It's mostly me just presuming its a a particle.
Bit of a huge presumption considering it's more a spiritual thing than a physical one.
Assorted TLs do refer to 'Spiritrons', but honestly, considering the more esoteric aspects of the subject matter, assuming normal tech without any modifications is capable of registering it in the first place is a bit of a long shot. Chaldea is the only place shown to be able of such, and their technology is... Decidedly not normal, to put it mildly.
But even than though we should be able to notice it interacting with other matter, thats how we detect dark matter after all.
From 6th Singularity:
@ Holmes
そもそもアトラス院とは何なのか?
In any case, what precisely is the Academy at Atlas?
いい疑問だ、ミスぐだ子。
A good question, Miss Gudako.
それはエジプトにあるもう一つのアトラス山に根付いた、錬金術師たちの学院だ。
That which is so called bases itself in the other Atlas Mountains (もう一つのアトラス山, mou hitotsu no Atorasu-san), situated in Egypt -- an academy for Alchemists.
別名を巨人の穴倉という。
It is referred to also by the appellation of "The Giant's Pit" (巨人の穴倉, Kyojin no Anagura, lit. "Giant's Pit-Cellar").
魔術協会、その三大部門の一つ、
It is one of the three primary branches of the Thaumaturgical Association --
蓄積と計測の院。
an institution that specializes in aggregation (蓄積, chikuseki, lit. "accumulation") and appraisal (計測, keisoku, lit. "measurement")
中世から主流となった現代錬金術とは異なる、
Diverging from (異なる, kotonaru) the modern practice of Alchemy (現代錬金術, Gendai Renkinjutsu, lit. "modern Alchemy") that has since the medieval period (中世から, Chuusei kara) entered the vogue (主流となった, shuryuu to natta, lit. "become mainstream"),
魔術の祖、世界の理を解明する錬金術師の集団だった。
they are an organization that conducts inquiry (解明, kaimei, lit. "elucidation") into the basis of Magecraft (魔術の祖, Majutsu no So, lit. "the forefathers / origins of Magecraft") and the Laws of the World (世界の理, Sekai no Kotowari, lit. "the principles / rationalities of the World").
彼らは魔術師でありながら、魔術回路の乏(とぼ)しい学徒たちだったと聞く。
Though they are indeed Magi, I've heard that they're predominantly academics (学徒, gakuto) possessed of scant Thaumaturgical Circuits (魔術回路の乏しい, Majutsu-Kairo no Toboshii, lit. "a destitution of Magecraft Circuits").
当然の帰結として、彼らは神秘を学ぶ過程において魔力に頼らず、多くの道具に頼った。
As an inevitable consequence, within the course of their study of Mysteries (神秘, Shinbi), they came to rely not upon Mana (魔力, Maryoku, lit. "magical energy"), but upon a great variety of instruments (道具, dougu, lit. "tools").
その在り方は科学技術による発展に近かった。
Said instruments evolved in form so as to closely resemble those technologies (技術, gijutsu) employed in scientific inquiry (科学, kagaku).
疑似霊子……
Pseudo-Spiritrons (疑似霊子, Gishi-Reishi, lit. "pseudo- spirit particles") ...
魂を観測可能なエネルギーとして扱い、
Making use (扱い, atsukai, lit. "dealing with / handling") of the soul (魂, tamashii) as a quantifiable (観測可能な, kansoku-kanou-na, lit. "capable of being observed") energy,
魔術回路を持つ生命、ホムンクルスを創造した。
they were able to coin (創造, souzou, lit. "create / fabricate") Homunculi -- organisms (生命, seimei) possessed of Thaumaturgical Circuits.
Pseudo-Spiritrons are also the particles used by Moon Cell for communications. Also, Chaldea's systems rely on them for purposes of quantum computing.

I'm starting to think that the Giant's Pit refers to whereever it is that the body of Sefar of the Earth ended up ...
 
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From 6th Singularity:

I'm starting to think that the Giant's Pit refers to whereever it is that the body of Sefar of the Earth ended up ...
Could be an interesting reference.

