The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%
  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%

  • Total voters
    738
Honestly I think that most of the High Council is going to want to keep our military forces here in the Trust as much as possible for now. If the Eldar ask about it later we can consider.
I don't think we'd be able to send significant numbers of troops to the Eldar at least not enough to really impact our line of battle.

However, I do not think that the council would get pissy if we increased the number we're sending now, especially with how much we've expanded our forces since we sent the initial group, specially since they're doing such good work kicking ass and saving peeps.
 
The arguments need some cleanup/editing/general changes. I've had a long ass day so I'm feeling a bit wiped and will need to motivate myself to do that if nobody else does.

Oh, and your second line on the Eldar favors proposal needs the format fixed.




Honestly I think that most of the High Council is going to want to keep our military forces here in the Trust as much as possible for now. If the Eldar ask about it later we can consider.
Be more specific and I will clean up and edit it
 
Further to the suggestions of @Nurgle and @Doomed Wombat , @Durin how useful would a dedicated foreign legion be to the Empire of Ashes, and how significant would its contribution be to the wider struggle against the forces of Chaos and other hostile powers? How many favours would such assistance to the Empire of Ashes be worth?
 
Well, I ended up throwing together my own version of things. Here you guys go.

[X] Vote for Champion Surt's proposal to increase the tithe
-[X] Argument 1: The Trust's elites have allowed it to punch above its weight against many dangerous foes, and will surely continue to do so. Ensuring that worlds can supply them in larger numbers is good for the security of the Trust.
-[X] Argument 2: Given the upcoming tech trade, it is very likely that we will receive new technologies that will enhance the Trust's industrial capacity, which will increase the amount that worlds are able to tithe. As such, we may be able to lower the tithe rate once these technologies are implemented due to that increase.

[X] Vote to puruse a merger with the Dragon's Nest
-[X] Argument: The benefits of merging with the Dragon's Nest will outweigh the negatives. Improving their existing infrastructure with our technology would provide a major boost to the Trust's total production capacity, and in time would outstrip growth from elsewhere. For negatives, we are already obligated by our alliance to send forces to fight for them in the event of them being attacked, so while merging increases that it doesn't increase our obligations from being nothing. With regards to the security issues, it's already very likely that some of our tech will end up stolen, though the Chaotic polities will not be all that likely to share it with eachother, and we can further mitigate that though a careful merger where we dedicate the right resources to rooting out infiltrators, improving internal security within the Dragon's Nest, and improving the technology of worlds only as they meet security goals.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to have Saint Lin healed as best as they can manage.
-[] Saint Lin is a living treasure who was granted knowledge from the Emperor himself, and extending his lifespan has many benefits. He is a one of a kind resource for research into certain esoteric subjects, including Chaos and how to fight it, and cannot be replaced. His death will also be a blow to the Trust's morale when it occurs, so it would be good to delay it.

EDIT - removing the argument since it's a little dry, and probably not necessary.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to decode the locked data jewels we possess.
-[X] Decoding the data jewels on our own will take an immense amount of Archmagos Tranth's and Grandmaster Ridcully's time, and the Eldar have the ability to save much of that by doing it quickly. They both have other tasks that they could be doing that would be of great value to the Trust, so this time savings would be worth it. Further, we would have access to the technology and knowledge in the crystals earlier, allowing the Trust to benefit from those technologies sooner than later, and possibly use that data in the upcoming tech trade. The Eldar also wouldn't really gain anything from it, since their tech base is already extremely advanced and based on different principles.

[X] Propose that we talk to the Eldar during the upcoming meeting about possibly continuing to loan the troops to them that we did to pay for the upcoming meeting. This should not be done for free, but earning even minor favors from the Empire of Ashes shouldn't be discounted given how much they are worth.
 
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Further to the suggestions of @Nurgle and @Doomed Wombat , @Durin how useful would a dedicated foreign legion be to the Empire of Ashes, and how significant would its contribution be to the wider struggle against the forces of Chaos and other hostile powers? How many favours would such assistance to the Empire of Ashes be worth?

While useful we can't send enough to truly change the outcome of desperate actions. The guys we sent are going around dealing with minor issues on their own or as part of a larger task-force the first group we sent was 500,000 Helguard, 2 Household of Knights (not sure how many this is, maniple is 5 knights, court is 208 maniples), and 300 space marines (two companies). A strong force by any standard but relatively few in numbers. Now we could probably afford to send at least another force twice this size with out risking our own defenses. With all three forces together a lot more can be done. As for favor at least a minor one for 1,500,000 Helguard, 6 households, and 900 marines is a force capable of turning most battles.
 
