Hmmph... this junior is a good seed [Cultivation Management Quest]

[occipitallobe]

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If you write a new Good Seed, or write an omake, please update the spreadsheet if you have access.

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This is mandatory. If a Good Seed does not record their omake by pinging collabs (or just requesting access and editing things themselves - this is the preferred option), I won't give out awards. If a new Good Seed is not recorded here, they won't advance. By doing this it makes the whole thing manageable for me - it's gotten pretty unwieldy!

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Omake Writer Instructions:

There are four fields you need to fill out.

Omake Link, which is just a link to your first omake for the turn. This makes it easier for me to read them as I do the update - without this it's tough to know off the bat which omake were written this turn, and to properly

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All other fields are for QM use to record character information to properly run the flow of the game.

 

[Timewarriors]

Please refer to the Nascent list, but here's the breakdown of all Nascents available to OC:
- Old Cannibal (Late)
- Gengxin the Poison Mistress (Early)
- Xinyue the Bee Queen (Early)
- Old Fish (Mid)
- Bloodhammer (Mid)
- Hu Ai (Mid)

That makes 1 Late, 3 Mid, 2 Early for the Bees. I've listed how we can have 1 Late, 1 Mid, 2 Early already.

If you're following so far, that leaves 2 enemy Mids unaccounted for, except that Hu Ai would be unusable since Altar Lord wants the Clan to succeed, and Old Fish hates Cannibal's guts and will actively want to kill him. So that means Cannibal is left with 1 Late, 1 Mid, 2 Early in the end too. And That's before considering however many Nascents are left behind to defend their Plains territory.

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Also while we don't know much about Bloodhammer personality I doubt he's very happy that Weeping Anvil is just gone with no body to eat.

 

[TehChron]

Can Bloodhammer be affected by a droplet of Rust and Ruin?

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No, he and Weeping Anvil explicitly had different Cultivation builds

Hu Ai might be allowed to fight if only to have her gain fighting experience against 'equals'. I think Old Fish can be relied upon to fuck over OC at the worst time, but what about Bloodhammer?

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Bloodhammers a wild card but if Old Cannibal genuinely is too spooked to move on the Pass in force then that's going to be another contentious subordinate for him to deal with.

Whatever agreement went on between the two, theres no way that Bloodhammer has unfinished business to deal with as part of it

The formation of Core Elders would be deployed alongside the Nascent-level Flying Fortress (called the 'WTF') for power projection and maneuvering, alongside the Chrysocolla Paints legacy that lets them defend against Nascent attacks. We're going to stack all of our available buffs on that roaming Fortress to raid in-force which should at least match whatever Cannibal splits to defend against us - all to set up an opportunity to use the Implacable Chant and permanently ruin their Devil Bee production.

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I'd really like to gank the Queen and rob their lands clean on the way out, but if that's not feasible then simply restricting access is fine since thatll buy enough time for our first batch of Seeds to hit Nascent-relevant tier

Once Princey and Rina consistently punch at that level it's more or less over for them

 

[CuriousRaptor]

The formation of Core Elders would be deployed alongside the Nascent-level Flying Fortress (called the 'WTF') for power projection and maneuvering, alongside the Chrysocolla Paints legacy that lets them defend against Nascent attacks. We're going to stack all of our available buffs on that roaming Fortress to raid in-force which should at least match whatever Cannibal splits to defend against us - all to set up an opportunity to use the Implacable Chant and permanently ruin their Devil Bee production.


Unlikely for Bloodhammer to be using the exact same cultivation method that Weeping Anvil was using, especially after he turned to Blood Path.

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I am aware of the plan. And Chron clarified that trying to kill the Great Circle Nascent soul Bee queen, which could easily tpk the entirety of the desert alone is a stretch goal and we're mostly trying to block off access. Which put me more at ease. That said, 100 cores in formation are still vastly slower than a Early Ns. Great on the defense, not so great on the attack.

 

[TehChron]

That said, 100 cores in formation are still vastly slower than a Early Ns. Great on the defense, not so great on the attack.

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That's why we present a mobile hard point that demands a response. One entrapped and envenomed and Plot Couponed to Hell and back. Whoever is assisting Old Cannibal is forced to attack the Fornation on preferred ground, and if Ferenike is present that means either one of the likely candidates for backup will be vulnerable to it.

 

[Shaper47]

and in doing so hopefully win the Blood Oaks over to our side, abandoning the Blood Path in its entirety.

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Ok, now this I'm not really seeing the reasoning for.

Not only is it very insulting but its counterproductive to our position.

Next turn, ideally, we can secure the final criteria by opening up negotiations with the Blood Defiance Pact.

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...

You do know that the Blood Defiance Pact are our enemies right?

The enemy of our enemy is not our friend.

They want us dead and are playing the long term game of waiting till their favoured are strong enough to genocide us. Why would we want to help them?

 

[BungieONI]

You do know that the Blood Defiance Pact are our enemies right?

The enemy of our enemy is not our friend.

They want us dead and are playing the long term game of waiting till their favoured are strong enough to genocide us. Why would we want to help them?

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Because in that specific instance it lets us achieve our strategic objectives. They will want the pass to remain open as much as we do, or more, and we want OC in a vulnerable position.

So a level of cooperation with putting pressure on the Pass invasion, which the RP will already be responding to, is logical.

 

[TehChron]

Ok, now this I'm not really seeing the reasoning for.

Not only is it very insulting but its counterproductive to our position.

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...Are you confusing the philosophy for the polity? Otherwise I'm not seeing the insult. They can't very well ditch the Demonic powers for us when we're a Demonic power ourselves

.

