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[Mafia] A Murder of Crows

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Terrabrand said:
Tell you what. If two different people in that pool die tonight, I will not only spare Wiadi personally, I will commit to lynching per Wiadi's choice tomorrow in specific, contingent on the lynch not being a confirmed crow from my perspective (eg me, -rosen, shadell, 1k) or rayday since I am not lightly breaking my word.

That way, Wiadi can shield his teammate if they both expend kills without having to justify it.
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I'd rather not
 
@Nictis
@ItzNarcotic
@Shadell
@Rayday11
@ComiTurtle
@NSMS
@TheMaskedReader
@1KBestK
@QTesseract
@Tykan
@OriginalName
@Wiadi
@-Rosen
@Terrabrand

There are seven crows, four ravens, a Magpie, and two jackdaws left. The crows are going to need to lynch the Jackdaw in order to prevent the Jackdaws from stealing two shinies at the end of the game. The Ravens and the Magpies will see no difference between the Crows and the Jackdaws in terms of threat. So I'm going to make my own offer to the Jackdaws.

Wiadi can kill Rosen, and the other Jackdaw can kill Terrabrand. Your kills will be wasted if they hit the Magpie or if they double up on the same target. Lowering the Crow's numbers will make it easier for you to find the Shinies at the end of the game and will preserve our own numbers from the blind fire. If you do kill the known Crows instead of killing potential Ravens, we will protect you until the end of the game. Let the sixth cycle determine the winner.

Either you can side with the crows that have you wasting your tools or killing ravens, lowering both of our strengths, or you can side with us and we'll let things play out at the end. We'll find and lynch the Magpie, and we'll keep both of our sides strong until the end. We will protect whoever spends their kill.
 
Nictis said:
@Nictis
@ItzNarcotic
@Shadell
@Rayday11
@ComiTurtle
@NSMS
@TheMaskedReader
@1KBestK
@QTesseract
@Tykan
@OriginalName
@Wiadi
@-Rosen
@Terrabrand

There are seven crows, four ravens, a Magpie, and two jackdaws left. The crows are going to need to lynch the Jackdaw in order to prevent the Jackdaws from stealing two shinies at the end of the game. The Ravens and the Magpies will see no difference between the Crows and the Jackdaws in terms of threat. So I'm going to make my own offer to the Jackdaws.

Wiadi can kill Rosen, and the other Jackdaw can kill Terrabrand. Your kills will be wasted if they hit the Magpie or if they double up on the same target. Lowering the Crow's numbers will make it easier for you to find the Shinies at the end of the game and will preserve our own numbers from the blind fire. If you do kill the known Crows instead of killing potential Ravens, we will protect you until the end of the game. Let the sixth cycle determine the winner.

Either you can side with the crows that have you wasting your tools or killing ravens, lowering both of our strengths, or you can side with us and we'll let things play out at the end. We'll find and lynch the Magpie, and we'll keep both of our sides strong until the end. We will protect whoever spends their kill.
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...assuming this is you claiming Raven, why are you coming out with it instead of running it through Rayday, the designated spokesperson?
 
The Magpie can be lynched. The Magpie cannot be killed by a Jackdaw. Shooting into that crowd only narrows the search for the Magpie and for the other Jackdaw, but the field is already narrow enough to find the Magpie without it.

The Magpie is also, still, the smallest threat to any of the factions. Anything it steals can be stolen back. The Crows are the largest faction to hide Shinies in, and will kill the Jackdaws since they're the only ones that can steal after them.
 
Wiadi said:
...assuming this is you claiming Raven, why are you coming out with it instead of running it through Rayday, the designated spokesperson?
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Assuming I am claiming Raven... He's offline and the night is ending in like, two hours. And I'm on the list of people to be shot.
 
Anyways, I've got to go take care of some stuff. Popped online midway through a game of cards with grandparents, saw that you guys suddenly gained kills (@InterstellarHobo What is the order on that btw? After steals? Start of night?) and that I was on the list. Only just got to not be on my phone, and I needed to make sure that either I wouldn't be on that list or that it wouldn't be used immediately.

I am serious about the offer though. From a theft perspective, there's no difference between a crow and you for me, so I'm fine with keeping you alive if it keeps me alive.
 
All right then. That's certainly a better bargain than the Crows have given me so far, considering that many of them seem to be planning my death anyway. Hey Crows: let's hear your counteroffer.
 
Not gonna bother to counter because I have no motivation to play this game anymore, go ahead and kill me or whatever
 
-Sudden burst of inspiration-

Best I can say is that Jackdaws want Ravens dead before they want Crows dead since Ravens have coordination power where Crows don't. If you hard-focus your kills on us then you're making the game harder on yourselves.

Ultimately you guys have the voting power to beat us out, and as it stands right now, I have a feeling the Crows have the most players that can possibly work out the identity of the Magpie in a mechanical sense.

