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It Belongs to a Museum
- Thread starter Boney
- Start date
- Fantasy
Well if he is fully in the material world, then maybe he just can't keep souls around, so to Ereth they go.
- Location
- Australia
[X] The Tide of Skjold
[X] The Careener
[X] The Careener
- Location
- Australia
The barrows all being from the same culture makes sense for why wights all have the same style of armour, and them being nomads is how you explain how they got all over the place, but that raises two questions.
First, what happened to them? There are no Scythians anywhere anymore. Did they get absorbed into the local groups? But then that raises the second question.
How did the Belthani survive? The Scythians were clearly warlike, so why didn't the Scythians conquer and absorb the Belthani like the Imperial Tribes later did?
I'm not sure how relevant or compatible this is, but WFRP 4e: The Night Parade does give some info on War of the Beard-era humanity in the form of a wight from that era. Page 13:
xamaplak
WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU'RE @SOUP?
- Location
- the Soup Store
- Pronouns
- He/Him
...what would have happened to any Ellinilli cleverly tried to hide in the Underearth?
They splintered into the Ungols and Gospodars and Kurgans. The word 'kurgan' is another name for the barrows we're talking about.
Horse nomads don't do well in dense forests, and the Reik basin is full of very dense forests. The Scythians would have been free to take the grasslands and it wouldn't have been anywhere near worth the trouble to try to conquer the forests.
Probably a short and brutal encounter with Grimnir.
- Location
- A Pit Of My Own Making
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Intresting stuff, mostly because of what it says about Beastmen culture, and that they can potentially co-exist with humans (although Chaos corruption happens).
But the character is also cool, would like to see more of her
Wouldn't be surprised if they were, to a certain extent. A familiar pattern with steppe confederacies is invasion of a sedentary polity followed by conquest of that polity followed by assimilation into/admixture with the culture of the polity in question. A good way to maintain dominance over a foreign people is to adopt some of those foreign people's customs and because they'll likely have been conducting diplomacy and especially trade with those sedentary peoples beforehand the cultural paradigms will already be familiar. The Parni becoming the Parthians and Mongol rule in China as the Yuan dynasty are good examples.
Edit: Hmm. Not sure 'Mathilde'd' works for this thread. Qu'aph'd, maybe? Eh, too many apostrophes...
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You know, I've never really seen any explanation of where the Brigundians got their horse shenanigans from. All the other Empire tribes were running around with axes and swords and these dudes were firing arrows from horseback, with stirrups.
- Location
- A Pit Of My Own Making
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Elves of some variety?
There were no Elven settlements anywhere remotely near Averland, or even on any of the routes the Brigundians could have taken to reach Averland.
That might get the Brigundians stirrups, but wouldn't teach them how to actually make composite bows or the skills to fire them from horseback. That takes significant and direct cultural exchange. And selling technology to human tribes before the alliance with Sigmar seems out of character for the Dwarves.
- Location
- Australia
Does that include the Belthani? The DPG says they taught them copperworking in exchange for food during the War of Vengeance. I'm not familiar enough with the relevant history to know how plausible that is.
I'd probably put that down to writers' unfamiliarity with pre-stirrup stability measures like Gallic horned saddles (and the fact that a skilled equestrian can shoot from horseback without stirrups at all)! Still, if the stirrup were to come from anywhere, reflecting IRL history like so much of Warhammer does, either the steppe or Cathay or Ind via the steppe seem like good bets; seems that there's a fair amount of academic controversy on the topic, as one would expect.
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What I was suggesting is that the Brigundians could be another inheritor of the Scythians. Unfortunately, probably not via the local Scythians just dying their beards red and saying 'how do you do fellow imperial tribes, I sure do love sausages and beer', but I think the Brigundians might have absorbed the Scythian remnants that would have been calling the plains of Averland home.
Sure, that sort of thing was extremely common for tribal peoples, a huge amount of them would happily adopt foreigners with useful skills. Making a new human takes a long time and a lot of resources, being able to just adopt a fully-grown one that's willing and able to do useful things today is hugely valuable. Ones that know how to do things that you don't know how to do? Absolutely sign them up immediately.
Sure, that sort of thing was extremely common for tribal peoples, a huge amount of them would happily adopt foreigners with useful skills. Making a new human takes a long time and a lot of resources, being able to just adopt a fully-grown one that's willing and able to do useful things today is hugely valuable. Ones that know how to do things that you don't know how to do? Absolutely sign them up immediately.
- Location
- Australia
Ah, bit of a mixup, I was referring to dwarves selling technology. The DPG says the dwarves taught the Belthani copperworking for food, but you said it was OOC to sell tech to human tribes before Sigmar, and since Brigundians were the topic of discussion, I wasn't sure how wide your statement was intended to be.
Ah, totally went over my head - apologies! Could also be a different steppe tribe/confederacy, geographically and culturally closer to the pre-imperial peoples, who were pushed ahead of the Scythians as the latter migrated (in a similar manner to the Hunnic confederacy).
"Peaceful farmers and pastoralists, they befriended the Dawi during the War of Vengeance, providing supplies in return for copper tools."
"During the War of Vengeance, they traded with the tribes, teaching the Humans to work copper weapons and tools, in return for food."
This is an annoying ambiguity, and the odd phrasing doesn't help. You can work copper into weapons and tools, and you can work with copper weapons and tools, and the distinction between the two is really important here. Seems like they could have used an editor for the DPG to point out this sort of thing.
But if we assume for the sake of argument that it was a full-blown technological uplift, then it is in a very specific set of circumstances: a peaceful people developing a relationship with the Dwarves, ones that Dwarves would have had a very long time to be able to observe, and during a time when Dwarves had just lost their major trade partner who was probably the main source of their food, and were actively fighting a continent-wide hellwar that would have been desperate for supplies. I don't think that should be taken to be the standard procedure for all Dwarven relations with humans.
Sinsystems
Patron Librarian
I think a more likely scenario is that the humans might have done some trading with the Dawi for some processed goods and at one point a trader saw a Dawi doing some forging or generally got enough info to muddle through the basics.
So less a technological uplift and more the fact that exposure to the Dawi gave the humans ideas and concepts that their society didn't really have before.
So less a technological uplift and more the fact that exposure to the Dawi gave the humans ideas and concepts that their society didn't really have before.
consequences
Not A Nice Person At All
- Location
- Jerkville
[X] The Tide of Skjold
I do like the element that even if Crucible and Careener don't win this round, they may still be an option to pick later. Removes a lot of the stress about "GET IT NOWWWW"