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In Thunder's Echo (Legend of the Five Rings Quest)

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If the GM doesn't mind, could it be appropriate to request a vote tally for this round? It would be better to have them in one place instead of searching the votes through the last couple pages of discussion.
 
cokerpilot said:
Can some tell the difference between the two votes as they are now because I'm having a hard time seeing it .
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Overall, I'd say that other then the "court" section, @primemountain's is a good tuning upgrade off of mine (ie, no significant changes in overall strategy, but a number of useful tweak improvements). I'm still a bit dubious about some of the court section, though, and am waiting for @Maugan Ra to weigh in with the results of the appropriate etiquette check. (Admittedly, it is notably improved from its first few incarnations). I figure at this point one of two things is going to happen. Either the etiquette check indicates that there are no issues and I change my vote over, or the etiquette check indicates that there are a few issues, primemountain tweaks appropriately, and then I change my vote over.
 
Sirrocco said:
[X] We acknowledge to the court that the Kakita took issue with our standing as champion for a member of his delegation and challenged us to a duel for the honor of representing her. We note our injury and his clear lack of same, and acknowledge that he won that duel - and that, in turn, we yield the honor to him. Alternately/Additionally, if she so chooses, Bayushi Kimiko might reasonably declare that she is unwilling to allow one of her samurai to risk his life on behalf of a... Crane.

@Maugan Ra - Etiquette check: My read on things is that this should all be seen as more or less honorable behavior (if, perhaps, not so very *impressive*, what with the losing and everything). Is that accurate?
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That would indeed come across as you acting in the honourable and otherwise expected fashion, yes. Your story actually works a bit better in Shiro Matsu than it might elsewhere, because any shame or dishonour in backing down is likely going to be attributed to the Kakita who forced you to.

The Matsu are always happy to blame the Kakita for something.

noliar said:
[x] primemountain

I am amused by the way we've racked up all this honour by cultivating the heimin because they're useful, behaving appropriately in public because it's in public at court and not having much to lie about yet. If our current honour levels are already nearing the point that our clan leadership might worry about our reliability just from establishing ourself as a junior diplomat, how do all the Scorpions not on active ninja jobs manage? Is there a special moustache twirling ceremony to shed the excess?
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Typically, most Scorpion diplomats would have lower honour because they use Low skills. Which includes lying, bribery, intimidation, seduction and exploiting the rituals and traditions of the Empire for your personal benefit (rather than adhering to them for their own sake).

Sirrocco said:
Eh? That sounds like time for an etiquette check, actually. @Maugan Ra, can you suggest what the Court would think of @primemountain's write-in for "Court"?
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As it stands at the moment, @primemountain, your vote is essentially a 'high risk, high reward' angle. Normally, a Scorpion framing their decision as adhering to Bushido would be met with derisive sneers, especially from the Matsu... but Naoto has been going out of his way to build a reputation as an unconventionally honourable Scorpion, so in that context it could work.

Basically, I'll be rolling Sincerity to see how Naoto comes across. Your vote involves a higher TN, but if passed will result in making a favourable impression on the Court and the Matsu in particular.

primemountain said:
@Maugan Ra can I get a Etiquette check, on what the proper way to apologize to our Lord for this transgression is?
I do not think I know enough about Rokugany Etiquette to properly grovel.
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Bowing. Like, so much bowing. Press your forehead to the floor, acknowledge your failure and await their judgement.
 
Well, if we use a void point on the retelling we would be rolling 7k5 for the Sincerity roll, but I see little reason to get greedy. Let's just fade into the background like a good little Scorpion.

The Vote takes its final form: :)

Response to Lion:
[X] Ignore the pain and make no reference to your injury, but head straight to your quarters.Do not make any particular effort to hide the injury, however - go to your quarters through the common, efficient routes rather than trying to sneak around, and so forth.
-[X] If pressed, simply say that it was the settling of a matter of honor, and as the matter was concluded, you see no reason to speak of it further tonight. You are confident the news will spread soon enough.
-[X] If Yogo Hanzo is not immediately available, then seek outside medical attention, explaining only that you resolved a matter of honor and that further details will be presented before the Court tomorow.

