Would you Distort or manifest EGO?


  • Total voters
    159
I just realized something exceedingly funny.

The prediction of [Big Bird]'s sapling being completed before [Der Freischütz]'s came true.

Goddamn, it gun man. We will never complete that damn thing, will we? The price required is far too much.
 
[X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong. Empathy and Friendship are the privileges of the strong, you have earned them at the least."
 
To be honest, all this talk about the strong and the survivors sounds like Carmen's speech to me, where she exacerbates the problem instead of trying to fix it. In fact, it's all more of a defence mechanism as a result of trauma than an actual worldview that she believes in and wants to follow. These are not the things that really bother her.

[X] In the end, Nothing There was defeated and Kyoko was a part of it. She saved Mami.
-[X] Do you really need a reason to help her?
-[X] Mami would be hurt if Kyoko left, she was really glad for the chance to restore their relationship.
-[X] The world can be dark, cruel, and unfair, but with enough will, anyone can make it a little better, even if only for a small number of people.
-[X]Light can give Kyoko the strength to fight injustice for the things she wants to make a reality. And you and Mami will be there for Kyoko to support her.
-[X]Maybe you can link Mami and Kyoko's minds so they can talk?

It should cover most of Kyoko's worries and regrets. She deserves no less.

[X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone. Support Mami.

It's also a good option, I think.
 
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Actually heres the plan.
[X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone. Support Mami.

Peer pressure + Things you want to hear = OP White Damage.
Dimple taught us best about it.
 
I take issue with "empathy and friendship are the priveleges of the strong", because it's not actually a true statement - or at least, it shouldn't be.

To be honest, all this talk about the strong and the survivors sounds like Carmen's speech to me, where she exacerbates the problem instead of trying to fix it. In fact, it's all more of a defence mechanism as a result of trauma than an actual worldview that she believes in and wants to follow. These are not the things that really bother her.

[X] In the end, Nothing There was defeated and Kyoko was a part of it. She saved Mami.
-[X] Do you really need a reason to help her?
-[X] Mami would be hurt if Kyoko left, she was really glad for the chance to restore their relationship.
-[X] The world can be dark, cruel, and unfair, but with enough will, anyone can make it a little better, even if only for a small number of people.
-[X]Light can give Kyoko the strength to fight injustice for the things she wants to make a reality. And you and Mami will be there for Kyoko to support her.
-[X]Maybe you can link Mami and Kyoko's minds so they can talk?

It should cover most of Kyoko's worries and regrets. She deserves no less.
I think this is generally correct, but trying to undo the entire way she conceptualizes herself in one conversation is a bit much, like I also said wrt Homura. She's also on the verge of death, there are better times to poke holes in her defense mechanisms.

Big changes like that come with experience and reflection, not just talking.
 
I think this is generally correct, but trying to undo the entire way she conceptualizes herself in one conversation is a bit much, like I also said wrt Homura. She's also on the verge of death, there are better times to poke holes in her defense mechanisms.

Big changes like that come with experience and reflection, not just talking.

She's not really going to die, we're using the Light to help her. Our main task now is to prevent her from becoming a Corruption, and therefore we must try to help her. Otherwise, it can become incredibly difficult, or even impossible. It won't necessarily be one conversation, as we don't know how long her recovery will take, but in my opinion, this is the best opportunity to help her break out of her regrets and guilt. If we think that the manifestation of the EGO can be the key to her recovery, it seems to me that this is the appropriate way.
 
Of course, all evidence indicates that Distortion is a far more likely outcome. That… well, it could be worse. As far as you can tell Distortions are still the same people they were before the transformation, just with certain traits over-expressed. The Ensemble had some way to bind a Distortion to a more human form, and between that and the disguises Angela managed to work out Homura was able to appear as a completely normal human. Even if Kyoko Distorts, you'll be able to do the same for her.

That's good, we already have a way to remove the physical problems with the disguise, all we need now is a way to help with the mental ones.

She is also staring in abject confusion at you, a look which Mami mirrors towards her. If she hadn't already met Angela, she'd likely have assumed the legendary mercenary to be your sibling instead.

Right. This is awkward.

"Angela, mind explaining why the Manager looks like me?"

Yeeeees, yes, this is all I hoped for, let the shenanigans begins!

Would've brought Binah too, but she's not really safe to keep around children."

"She's not really safe to keep around anybody." you grumble as you dig out Kyoko's Soul Gem.

Lies and slander! Binah's perfectly harmless! Just ask the city of Vale! She definitely didn't let the queen of hatred loose on it on a whim because it was amusing in another quest!

Mami squeezes your arm. You pull her closer and widen the connection between you and Kyoko and let her voice filter in.

"Oh. So you died too. Damn it. Mami was really happy to have you around, you know?"

Her voice echoes through your mind, choked and weak. It sounds as though she's been crying while trying to swallow shards of broken glass.

"Neither of us are dead. You are pretty badly hurt, though. Should be healed in a bit, so just hold on until then."

"Healed? Why are you wasting time with that? I died. Something stronger than me showed up, and nobody's got any right to complain about it. That's just how it goes."

So she was cognizant enough to see us through Nothing there's eyes, interesting.

Her mindset is pretty bad though, we are going to have to work on it if we don't want her to become self-destructive.

You will simply play the part of guide before Carmen can.

