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Hybrid Hive: Eat Shard? (Worm/MGLN) (Complete)

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karloss99 said:
Did Taylor make that city, or did she just 'repurpose' one on that stripped-lifeless world they found earlier?
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The latter. But it was emptied of people into bunkers long before the atmosphere hit "everyone dies" levels, so she didn't have to remove corpses. <_<
EmperorArthur said:
I mean, he doesn't have to fight crime. Heck, a significant portion of what Taylor's been doing is mundane utility type things.

Just think of the applications. Never have to worry about running out of toilet paper again. All for the low low price of having your heart ripped out and re-grown.

More seriously, Taylor's constructs are so useful that magic is almost certainly worth the cost. Not as a combat method, but as a general utility.
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...can you honestly see Danny not doing his best to be combat-capable if given magic, if only to ensure that Taylor knows that she doesn't have to protect him?
EmperorArthur said:
Also, planetary shield generators which can disable secondary connections. So, the question is if all powers are caused by secondary connections. Because this is basically them being able to de-power the entire planet!
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Powers are caused by a multitude of connection types, and some are safer to disable than others. The reason for targeting the planet the shard is on and not Bet is that some similar-enough connections back to humans are likely to be fatal if disabled in that manner.

Some powers generate extra connection channels back to the parahuman on activation (see Potter), others are always "active" and use the primary channel (Tattletale, Aegis), then others reach out to things nearby (Vista, Panacea, Clockblocker), and some do all of it!

Hive's power-blocking shields have, so far, been split into two categories. "Block as much as possible" and "block as little as possible". The larger the area to be covered, the more general the shield ends up being as a result for maintenance purposes. So "block off Brockton Bay" can be done fairly safely for targeting the Mathers family. "Block off Earth Bet" would start catching other connections that are "close enough". "Block off Mathers Family shard's Earth" allows for that additional fuzzy matching from scale to not matter.
EmperorArthur said:
Not to mention, I'm pretty sure even the TSAB doesn't have those. I'm pretty sure self-replicating matter to energy weapons, combined with planetary shields, and an FTL drive* typically marks an interstellar power. The moment they get a dimensional sea drive up and running, they're going to be an interdimensional power as well. Especially if they combine shard based techniques to cut the travel time down significantly.
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The TSAB isn't nomming continent-sized multidimensional organic supercomputers on a regular basis either!

They're really operating on different scales...
EmperorArthur said:
Oh, and @CmptrWz Once Hive gets her mods down, I really hope she adds some sort of self-replicating function to the new Linker-Core stuff. She stated explicitly why she removed / isn't bothering with the old one, but that's no reason to abandon the idea of allowing mage's children to also experience the benefits. Though, I also believe an instruction manual / tutorial mode would also be helpful to prevent civilization backslides. Which is what seems to happen over and over again. The only reason linker cores still exist is the genetic part.
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The new linker core additions are incompatible with being genetically encoded.

A mage's children get the benefits once they're old enough by going through the install process instead of connecting it to a genetic blueprint that's subject to random mutation errors on transcription.
EmperorArthur said:
It would also be neat if Hive could figure out a way to make linker cores work / form properly in low mana environments. One option would be for a parent's linker core to create the material for a minor augment unit for the child. It's not perfect, but helps. Plus, hive's re-design will almost certainly be more efficient, especially if it has a "low mana" mode.
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Hive's "re-design" isn't changing the base linker core at all.

Augmentation units require a lot more than what a linker core can provide as well, such as incredibly rare materials that are nearly impossible to find. Unless, of course, you find an organic Von Neumann machine that's partially made of the stuff and creates it as part of growing.
LostArchivist said:
It is times like this that remind me how absurdly scary she is. The "simple" solution is to blockade an entire alternate earth with dimensional jamming. And of course that she can semi-easily deploy such a thing just like that...
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Well, if by "semi-easily" you mean "wait for over a month for the generators to be constructed..."

Once they're constructed then they'll be able to generate a single shield on a single planet!
 
CmptrWz said:
The latter. But it was emptied of people into bunkers long before the atmosphere hit "everyone dies" levels, so she didn't have to remove corpses. <_<
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I had a quick look and all you mentioned about that planet was the atmosphere vanishing and that some of the technology was functional but not all of it. We all assumed they were dead especially since a shard could just eat the air in any compartment as well. So now that we know are they going to help these people in the bunkers? It can't be comfortable. A permanent portal to a habitable world would probably be welcome.

