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Panopticon: A Game of Posthumans, Perniciousness, Paranoia, Politics, and Plasmaguns

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Should we wheel out the DOSHMOBILE for Donald and co?

That thing is an actual, uh, whatsisname magical item as opposed to just the car we have now.

And, if we're going to be swooping in to rescue Jamelia from Evil Evil VEs, speed and toughness might be good. Hopefully Jamelia's ability to sneak and be stealthy is even better though.
 
Quantumboost said:
Okay, need to point this out: DimSci 1 doesn't actually enable you do those things. It's used to perceive extradimensional space and EDEs, it does not actually allow you to influence or contact those things in and of itself. For that you need DimSci 2, or doing something that doesn't strictly require DimSci Ranks in the first place (e.g. talking to ghosts via saying words with your mouth).
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My proposal was that Jamelia would use her vocalization projection apparatus in conjunction with a mind 2 suggestion effect, with Dsci 1 to communicate with a spirit- corr 2 if it's not in the immediate vicinity, and then that spirit would go find Kessler. Spirits can do that. There's a whole category of them that do that.

I never said "use Dsci 1 to mystically bind a spirit to working for you against its will as per the Spirit 4 effect when Jamelia doesn't actually have that rating". You just made that bit up.
 
Kerrus said:
My proposal was that Jamelia would use her vocalization projection apparatus in conjunction with a mind 2 suggestion effect, with Dsci 1 to communicate with a spirit- corr 2 if it's not in the immediate vicinity, and then that spirit would go find Kessler. Spirits can do that. There's a whole category of them that do that.

I never said "use Dsci 1 to mystically bind a spirit to working for you against its will as per the Spirit 4 effect when Jamelia doesn't actually have that rating". You just made that bit up.
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:|

I made nothing up, stop misrepresenting what I said. At no point did I indicate you wanted to have Jamelia compel a spirit with Rank 4 Spirit influence. You see this part?:
with Dsci 1 to communicate with a spirit
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DimSci 1 does not do that. It is not a thing that DimSci 1 does. It is a thing that DimSci 2 does, as I goddamn well said. By "influence" I meant "cause to be affected in some fashion", such as "stabbing them with an ordinary knife" or "talk to them when they couldn't otherwise hear you" or "HUGZ". That is a form of influence, and it requires DimSci 2. Jamelia cannot, as of her current Sphere rankings, do that any more than a Sleeper can except insofar as she can do what they can do better.
 
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Garlak said:
Should we wheel out the DOSHMOBILE for Donald and co?

That thing is an actual, uh, whatsisname magical item as opposed to just the car we have now.

And, if we're going to be swooping in to rescue Jamelia from Evil Evil VEs, speed and toughness might be good. Hopefully Jamelia's ability to sneak and be stealthy is even better though.
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Hmm. Unfortunately, neither Donald nor Rose have the Forces + Corr 2 needed to remote-drive it to catch up with them. So the question is, do we feel that they have time to get to the Heathrow area (which is where I assume the car is) and pick it up, or will that lose too much time?
 
EarthScorpion said:
Hmm. Unfortunately, neither Donald nor Rose have the Forces + Corr 2 needed to remote-drive it to catch up with them. So the question is, do we feel that they have time to get to the Heathrow area (which is where I assume the car is) and pick it up, or will that lose too much time?
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Donald, however, has the Cash + Lackeys 10 needed to get someone to drive it for him.

"Paladin Security, we heard you needed a driver?"
 
Amorous Intent said:
Hey guys, I have a better idea. Why don't we use our newfound DSci to coax the dead Nazis into fighting the Subjugators to create a red-on-red distraction? Then we can make like Garrett and ghost the fuck out of Shalebridge Cradle.