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While useful we can't send enough to truly change the outcome of desperate actions. The guys we sent are going around dealing with minor issues on their own or as part of a larger task-force the first group we sent was 500,000 Helguard, 2 Household of Knights (not sure how many this is, maniple is 5 knights, court is 208 maniples), and 300 space marines (two companies). A strong force by any standard but relatively few in numbers. Now we could probably afford to send at least another force twice this size with out risking our own defenses. With all three forces together a lot more can be done. As for favor at least a minor one for 1,500,000 Helguard, 6 households, and 900 marines is a force capable of turning most battles.
To be honest, as far as I can tell our military contributions to the Eldar will only ever really be minimal, unless we shared some truly apocalyptic DAoT artifact that punched way above even DAoT humanity's tech level. They have larger forces that are more powerful than anything our elites could possibly bring to the table. It's part of the reason why I want to know if it's really worthwhile to send this military aid or not. I suspect the only thing we can really do to help is continue lending the assistance of Ridcully, or any other Seers of similar power who crop up.
 
To be honest, as far as I can tell our military contributions to the Eldar will only ever really be minimal, unless we shared some truly apocalyptic DAoT artifact that punched way above even DAoT humanity's tech level. They have larger forces that are more powerful than anything our elites could possibly bring to the table. It's part of the reason why I want to know if it's really worthwhile to send this military aid or not. I suspect the only thing we can really do to help is continue lending the assistance of Ridcully, or any other Seers of similar power who crop up.
It is worth it. Even if it doesn't help much in the grand galactic game, it does give us cool stuff through the accumulation of credits and favours.
 
Well, I ended up throwing together my own version of things. Here you guys go.

[X] Vote for Champion Surt's proposal to increase the tithe
-[X] Argument 1: The Trust's elites have allowed it to punch above its weight against many dangerous foes, and will surely continue to do so. Ensuring that worlds can supply them in larger numbers is good for the security of the Trust.
-[X] Argument 2: Given the upcoming tech trade, it is very likely that we will receive new technologies that will enhance the Trust's industrial capacity, which will increase the amount that worlds are able to tithe. As such, we may be able to lower the tithe rate once these technologies are implemented due to that increase.

[X] Vote to puruse a merger with the Dragon's Nest
-[X] Argument: The benefits of merging with the Dragon's Nest will outweigh the negatives. Improving their existing infrastructure with our technology would provide a major boost to the Trust's total production capacity, and in time would outstrip growth from elsewhere. For negatives, we are already obligated by our alliance to send forces to fight for them in the event of them being attacked, so while merging increases that it doesn't increase our obligations from being nothing. With regards to the security issues, it's already very likely that some of our tech will end up stolen, though the Chaotic polities will not be all that likely to share it with eachother, and we can further mitigate that though a careful merger where we dedicate the right resources to rooting out infiltrators, improving internal security within the Dragon's Nest, and improving the technology of worlds only as they meet security goals.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to have Saint Lin healed as best as they can manage.
-[X] Saint Lin is a living treasure who was granted knowledge from the Emperor himself, and extending his lifespan has many benefits. He is a one of a kind resource for research into certain esoteric subjects, including Chaos and how to fight it, and cannot be replaced. His death will also be a blow to the Trust's morale when it occurs, so it would be good to delay it.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to decode the locked data jewels we possess.
-[X] Decoding the data jewels on our own will take an immense amount of Archmagos Tranth's and Grandmaster Ridcully's time, and the Eldar have the ability to save much of that by doing it quickly. They both have other tasks that they could be doing that would be of great value to the Trust, so this time savings would be worth it. Further, we would have access to the technology and knowledge in the crystals earlier, allowing the Trust to benefit from those technologies sooner than later, and possibly use that data in the upcoming tech trade. The Eldar also wouldn't really gain anything from it, since their tech base is already extremely advanced and based on different principles.

[X] Propose that we talk to the Eldar during the upcoming meeting about possibly continuing to loan the troops to them that we did to pay for the upcoming meeting. This should not be done for free, but earning even minor favors from the Empire of Ashes shouldn't be discounted given how much they are worth.

@Durin
1. Does any of the above sway any of the fence sitters on any of the votes?
 
To be honest, as far as I can tell our military contributions to the Eldar will only ever really be minimal, unless we shared some truly apocalyptic DAoT artifact that punched way above even DAoT humanity's tech level. They have larger forces that are more powerful than anything our elites could possibly bring to the table. It's part of the reason why I want to know if it's really worthwhile to send this military aid or not. I suspect the only thing we can really do to help is continue lending the assistance of Ridcully, or any other Seers of similar power who crop up.
Actually our units skill and equipment do make it worth it. They are that good even compared to what the Eldar have. They don't have the numbers even with the wraiths they are spread thin. The units we send are powerful and skilled enough to be useful in many situations. We won't be winning any wars on our own for them but holding a flank or launching a deep strike against certain enemies is not to be taken lightly.
 
[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to have Saint Lin healed as best as they can manage.
-[X] Saint Lin is a living treasure who was granted knowledge from the Emperor himself, and extending his lifespan has many benefits. He is a one of a kind resource for research into certain esoteric subjects, including Chaos and how to fight it, and cannot be replaced. His death will also be a blow to the Trust's morale when it occurs, so it would be good to delay it.
This argument feels bad. It argues too much about his material value, which is bad given our reputation for ruthlessness. It should be balanced out with moral and sentimental reasons for why we should keep him around.
 
