Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Say what?
Demon infighting does not decrease DS, in fact demon infighting is what retards the loss of DS below 0.
Meguca Micro Empire Quest (PMMM)
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Say what?
Demon infighting does not decrease DS, in fact demon infighting is what retards the loss of DS below 0.
I don't think we can count on it being one of these scenarios. We don't know what is going on. The only thing we do know is that the enemy forces girls to burn through grief cubes. We have only two counters to that. Mami and Kaoru. Mami because she uses less magic and so can keep going longer, and Kaoru who can counter depression with her magical ability for the entire group she is with.
We'd have to be insane not to bring Kaoru along with us on this mission.
We also have other abilities that we need and the Elite's don't have. Now possibly Mami and Kyouko could act as barrier providers, but none of our Elites are Teleporters, and none are Healers... Well, Mami, but that is a tertiary power at best for her.
An alternative organization would be this:
Mami
Kyouko + Clone
Taya
Kaoru
Healer
3x Evacuation Teams:
1x Barrier each
1x Teleporter each
1x Calirvoyant each
Mami and her team would be the hunting squad (probably combined with Seto and her team), and the Evac teams are there to pull people out if we get into a bad situation.
I think he's suggesting that letting the demons fight each other would be more effective than letting magical girls fight a demon that has evolved especially well to fight magical girls (but, correspondingly, is less well suited to fight other demons).
Huh so try and lure the demon into a pack of demons that are good against fighting demons then?
I wonder if that might work?
Class 3 Demon Event Part 2 Q&A
Superdemon Event Part 2 Q&A
Seto's very grateful for your help.
Seto can't give you a demon strength in your terms, but it's fairly safe to hunt in pairs usually. Her group is thirteen strong, or at least it was she corrects morosely. Her group's territory, which extends a bit further than you knew, is enough to cover this without increase. It's actually quite a geographically large territory as she describes it, though much less densely populated than your own. She's aware of the dangers of over hunting from her own experience before even making a group, though not with your degree of precision. If demons begin to be a serious threat they simply ease off hunting for a while. There hasn't really been any unusual increase though.
Her own specialty is teleportation, and she's normally quite capable. Her short range flickers are quite rapid, and her group teleports have a much shorter recharge.
The despair field as you called it began affecting the members of her group the moment they entered the demon's miasma, even though they didn't see the demon at the time. It got stronger when the demon actually engaged them though. She was mostly still able to shrug it off, but the veterans she brought were not.
She only engaged it the once, as with her group already having lost 4 members to it the situation is critical, she simply doesn't have the puella to handle fighting it. Not to mention that she expects her members to be even more vulnerable to the despair field with the hit to morale from the lost lives.
The group she took against it was herself, a healer, a shielder, and two without particular powers. Her group always uses whatever means they can to kill demons, and do make use of hardened leather armor which one of them was able to acquire as well as shields.
The demon killed their healer from stealth while they were wondering why there was an empty miasma. They just turned around and half her body was gone. Their shielder threw up a spherical shield around them immediately, which sparked as the demon was caught in its formation, temporarily illuminating it. That was probably the best view of it they got, and it was very reptilian, like a lizard the size of a car. The other girls she brought tried to light it up with ranged attacks through the shield, but their blows didn't seem to do any significant damage. Seto's own attacks are melee taking advantage of her flicker speed and she was able to flicker past the shield and carve into it with her daggers, but jumped out again as its tail came around to swat her off and it pulled itself free of the barrier and vanished.
They waited under the barrier for a while after that, the seconds ticking by in agony as they burned grief cubes to deal with their despair build up. They kept trying to spot it and her girls kept firing off random attacks hoping to hit it by chance but had no luck.
Then it smashed into the shield from above with enough force to shatter it completely and render the shielder insensate and crush one of the other girls to paste. Seto then cut her losses realizing she couldn't handle this and teleported the ones left alive back to their home.
She's been tracking the demon's miasma since then and it's wandering about much faster than normal. Based on where she encountered it and where the original pair of hunters vanished she suspects it came from outside her territory, to the northeast. She's only got 3 greens and 5 vets left. The shielder has been pretty much inconsolable and Seto's unsure if she can prevent her vanishing even as it is. She's got one more healer and the other three vets don't have particular powers. The greens have a healer and shielder, but she's not willing to let them face this demon at all, that would be outright murder as much as if she killed them herself.