Now, this is the really clever part. We don't fucking blow shockwave codes we don't have and draw attention on us. We want to keep this whole problem as quiet as possible, just like we set out to do from the beginning. The fewer excuses we have to make to Command about what we were doing when we were supposed to be convalescing, the better. Trying to lie to Command and cover shit up is even worse. If we just stroll right the fuck out of there, it looks like the VEs did a failed raid on an old museum to clear out the EDEs. If we start calling in outside assets, Command will find out we're AWOL. So let's not do that and simply use the incredible distraction we already have right there to get away.

Stop trying to put us in deeper shit with the Tribunal than we already are.
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Mainly because i don't see a bunch of Nazi ghosts, using 40s technology lasting significant amount of time against Void Engineers whose "genocide spirit-ness" have been taken up to the 11th. Getting the fuck out is going to be pretty difficult with a plasma spewing flying saucer on overwatch outside the base. Screw up a roll, and we will be running from a UFO out to kill us on foot, and unless i have missed something significant, Donald and Rose have no chance of taking it out at all, so even if we get out and rendezvous with them that will just become a game of trying to drive away from UFO while dodging plasma blasts on roads.

I also don't see how reporting a Gauntlet breach from which hostile EDE have entered in significant number is in anyway similar to calling in a shockwave code. It is literally part of the Union's mandate to combat these sort of breach. Even if you got away clean due to good stunt and good rolls, it would still be necessary to bring in the Void Engineers to plug the hole in the Gauntlet that the Subjugation Corp came through, and strengthen the gauntlet so that they can't exploit that specific weakness again.

Seriously, Threat Null getting physical access to Earth is not something you want to keep quiet about. Everything that they have brought through need to be hunted down with extreme prejudice, and their point of entry need to be plugged, then mined and then watched with automatic sentries.
 
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Wouldn't the doshmobile stand out like a sore thumb and be easily tracked? And don't the VE's have enough firepower that that factor far outweighs the armor (at last until we get inside a populous city)?
 
Calling in this psuedo-VE squad required an agent on the ground who looked like she could have been here indefinitely, a phone, and minimal effort. It's going to go away on its own once we're gone one way or another - otherwise, the world would be swamped in psuedo-VE squads. If this is physical access to earth, Threat Null *has* physical access to earth. Panopticon is also a thing. It has problems bringing in major avatar figures without elaborate summoning rituals, but these are not they.
 
Sirrocco said:
Calling in this psuedo-VE squad required an agent on the ground who looked like she could have been here indefinitely, a phone, and minimal effort. It's going to go away on its own once we're gone one way or another - otherwise, the world would be swamped in psuedo-VE squads. If this is physical access to earth, Threat Null *has* physical access to earth. Panopticon is also a thing. It has problems bringing in major avatar figures without elaborate summoning rituals, but these are not they.
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I may be over reacting here, but I would like to hear your reasoning.
How concerned are you, on the scale of 1-10 about the fact that:
In Moscow, Threat Null used almost exclusively subverted groundside personnel, and they needed a Baali ritual, and poached our DSci expert before they could bring in their own asset.
Compared to London, were we have confirmed Resident doing their stuff, a Transhuman bioweapon on the loose and squad of Subjugators walking around in their jackboots.

Also, someone brought up about Conditioning. As a senior NWO Operative, we are probably heavily Conditioned(How much of this remaining in our current condition is a good question though, nevertheless we fought a guy with Control whispering in his ear while being most Conditioned member of our party), Donald is a defector, so he should have gotten a extra dollop of Conditioning when he joined, and Rose has literal kill switch installed. Not bring in more people because they might be Conditioned as well seems a pretty weak excuse. Interestingly, Siddarth would have been the member of our party with the least amount of Conditioning due to him being part of a convention that redress Conditioning.
 
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VanusDraco said:
I may be over reacting here, but I would like to hear your reasoning.
How concerned are you, on the scale of 1-10 about the fact that:
In Moscow, Threat Null used almost exclusively subverted groundside personnel, and they needed a Baali ritual, and poached our DSci expert before they could bring in their own asset.
Compared to London, were we have confirmed Resident doing their stuff, a Transhuman bioweapon on the loose and squad of Subjugators walking around in their jackboots.