So, @Wiadi, now that this sudden burst of inspiration has hit me, I now have a counter-offer to make: both Jackdaws withhold your kills tonight, in exchange for the Crows' aid in finding the Ravens and the Magpie. Ultimately, all it takes is one more Crow death for you guys to hold voting power over us, and the other two factions are a bigger threat to you, so I think this is entirely fair, as it gives you more of an opportunity to win the game via beating Crows over lack of coordination, rather than trying to beat the Ravens' coordination on your own.
 
Of course, you may alternatively have one of you guys shoot Rayday and have the other withhold their kill, which still furthers your game state.

Regardless, I don't believe using both of your kills is a good idea since the power your kills have increases as the game progresses.
 
Actually, full compromise mode is in action if what I just came up with can work

@Wiadi where do you stand on the value of the Jackdaw kills? Is it something that you would rather wait until endgame to use, or something you would want to utilize to gain the greatest benefit?
 
Wiadi said:
All right then. That's certainly a better bargain than the Crows have given me so far, considering that many of them seem to be planning my death anyway. Hey Crows: let's hear your counteroffer.
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I'm not sure what to tell you, given that:
1. I've only got an hour and 20 mins
2. This sounds like a good offer; if I was a jackdaw, I'd be seriously considering it, and nictis was willing to out himself to support it.
3. You've already seen several crows openly admit to plotting you dead.

That said, I'll make an offer; if you refrain from killing townies willing to work with you, I will argue and vote against your death for the rest of the game. It's more advantageous to the crows to have 2 jackdaws around at Game's end than piss off the jackdaws; even if it means 33% crows 66% jackdaws, or whatever, that's better than splitting the win chance between ravens and jackdaws.
 
What Rosen says is mostly true. Minus the part about coordination power, I think you've made it plenty obvious that you're going to coordinate your night actions when you need to.

And the concern where the Crows need to remove the Jackdaws as the only true threat remains. Unless if you're saying that you are never going to kill the Jackdaws when the Jackdaws are the only ones that can prevent you from winning by stealing out two shinies at the end of things.
 
Counter offer; wiadi, kill nictis, other jackdaw, kill rayday.

I'm not holding to a deal to keep rayday alive if ravens are going to try to buy kills of specificaly multiple confirmed crows. If those two die, I am willing to hold to leaving wiadi permanently alive, and fighting to ensure others go along with it.

I'll even throw in my prior offer for wiadi to direct tommorows lynch.

If Ravens are gonna try to make me lose like that, my goal is officially Ravens Lose.

Because let's remember that nictis just tried to buy a Ravens Cannot Win Scenario to expressly fuck over my team. Tit for tat 'friend'.
 
Potential compromise solution if Wiadi agrees to it:

- Jackdaw kills are directed toward Rayday11 and Shadell.

In exchange:

- Crows work with the Jackdaws to find the Magpie and the Ravens.

The reason I picked those specific targets is because Shadell is mechanically cleared from being a Jackdaw, based on the steal chain leading to 1K. This would mean that a Raven and a Crow die, furthering the Jackdaw's agenda twofold:

1) Ensuring that the Crows on their own cannot eliminate a Jackdaw during the Day.
2) Eliminating part of a faction more threatening to the Jackdaws.

@Nictis coordination power is much more apparent with the Ravens, who have a QuickTopic. Crows cannot outwardly coordinate their actions without the Jackdaws knowing what's happening outright. Your argument fails in that regard.
 
Like.two jackdaws alive at end is mechanically unwinnable for ravens without crows kingmakering for ravens after you've fucked us over.

You are literally making an offer for crows to lose that requires you lose where the prior offer left things up in the air.

Fuck that noise. Nictis dies no matter what, and I don't much care who wins as long as it is not ravens.
 
Personally, I'm fine with the Jackdaws as long as they are kill incapable. If only one of them is kill capable, only one of them is more of a threat on the final night.

Terrabrand said:
Because let's remember that nictis just tried to buy a Ravens Cannot Win Scenario to expressly fuck over my team. Tit for tat 'friend'.
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Your original plan was to have the Jackdaws either waste their ability targeting a magpie or having strong odds of killing ravens.

Even with the Jackdaws killing Crows right now, your faction still has decent odds of winning.

And yes, with only faction being able to win, we're going to want to be the ones to win. You directing the Jackdaw to kill us is not to our favor, or to the Jackdaw's favor. Don't try and get angry over me trying to keep myself alive.
 
Nictis said:
Anyways, I've got to go take care of some stuff. Popped online midway through a game of cards with grandparents, saw that you guys suddenly gained kills (@InterstellarHobo What is the order on that btw? After steals? Start of night?) and that I was on the list. Only just got to not be on my phone, and I needed to make sure that either I wouldn't be on that list or that it wouldn't be used immediately.

I am serious about the offer though. From a theft perspective, there's no difference between a crow and you for me, so I'm fine with keeping you alive if it keeps me alive.
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Jackdaw kills are in place of their normal theft, at the time of their normal theft.
 
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