Wasn't there an omake a while ago which involved Ji Rong and his omake-series teacher doing Heaven things on a Heaven peak (Xiulan's tribulation was discussed, I believe?) and then Yrs said Ji Rong got something from that but didn't specify what? Because unless that was addressed in one of the between-updates pages I haven't read, picking up a Heavenly Dragon seems fairly likely to be his reward for that.
We know that there is at least one family of River dragons in the area (given our experience with the son) and we have OoC knowledge that there is, or was, an underground dragon in the sect. Next, here is the text regarding Heavenly dragons that Ling Qi found in the archives:
We know that the Sect Head has been depicted as a perfectly controlled all-consuming storm, and the Wall has some of the highest peaks in the area. It is not, therefore, out of the realm of possibility that Heaven dragons would be attracted towards the area. Further evidence for this is provided that other types of dragons are attracted to the area, both river, and underground.
Furthermore, it appears known that heavenly dragons might like the area for nesting sites given that Xiulan attempted to find/entice one. Which leads me to think that while dragons are rare, likely exceptionally so, they are not hyper-rare in that they can only be found in the Celestial peaks.
Additionally, we don't know why, exactly, the dragon agreed to go with Ji Rong. It could have been in a rebellious phase and was enticed by a high talent cultivator wanting to bind it (as a way to get away from his family). It could be that the dragon just hatched and heavenly dragons leave their young to fend for themselves, and this one found Ji Rong. It could be that Ji Rong forcibly bound it because it wasn't associated with the Sect. There are a lot of possibilities here once we have the presumption that a heavenly dragon would be attracted to the location.
So I don't particularly think that this is just random happenstance. Ji Rong is a strongly heaven aligned, with a bit of wind, and is high talent. Likely very attractive to a heavenly dragon to bind with. Furthermore, this area seems to be a place that dragons are attracted to, for whatever reason, and the Wall has the highest mountains in the region, which is perfect for heavenly dragons. There have been enough hints and dots to connect that this doesn't seem, to me, to have come out of the left field and is rather a natural progression on what we already know about the Argent Sect.
Thanks for the insightful response, even though I don't agree.
I don't remember anything about the underground dragon? Do you have a quote? Or was this another discord special which never got mentioned in thread?
Besides which, saying there is a family of river dragons in the area isn't particularly useful, as family can imply a lot of different things. All I remember was that the Sect master's dragon had clearly had children with a river dragon, and given that Heizui and his mother's behaviour didn't exactly give the impression he was innundated with siblings I have been working on the assumption that Dragons had very small families. I would also note that the original text you quoted gives the distinct impression that River dragons are the most common (mention of local dragons), with sky dragons being the rarest to have any sort of contact with.
Dragons, it seemed came in three broad types. Heavenly or Sky Dragons, kin to the First Emperors spirt, were the only dragons which flew. Their scales were typically light blue or white, and they had the longest and most serpentine forms. They lived among the clouds, only touching the earth to nest on the very highest mountain peaks. They had an instinctive command of wind and cloud, able to whip up storms at a moment's notice
The second type were underworld dragons, which lived underground and had deep black or brown scales as well as broader, more lizardlike shape. They lacked the horns of their kind and rarely came to the surface, burrowing freely under the feet of the empire. Their passage revitalized the earth they passed through, and a deep love for certain liquors. They were especially common in the Ebon Rivers province, insofar as dragons were common anywhere.
Most relevant to her interests were River or Flood dragons, the category to which the one in the valley assuredly belonged, going by all description. They were the most social dragons, and many of the empires larger cities had a festival set aside for celebrating and propiating the local river dragon. This did reveal the trouble though.
River dragons, especially the younger ones were incredibly territorial and prideful. If what she was reading was correct, the young dragon was probably still infuriated by the theft of the fruit, and would likely be in no mood for chatting. It would be difficult to even get it to listen most likely.
Difficult, but not impossible. Unlike the Heavenly dragons, whose aloofness made them nigh unapproachable. The pride of River dragons was rather more… vain. Hence the elaborate and expensive festivals cities with older members of their race threw.
The Xiulan point is essentially meaningless, as I said in my original box, she shouldn't have been looking for them either. Honestly, if a decent number of ddragons were nesting around the sect in this way it should have been much more forshadowed than it has been for it not to feel like a cheat to power up Ji Rong again.