So, generally not Beast level, no. Beasts, so far, are quite capable of ending human civilization, and it took 72 pillars, Solomon's body, and a plan to gather power from all of human history to reach Beast.

Demon Pillars aren't true demons from what I can tell. In the end we don't really have many examples of true demons but considering that Kiara in F/E CCC was -almost- one...

I'd put one at above a Beast.
 
Could be an interesting reference.

Demon Pillars aren't true demons from what I can tell. In the end we don't really have many examples of true demons but considering that Kiara in F/E CCC was -almost- one...

I'd put one at above a Beast.
Terminologically, "True Demons" aren't a power level. It's just a class or category of existence. If a Demon managed to develop into a state whereby it no longer requires direct basis in the distortions of humanity, it automatically qualifies as a True Demon. You could theoretically have incredibly weak True Demons.
 
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That is true but the whole being separatefrom common sense of humanity thing tends to make things... odd in interactions anyway.
How would you define strength in this case anyway?
 
Power levels, the way everybody who asks about True Demons/Phantasmal Beasts/Divine Beasts/Beast Class Servants does.
 
That is true but the whole being separatefrom common sense of humanity thing tends to make things... odd in interactions anyway.
How would you define strength in this case anyway?
Tsukihime Lab:
真性悪魔 しんせいあくま
「人間の想念を被って『個体名』に成る偽物」ではなく、人が名付ける前から既にそうであった本物の悪魔を聖堂教会ではこう呼ぶ。受肉した魔。​

True Demons (Shinsei Akuma)
Not "forgeries that obtain 'Designations' by way cladding themselves in the thoughts of humans"; the name assigned by the Holy Church to those actual Demons that existed prior to being assigned appellations by humans. Enfleshed Demons.​
The point is, they're just a category of existence. There's no level of strength inherent to the definition. This is, of course, an older definition. Somewhere in Extra CCC, they talk about how things can "become" True Demons.
 
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I have some personal ways of improving Tesla.

I'd make Tesla a Caster.

His introduction would be a deliberate callback to Gilles de Rais, so that people would assume he's a bad guy.

In this case, he isn't, but he does have ranks in Mental Pollution.

He does not have Galvanism; that skill doesn't make that much sense when it comes to Tesla.

He'd have three NP's; the ability to summon electrified doves that shoot lasers as his familiars, his tesla coils, and the ability to summon the internet as a Reality Marble (he was a pioneer of wireless communications) which grants him the ability to make his more terrifying mad science projects; but it also increases his ranks in Mental Pollution and isn't entirely under his control, so it has a chance of backfiring horribly.


He'd also be a MASSIVE gambling addict (which got him kicked out of college), like how Saber's a glutton or how Lancer's a butt monkey. Another running gag would be the fact that he's utterly terrified of sex or sexy things, and is surrounded by characters whose designs tend to be pretty damn sexualized.

Just saying.

But we're not talking about that; for my two cents, I'm pretty sure that Natural Demons are another Lovecraft reference (because we needed another one, DIDN'T WE NASU?)

No, seriously, I'm pretty sure that they're Shoggoths or the like...

Say, you know how 21st century humans would be immune to the existential dread that those creatures cause?
 
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For comparison, JP Wiki's definition of Demons:
悪魔
第六架空要素。人間の願いに取り憑き、その願いを歪んだ方法で成就せんとする存在。悪魔に憑かれると他の要素に異常が起き、最後には肉体も変化して異形の怪物と化す。高位の悪魔ほど「症状」が表に出づらく検知が困難で、露見するのは大惨事が約束された後になりやすい。​

Demon
The 6th Imaginary Aspect (第六架空要素, Dai-Roku Kakuu Youso). Existences that come to be invested within (取り憑き, toritsuki, lit. "to take hold of / to come to haunt") the wishes (願い, negai) of humanity, realizing said wishes by distorted means (歪んだ方法, yuganda houhou). Upon possession by a demon, irregularities (異常, ijou) manifest in the other Aspects (要素, youso) of the victim, eventually rendering them as grotesque monsters by the metamorphosis of the flesh. Being that higher order demons (高位の悪魔, koui no akuma) are capable of suppressing the manifestation of these "symptoms" (症状, shoujou), detection of such is difficult, and it is likely that a disaster becomes inevitable in the event of their discovery.​
In the Demons definition in Tsukihime Lab, Higher Order Demons (高位の悪魔) is written as True Demons (真性の悪魔), and they're said to be able to suppress their Spiritual Corruption (霊障) from detection by others in the process of possession.

