Noblesse Oblige [Znt/SI]
She's a twin so she would've been killed.
MutantRancor
[Suspected Sithspawn]
- Location
- Kashyyyk. I'm a Wookiee, can't you tell?
Who else thinks that Henry will name Karin as his champion if he gets challenged to a duel over this? Assuming that he doesn't, for whatever reason, fight the duel himself.
- Location
- Kansas
Actually, you know what? I think Henry should be completely truthful with Charles. He should tell him strait out that while he was searching for Josette, he got word that their were plots to kill the twin if she was found. He figured it would be safer for her if she were to simply disappear until Joseph was confirmed king and twin nieces would no longer be a threat to the thrown.
See completely honest. True that wasn't the order the events happened it, but it isn't his fault people think in happened in the order he listed them in.
See completely honest. True that wasn't the order the events happened it, but it isn't his fault people think in happened in the order he listed them in.
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That doesn't sound like Henry. Aside for the fact that Henry has not been one to run to his mother for help, there is also political angle to consider. Calling a foreign noble as a champion? Proooooobably not a good idea.
GiftOfLove
From the Heart
Inb4 Joseph murders his brother because he likes Henry better.
"I never did get my daughter a wedding present."
"I never did get my daughter a wedding present."
When dealing with hereditary succession twins, especially same sex twins, are a major threat to the nations stability. With normal siblings their is hierarchy of age to help mitigate things. Not the case with twins. With twins they where both born more or less at the same time so neither one would have already been groomed for the position when the other is old enough to start looking for their place in the world.
Now it may seem unfair to us to expect two parents to kill on of their children at birth. But honestly the thousands of lives that would be lost in a war for succession outweigh their happiness something fierce. It's kinda like the fact that catholic priests aren't allowed to get married, and for similar reasoning: wise politics masquerading as religious superstition. Sure if you look at now and wonder why catholic priests can't get married and are supposed to be chaste you may say "well that's dumb religious superstition". But if instead you look at the history and see the wars, the willing of cathedrals and more that resulted from it you'd instead see that it was a logical answer to the political climate of the past. Namely to insure their children would be bastards and thus unable to inherit anything, let alone the catholic church.
- Location
- Lynn, MA
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Don't think we have to worry about that. Joseph already said he would be sad if Henry managed to kill his brother.
Is there any reason you can't publicly designate one as the heir and work from there?
Unless you maim one of the twins, they could be changed anytime.
Let's say you marry one of the twin to an country and the other to an other one. If they exchange their place for wathever reason, the political consequence would be dire. Like the whole succession line isn't certain anymore.
- Location
- Lynn, MA
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
Because they are Identical they can easily switch places with one another. This can be used to take power from the rightful heir, or as a reason to incite civil war by outsiders and by those wish wish to seek power, all they'd have to do is silence one of the twins and coerce the other. It is a bad thing to have politically speaking. If they weren't identical it would be another story entirely, but they are so it posed a problem.
Chaoswind
Lord of nonsense
- Location
- Latin America
The man in the iron mask.
A political opponent will use the discarded less lucky twin to subvert the succession.
Twins create too many problems and produce no advantages
Get the spare a visible tattoo. Problem solved - the two are now easily distinguishable.
In what way is this situation worse than with siblings?
- Location
- Lynn, MA
- Pronouns
- He/Him/His
If everyone knows about the tattoo then it can be easily replicated on to the other twin. The same works with scars and such. An identifying mark only works if very few people know what it is, and even then that can be abused as well. The easiest and simplest solution is to get rid of one of the twins, and while it isn't very kind it is a sure fire way to prevent any of the mentioned scenarios from coming into play. All this discussion though is meaningless because neither of twins are next in line to the throne now that Joseph has been named King.
Brilliant plan. You're going to use his daugter as a shield.
I suggested getting the spare the tattoo, not the heir. If you replicated said tattoo, the best you could do was getting the heir to pose as the spare, which is of course useless.
Chaoswind
Lord of nonsense
- Location
- Latin America
And how are you going to stop your political opponents from fixing the "spare" twin?
A tattoo can be easily erased, Scars as well as the only ones we see are considered a mark of pride or have been in people too poor to get a mage to get rid of them... The only thing that would work is dismemberment and this a setting in with mages have been known to transplant entire limbs (and in one case a brain) so that one cannot be assured to work either.
The only thing that will work 100% fool proof is to get rid of one of the twins.
Sonifri
Is this the face of a villain?
- Location
- Texas
Henry let his open shirt fall off a shoulder exposing his chest slightly. He offers the duke a blunt of the finest herb in his garden.