They have about a month of cubes stored up now, a month and a half even, with their losses. But she's not sure the idea of letting it get weaker is going to work. It hasn't interacted with other demons and there didn't seem to be any others in its miasma, though she wasn't there long enough to know for sure.
-----------------------------------
(Worth noting, your own Veteran rank teleporters can self teleport fairly often in a fight, but a long range group teleport is somewhat exhausting and they have not just a charge time but a recovery period after that's basically a lifetime in combat during which they can't even teleport themselves. Hence why having them teleport a hunting party to intercept the poachers was less effective. As an Elite Seto can basically flicker about the battlefield at will, and her ability to teleport groups is significantly improved with her able to be combat effective immediately after. A green teleporter can't move anyone but herself.)
Also her group's wish magic rolls sucked horribly. Only 3 out of 8 vets had any. Also assume that Mami asks questions as delicately as they can be put. Though asking directly about her territory and numbers was indelicate even at best.
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Hmm.
Ok, 1 superdemon. It doesn't interact with other demons, so the idea of luring in other demons to fight it is probably a non-starter.
We have tracking information, so we don't have to search blindly.
It apparently came from a territory northeast of her area. Is she aware of any groups in that direction? Has she attempted to contact them to see if they are still there?
Ok, 1 superdemon. It doesn't interact with other demons, so the idea of luring in other demons to fight it is probably a non-starter.
We have tracking information, so we don't have to search blindly.
It apparently came from a territory northeast of her area. Is she aware of any groups in that direction? Has she attempted to contact them to see if they are still there?
I wonder if maybe this was an experiment gone wrong? Such a dangerous demon...
Yeah so demon infighting plan probably won't work.
It's apparently very hard to see, and quite strong. Probably should only bring elites with us...? But huh... I wonder...
It got stuck in the shield right? And the shield/barrier revealed it right?
So what if we spammed the miasma full of shields/barriers to trap/find it? And then had our elites go in and destroy it. It'll probably be a bit costly GC wise, but... it seems like it'll work.
Yeah so demon infighting plan probably won't work.
It's apparently very hard to see, and quite strong. Probably should only bring elites with us...? But huh... I wonder...
It got stuck in the shield right? And the shield/barrier revealed it right?
So what if we spammed the miasma full of shields/barriers to trap/find it? And then had our elites go in and destroy it. It'll probably be a bit costly GC wise, but... it seems like it'll work.
Ah, more of a wanderer then. Even better: it looks like super-demon is headed right for us; do we have an ETA before it arrives in our Northeast territory?
Yeah, that's why I was urging us to ask only if Seto couldn't give us a direct measure of the group's ambient demon strength.
Not necessarily. It may not go out of its way, but if we can lure some demons from our lower-strength territory into its miasma it makes sense to me that the low-strength ones will go after super-demon. At the very least I'd like to whittle down super-demon a little before we engage it. I like your order of battle plan for the actual fight, too.
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Hmm... okay... this isn't as bad as I thought. With Seto being a teleporter we are in rather good shape.
I see the following options:
1: Pure Elite:
Mami
Kyouko
Taya
Seto
Taya provides clairvoyant warnings so we avoid getting killed in a surprise round. Seto provides teleportation. Her main job is to make sure no one gets killed. Mami wraps it up in ribbons to hold it down and snipes. Kyouko and Clone provide the primary melee attacks to kill the thing after Mami has it tied down. We have to be very aggressive to kill it quickly before the miasma effect wears us down.
2: Elite + Kaoru
Same as above, but we include Kaoru to give us her emotional uplift and counter act the negative effects of the miasma.
3: All out Pack Hunt:
Mami
Kyouko
Taya
Kaoru
Seto
Seto's team healer (Vet)
3x other Clairvoyants
5x Barriers
3x Teleporters
This move is completely dependent on Kaoru's ability to counteract the enemy's negative emotion ability. The idea is that we have Taya and the 3x Clairvoyants provide our early warning,so minimum chance we get surprised. Barriers provide barriers protecting us while we snipe the enemy, can trade off and reinforce each other, Elite's excepting Seto provide attack power (Mami and Kyouko especially, Kyouko can summon additional spears you know, spears can be used as throwing weapons.) Seto provides battle filed mobility, making sure no one gets killed. Other 3 teleporters are there to provide evacuation for any injured, along with a healer to provide on-site healing if needed. Extra barriers can provide protection to teleporters when charging up to teleport people out.
There are some other variations, but these are probably the main three.