Again, the numbered Aspects (要素, youso) are as follows:

1st: Corpus
2nd: Spirit
3rd: Mind
4th: ???
5th Imaginary: Ether
5th True: True Ether
6th Imaginary: Demons

The Elements (元素, genso) are as follows:

4 Great Elements: Wind, Fire, Water, Earth (in no particular order)
5th Element: Ether
Unnumbered: Void, Hollow

Jonnobi says:
悪魔(用語)
第六架空要素。人間の願いによって生み出され、人間の願いによって呼び出される受動的なモノ。モノの想念が集まってカタチをなした実像幻想。実体化には『人々が創造したカタチ』が必要。真性悪魔ではなく『個体名』になるもののこと。
名前をつけてしまうと本当に自由になってしまうため、悪魔を安易に名付けてはならないという決まりがある。
結果はどうあれ、人の苦悩を理解し取りのぞこうとするもので、見ようによっては人間の味方。​

Demon (Terminology)
The 6th Imaginary Aspect. Existences born of the wishes of humans, passively (受動的な, shuudou-teki-na, lit. "as acted upon") called forth by human desire. Manifest phantasms (実像幻想, jitsuzou gensou) that take form via the aggregation of ideation (想念, sounen, lit. "thought"). For materialization (実体化, kittaika, lit. "manifestation to material") occur, "a form fabricated by humans" is necessary. Not True Demons, but existences that obtain being by the imposition of a Designation (個体名, kotai-mei, lit. "unit designation").
As Demons attain true freedom upon receiving a Designation, it is a general rule that the naming of Demons is not an act to lightly engage within.
Temporarily setting aside the outcomes of engaging with such, Demons may be assessed as allies of humanity, who exist so as to empathize with and resolve the sufferings of humanity.​
Goetia, incidentally, mentions that he was granted a Designation. He also describes himself as spawning from the distortions in the hearts of men.

In the Final Singularity:
私は全能だった。
I was omnipotent.
ソロモンがそう創ったからではない。
It was not omnipotence possessed because Solomon created me thus.
我々はもとより人間の精神活動の 歪(ひず)みとして生まれ、
We were originally born of Distortions within the activities of the human psyche --
名称と能力を獲得した 魔神(もの)を束ねた 群体(もの)。
a Collective of Demon Gods (魔神, Majin, lit. "jinn") which had obtained Names and Powers.
は初めから超越者であり、
I was from the beginning a Transcendent One,
我々になった時、全能の力と視点を得た。
and when I became We, omnipotence and omniscience were had.
TL;DR Demons need names to "exist." True Demons exist without needing names.

EDIT:

Found this in Extra CCC Material:
真性悪魔【事柄】
True Demon [Circumstances]