If it was as badly foreshadowed as Ji Rong getting one I absolutly would be, and am. But at least if Xiulan got one we might get a bit more of a tale devoted to it than a oneliner of "Oh hi, guess I got a Dragon now, bye".
Allright Yrsillar. I get that this is your story but bluntly, this is total crap. We're green 2-3, if every person in the empire who got to cyan had a legendary creature drop into their dantian the empire would look very, very different.
At the end of the day it comes down to the fact that this story is about Ling Qi, so we have to judge from the perspective we get of the world from her point of view. The complaint about rubber banding often comes up in regards to Ji Rong because he's the one that is hardest to actually see as justified, not helped by the number of previous edge cases involving him.
No one complains that Sun Liling shouldn't turn up with new spirits or arts. We know where she'd generally getting them. She's a Sun and get's their benefits. Meizhen and Xiulan gets things from their families. In the thread so far, Ling Qi also generally gets new things from her established connections: the moon, Zequing, Cai, even Li Suyin.
Similarly, Ji Rong has a set of established sources for new cool toys. @TehChron has invested a large amount of time creating an interesting (if infuriating) canon mentor figure for him. He has backing from Liling. If Ji Rong had turned up with a strong new spirit which his shady wind mentor had taught him how to get that would be irritating but fine. Similarly if Sun had sprung for a super lightning spirit. Hell, if he'd really impressed some elder and got a month's tutoring it wouldn't be beyond the pale (even if we might grind out teeth), because it's a well established part of the story that that sort of thing happens. But dropping in "Oh he has a dragon now" is well outside of that and should recieve appropriate narrative buildup/attention.
That is not to say that other people can't have fortunate encounters; but if you're going to bring in something of on the level of "Oh and your rival character now has a dragon" we could do with some more foreshadowing than our friend saying "by the way I've been trying to catch one of the rarest seen types of dragon" in the very same update. I'm sure you're capable of writing an epic that fully justifies Ji Rong's acquistion of a dragon companion, but that is not the story we actually see, we're seeing the one line.
Yeah, see, that's the idea that Arkeus is objecting to. The "once per generation" thing. It's not that talent 6 is anywhere close to the average. It's that once you whittle things down to the sect - which is the cream of the crop - you've probably got like 5-10% being talent 6. It's just that raw talent isn't everything. Like, if Ling Qi wasn't an actual crazy person who cultivates 140+ hours a week, she wouldn't stand out like she does.
Sure, but it takes both the talent and the attitude to get the sort of beneficial attention from spirits that we can sum up as 'luck'. Even then it might not happen, particular decisions and personality traits also matter to different kinds of spirits.
The same is true about the resources from your family to be a serious candidate for the title. If Meizhen wasn't a cultivation maniac she'd not get any favor, if Liling wasn't one she'd be dead like many of her family members, and if CRX wasn't one she'd have gotten recycled by Oppression Mom.
I personally like how the dragon played out. One of the biggest things that gives worlds a feeling of depth and realism is the idea that the world moves to its own tune and things happen apart from the protagonist's actions. It's a subtle value, but one standing in the way of a story going from good to great.
The fact that Ji Rong is out there, living his own story with its own twists, turns, and strokes of luck makes the world feel deeper and more alive, and the fact that we only heard about it tangentially only enhances that. If yrsillar decided that we ought to get front row seats to everything meaningful in the world it would only feel as alive as what we see, and I'm personally happy to see this touch of life to the background layers of the world.
I could be wrong, but isn't this exactly what happened? I thought the dragon was a reward from one of TehChron's omakes? Or it was implied at least.
And this is more of a general comment, but I think this whole topic is being blown way out of proportion; we're making mountains out of molehills here.
I could be wrong, but isn't this exactly what happened? I thought the dragon was a reward from one of TehChron's omakes? Or it was implied at least.
And this is more of a general comment, but I think this whole topic is being blown way out of proportion; we're making mountains out of molehills here.
I think it was less "It's a reward" and more "This is something that was happening anyway, but I'll let you write an omake that portrays the events leading up to it" thing.
Like, if you're committing to writing an Omake that you're going to try and sidestory, yrsillar doesn't mind explaining the rough brushstrokes of what the NPCs are up to so you can incorporate it. Case in point, I had to ask some questions as to what Su Ling was up to for my recent one, and he confirmed the broad strokes so I could write it in.
Notably, you'll see the most recent Ji Rong sidestory didn't show what he got or how he did in the storm--just that he was going for it.