I see the following options:
1: Pure Elite:
Mami
Kyouko
Taya
Seto
Taya provides clairvoyant warnings so we avoid getting killed in a surprise round. Seto provides teleportation. Her main job is to make sure no one gets killed. Mami wraps it up in ribbons to hold it down and snipes. Kyouko and Clone provide the primary melee attacks to kill the thing after Mami has it tied down. We have to be very aggressive to kill it quickly before the miasma effect wears us down.
2: Elite + Kaoru
Same as above, but we include Kaoru to give us her emotional uplift and counter act the negative effects of the miasma.
3: All out Pack Hunt:
Mami
Kyouko
Taya
Kaoru
Seto
Seto's team healer (Vet)
3x other Clairvoyants
5x Barriers
3x Teleporters
This move is completely dependent on Kaoru's ability to counteract the enemy's negative emotion ability. The idea is that we have Taya and the 3x Clairvoyants provide our early warning,so minimum chance we get surprised. Barriers provide barriers protecting us while we snipe the enemy, can trade off and reinforce each other, Elite's excepting Seto provide attack power (Mami and Kyouko especially, Kyouko can summon additional spears you know, spears can be used as throwing weapons.) Seto provides battle filed mobility, making sure no one gets killed. Other 3 teleporters are there to provide evacuation for any injured, along with a healer to provide on-site healing if needed. Extra barriers can provide protection to teleporters when charging up to teleport people out.
There are some other variations, but these are probably the main three.
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Now the bulk questions have been answered, though I'll clarify where I was unclear:
Also I tried to show that the lexicon is a little bit different between groups. You've been calling them barrier specialists while she just calls them shielders. Despair vs grief, vanishing vs grief spiraling.
Demons just don't leave their miasma from what you know, and their miasma does tend to move a bit if you give them time, but it's slow. Usually you can just leave the miasma and be safe (though most deaths are very quick anyways). What she means is that its miasma hasn't run into any other demons' miasma when she says it hasn't interacted.
She's been tracking the miasma, which is not to say she knows where it is in the miasma. She can see and feel the miasma, but not the demon directly.
She has not been the most communicatory. She doesn't know the surrounding groups very well beyond the borders.
For a couple seconds before it pulled free it was caught in the original formation of the shield.
Also I tried to show that the lexicon is a little bit different between groups. You've been calling them barrier specialists while she just calls them shielders. Despair vs grief, vanishing vs grief spiraling.
Well, since all the cool kids are doing it, here's my team recommendation, sort of an update of @Kinematics:
Team 1 - Point
Mami (sniper)
Kyouko (stealth, melee)
Kyouko clone (scout point)
Taya (scout)
Seto (territory lead)
Yui (barrier)
Aiko (barrier)
Team 2 - Support
Kaoru (AOE emotional protection)
(barrier)
(barrier)
(sniper)
Akeno? (inertia control)
Shinobu (teleporter)
Team 3 - Evac (outside of miasma)
Sayaka (healer)
Seto's healer
(barrier)
(barrier)
Taura (telepath)
(teleporter #2)
This uses all six of our barrier-maidens, arranged in overlapping pairs, since it's already been proven that super-demon can punch through a single barrier. Teams 1 and 2 will be in full Kevlar, as well as the teleporter in our evac team.
Team 1 - Point
Mami (sniper)
Kyouko (stealth, melee)
Kyouko clone (scout point)
Taya (scout)
Seto (territory lead)
Yui (barrier)
Aiko (barrier)
Team 2 - Support
Kaoru (AOE emotional protection)
(barrier)
(barrier)
(sniper)
Akeno? (inertia control)
Shinobu (teleporter)
Team 3 - Evac (outside of miasma)
Sayaka (healer)
Seto's healer
(barrier)
(barrier)
Taura (telepath)
(teleporter #2)
This uses all six of our barrier-maidens, arranged in overlapping pairs, since it's already been proven that super-demon can punch through a single barrier. Teams 1 and 2 will be in full Kevlar, as well as the teleporter in our evac team.
OK. Still means the demon baiting probably won't work, since even if we could get the attentions of demons, getting the miasma to move is an entirely separate issue.
We might, however, be able to initiate the fight at a point where it's close to another existing miasma, and maybe have the two mix together, bringing the other demons in. Not the best idea, but it is an option.
How large is the miasma area? For that matter, how large are they typically?
Unfortunate. Rather than a demon-bomb, this might be a godzilla-like natural disaster, wandering through killing groups off. Does the miasma's movement approximate anything one might call a search pattern?