EXTRA世界にあっても、悪魔の概念は人類にとって最大の障害として扱われる,
Even in the world of Extra, the concept of Demons (悪魔の概念, akuma no gainen) is by humanity treated (扱われる, atsukawareru) as the greatest of obstacles (最大の障害, saidai no shougai);
神が全知全能であるのなら、悪魔は人知無能の存在。
so as God is to omniscience and omnipotence (全知全能, zenchi zenou), so as demons as an existence are to mortal levels of awareness and impotence (人知無能, Jinchi Munou, lit. "human intellect and impotence").
手の届く範囲にありながら決して理解できない淵(ふち)だ。
They are as an abyss (淵, fuchi) that lies within arm's reach (手の届く範囲, te no todoku han'i. lit. "the boundary of an arm's reach"), yet decisively (決して, keshite) beyond comprehension (理解できない, rikai-dekinai, lit. "incomprehensible").
staynightにおいて悪魔は偽物しか存在せず、
Distinct from those demons from staynight, which exist only as imitations (偽物, nisemono),
本物───受肉した悪魔に人間は太刀打ちできないとされる。
the real thing -- Enfleshed Demons (受肉した悪魔, juniku-shita akuma, lit. "incarnated Demon") are that with which humans are incapable of competing (太刀打ちできない, tachi-uchi-dekinai, lit. "incapable of crossing swords").
※受肉した悪魔を退散させた例は一件のみ記録されているが、それはまた別の話
※There is in record only a single instance in which an Enfleshed Demon was forced to disperse (退散, taisan, lit. "disperse / retreat"), but that's a different story.
たいてい悪魔は憑くものとされ、人間の体を用いて受肉しようと働くが、
In general, demons are existences that take possession (憑く, tsuku), utilizing the corpus of a human to incarnate (受肉, juniku) and take action,
苗床になる人間の精神が耐えられず、周囲に魔をまき散らして自壊するのが通例。
but in the event the psyche (精神, seishin) of the human host (苗床になる人間, naedoko ni naru ningen, lit. "the human that becomes the seed-bed") cannot withstand the strain, it is commonplace (通例, tsuurei, lit. "common example") for self-annihilation (自壊, jikai) to occur, dispersing the essence of the demon into the vicinity.
中には自らの業によって人間ではなくなってしまい、結果的に悪魔のカテゴリーに含まれる人間もいるが、
There exist also humans who by way of their own acts (業, gō, lit. 'sins; worldly preoccupations / fixations / absorptions; karma') are subsumed unto the category of Demons as a result of losing their humanity;
これは魔人化と呼ばれるもので真性悪魔ではない。
but these creatures that are said to have become Fiends (魔人, Majin) cannot be considered True Demons.
EXTRA世界において、悪魔憑きであれ、自らの業で変化したものであれ、
In the world of Extra -- whether by way of Demonic possession, or in the circumstance that one's own actions bring about a transformation --
真性悪魔を生み出した現象は2030年現在、一つの成功例もない。
the phenomenon whereby a True Demon is birthed unto the world has, as of present day in 2030, not been brought successful fruition even once.
悪魔、魔人化、と銘打ってはいるが、その在り方は異なる文明圏、異なる惑星に住まう高次元生命体と変わらない。
Though the classifications of "Demons" and "Fiends" do exist, their manner of existence is in essence indistinguishable from that of a higher-order lifeform (高次元生命体, kou-jigen seimeitai, lit. "higher-dimension lifeform") that inhabits a different sphere of civilization (異なる文明圏, koto-naru bunmei-ken) upon a different planet (異なる惑星, koto-naru wakusei).
なにしろこの認識宇宙における『人』ではなくなったのだから。
In sum, said existences can, per the recognition of the Universe of Awareness (認識宇宙, ninshiki-uchuu, lit. 'the universe derived of observation / perception'), no longer be discerned as "human."
その在り方は二十世紀に流行した、とある創作神話における邪神の在り方に近い。
Their existences would approximate to that of the cosmic horrors (邪神, jashin, lit. 'evil god') of a certain fictitious Mythos popular in the 20th century.
CCCの真ルートで変生《へんじょう》したある人物はこの域に達しながら、些細なミスによって神の座から転落した。
In the True Route of CCC, a certain individual that has undergone transmigration did indeed manage to reach this realm, but owing to a slight mistake, they were capsized from the Seat of Divinity (神の座).
I guess Extraverse added powerlevels to the discussion ...

EDIT 2: Added corrections to the Extra CCC entry.
 
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He does not have Galvanism; that skill doesn't make that much sense when it comes to Tesla.

He'd have three NP's; the ability to summon electrified doves that shoot lasers as his familiars, his tesla coils, and the ability to summon the internet as a Reality Marble (he was a pioneer of wireless communications) which grants him the ability to make his more terrifying mad science projects; but it also increases his ranks in Mental Pollution and isn't entirely under his control, so it has a chance of backfiring horribly.

