you say, even as the arcane machinery around you lowers the temperature in the room and condenses blocks of ice to trigger your powers.
    [X] There are lots of people from lots of history in attendance. This calls for classics. The foundation of the outfit is a classic sleek but flowy and not restrictive sleeveless silk dress dyed a bright emerald green. It is classic in that understated elegance way that never goes out of style. But a dress alone does not an outfit make. Alongside the dress comes jewelry, specifically cascade of small brass and emerald teardrop earrings that dangle from the multiple ear piercings that Molly refuses to hide. Additionally her left arm is adorned by a brass and emerald bracelet. Three bands of brass twist around her wrist with six large perfectly clear dark green emeralds appear almost black save for when they catch the light and flash brilliantly green. Her left hand also bares two thick rings, one on pinky and one on index, with emeralds of similar quality. Her right hand and arm are bare. Without really thinking about it the outfit is designed with deliberate asymmetry so that while it looks gorgeous all the time, it is most complete and balanced when Molly has sword in hand, the lines of the brass and the flashing green emeralds a mundane counterpart to her eldritch blade. Also accompanying the dress is a green silk clutch with brass hardware attached to a thin green silk shoulder strap, because for however much elegance Molly has come to appreciate she is still a practical girl and practical girls carry clutches.
    [X] Go for the whole dark, magnificent lady look, but add something very cutsy and obvious as well. You're thinking a dark slinky dress, kick ass boots, and perhaps a nice flower decoration in your hair. Have some fun with it if you can, and over the top is a must!
    [X] Dress as a devil ;)
 
Let's not go justifying Molly or putting words in her victim's mouth here.
It's worth keeping in mind that as far as Dresden and the white council are concerned forcing mind magic on someone is basically magic powered rape. It's never really said explicitly, but the metaphor is so overt it might as well be.

The context is different because of what was actually being done* but the consequences for Rosie are significant, permanent, and possibly degenerative. Being mentally altered tends to make the person's subconscious futilely fight back, like a wounded animal thrashing around and making an injury worse. Might not be the case here, but it's a legitimate worry that Rosie has to deal with now.

She has every right, and nearly every reason, to throw Molly's good intentions back in her face. She just can't because Molly is the last person in her corner; which I'm sure will be great for her mental health.

We'll probably work something out, because we have to one way or another, but I think it's important to avoid underplaying exactly what Molly did, whatever her reason were for it, and the consequences of her actions for other people.
*compared to other uses of mind magic.
1)The White Council generally consider non-consensual mind magic to be corruptive to the user and the used.

However. Whether or not they consider specific instances to be a violation, or what form of violation, is very much a "it depends".
This is just my speculation, but I have doubts that every wizard who got mindscrewed by Peabody gave consent, or could give consent to mental examination and treatment.

Note that it appears to be entirely legal to use such magic on non-mortals. As long as the Council does not currently have you on probation, that is.

Furthermore, see Dresden when Mab went into his head and removed all memory of fire magic in Small Favor to save him from Summer's hitters; he was terrified of his vulnerability, but he didnt appear to equate it with magical rape. Similarly, when he ordered Bob to forget his time with Kemmler in Dead Beat, he didnt consider that to be a violation of Bob's personhood.

Or when he attempted to make that lawyer forget getting mindscrewed by Madison Raith in Turn Coat; it was very much an act of mercy, and allowed by White Council rules, but it was as nonconsensual as Molly geasing Rosie and Nelson into forswearing drug abuse for their own good.


===
2)That appears to depend on what kind of mental intervention happened.
Dresden's subconscious kept dropping hints to people around him after Mab whammied him that something was off.
Luccio's did not. The Senior Council and the junior Wardens never even noticed they were adjusted.


===
3)With regards to Molly in particular? Not to minimize the severity of what she did, but intentions do matter.

None of this was to Molly's benefit. She gained no personal benefit from acting.
She could very much have turned her back and walked away when persuasion didnt work, and had reason to; Rose slept with her then boyfriend when both of them were under the influence of drugs, and thats where the pregnancy is from.

Most friendships would have ended at the sleeping with boyfriend bit, without getting as far as "Im pregnant now, and still using drugs".

At her first meeting with Dresden, Rosie makes it clear she wants to stop. She may be under no obligation to show gratitutde, but its an entirely valid response for Rosanna Marcella to go "thank you" instead of "fuck you" and genuinely mean it, instead of doing it because Molly's her only independent lifeline.

Its also entirely plausible for her to go "fuck you" and cut Molly out of her life, of course.


===
The themes seemed to be more along the "path to hell and good intentions" theme, a motif that's repeated in the same book with her mother Charity's plotline with regards to Molly.

That said?
Im still an advocate of remembering we have unfinished business with her ex Nelson.
And the other survivor of the Splattercon attack.

Thst doesn't mean they fell, it means that the arhat tried to use a Chi'iu Muh power in the book and it backfired, making them lose the ability to us that discipline. Opening the third eye is a manifestation of that discipline.
I dont agree. But I'll shelve it for the moment.

Thank you for the citation.
Second point still stands; Usum is extrapolating from his experience with other creatures, and knows nothing about naagloshii in particular.


This certainly wont come back as an issue in the future at all.

We should also not outshine the hostess
Wikipedia suggests Bachelors Grove was used as a cemetery since at least 1838, with the last known burial being 1989.
Minimum hundred and fifty years of ghosts spanning two centuries, most of whom would have had radically different ideas of both funeral custom and celebrations.

Do as you will.


@DragonParadox
QUESTION
Does Rosie's mother know who the father of the child is?
Did she just assume its the dead boyfriend?
Doesnt wamt to know the details? Or did she ask and Rosie lied about it?

Because somehow, her behavior doesnt strike me as someone who knows that her daughter is pregnant from sleeping with her best friend's then boyfriend.
 
@DragonParadox
QUESTION
Does Rosie's mother know who the father of the child is?
Did she just assume its the dead boyfriend?
Doesnt wamt to know the details? Or did she ask and Rosie lied about it?

Because somehow, her behavior doesnt strike me as someone who knows that her daughter is pregnant from sleeping with her best friend's then boyfriend.

Molly did not bring up the matter IC, you guys would have to vote for it because it is quite fraught
 
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