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saganatsu said:
I think he's saying that they died slowly enough that they evacuated to bunkers and didn't leave corpses lying all over, but still died.
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Unfortunately that makes more sense, but the way he said it suggested they were alive hence my question
 
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CmptrWz said:
Well, if by "semi-easily" you mean "wait for over a month for the generators to be constructed..."
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Anything planetary scale done in under a year is definitely easy. Anything planetary scale with the underlying technology acquired less than a year ago is mindbogglingly fast.
The only thing we have that's planetary scale is GPS and its competitors, and GPS took 20 years to set up; not counting upgrades. Maybe the internet, but it can be argued that it only got above 50% deployment in 2019.

CastleTrime said:
I had a quick look and all you mentioned about that planet was the atmosphere vanishing and that some of the technology was functional but not all of it. We all assumed they were dead especially since a shard could just eat the air in any compartment as well. So now that we know are they going to help these people in the bunkers? It can't be comfortable. A permanent portal to a habitable world would probably be welcome.
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I think he's saying that they died slowly enough that they evacuated to bunkers and didn't leave corpses lying all over, but still died.
 
Pinklestia said:
So.... how is Dragon upgrade into a Hive like being going?
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First of all, I would like to make sure, you mean the unison device right? If that is what you mean, then I would like to know how I missed that it was going to happen. If not, I am horrified by the AI hivemind that you are saying Dragon is turning into.
 
saganatsu said:
Anything planetary scale done in under a year is definitely easy. Anything planetary scale with the underlying technology acquired less than a year ago is mindbogglingly fast.
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Very true, but Taylor and Hive have been able to operate interplanetary almost from the start. Remember, between the two of them they have access to more or less the complete resources and capabilities of the various Shards Hive absorbed. And Shards, given how they are depicted both in canon and in this story, are already easily capable of planetary-scale engineering, even when that isn't their actual purpose. From that, its mostly a matter of scaling up infrastructure, something that seems to happen in the background, but is occasionally mentioned in the story.

In many ways, Hive can skip straight past a lot of the issues that discovering and utilizing new technology would ordinarily entail, since the Shards they absorbed already did it for them, and simply use the best practice the Entities arrived at over thousands/millions of years. So it isn't even really new technology, as much as it is ancient technology put to a new purpose.

Besides, the real hurdle at this point will be creating the facilities and infrastructure to safely and autonomously dismantle trillions of Shards spread over trillions of worlds. Creating a single planetary mega-structure is positively trivial in comparison. There is, of course, somewhat of a disconnect between what Taylor and Hive can do and what the story is focused on -- given the things they can do with drones, remote-controlled and autonomous, there is absolutely no reason for Taylor to spend any time running around as Minerva.
 
Brainstorm813 said:
Food, probably. As an advanced society, they could probably recycle the air and water, to a degree. But with nowhere to grow food.....
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If they were left alone probably but remember this wasn't a natural disaster but a shard trying to kill off an advanced society. I don't see any reason they wouldn't suck air out of the bunkers. Which is horrify to contemplate. You know the air was disappearance mysteriously and its still happening in an air tight room suggesting it an attack not natural....
 
USRTS said:
First of all, I would like to make sure, you mean the unison device right? If that is what you mean, then I would like to know how I missed that it was going to happen.
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Dragon asked Hive for a upgrade, Hive said it would have a few downsides but Dragon wanted it anyway. There is also the fact one of the downsides is that it would remove Dragon shard.

Is in the chapters were they give Dragon the upgrade to unchain her and then Dragon finds Taylor is Minerva.
 
CmptrWz said:
The new linker core additions are incompatible with being genetically encoded.

A mage's children get the benefits once they're old enough by going through the install process instead of connecting it to a genetic blueprint that's subject to random mutation errors on transcription.
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Yep. I guess my point was more that the only thing that has seemed to survive has been the self replicating stuff, because society keeps collapsing. Though I should have been more clear that I was referring to a non-genetic method of self-replication. We know, through basic deduction, that linker cores self-replicate and have at least some level of self-repair. I was referring to piggy backing on that process to store the blueprints and let the linker core do the work. It's not perfect since, you're now talking pure energy storage mediums, but given that linker cores themselves are pure-energy...

Is it a top priority, no. However, if you're thinking long term, and are aware of the pattern of advanced magical civilizations collapsing,* it makes sense to add a few extra preparations.

CmptrWz said:
Hive's "re-design" isn't changing the base linker core at all.

Augmentation units require a lot more than what a linker core can provide as well, such as incredibly rare materials that are nearly impossible to find. Unless, of course, you find an organic Von Neumann machine that's partially made of the stuff and creates it as part of growing.
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Well, that's what I was missing. I was assuming these are part of the base structure, and forgot the part where the Belkans were advanced enough to add linker core features, but not enough to touch the base coding. When hive gets to that level, things will get interesting. Though it does raise a question. Is the genetic encoding part of the base linker core structure or something the Belkans added?