Thanks for the insightful response, even though I don't agree.
I don't remember anything about the underground dragon? Do you have a quote? Or was this another discord special which never got mentioned in thread?
Besides which, saying there is a family of river dragons in the area isn't particularly useful, as family can imply a lot of different things. All I remember was that the Sect master's dragon had clearly had children with a river dragon, and given that Heizui and his mother's behaviour didn't exactly give the impression he was innundated with siblings I have been working on the assumption that Dragons had very small families. I would also note that the original text you quoted gives the distinct impression that River dragons are the most common (mention of local dragons), with sky dragons being the rarest to have any sort of contact with.
The Xiulan point is essentially meaningless, as I said in my original box, she shouldn't have been looking for them either. Honestly, if a decent number of ddragons were nesting around the sect in this way it should have been much more forshadowed than it has been for it not to feel like a cheat to power up Ji Rong again.
[] Shen Hu: The taciturn boy has approached you for once. He has found the abandoned lair of an underworld dragon, but is not confident that he can face the scavengers that fill it unopposed.
This is why I said it was OoC knowledge. Ling Qi doesn't know about it, but we, the readers, do know about this meta-knowledge.
Now, let's discuss the points you've raised!
First, the fact that there is a family of river dragons is not of particular note, that is true. But the fact that there are river dragons here is of note. It's of note because it establishes a precedent that this is the type of area that a subspecies of dragon would reside in and is, most likely, attracted to. The information regarding the underground dragon supports this. That the Argent Sect, most likely due to its strangely potent qi sites, is of some attraction to at least 2/3 types of dragons. Drawing on that, it is not that difficult to assume that it would be attractive to the third type of dragon, the heavenly dragon, based upon the fact that the Wall has the highest mountains in the area.
The original text doesn't give any impression, to me, which dragon was more common. The River dragon would certainly be more common to see by ordinary people and individuals in cities given that they are more social in nature, but that doesn't tell us which type of dragon is more common in the world.
Additionally, it seems to me that you have an assumption about how things are supposed to be, and then rejecting evidence that the assumption might not be accurate. Xiulan did look for Heavenly dragons, for whatever reason. Saying that she shouldn't because of the assumption that dragons are hyper rare doesn't really work. Heavenly dragons can still be rare, but knowing their nesting habits and preferred locals will give one a good clue as to where they might be. And one of those places seems to be the Argent Sect.
It's like, for example, looking for polar bears. They are objectively rare in that there are not many of them in the world, but they have a very specific locale that they will be living in (the north pole). If you know that, and want to find a polar bear, looking anywhere but the north pole will show you zero results. Even going to the north pole might not give you the opportunity to spot one, but at least it will dramatically increase your chances.
To me, that is kind of like what the Dragons are. They are rare and live in specific locales, and even going to one of the specific locales might not allow you to see one. But it shouldn't be all that surprising that if you go and search in a bunch of their habitats that you'll be able to find one. Especially in this world where they may very well be attracted to your talent and come to you.
I think the fact that this is a somewhat more sensible xianxia setting is not the same thing as expecting it to be fully Rational and Logical and all that.
The whole damn thing still runs on an engine of narrativium; it's just slightly more concealed than usual.
All I'm taking from Ji Rong getting a heavenly dragon is that we should go and have Zhengui fight the river dragon. Put a fire under that lazy dragon's ass by showing him the turtle he bullied is either catching up to or stronger than him now.
I think the fact that this is a somewhat more sensible xianxia setting is not the same thing as expecting it to be fully Rational and Logical and all that.
The whole damn thing still runs on an engine of narrativium; it's just slightly more concealed than usual.
I'd argue the engine has been more-or-less in the open all along: Spirits, Great or otherwise, are beings with agency that control a lot of the things humans don't. So the world doesn't run wholly or even mostly on random chance, and it has never really claimed to.
Though in this case, you really have to think it from the Dragon's PoV, once we establish there's a dragon in this area at all:
You're a Heavenly Dragon. You want to become strong for <insert reason>, it hardly matters because you know how to do it: get a pet cultivator to help you level up. You want a cultivator who is as strong as you, much stronger would make you a minion and much weaker would make them a burden. You want one with as much potential to climb higher as you so they don't become a burden later either. You want one with the same elements as you, for synergy.
So when all the cultivators who want a dragon come looking for you, you get your pick of the litter.