Also, someone brought up about Conditioning. As a senior NWO Operative, we are probably heavily Conditioned(How much of this remaining in our current condition is a good question though, nevertheless we fought a guy with Control whispering in his ear while being most Conditioned member of our party), Donald is a defector, so he should have gotten a extra dollop of Conditioning when he joined, and Rose has literal kill switch installed. Not bring in more people because they might be Conditioned as well seems a pretty weak excuse. Interestingly, Siddarth would have been the member of our party with the least amount of Conditioning due to him being part of a convention that redress Conditioning.
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Second part first: my understanding is that the real threat of Conditioning is that Threat Null might know the codes. That's only an issue if the conditioning was put in prior to 1999. Rose's kill switch is thus a non-issue as far as this is concerned. Donald - I don't know when he was hit, or for how much. Jamelia actually *had* her Conditioning triggered already - that wont' be an issue again (once we fix the medical side-effects). The problem wth Conditioning is that there are a lot of older assets that got their conditioning early enough that Threat Null has the codes for them.

In Moscow, they needed a ritual and a poached DSci expert in order to bring through a major manifestation, who was in turn able to deploy beings of godlike power (and do other unpleasant things). Here, they're not throwing around anything *like* the same degree of power. The level of penetration is a concern, but that's not actually the point. The point is that these are assets that they have available on the ground, for however long. They had them available before Jamelia showed up, and they weren't blowing up London at the time. Thus, chances are, if Jamelia can make good her escape, they won't immediately turn around and *start* blowing up London. Yes, it would be better to have them all die than to not have them all die, but their existence did not suddenly become a time-critical crisis just because we became aware of it.
 
Do not escalate: Do a Scooby Doo thing while VEs are occupied with ghosts.

Because doing it loud goes against most that is Jamelia Belltower. It's not Moscow, it's just local British assholes from beyond the Veil, they were collected from entire island, you deal with them later, after headache.

Also, yes, escalation takes valuable time until our killswitch kills us.

Covert extraction by Donald, preferably without sacrificing Jameliabot.
 
Sirrocco said:
Second part first: my understanding is that the real threat of Conditioning is that Threat Null might know the codes. That's only an issue if the conditioning was put in prior to 1999. Rose's kill switch is thus a non-issue as far as this is concerned. Donald - I don't know when he was hit, or for how much. Jamelia actually *had* her Conditioning triggered already - that wont' be an issue again (once we fix the medical side-effects). The problem wth Conditioning is that there are a lot of older assets that got their conditioning early enough that Threat Null has the codes for them.

In Moscow, they needed a ritual and a poached DSci expert in order to bring through a major manifestation, who was in turn able to deploy beings of godlike power (and do other unpleasant things). Here, they're not throwing around anything *like* the same degree of power. The level of penetration is a concern, but that's not actually the point. The point is that these are assets that they have available on the ground, for however long. They had them available before Jamelia showed up, and they weren't blowing up London at the time. Thus, chances are, if Jamelia can make good her escape, they won't immediately turn around and *start* blowing up London. Yes, it would be better to have them all die than to not have them all die, but their existence did not suddenly become a time-critical crisis just because we became aware of it.
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Eh i think we are talking about different things when we are using the word Conditioning. GHOST BEAR is a special project unique to Jamelia, but every technocrat is conditioned(a mind effect) to be loyal to the Union and Obedient to Control. It's literal a brainwashing technique used on every Technocrat when they join, except the VE who undo the Conditioning with their in-house technique.

Also, we don't know that the asset here on the ground has already been here for long. I-50 has a specific mission, as do the Subjugators. Personally i think that it's far more likely that they snuck through a opening due to the Union focusing on rebuilding Moscow. The Residents seems to have embeded themselves pretty deeply, but we don't know how long it took them to do so. They are not throwing the same degree of power here is because they are not Autopolitans. This is a quiet campaign, and is no less deadly, and far more insidious.
 
