[X] Intervene… -[X] Support both
--[X] Tell both of them to leave it. They can continue tomorrow.
Its for the best that they just don't argue tonight. The last thing I think anyone wants is to have to explain what the hell an abnormality or magical girl (well the specifics of this universes Mahou Shoujo to be more precise) is to Madokas parents if they wake up. Besides they are both correct, so its not like this argument is truly nessicary.
Huh... I don't think X is the kind to "save by killing"... On the other hand the fight with nothing there is seeming more inevitable, if the magical girls can't be saved then at least kill them so they don't suffer... I really wanted to get NT as a daughter
I've been thinking, if Madoka's reason to contract is to be able to help, what if we tell her that contracting will NOT help (without necessarily telling her about witches). Like, something along the lines of:
"You are right about you being knees deep in all this abno business, however Homu is also correct in that you can't just jump into the opportunity to 'help'. What do I mean by this? Well, abnormalities are creatures that should be treated carefully, one mistake could cost the lives of dozens, if not more. If you want to help then you should keep a cold head, and try to inspect all your options to the best of your ability, trusting a really good deal from an abno without knowing the fine print could spell your doom or that of others for example... If you desire... I could teach you how I used to deal with these creatures. It's more of a support role I'll admit, but it's something you could do."
Okay, this gave me an idea for a scientific experiment.
What if...we...give the Sapling away to someone else? Homura in this case, since she'll have an easy time fulfilling the requirements.
Homura has the employee card. And the Abnos are rather docile in sapling form. At worst, Homura will do the requirements and nothing will happen, save maybe an E.G.O Gift. At best, she'll get access to E.G.O like the thread wanted for some time. It's not like she has to wear it at all times, too, so we'd be able to test it in a controlled environment. Well, this is assuming Big Bird likes her enough.
I realize this is kind of cheesy in terms of narrative, but it makes some sense IC, and the QM can always put a lid on this in-story. Also I still very much want to hear Big Bird talk, he got done dirty in that update.
[X] Intervene… -[X] Support both [X] After you're done with the Kanames, ask Homura to hold on to the sapling
Edit: lol I forgot we tried that already with Mami
[X] Intervene…
-[X] Support both
Okay, this gave me an idea for a scientific experiment.
What if...we...give the Sapling away to someone else? Homura in this case, since she'll have an easy time fulfilling the requirements.
Homura has the employee card. And the Abnos are rather docile in sapling form. At worst, Homura will do the requirements and nothing will happen, save maybe an E.G.O Gift. At best, she'll get access to E.G.O like the thread wanted for some time. It's not like she has to wear it at all times, too, so we'd be able to test it in a controlled environment. Well, this is assuming Big Bird likes her enough.
I realize this is kind of cheesy in terms of narrative, but it makes some sense IC, and the QM can always put a lid on this in-story. Also I still very much want to hear Big Bird talk, he got done dirty in that update.
[X] Intervene…
-[X] Support both
[X] After you're done with the Kanames, ask Homura to hold on to the sapling
Not sure how we'd tell her the reqs since we don't know about them IC, and how we'd prepare against the possibility of Big Bird waking up again, but otherwise why not?
(Given Save isn't fulfilled yet as mentioned earlier, it might not be particularly easy for Homura either)
E: Regarding the interaction requirement, I guess Yuma is also a possibility?
Getting this just before the Day 4 Witch fight would have fulfilled the mercy-kill requirement (if that is what it needs) I think
Does anyone have a list of the requirements of each sapling? Because keeping track of all of them is a bit difficult at this point (4. We have 4 of them now. And all of them ain't growing. Cactus-senpai is very disappointed in X right now.)
Singing Machine is a glowing example of that, it may be *just a HE*, but it killed more agents in my facility than some ALEPHs (Nothing There is a very good boy when compared to this annoying thing, just to give an example).
"You shouldn't waste time thinking about things like that." Homura says sharply, speaking for the first time since you left the site where Big Bird was. "An ordinary person should not be involved in the world of Magical Girls."
Uncertainty overcomes Madoka for a moment, but resolve pushes it back once again.
"I can't do that anymore, Homura. I'm already involved."
They are both right here, the ideal situtation would have Madoka not even knowing that there are dangerous things out there, with the MAgical girls taking care of it without much problems, but Kuibey's system is deliberately sabotaged on some part, and thus, she knows there are things in the dark ready to eat her.
Though I think I would like to use the occasion to bring up telling her parents, they also got involved, after all.
[x] Intervene…
-[x] Support both --[x] Explain your reasoning for both sides of the argument.
-[x] Make sure to imply that the reason Madoka is involved when she shouldn't is Kyubey, plant the seeds of doubts. Also, point out that Madoka's parents did get involved too, you can't involve everyone here, because you don't know them enough, but maybe she could think about including them?
On the other hand the fight with nothing there is seeming more inevitable, if the magical girls can't be saved then at least kill them so they don't suffer...
So, with Big Bird we need SAVE, which we should try doing conventionally first before going to Mercy Killing or saving 15% or more on car insurance
Der Freischütz's PAYMENT probably refers to getting payed, however, we could alternatively try paying someone for a task
Punishing Bird's COMEUPPANCE....test if Kyubey roasts like Marshmallows? Is there a abnormality who we will be beating the shit out of in a Karmic way?