The duke falls unconscious.
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Now thats an idea,
Step1 get him stoned up to his eyeballs
Step 2 introduce long thought dead daughter
Step 3 ...?
Step 4 profit?
Edit: why is the Y next to the T? and why is daughter so hard to spell?
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That's brilliant.
No really. That's fucking brilliant.
Maybe they could bring Joseph too.
Chapter Ninety
- Location
- https://discord.gg/z9tBvbh
Chapter Ninety
It is by accepting one's own fault, and shouldering responsibilities, that one grows as a person. Those who run away, or shy from their duties-they will never achieve anything of worth. If such duty requires to stand in front of a father whose daughter you kidnapped, and hid from him, then so be it.
"You hid my daughter from me," the Duke D'Orleans spoke crisply, without heat in his voice, but without any form of peaceful intentions either. A spell to remove illusions had been cast, and yet when Josette had remained her blue-haired self and with her traits as they were, Marie D'Orleans had rushed with tears and screams of delight to hug her long lost daughter, clutching her tightly as if afraid she'd go away if she dropped the hold.
"You renounced her in the first place," I replied firmly, locking eyes with the man. "You left her in the monastery of Saint Margarita-when I found out, I recovered her to give her the life she should have had."
"And when I came begging my brother to look for her-you already had her by then, did you not?" Charles asked, his lips thin in displeasure. "Yet, you still went looking for her. How much did my brother laugh at my misery? How much did he truly enjoy seeing me beg for his help? I loved my brother, and he-"
"Strange way of showing your love to him, causing troubles with retainers and buying off loyal subjects," I answered dryly, snorting and raising a hand in dismissal. "Don't claim innocence, Duke. It might work with the court, and it might work with your family, but you aren't perfect-and I know it intrinsically well." I narrowed my eyes. "Also, your brother did not know until much, much later. He found out when I brought back the corpse, to be honest."
"What reason was there for such a thing?!" the Duke snarled, "If you had given her back before-then I wouldn't have been fit as future king, wouldn't that be for the best?"
"The crown would have gone to Joseph regardless of her presence or not," I said honestly, "the only reason I didn't give her back earlier was because she wouldn't have been happy having to live risking her life. After all, if she were to die, then the chances of you inheriting the thrones would have gone back up right away, wouldn't they?"
"You..." Charles hissed, "Are you implying I would have my own daughter...killed?"
"I am not implying," I answered honestly. "The problem of people with pretty faces and warm smiles is that when they're lying, you can't be sure of it until you read their minds. Unfortunately, that's not something possible, so...did I dare take the risk with someone like you? In the end, I chose not to risk Josette's life."
Charles laughed at that, "You chose not to? You did it for her? Is that your excuse? The noble excuse you are going to use? Why not say it's all my brother's fault? He'd be petty enough to think this sort of thing, and don't think I haven't seen the ring at Isabella's finger-"
"The King is innocent," I snapped curtly. "It was my idea, my plan and myself who brought it all to completion. If you want to blame someone-then blame me. Joseph might have wished to take the blame in my stead, but I am the sole man responsible and guilty of it."
The Duke D'Orleans nodded firmly, "This calls for a duel," he said then, grasping one of his gloves and gingerly removing it. He then let it fall on the ground, bringing out his swordwand, eyes narrow. "I will need no second, nor nominate a champion."
"Neither will-" I replied calmly, only to be interrupted.
"Uncle! Henry!" Isabella's sharp voice was mixed with the utter paleness of her face, "What are you two thinking?!"
"Charles-please, we have our daughter back, our Josette," Marie D'Orleans pleaded as she held tightly to her chest Josette, "Don't spill blood on this day."
"Please don't!" Josette pleaded earnestly too, "Please-father...please."
Charles took a small breath, and for a brief instant, I thought it would work. I really thought it would work. "No," he said in the end, crushing my hopes that this would end without bloodshed.
I swallowed, and then nodded. "Very well," I said. "Then-the shores of the Ragdorian lake," I added.
"I will not stop until satisfied," Charles said firmly, glaring at me.
"May the gods be with me then," I answered in turn, and turned to walk away from him, and his family. We would meet by the shores of the lake, and there...there we would face each other. To the death, perhaps not. Till one of us could no longer fight, perhaps yes. To first blood? I doubted he'd stop at first blood.
Raven flew right down by my side, his breathing short, his eyes wide as he shared my inwards fears, but externalized them too. "Henry!" he cawed, his voice practically joined with that of Isabella, who drew near with her hands clasped together.