Are they really Noble Phantasms however? the first one and second one just don't seem like great Noble Phantasm ideas. I guess you could make a third one based on internet or his whole wireless power transfer. but why a reality marble? Doves are a funny tale but is it Noble Phantasm worthy? Tesla Coils would work better as stuff made from Item Construction I'd say.

Galvanism makes plenty sense considering that he's associated with both energy and electricity.

In the end while it's a good amount of wank, F/GO Tesla also fits pretty well into established Nasu stuff I'd say.

It just feels a bit weak in a way? There are good things to making a Tesla like this but there's something that just feels lacking. I guess it's mainly that I don't feel like something important or something that defines him, or his accomplishments/contributions to humanity are fully represented in some unique manner with his Noble Phantasm.
 
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It just feels a bit weak in a way? There are good things to making a Tesla like this but there's something that just feels lacking. I guess it's mainly that I don't feel like something important or something that defines him, or his accomplishments/contributions to humanity are fully represented in some unique manner with his Noble Phantasm.
Honestly I'm of the other opinion. Aside from the fact that I'm very much not a fan of "Wisdom of the X" type skills like Natural Genius, his NP is all about how he tamed lightning and brought electricity under the control of humanity, except it wasn't just Tesla that did that, despite what Fate claims. Add in that Sakurai has already written a VN with Tesla and is extremely fond of him and it's just a little aggravating.
 
Honestly I'm of the other opinion. Aside from the fact that I'm very much not a fan of "Wisdom of the X" type skills like Natural Genius, his NP is all about how he tamed lightning and brought electricity under the control of humanity, except it wasn't just Tesla that did that, despite what Fate claims. Add in that Sakurai has already written a VN with Tesla and is extremely fond of him and it's just a little aggravating.

Don't get me wrong, Sakurai stuff is generally aggravating and I agree with you. Butfor stuff about Tesla and electricity you still have to admit that the common perception of electricity evokes Tesla more than anyone else.

Imperial Privilege, Wisdom of X, Natural Genius and other such skills that are "I have all the skills" are terrible, yeah.

Still, laser doves and tesla coils just don't feel like worthy Noble Phantasms at all. You could easily have them in there as non-Noble Phantasm things.
 
Honestly I'm of the other opinion. Aside from the fact that I'm very much not a fan of "Wisdom of the X" type skills like Natural Genius, his NP is all about how he tamed lightning and brought electricity under the control of humanity, except it wasn't just Tesla that did that, despite what Fate claims. Add in that Sakurai has already written a VN with Tesla and is extremely fond of him and it's just a little aggravating.
Maybe a better Np would represent something like how he he made all this devices yet was exploited for them and left to dry.
 
Honestly, if we're talking Tesla, the obvious thing seems to be making him a relatively weak Caster as most modern Casters are, but give him the death laser thing as a trump card. Not the time-space breaking superlightning that he robbed from the gods or something like that.

Imperial Privilege, Wisdom of X, Natural Genius and other such skills that are "I have all the skills" are terrible, yeah.
The only one of those I find even a little bit okay is Wisdom of the Divine Gift, and even then only because Chiron has a damn good reason for having it. Stuff like Natural Genius where it's "lol genius i have all the skills" and Wisdom of the Abyss where it's "lol i live in the ass-end of scotland for ages i have all the skills" are just really really bad.
 
You know, I have this question that's burning at the back of my mind..

Besides memery, why are Nobunaga and Atilla The Hun girls!?
Like, I get Saber(ambiguous enough and not confirmed person), and Yorimitsu(mixed up with another legendary figure who was a girl), Jack and Nursery Rhyme(not actual people, are concepts and feelings, and ideas given form)...

But why the shit Nobu and Atilla!?
They were both clearly men, recorded down in history as being men, so why!?
 
Plus, y'know, I posted the blatantly-Jeanne image from the same artist in the same pose and outfit.
 
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