Porccubus had BLISS/TRUST/ESCAPE, presumably we got TRUST, So maybe taking one day to go on a family road trip without everything Blowing up would fulfill the conditions
Unfortunately, as someone else pointed out, if it wasn't save in the Big Bird way, we would already have it several times over, saving people is our favorite way to pass time, after all.
Or we could simply not work on it, trying to get all the conditions at the cost of our humanity is NOT something I will accept. If we ever get this one, it will be because we found an alternate method than simply killing people.
I suppose it depends on how flexible we can get with saving someone through their own death.
"Do I not destroy my enemies when I make them my friends?" Type mindset could possibly work as well.
Of course, there is also the aspect of Big Bird that stood vigil over the Forest. Perhaps standing vigil over Mitakihara and the MG's who protect it will resonate along those lines?
For whatever reason, Yuma can at least touch the Sapling (probably not reach through though), not sure about the others now if that still holds through
So, with Big Bird we need SAVE, which we should try doing conventionally first before going to Mercy Killing or saving 15% or more on car insurance
Der Freischütz's PAYMENT probably refers to getting payed, however, we could alternatively try paying someone for a task
Punishing Bird's COMEUPPANCE....test if Kyubey roasts like Marshmallows? Is there a abnormality who we will be beating the shit out of in a Karmic way?
Porccubus had BLISS/TRUST/ESCAPE, presumably we got TRUST, So maybe taking one day to go on a family road trip without everything Blowing up would fulfill the conditions
Can't think of a way to test this right now, but as these are conditions given to X by the Abnormalities, she probably needs to fill the requirement as the Abnormalities would interpret them. For example, if we need Payment from Der Freischütz, we need to be hired to do something, probably killing something, and accept payment. Or maybe take the payment first then do the thing. Comeuppance would need X to find someone that's done something wrong and punish them for it, though hopefully X won't need to eat anybody. And it has to be a meaningful punishment, bouncing Kuybey around like a basketball might be cathartic, but it's not harming him at all.
The hard ones left are probably Bliss and Escape. And I don't think we can apply those to X for it to work. Under this logic, X would has to help someone else achieve Bliss or a form of Escape.
Again, no way to prove this, but I think the logic tracks. Would need to do some rereading on Saplings we've finished.
Seems a bit weird to use this descriptor: city? shell?
Missing end quotation mark here
For whatever reason, Yuma can at least touch the Sapling (probably not reach through though), not sure about the others now if that still holds through
Anyone can touch and see them, they just don't interact with them the way X does. Though we do have other tests we could try. For example, what if Mami touches her Employment Card to a Sapling? Still need to try touching a Grief Seed and Clear Seed to them as well, though that probably won't go anywhere.
On the vote, I have a thought.
[X] Intervene…
-[X] Support both
--[X] Make sure to imply that the reason Madoka is involved when she shouldn't is Kyubey, plant the seeds of doubt. Also, point out that Madoka's parents did get involved too, you can't involve everyone here, because you don't know them enough, but maybe she could think about including them?
--[X] If she wants, part of what you intend to explain tomorrow has to do with the cards Homura, Sayaka and Mami have. Once we've explained the details, perhaps she could also have one?
Basically implying that X can give Madoka her EGO gift, and the mental protection from from it, tomorrow. Once she's explain what she knows. She's probably going to get one soon anyway.
Also, wouldn't it be a real dick (but kinda funny) move if Kyubey didn't do anything about Big Bird's victims because it hasn't got anything to do with his system?
Also, wouldn't it be a real dick (but kinda funny) move if Kyubey didn't do anything about Big Bird's victims because it hasn't got anything to do with his system?
Yep. However, this would definitely be spun in some direction, whether it's useful to us will depend on our speech skill and the other person themselves
It won't work. As X agrees with Madoka that "it's impossible just to pretend that everything is okay", Kyubey, who explained to Madoka the dangers of the world around her and offered the means to fight it, did nothing but a good deed. Ignorance does not really protect you from danger. Even if Madoka refused to become a Magical Girl, just getting to know Mami and knowing about the existence of the Witches made her life noticeably safer.
[X] Intervene…
-[X] Support both
--[X] Tell both of them to leave it. They can continue tomorrow.
--[X] Both of them are tired. It will be better if you talk about it tomorrow - after you tell them what you wanted to tell.
I do not think that this argument will go anywhere today. And we need this conversation if we're going to try and convince Madoka that she doesn't have to be in a contract to be useful.
Basically implying that X can give Madoka her EGO gift, and the mental protection from from it, tomorrow. Once she's explain what she knows. She's probably going to get one soon anyway.
t won't work. As X agrees with Madoka that "it's impossible just to pretend that everything is okay", Kyubey, who explained to Madoka the dangers of the world around her and offered the means to fight it, did nothing but a good deed. Ignorance does not really protect you from danger.
I want to make sure to point out that Kyubey's system is the problem, that he is the reason "it's impossible just to pretend that everything is okay", that he didn't do a good deed by telling her because there shouldn't be any need to tell anything. That's also why I talk about telling her parents, point out the fact that he recruit child soldiers, thing is, I also don't want to make a giant vote, so I put the bullet points and some of my reasoning has become invisible, hmm, actually, ok:
@Lepidoptera, just pointing this post out so that you can see part of my reasoning for what I want to tell Madoka in plain sight without having to create a vote that is too long, hope it helps.