Bayushi Kimoko
[X] Convey the gist of the events truthfully. Place special care in retelling the challenge and especially the talk afterwards. Note that it seemed a perfect opportunity to break the Cranes composure, and get closer to her. It did work, as she did reveal details. Note your suspicion that the letter may have been tampered with, and the idea of asking Genji for the letter recieved by the master. Seek advice in any other path that might be taken to prove or disprove its validity or further orders on the matter of securing our embassy.

-[X]Note the favor Kakita did us by defeating us, namely making us seem less competent, and thus less of a target. He also took on the duel against Matsu Heijiko that likely would have killed us, as well as giving us his orders, as he was kind enough to repeat them in our hearing as well as show his willingness to break or ignore orders from Doji-sama if needed. This could be valuable intelligence, and the price paid is but a bit of pain.

-[X]Suggest that it would probably serve both her position and ours well now for her to be publicly seen to be annoyed with us - allowing us to continue to carry the wound (having Yogo Hanzo heal it only enough to prevent long-term damage), putting us through a punishing regimen of training, and so forth. It would certainly work to reduce our prominence in court. Add the spectacle of the upcoming duel between Matsu and Kakita and we should be back in the background where we belong.

-[X]Admit that had Kakita-san not stepped in it could have been much worse. We did not actually have a plan for dealing with Matsu Heijiko in the moment when we took on the duel. Bow, pressing our forehead to the floor and acknowledge it was foolish of us to jump into a duel to the death with no plan and knowing little of our opponent as well as apologize for risking our life without her permission. Await judgement.

The court
[X] We acknowledge to the court that the Kakita took issue with our standing as champion for a member of his delegation and challenged us to a duel for the honor of representing her. We note our injury and his clear lack of same, and acknowledge that he won that duel - and that, in turn, we yield the honor to him. Alternately/Additionally, if she so chooses, Bayushi Kimiko might reasonably declare that she is unwilling to allow one of her samurai to risk his life on behalf of a... Crane.
******
Some stuff was moved around a bit in reporting to Bayushi Kimoko as it makes sense we finish out report with the apology, instead of it being mid-report. That should be about it.
 
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@Maugan Ra: How about my joke vote? Obviously I'm just contributing levity every time I do one, but I'm quite curious to see how they'd translate to Rokugan's structured society.
 
@Maugan Ra: I've forgotten to ask, when Kakita hit us, did we take 20 Wounds after spending a Void Point reducing them, or did we just take 20 Wounds? It occurred to me, if his first strike is not powerful enough, he might actually lose that fight with the Lion.

EDIT: Edited for clarity.
 
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primemountain said:
@Maugan Ra: I've forgotten to ask, when Kakita hit us, did we take 20 Wounds after spending a Void Point reducing them, or did we just take 20 Wounds? It occurred to me, if his first strike is not powerful enough, he might actually lose that fight with the Lion.

EDIT: Edited for clarity.
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He did twenty damage.

...

This, uh, was after a damage roll of 10k2. Dude did not get the best dice results in the world.
 
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4.12 - Reporting in
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    • It takes you some time to make your way back to your quarters within Shiro Matsu, but then perhaps it is merely your injury that makes the journey seem so much longer. Your chest feels like it is both aflame and touched by ice at the same time, and you suspect that walking around with the wound untreated is only making things worse. Still, asking for help in town is not an ideal result, and fortunately the dark colours of your kimono help to hide the blood.

    You are fairly sure that the Matsu standing guard at the castle entrance are perfectly aware that you are injured, but while they offer aid in a relatively discrete fashion they do not press the matter when you wave it off. Indeed, several of them nod in approval - you suspect this probably counts as some kind of display of bravado in their eyes. Well, you can live with that.

    As it turns out, both of your fellow Scorpion are absent from your quarters when you return, doubtless making good use of the festivities or the distraction that they provide. You grunt in disappointment, and are just considering whether to apply a simple dressing yourself or head out in search of aid when there is a quiet gasp from the corridor outside.

    Wren, the servant girl, stands there with her hand over her mouth. "Samurai-sama! You are hurt! Do you need medical attention?"

    You nod slightly. "A matter of honour. And yes, if you know someone capable of treating injuries, please direct them to me. Alternately, do you know when my kinsman, Yogo Hanzo, will return?"

    Wren shakes her head. "My apologies, samurai-sama, I do not know about your kin. But... I have some skill in treating injuries, if you require aid?"