"Please think this through! It's not too late-a public apology, a written apology, an oath by the Founder-anything! Uncle looked mad-he is mad-he's going to kill you!" she babbled, but I simply shook my head and rubbed her hair once, much to her visible anger as she swatted my hand away.
"He'll hurt me really, really bad," I acquiesced. "But once he's satisfied..." I smiled, "Everything will be fine once more."
Isabella remained red with anger all the same. "You-" she hissed, "You stupid imbecile!" she yelled next, "It's like you don't care about me, or my opinion! I'm your wife-I'm your crown-princess! Henry-I command you-"
In answer, I knelt to be on a lower level than her, "You can most certainly command me to do so," I acquiesced, "And you can most certainly force me to do so," I added, "You can order me, and you can force me-but...ask yourself this," I remarked as Isabella took time to breathe, "after you've done that, after you've forced me like that-can you be sure I'll forgive you for such a thing?" I said gently. "I care about you, Isabella. And I care about your opinion. However...do you care about my opinion? Do you care about me?" I asked her, "Sometimes, we have to let the people we love do stupid things, because it's what they desperately want to do."
"You're throwing yourself in the fire head first!" Isabella wrung her hands, grasping hold of my cheeks with a firm tenacity and ferociousness the likes of which I had felt only by Eleonore's hands, "Don't you dare think I don't care about you, my Henry! But this-this is a madness bordering on the suicidal! You won't win! You have no chances at winning! No chances at all!"
"You don't know that," I managed to answer even as my cheeks began to burn from the pulling and squeezing and pinching they were subjected to. "You'll have to trust me."
Isabella's hands pulled my face towards her, and as she firmly planted a kiss on my lips, she let go a second later. "You better come back," she hissed. "You better."
I smiled, "You are the queen of my heart. Every one of your words...is my command. Also," I said as I stood back up, "I'm backed up by my trustworthy familiar. He's had my back for a long time now...he won't disappoint me."
"I won't!" Raven cawed with a nod, "Valhalla awaits...but it can keep waiting for us!" he added, gingerly rubbing his giant head against the sides of mine.
This made me chuckle, even as I grabbed hold of the soft feathers and inwardly prayed to the gods for a miracle to happen.
I was so screwed.
I was so screwed...it wasn't even funny how much I was screwed.
It is by accepting one's own fault, and shouldering responsibilities, that one grows as a person. Those who run away, or shy from their duties-they will never achieve anything of worth. If such duty requires to stand in front of a father whose daughter you kidnapped, and hid from him, then so be it.
"You hid my daughter from me," the Duke D'Orleans spoke crisply, without heat in his voice, but without any form of peaceful intentions either. A spell to remove illusions had been cast, and yet when Josette had remained her blue-haired self and with her traits as they were, Marie D'Orleans had rushed with tears and screams of delight to hug her long lost daughter, clutching her tightly as if afraid she'd go away if she dropped the hold.
"You renounced her in the first place," I replied firmly, locking eyes with the man. "You left her in the monastery of Saint Margarita-when I found out, I recovered her to give her the life she should have had."
"And when I came begging my brother to look for her-you already had her by then, did you not?" Charles asked, his lips thin in displeasure. "Yet, you still went looking for her. How much did my brother laugh at my misery? How much did he truly enjoy seeing me beg for his help? I loved my brother, and he-"
"Strange way of showing your love to him, causing troubles with retainers and buying off loyal subjects," I answered dryly, snorting and raising a hand in dismissal. "Don't claim innocence, Duke. It might work with the court, and it might work with your family, but you aren't perfect-and I know it intrinsically well." I narrowed my eyes. "Also, your brother did not know until much, much later. He found out when I brought back the corpse, to be honest."
"What reason was there for such a thing?!" the Duke snarled, "If you had given her back before-then I wouldn't have been fit as future king, wouldn't that be for the best?"
"The crown would have gone to Joseph regardless of her presence or not," I said honestly, "the only reason I didn't give her back earlier was because she wouldn't have been happy having to live risking her life. After all, if she were to die, then the chances of you inheriting the thrones would have gone back up right away, wouldn't they?"
"You..." Charles hissed, "Are you implying I would have my own daughter...killed?"
"I am not implying," I answered honestly. "The problem of people with pretty faces and warm smiles is that when they're lying, you can't be sure of it until you read their minds. Unfortunately, that's not something possible, so...did I dare take the risk with someone like you? In the end, I chose not to risk Josette's life."