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Tradwiki: Christos Barberis
  • Informational
    • Christos_Barberis(Euthanatos)/Discussion

    Notification

    Okay, I'm locking this page. I tried warning you guys. I even put a big splash screen up which flagged up that Christos has a hanging curse which hits people who vandalise his page. And what happened? Oh yes, some idiots decide to vandalise his page. And now some idiots found what Entropy and Spirit can do to their hardware - which included some headware. Well, I'm locking it to protect you idiots from yourselves. Maybe I'll reconsider after the new year or something. Though that's only likely if I think some noobs need to introduced to the chlorine in the gene pool. If you're stupid enough to try to vandalise Christos_Barberis(Euthanatos) as a page, you're stupid enough you should never be let near Union Black ICE, which at /best/ will leave you hurting for weeks, and at worst might download an override into your brain. Yes, I'm taking away your freedom to be morons for a bit. And if any of you noobs call me a 'Crat for doing that, I'll lol so hard. - Dante(superadmin)(stickied)
    -> Dante o7 - Baneier
    -> O7 for the lost - EACA
    -> ^_&'7 - MetaOpCal
    --> Gotta ask, what's that expression? - PSA4U
    ---> I have a cybereye taking up half my face. Looks kind of like that. - MetaOpCal
    --> What's happening here? - quibly
    --> This was Dante's last post in 1999. He set up TradWiki and now we've been running without the superadmin for over 15 years. Dante. : ( o7 - Turing007
    ---> Don't worry! Fear not! Dante is not gone! Hyper-expansion of cognition is all we need to do to follow him to the realm of pure intellect he now exists in! The Rogue Council will lead us to the Singularity! Without the Technocracy to chain us down, the Singularity will come! Dante is leading the way! Look at all of this [linkDeleted] [linkDeleted] [linkDeleted] - SolarWall
    ----> Reported as Rogue Council spam. Please take that to Arguments_About_the_Rogue_Council/Discussion - PatternHax2U
    ----> Links deleted - Justification: Memetic hazard. - HackedHITMark11(moderationbot)
    -----> Does it worry anyone else that TradWiki uses hacked HITMarks as... like, sub mods? i can't be the only one who eels bad abiut the idea that robots have the power to ban people - WickedWitchOfTheWeb
    ------> The HackedHITMarks are the fairest and least biased mods on the board. They're always polite and don't enjoy mocking people who they ban. They're much better than a lot of the normal mods. - PatternHax2U
    -> o7 - Li42
    -> 07 - SmithOfWorlds

    Copy of Union files

    So why is this page just a copy of the Union reports on him? Like, I hacked their stuff trying to see if there was anything interesting on him, and it's all the same. What gives? - Li 42
    -> Christos. Christos gives. Because he's an arrogant cockfuck who probably finds it hilarious that we know as much about him as the 'Crats know. - Thig4Life
    --> How stupid do you have to be to flame a touchy master on his own discussion page? I'm not going to infract you to this. I'm just going to assume something bad will happen to you, at some point, for some reason, which is his fault. - Wingz(moderator)
    ---> Oh yeah, keep on watching the mod staff protect murderers. Fuckers wiped out House Janissary and forced anyone who wanted to survive to defect to the Union. Those bastards just handed the 'Crats a bunch of good Hermetics because they're Jhor-crazy paranoid lunatics no different from the NWO. - Thig4Life (user was infracted for this post)
    ----> And now come the points - Wingz(moderator)

    Sorcerer: the Exaltation!!!