[X] Vote for Champion Surt's proposal to increase the tithe
-[X] Argument 1: The Trust's elites have allowed it to punch above its weight against many dangerous foes, and will surely continue to do so. Ensuring that worlds can supply them in larger numbers is good for the security of the Trust.
-[X] Argument 2: Given the upcoming tech trade, it is very likely that we will receive new technologies that will enhance the Trust's industrial capacity, which will increase the amount that worlds are able to tithe. As such, we may be able to lower the tithe rate once these technologies are implemented due to that increase.

[X] Vote to puruse a merger with the Dragon's Nest
-[X] Argument: The benefits of merging with the Dragon's Nest will outweigh the negatives. Improving their existing infrastructure with our technology would provide a major boost to the Trust's total production capacity, and in time would outstrip growth from elsewhere. For negatives, we are already obligated by our alliance to send forces to fight for them in the event of them being attacked, so while merging increases that it doesn't increase our obligations from being nothing. With regards to the security issues, it's already very likely that some of our tech will end up stolen, though the Chaotic polities will not be all that likely to share it with eachother, and we can further mitigate that though a careful merger where we dedicate the right resources to rooting out infiltrators, improving internal security within the Dragon's Nest, and improving the technology of worlds only as they meet security goals.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to have Saint Lin healed as best as they can manage.
-[X] Saint Lin is a living treasure who was granted knowledge from the Emperor himself, and extending his lifespan has many benefits. He is a one of a kind resource for research into certain esoteric subjects, including Chaos and how to fight it, and cannot be replaced. His death will also be a blow to the Trust's morale when it occurs, so it would be good to delay it.

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to decode the locked data jewels we possess.
-[X] Decoding the data jewels on our own will take an immense amount of Archmagos Tranth's and Grandmaster Ridcully's time, and the Eldar have the ability to save much of that by doing it quickly. They both have other tasks that they could be doing that would be of great value to the Trust, so this time savings would be worth it. Further, we would have access to the technology and knowledge in the crystals earlier, allowing the Trust to benefit from those technologies sooner than later, and possibly use that data in the upcoming tech trade. The Eldar also wouldn't really gain anything from it, since their tech base is already extremely advanced and based on different principles.

Meh. I don't really care for a foreign legion whatever. I would wait untill Imperial Trust becomes less xenophobic before aiding the demo bros to such a degree.
 
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@Enjou Suggestions:
A) A limited tech release to the nearby imperial remnants and gifting them whatever leftover imperial era equipment we have clogging up our armories? Costs us basically nothing, and it allows us to clear out inventory clutter.

B) Also, authorize the security council to begin a limited, sustained offensive to target the assorted ork and chaos scrubs in the area, with the following target criteria:
1. Ork or Chaos Polities in position to threaten the imperial remnants. (Because they're the ones in position to actually accomplish something)
2. Minor chaos polities suspected of spying on the trust or nest, or being used as a staging point by those who are.
3. Chaos Polities that Demagoye is in a position to absorb.
4. Scrubs dumb enough to raid the Trust
5. Scrubs dumb enough to raid Dragon's Nest.
6. Randoms
7. Scrubs raiding people we don't like. (EG, orks poking Necrons or Chaos, ect.)
 
A couple of things @Enjou

[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to have Saint Lin healed as best as they can manage.
-[X] Saint Lin is a living treasure who was granted knowledge from the Emperor himself, and extending his lifespan has many benefits. He is a one of a kind resource for research into certain esoteric subjects, including Chaos and how to fight it, and cannot be replaced. His death will also be a blow to the Trust's morale when it occurs, so it would be good to delay it.

I will try to add the idea that prolonging his life even a few more decades could potentially mean his complete healing and the idea that it is a race against time (so the Eldar´s can free Isha), and even if it is a small chance of actually working it is still worth it.
[X] Propose spending a Minor Favor with the Eldar to decode the locked data jewels we possess.
-[X] Decoding the data jewels on our own will take an immense amount of Archmagos Tranth's and Grandmaster Ridcully's time, and the Eldar have the ability to save much of that by doing it quickly. They both have other tasks that they could be doing that would be of great value to the Trust, so this time savings would be worth it. Further, we would have access to the technology and knowledge in the crystals earlier, allowing the Trust to benefit from those technologies sooner than later, and possibly use that data in the upcoming tech trade. The Eldar also wouldn't really gain anything from it, since their tech base is already extremely advanced and based on different principles.
I would also point here that the Eldar won´t get their hands on the designs... and that they would only provide the codes so that the Mechanicus can use it later.

[X] Enjou
 
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This argument feels bad. It argues too much about his material value, which is bad given our reputation for ruthlessness. It should be balanced out with moral and sentimental reasons for why we should keep him around.

Weren't you one of the people saying that we shouldn't add things that aren't necessary? We actually do have a ton of legit reasons to keep Lin alive with him being a saint means that everyone else also wants to keep him alive.
 
I meant the ones in position to threaten the 8 or so unaffiliated worlds in our immediate area.
Alright that makes much more sense. Yeah we should push for that. We can get the DN to help form some task forces now that our navies are large enough, go around and beat down the minors. We really should concentrate on the ork first though they are the biggest exponential threat.
 
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