Charles laughed at that, "You chose not to? You did it for her? Is that your excuse? The noble excuse you are going to use? Why not say it's all my brother's fault? He'd be petty enough to think this sort of thing, and don't think I haven't seen the ring at Isabella's finger-"
"The King is innocent," I snapped curtly. "It was my idea, my plan and myself who brought it all to completion. If you want to blame someone-then blame me. Joseph might have wished to take the blame in my stead, but I am the sole man responsible and guilty of it."
The Duke D'Orleans nodded firmly, "This calls for a duel," he said then, grasping one of his gloves and gingerly removing it. He then let it fall on the ground, bringing out his swordwand, eyes narrow. "I will need no second, nor nominate a champion."
"Neither will-" I replied calmly, only to be interrupted.
"Uncle! Henry!" Isabella's sharp voice was mixed with the utter paleness of her face, "What are you two thinking?!"
"Charles-please, we have our daughter back, our Josette," Marie D'Orleans pleaded as she held tightly to her chest Josette, "Don't spill blood on this day."
"Please don't!" Josette pleaded earnestly too, "Please-father...please."
Charles took a small breath, and for a brief instant, I thought it would work. I really thought it would work. "No," he said in the end, crushing my hopes that this would end without bloodshed.
I swallowed, and then nodded. "Very well," I said. "Then-the shores of the Ragdorian lake," I added.
"I will not stop until satisfied," Charles said firmly, glaring at me.
"May the gods be with me then," I answered in turn, and turned to walk away from him, and his family. We would meet by the shores of the lake, and there...there we would face each other. To the death, perhaps not. Till one of us could no longer fight, perhaps yes. To first blood? I doubted he'd stop at first blood.
Raven flew right down by my side, his breathing short, his eyes wide as he shared my inwards fears, but externalized them too. "Henry!" he cawed, his voice practically joined with that of Isabella, who drew near with her hands clasped together.
"Please think this through! It's not too late-a public apology, a written apology, an oath by the Founder-anything! Uncle looked mad-he is mad-he's going to kill you!" she babbled, but I simply shook my head and rubbed her hair once, much to her visible anger as she swatted my hand away.
"He'll hurt me really, really bad," I acquiesced. "But once he's satisfied..." I smiled, "Everything will be fine once more."
Isabella remained red with anger all the same. "You-" she hissed, "You stupid imbecile!" she yelled next, "It's like you don't care about me, or my opinion! I'm your wife-I'm your crown-princess! Henry-I command you-"
In answer, I knelt to be on a lower level than her, "You can most certainly command me to do so," I acquiesced, "And you can most certainly force me to do so," I added, "You can order me, and you can force me-but...ask yourself this," I remarked as Isabella took time to breathe, "after you've done that, after you've forced me like that-can you be sure I'll forgive you for such a thing?" I said gently. "I care about you, Isabella. And I care about your opinion. However...do you care about my opinion? Do you care about me?" I asked her, "Sometimes, we have to let the people we love do stupid things, because it's what they desperately want to do."
"You're throwing yourself in the fire head first!" Isabella wrung her hands, grasping hold of my cheeks with a firm tenacity and ferociousness the likes of which I had felt only by Eleonore's hands, "Don't you dare think I don't care about you, my Henry! But this-this is a madness bordering on the suicidal! You won't win! You have no chances at winning! No chances at all!"
"You don't know that," I managed to answer even as my cheeks began to burn from the pulling and squeezing and pinching they were subjected to. "You'll have to trust me."
Isabella's hands pulled my face towards her, and as she firmly planted a kiss on my lips, she let go a second later. "You better come back," she hissed. "You better."
I smiled, "You are the queen of my heart. Every one of your words...is my command. Also," I said as I stood back up, "I'm backed up by my trustworthy familiar. He's had my back for a long time now...he won't disappoint me."
"I won't!" Raven cawed with a nod, "Valhalla awaits...but it can keep waiting for us!" he added, gingerly rubbing his giant head against the sides of mine.
This made me chuckle, even as I grabbed hold of the soft feathers and inwardly prayed to the gods for a miracle to happen.
I was so screwed.
I was so screwed...it wasn't even funny how much I was screwed.
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Malbutorius
C'est le bien qui fait mal
I am experiencing pure, unadulterated schadenfreude right now.
Nervos Belli
Don't think this means you've won!
- Location
- Murica
If Charles wants to be truly vindicative, he can let Henry know what it feels like for someone close to him to be dead. Raven should be very careful during this duel. Having a familiar to help is a strength, but also a potential weak spot.