    You consider for a moment, then nod. Keeping the truth of the extent of your injury within the Clan and those indebted to it seems like a wise enough move. So you wait patiently while Wren fetches some basic medical supplies from her quarters, taking a seat in the centre of the room and focusing on controlling your reaction to the pain.

    Amusingly, the peasant girl actually seems to become stern and authoritative when she returns to treat you, kneeling by your side and issuing instructions in a crisp tone of voice. You suppose that she is focusing on her duty too much to give excessive thought to courtesy, but it still catches your curiousity. As does the skill with which she cleans out the long slash wound across your chest and sets to work on bandaging it up.

    You suspect she might have had to treat sword wounds before.

    "Samurai-sama..." She says quietly as she works. "I... my family and I owe you a debt. Is there any way in which we might be able to repay it?"

    Respond:
    [ ] Write in

    -/-

    Wren is just finishing up when the door to your quarters slides open and Bayushi Kimoko returns. Your superior looks at the bloody bandages, the bowing peasant woman and the distinctive katana wound on your chest. Her one visible eye narrows.

    "Explain."

    Bowing low, you do just that. You relay the full details of what happened as clearly and succinctly as you can, adding your own observations and thoughts in quick asides where they help to provide useful context. The Crane, their letter, Genji's request and more are quickly reported, while your superior listens silently. Eventually you finish, and wait in silence for your superior's judgement.

    "I see." Kimoko says at last. "Well, I won't deny that you achieved your goals, albeit not in a way I would have recommended. Tell me, Soshi-san, what would you say your biggest mistake was?"

    You wince slightly. "I... did not have a plan in mind to deal with Matsu Heijiko when I issued the challenge, Bayushi-sama. Given what Kakita-san told me, it is likely she would have proven too skilled for me to overcome in a duel. I should not have risked my life without your permission."

    "No. You should not." Kimoko says bluntly, before sighing. "Still, success is an excellent justification, and I would be the greatest hypocrite imaginable if I were to disapprove of taking foolish risks in pursuit of your goals."

    There is little you can say in response to that, so you remain silent. Bayushi Kimoko studies you for a long moment, then smiles. "Still, I suppose this is a sign that I was right. I believe it is time that we develop your training, Soshi-san, and since we are far from the dojos of our Clan I will have to be your teacher. After all, while one loss is not so bad, I do not want you disgracing us in the future. I think... five days should do."

    "Of course, Bayushi-sama." You say uncertainly. "Though I believe I still need to inform the court of the arrangement."

    "I will take care of that, Soshi-san." Kimoko says with a wide smile. "You get some rest. You're going to need it."

    You suddenly begin to feel very, very afraid.

    -/-

    Soshi Naoto has demonstrated his courage, his insight and his skill, making significant progress on the matter of the Crane Delegation's strange behaviour. He earns six experience points, for a current total of eleven.

    Although his conduct and skillful handling of the fallout have mitigated any loss of honour, Naoto has been defeated in a duel and then withdrawn from the public eye at his lord's command. He loses two points of Glory.

    You have five days until the next scheduled activity, the Winding River Banquet. Bayushi Kimoko has commanded that you spend the mornings training with her. In the afternoons, however, she is attended to her courtly duties and you have some free time. You may select one additional activity to complete on each day.

    Note that spending additional time training is possible, and has a chance of generating further rewards. Alternately, you could spend time with a chosen NPC, or try to achieve some personal goal.

    How do you spend you time?
    [ ] Write in (x5)

    BONUS
    Bayushi Kimoko is a fine educator, if somewhat... enthusiastic. Over the course of the training montage (which will likely take up two or three updates), you gain a discount on purchasing Bugei skills.

    The discount currently stands at -1xp to the cost of each purchased rank, to a minimum of 1xp.
     
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    • [X] in time
    [X] Training x3
    [X] talk with Chen
    [X] talk with pale oak
    [X] buy battle 2 (1 xp)
    [X] buy kenjutsu and iajutsu 3 (5xp)
    [X] buy forgery 2 (4xp)
    The discount is very good, as is the chance of further traits increases, the problem is that we can't not talk with anyone during all 5 days.

    We will need forgery in the future... and as we will be using some of our xp anyway
    Edited took out defense, as pointed it is useless and increased iajutsu.
     