Interesting little thing to note here: The important part is not to have Kyouko get EGO instead of distorting, that's an end state, but not a method, the most important thing is to have Kyouko in a good mental state, one she can live with and thrive with, reaching it is not going to be easy, but we should strive for that anyway.

Carmen's problem is that she is too centered on letting people *be themselves* at any costs, we can reach balance and allows for a better solution.

Also, I've started up a second Quest to run at the same time as this one.

*See distortion quest in the title*

I am going to run very fast to read it right after I finish voting for this quest! This is a dream come true! You can't imagine how giddy I am right now!

[X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong."

Not bad, but maybe not enough, we may add a little thing or two?

(Also, I'm interested in how QM will parse it, cuz I'm not actually sure what precisely Kali even meant by it, lol)

Clearly we should ask Myo about it, she's clearly an expert on this! :V

[X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong. Empathy and Friendship are the privileges of the strong, you have earned them at the least."

Better, still seeing what the thread had for ideas, may vote for this in absence of iterations, we'll see.

Goddamn, it gun man. We will never complete that damn thing, will we? The price required is far too much.

*Point at a sign saying "I told them so"*

[X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone. Support Mami.

Pretty good! No complaints on this one, will probably vote for it!

Even Partial E.G.O would be good enough for me personally.

As I said earlier in this post, my goal is not about EGO or distortions, it's about Kyouko's mental health, if she come out of it as a distortion that is mentally healthy, that's a win, if she comes out as an EGOist that is bonkers, that's a loss, the states of EGO and Distortion are not the important bit, and they are not necessarily a good indication of the truly important part, what with Carmen contaminating the Distortion part of the sample with her bullshit.

Well, time to vote:

[X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone. Support Mami.

Now excuse me, I have a distortion quest to read!

*Go away while Bouncing like a little girl*
 
[X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
-[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
-[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.
 
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[X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
-[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
-[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.

Edit: This is soo much better! Thank you @Nottheunmaker for making this vote.
 
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I don't remember if I've mentioned this here, but I despise voters giving up responsibility and agency by passing off a decision to a character controled by the QM. So I'm not a fan of putting this on Mami.

The QM said it was more the spirit of the vote then any line, so that what I'm going to convey is intent.

[X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
-[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
-[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.


I don't feel a need to give her a text dump on Distortion and EGO and Light and yadda yadda, but I do feel like she should get some basics.

I also don't feel a need to contradict her world view, the situation speaks for itself.
 
[X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
-[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
-[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.
 
The votes I all agree with. And at this rate any of them could be the correct decision.

I will just keep faith with the vote I have already choosen.
 
I don't remember if I've mentioned this here, but I despise voters giving up responsibility and agency by passing off a decision to a character controled by the QM. So I'm not a fan of putting this on Mami.

There is such a thing as delegation, nobody can do everything alone and knowing when to ask someone better placed than you to do something is a good thing, protagonist syndrome is a mental disorder for all intent and purpose (a variant of narcissism I'd say), wanting to do everything ourself because *we don't like giving up responsibility, even when it makes sense and is probably the best solution* is not really an attitude I like.

A good leader know that they can ask their subordinates for help, an incompetent one try to do everything themselves.
 
[X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
-[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
-[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.
 
Here is the current votes sorted by Block:
Adhoc vote count started by catgc on Dec 30, 2022 at 1:14 PM, finished with 39 posts and 20 votes.

  • [X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone. Support Mami.
    [X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong. Empathy and Friendship are the privileges of the strong, you have earned them at the least."
    [X] She knows that her dying wouldn't be that simple, not for anyone that cares about her, and she isn't dead anyway.
    -[X] If nothing else, Mami still wants to be her friend, and she care about her happiness. Don't throw away a perfectly good second chance.
    -[X] It's important she knows that after this, things won't be the same. She probably won't have a Soul Gem, and thus no need to hunt witches. But she'll still have power.
    [X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong."
    [X] Let Mami take the lead on this. She knows Kyoko best out of anyone.
    [X] In the end, Nothing There was defeated and Kyoko was a part of it. She saved Mami.
    -[X] Do you really need a reason to help her?
    -[X] Mami would be hurt if Kyoko left, she was really glad for the chance to restore their relationship.
    -[X] The world can be dark, cruel, and unfair, but with enough will, anyone can make it a little better, even if only for a small number of people.
    -[X]Light can give Kyoko the strength to fight injustice for the things she wants to make a reality. And you and Mami will be there for Kyoko to support her.
    -[X]Maybe you can link Mami and Kyoko's minds so they can talk?
 
[X] In the end, Nothing There was defeated and Kyoko was a part of it. She saved Mami.
-[X] Do you really need a reason to help her?
-[X] Mami would be hurt if Kyoko left, she was really glad for the chance to restore their relationship.
-[X] The world can be dark, cruel, and unfair, but with enough will, anyone can make it a little better, even if only for a small number of people.
-[X]Light can give Kyoko the strength to fight injustice for the things she wants to make a reality. And you and Mami will be there for Kyoko to support her.
-[X]Maybe you can link Mami and Kyoko's minds so they can talk?
 
[X] "It's not the strong who survive; it's those who survive that are strong. Empathy and Friendship are the privileges of the strong, you have earned them at the least."

Can't say I'm particularly fond of the second half of this vote, but tactical voting and all. Still would rather say this than leave it completely up to Mami.
 
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