* Once they meet the TSAB, they will be
 
Oh boy, how will the media react to the whole Cauldron thing? Minerva already dealt with two of the three Endbringers so her dealing with a Worldwide conspiracy wouldn't raise any eyebrows.

The problem is that there is still a lot of S and A class threats she has not deal with yet and this will inevitably cause some people to "go off rails." for good and bad.
 
Pinklestia said:
Oh boy, how will the media react to the whole Cauldron thing?
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Implying the media will learn about it. It's more than likely to happen behind closed doors with only the highest levels of authority being aware of what happened. Sure, maybe someone will leak the information but... Highly unlikely in any case. The only problem I can see is Tagg getting a higher position somehow, despite the fact that he's not supposed to lead anything except for maybe a combat squad. He'll probably be pushing to do something with Minerva and her group.
 
Brainstorm813 said:
I don't think anyone in an administrative position would be stupid enough to tangle with a foreign, multiversal superpower when their own jobs are at risk.
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I'm not saying anyone would listen to him or follow any of his advice - doesn't stop him from saying things or attempting to do something. Who knows.
 
Qro said:
The only problem I can see is Tagg getting a higher position somehow, despite the fact that he's not supposed to lead anything except for maybe a combat squad. He'll probably be pushing to do something with Minerva and her group.
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I actually think Tagg would be good if put in charge of a SWAT type squad designed to go around the country and bring in or take out A-rank or S-rank threats such as during the Echidna incident, or even when Bakuda was going on her bombing spree.
The FBI has specialized teams such as the Hostage Rescue Team, giving the PRT a specialized team to take out such threats would make sense if they were not set up to fail. Tagg would actually be really good at it.
He struck me as the kind of guy you would not want to put in charge of deciding when or when not to use force, but would be excellent as the person you turn to when you decide that force is the appropriate option.

Should he ever be a PRT Director? Absolutely not. However as a commander of PRT field troopers deployed to bring in capes, he would be excellent. Put in charge of cape support as well acting as a general and he'd be even better.
Now on the subject of CauldronI find it interesting that Minerva is only now contemplating going after Cauldron, while she has accidentally been indirectly undermining them for quite some time, and Cauldron is now convinced they are under attack, when the real attack hasn't even begun.
Actually, I find this kinda hilarious:
CmptrWz said:
...which was almost certainly the point, wasn't it? Minerva's backers, whether they were the 'Belkan Empire' or not, knew about Cauldron. Had seen their portals when scanning the base that day. This had to be a deliberate move to curtail their ability to operate on Earth Bet without opposing them directly, disguised as a method to contain a single problematic parahuman that they'd captured when nobody else could but far more broadly applicable. Who knew how many other agent-based abilities the devices interfered with without being obvious about it.
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Considering that Minerva didn't really know Cauldron existed at this point. They only recently came up on her radar.
 
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Pinklestia said:
Dragon asked Hive for a upgrade, Hive said it would have a few downsides but Dragon wanted it anyway. There is also the fact one of the downsides is that it would remove Dragon shard.

Is in the chapters were they give Dragon the upgrade to unchain her and then Dragon finds Taylor is Minerva.
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Ah, alright then, I did miss something. Sorry about that.
 
SlickRCBD said:
I actually think Tagg would be good if put in charge of a SWAT type squad designed to go around the country and bring in or take out A-rank or S-rank threats such as during the Echidna incident, or even when Bakuda was going on her bombing spree.
The FBI has specialized teams such as the Hostage Rescue Team, giving the PRT a specialized team to take out such threats would make sense if they were not set up to fail. Tagg would actually be really good at it.
He struck me as the kind of guy you would not want to put in charge of deciding when or when not to use force, but would be excellent as the person you turn to when you decide that force is the appropriate option.

Should he ever be a PRT Director? Absolutely not. However as a commander of PRT field troopers deployed to bring in capes, he would be excellent. Put in charge of cape support as well acting as a general and he'd be even better.
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While it's a derail, I must say that I agree with your thoughts on Tagg
 
Sorrow said:
Okay, what's with the fish? What does it mean? Why do I keep missing these things? (Last one is rhetorical.)
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Poisson d'Avril, or 'April fish', is a french April Fools Day tradition dating back to around 1564. At the time, supposedly, the start of the French calendar was April 1st, but King Charles IX made a proclamation moving the start of the new year to January 1st, to mixed approval. The end of Lent also coincided with April 1st at the time, and thus people were forbidden from eating meat, but the consumption of fish was tolerated, and often sent as gifts for New Years.
Those who were fine with the new calendar mocked those that weren't by sending them fake fish.
 
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