That stealth is going to be a real issue. We have Taya, but we'll probably want a barrier user to give us breathing room in case Taya has difficulty or loses track of it. We need to be proactive the instant we enter the miasma; no wandering around searching, just put up barriers and start the scan.
Unfortunately, I'm going to be taking off for a while. I might check in a bit, but don't expect extensive planning til much later tonight.
Aside: Is there anything we want to do before we start armoring up for bear?
Setting aside the risk for each tactic, what are the possible benefits? (Other then killing the super demon).
Well the first one emphasizes the Elites. It's a way of demonstrating that we have a very powerful elite force. It's also light touch on Seto's group. She's really the only one that interacts with us.
The second one is the same, but introduces Kaoru which might be a plus as getting girls to come listen to her sing might be helpful longer term. Suggests we have specialists.
The third option is the one that is the largest impact. Essentially we will be bringing a squad in that equals Seto's entire team. It is a massive show of strength and even involves Seto's team a little bit.
Third option has probably the most benefits...
A small note, I reviewed your plan, and our upkeep is 48 not 47 (Kyouko Clone costs a cube).
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There is a problem with this. Teleportation as described means that our evac teleporters can not teleport in and then teleport out right away, they will need some charge up time. So to really be useful we would need the teleporters to be in the group inside the miasma, and then teleport injured out to the healers group outside the miasma. Then then potentially teleport back in with a replacement... though that would probably require a clairvoyant and/or barrier to help point out the safe place to teleport...
I put the Kyouko clone in the "additional spent" section.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
I think that I favor full out pack hunt.
While it will be a massive show of force, if we combine it with treating Seto's group like equals in the diplomacy actions later on in the main turn, that will do very good things to our reputation with other diplomacy groups.
While it will be a massive show of force, if we combine it with treating Seto's group like equals in the diplomacy actions later on in the main turn, that will do very good things to our reputation with other diplomacy groups.
They vary a bit but average around 10,000 square meters. This one is significantly larger, 40,000 square meters perhaps. They tend to have somewhat uneven edges. Interior geometry usually matches the normal world, usually.
Its route is no where near straight enough to predict this. Even if it didn't wildly veer off in another direction.
She hasn't discerned a pattern, though she suspects it's moving towards concentrations of puella, but not very accurately if it is.
He has Shinobu listed in the inside group it looks like? So she can. I assume when she ports out the teleporter in the outside group teleports in to take her place ready for the next evac.
Though also note that the charge up and recovery period are dependent on distance and number transferred. Just going a few hundred meters won't be nearly as bad as multi-kilometer jumps. (Shinobu on trip to Iwata would have been combat ineffective for quite a while, but your plan didn't really require her to do things quickly. Also I may have thought out these limitations after that
)
True enough, but if the dice rolls turn out bad we'll likely take severe losses.
40,000 square meters?
So uh 40 km worth of space to explore? That's almost 25 square miles of ground space to explore... man these Miasma clouds can reach the sizes of small cities!
Uh how high does the Miasma normally reach? Can we use tall buildings to rise above it and explore from above?
So uh 40 km worth of space to explore? That's almost 25 square miles of ground space to explore... man these Miasma clouds can reach the sizes of small cities!
Uh how high does the Miasma normally reach? Can we use tall buildings to rise above it and explore from above?
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Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
The way to avoid that is to leave Seto out to dry, which is not an option.
Being a meguca is hard. Mami has done her best to keep her meguca safe, but someone you need to take risks out of principle. This is one such.
The more firepower we have in place the better chance we have to kill this thing. The only real objection to any plans other than "elite only" is that we are betting everything on Karou being able to counteract this thing's despair field.
Avalanche
Atypical Netizen
- Location
- Australia
What? 40000 square meters is a circle 112 meters in radius. It ain't that large.
Or a 200*200 square.
Eh?!
I've been doing calc problems for too long. I can't even do basic math anymore. 40,000 square meters = 40000*40000 was what my brain got, and then it was like, SO MAN THAT'S REALLY BIG. Instead of the more reasonable assumption that it was 200*200 = 40,000 squared. I guess I'm thinking 40,000^2 instead of 200^200 = 40000 km^2
Just letting you know that this could significantly cripple Serene if the rolls go bad.
Aranfan
Team Plasma Grunt
Even "Elite Only" can cripple the Serenes if Mami bites it.
As this risk is the cost of helping Seto, and we are all agreed on helping Seto, I don't really consider it a valid objection to any particular plan.