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    Maugan Ra said:
    The discount currently stands at -1xp to the cost of each purchased rank, to a minimum of 1xp.
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    *spittakes*
    Iaijutsu, Kenjutsu and Defense just jumped massively in terms of priority.

    [X] buy Battle 2, Iaijusu 3, Defense 3 and Kenjusu 4 (11xp)

    No idea what else we should do but this is a must.
     
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    Okay.
    - We should totally get Kenjutsu 3. I'll admit it. We should have before, and now that it's cheaper, we absolutely should now.
    - We should totally buy up to Iajutsu 3. The fast-draw can be very useful in the right circumstances, Iajutsu 3 shoudl be enough for our needs for the forseeable future, and we should exploit the discount.
    - Battle... yeah, Battle 3 is probably worth it too - if only as in investment for Hachiman. Now is absolutely the time to buy it.
    - Not sure abotu Defense. Honestly, I have yet to see a situation where I'd *care* about my score in defense. If someone wants to bump it up to 3, I'm not saying they're wrong, but I'd like to hear of at least one realistic case where it's actually useful first

    That'd be 8 points (2 for kenjutsu, 3 for iajutsu, 3 for Battle), or 10 with Defense. I might also wish to pick up Perception/Investigation, but the discount is simply too valuable to ignore.

    Wren:
    [x] "You are an honor to your family, Wren-san, but there is no debt. Your Uncle deserved Justice and it was my Honor to help give it. The Emperors Under-Hand is sworn to uncover and deal with such matters, from those plots targeting the whole of Rokugan, to those threatening a single member. While there are duties you could take on to further help the Empire, I will not force them upon you by some nonexistent debt. "Remove your mask and ask gently:"Do you want to serve the Emperors Under-Hand Wren-san?"
    -[x] Should she accept, instruct her in the basics of what we need. Essentially keeping her ear out for any plots, especially against the Empire, the Matsu or the Scorpion. Note that something is going on with the Crane, and any light she could shed on the situation would be helpful.
    --[x] "If I am unavailable, or you cannot reach me for some other reason and the matter is time sensitive you can approach Pale Oak-san. He is a colleague of yours now. You may find his advice helpful in performing your new duties."
    -[x] Whether she accepts to job offer or not, ask her gently: "You are quite skilled in treating sword wounds. Might I ask where you practiced the art?"

    Spending Time:
    [x] Contact Ikoma Genji (by appropriately secretive means - probably including letters). Once he has deigned to arrange for a meeting or other trustworthy channel, reveal what you have found about the source of the Crane's orders. Ask if he might be able to provide you with an example of a message written in the Champion's own handwriting
    [x] If successful, approach Doji Mariko. Acknowledge that she is absolutely certain of the source of her orders, but that you are a Villainous Scorpion (who happens to care for her) and you simply cannot shake the feeling that she is trapped in some evil plot. Ask if she might do you the great favor of allowing you to see the missive on which she was given her orders. Surely the thrust of them must be clear to all by now, yes? If there are still portions that she feels she must keep secret, then might you be permitted to see a segment of the writing that does not contain sensitive material?
    -[x] If not successful, just spend some time with her, stabilizing things after the recent events, and trying to get a feel for how the dynamic may have changed
    [x] Try to spend some time with Kakita Sekawa, reassuring him of your good intentions and providing proper respect. If this can be done on the training yards, all the better.
    [x] Training x2


    experience
    [x] Buy Iajutsu 3 (3 exp)
    [x] Buy Kenjutsu 3 (2 exp)
    [x] Buy Battle 3 (3 exp)


    Actually, etiquette question - would it be reasonable to expect that the updated orders for Doji Mariko be written by her champion directly, or are scribes often used for things like that? If the handwriting comparison indicates that they *were* done in different hands, is that any real evidence of anything?

    Obviously, if it's not, I'll be changing my write-in.

    edit: because @primemountain's response to Wren was pure awesome, and I am stealing it shamelessly.
     
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    If we spend XP the right way, is it possible to challenge the Kakita again and defeat him?
     
    Quest said:
    If we spend XP the right way, is it possible to challenge the Kakita again and defeat him?
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    Technically? Yes. this game is dice-based enough that we *could* have beat him as we were. By the same token however, getting to the point where we could consistently expect to beat him would take a *lot* of investment.

    Practically speaking, not really worth it as a goal.
     
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