    Wow. No way! he was behind Sorcerer: the Exaltation? I used to play it at school! - GothicPsychicChick
    -> I know, right? - Wingz(moderator)
    --> Honestly, gotta say that it makes so much more sense why they took away all the copies when they found we had them and destroyed them - GothicPsychicChick
    ---> : ( Wow. What kind of fundie school did you go to? - Wingz(moderator)
    ----> A pretty horrible place in Europe. Not a great place at all. - GothicPsychicChick

    Christos Facts on the Discussion Page

    I just deleted this entire 'forum game'. This isn't the place, and it's just stupid. You're all stupid. "Christos once seduced Control, and didn't call back." "Christos killed JFK because the rat owed him $400 for hookers". "Christos can kill twelve men with six bullets... and doesn't use a gun to do it." "Christos has had kids with every kind of supernatural being. He felt it was the only way to make things fairer". God, I really hate you all. I spent /fifty three minutes/ clearing up the page and handing out infractions. I hate everyone who made me do this. - BaptismOfFire(moderator)
    -> Point of order. This should be under Moderator_Criticisms_of_the_Userbase, and I'm also reporting you for a group attack - PatternHax2U
     
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    • EarthScorpion said:
    Okay, I'm locking this page. I tried warning you guys. I even put a big splash screen up which flagged up that Christos has a hanging curse which hits people who vandalise his page. And what happened? Oh yes, some idiots decide to vandalise his page. And now some idiots found what Entropy and Spirit can do to their hardware - which included some headware. Well, I'm locking it to protect you idiots from yourselves.

    --> How stupid do you have to be to flame a touchy master on his own discussion page? I'm not going to infract you to this. I'm just going to assume something bad will happen to you, at some point, for some reason, which is his fault. - Wingz(moderator)
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    Oh, Christos. In some ways, you and Jamelia might get on rather well.
    EarthScorpion said:
    ----> Links deleted - Justification: Memetic hazard. - HackedHITMark11(moderationbot)
    -----> Does it worry anyone else that TradWiki uses hacked HITMarks as... like, sub mods? i can't be the only one who eels bad abiut the idea that robots have the power to ban people - WickedWitchOfTheWeb
    ------> The HackedHITMarks are the fairest and least biased mods on the board. They're always polite and don't enjoy mocking people who they ban. They're much better than a lot of the normal mods. - PatternHax2U
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    I did like this bit, too. Hee.
     
    ------> The HackedHITMarks are the fairest and least biased mods on the board. They're always polite and don't enjoy mocking people who they ban. They're much better than a lot of the normal mods. - PatternHax2U
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    BEEP BOOP YOU WILL FOLLOW THE RULES BEEP BOOP
    BEEP BOOP I AM INCAPABLE OF MERCY, EMPATHY OR TAKING SIDES BEEP BOOP
    BEEP BOOP I AM MODMARK IV-27 MY DUTY IS THE ENFORCEMENT OF TRADWIKI TERMS OF USE BEEP BOOP
     
    Ha. Okay, what is the deal with PatternHax2U? I've seen a few of expies of SB posters, and I could swear that PH2U feels familiar enough that he feels like another inspired-by-an-SB-poster name.

    Or is it just that his behavior is so damn stereotypically annoying that anyone who's met annoying rules-obsessed whiny morons, immediately feels deja vu?
    EarthScorpion said:
    Okay, I'm locking this page. I tried warning you guys. I even put a big splash screen up which flagged up that Christos has a hanging curse which hits people who vandalise his page. And what happened? Oh yes, some idiots decide to vandalise his page.
    Click to expand...
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    --> How stupid do you have to be to flame a touchy master on his own discussion page? I'm not going to infract you to this. I'm just going to assume something bad will happen to you, at some point, for some reason, which is his fault. - Wingz(moderator)
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    Oh my god. This... this is the best. :D
     
    Garlak said:
    Oh my god. This... this is the best. :D
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    Notably, he got points immediately afterwards.

    This may indicate that Christos a) believes in instant karma, and b) is good at being subtle. Or it may not be related at all.

    Jamelia: "I think I'm in love."

    Donald: "... how would you know? Does it feel the same as getting a particularly hard bit of work? Or maybe a challenging mission?"

    Jamelia: "..."

    Jamelia: "Shut up."
     
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