You do know that the Blood Defiance Pact are our enemies right?

The enemy of our enemy is not our friend.

They want us dead and are playing the long term game of waiting till their favoured are strong enough to genocide us. Why would we want to help them?

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Okay this is just low tier bait. Theres no way you're seriously calling anyone short sighted with this kind of take.

Because in that specific instance it lets us achieve our strategic objectives. They will want the pass to remain open as much as we do, or more, and we want OC in a vulnerable position.

So a level of cooperation with putting pressure on the Pass invasion, which the RP will already be responding to, is logical.

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Yeeeeeeeep.

We're a Demonic power because we are flexible in means and the latitude we have - that we earned - with the Righteous powers is why we've been able to pick our fights the way that we have for the entirety of this quest.

That's self evident

 

[MrRageQuit]

As For Yuan? There are at LEAST 3 NS attacking and one fully committing to a death or glory assault in the Ma Emperor. The Trial Lord is badly injured and isn't going to be in shape to fight. Which means we need all hands on deck. Nascents included. We could conceivably four load into the Yuan, but we really really do need to poke the Blood Oaks, who have that tree that can brush into Spirit severing, and frankly doubling up is not only a good idea, but necessary if the Blood mists did the worst.

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You assume, of course, that the Noble Devil Alliance is going to be operating as one. Altar Lord's entire plan to to hang the Ma Clan out to dry so the Golden Devils can take over the Yuan. Learning that we've already turned the Yuan into our vassals will simply lead him to pull the plug on the support sooner.

Moreover, the NKS has no real incentive to bail out the Ma Clan. They're not Blood Path, so they don't even have the nom-nom gain. They basically got what they wanted right at the beginning - the absorption of the Ma lands - so why should their Nascents risk themselves for the Ma Emperor? All the more so when it looks like Old Gold pulled another All According To Keikaku out of his rear end.

 

[TehChron]

The Ma Emperor. As a blood path without any lands, faces the exact same dilemma that Old Cannibal did after we baited him in the aftermath of Corpse Gulper.

He has no stocks left to draw from.

If he wants to sustain himself, he needs to eat his own subordinates

The very ones hes doing all of this for in the first place. With the critical difference of this being a fight we have long experience in under considerably worse circumstances...

While the Ma Clan...don't

The very act of the Ma Emperor committing to battle will end this invasion. One way or another.

 

[CuriousRaptor]

You assume, of course, that the Noble Devil Alliance is going to be operating as one. Altar Lord's entire plan to to hang the Ma Clan out to dry so the Golden Devils can take over the Yuan. Learning that we've already turned the Yuan into our vassals will simply lead him to pull the plug on the support sooner.

Moreover, the NKS has no real incentive to bail out the Ma Clan. They're not Blood Path, so they don't even have the nom-nom gain. They basically got what they wanted right at the beginning - the absorption of the Ma lands - so why should their Nascents risk themselves for the Ma Emperor? All the more so when it looks like Old Gold pulled another All According To Keikaku out of his rear end.

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Either way we're going to need to commit at least two Nascent souls for a clean kill, and that's assuming the NK hang him out to dry and don't follow through on whatever pact they made to get the Ma to move. Given two of our Ns are fresh and eating a nice "Lmao new" malus, that means either Kleisthenes who is our chief diplomat (Whom we need to make contact and diplo the Oaks) and is also a tier lower, and thus easier to escape or beat, or Manuel who despite being wounded has the Spear of LMAO get bent and is still a Middle NS. Either way Chron's logic for this turn's plan is sound. Risky but what isn't this late in the game?

 

[TehChron]

Once again, were early enough into the invasion that the invaders dont know for sure what the Trial Lords status is.

So to any observer, if they can spot Manuel attacking, that's potentially two Mid Nascents + Kleisthenes with positional advantage against two earlies + Ma Emperor who lacks staying power due to a lack of potential victims to eat

It's not a great position for the invaders to be in, and fortunately it's a situation that wont reveal itself until a time of our sides choosing.

Which bleeds over into forcing Old Cannibal to be cautious due to lack of seeing Weeping Anvil and Manuel with him.

 

[fictionfan]

Please refer to the Nascent list, but here's the breakdown of all Nascents available to OC:
- Old Cannibal (Late)
- Gengxin the Poison Mistress (Early)
- Xinyue the Bee Queen (Early)
- Old Fish (Mid)
- Bloodhammer (Mid)
- Hu Ai (Mid)

That makes 1 Late, 3 Mid, 2 Early for the Bees. I've listed how we can have 1 Late, 1 Mid, 2 Early already.

If you're following so far, that leaves 2 enemy Mids unaccounted for, except that Hu Ai would be unusable since Altar Lord wants the Clan to succeed, and Old Fish hates Cannibal's guts and will actively want to kill him. So that means Cannibal is left with 1 Late, 1 Mid, 2 Early in the end too. And That's before considering however many Nascents are left behind to defend their Plains territory.

Click to shrink...

Being outnumbered by blood path isn't quite as bad as the raw numbers might suggest many or even most of our enemies don't trust each and would actively betray each other if the opportunity came up. They certainly are not going to deploy as optimally like a well drilled unit who all trust each other to have their backs.

Still even with that being kept in mind the numbers are grimm. We are going to need Manuel to being cunning. This was a very bad time to have memory lose.

I feel like our best move would be not to go for kills. Play defensive and promote paranoia as we drag things out.

 

[Simon_Jester]

Manuel getting Wounded is a slight bummer for the planned Nascent ganking spree, but he should still hold superiority with the Stone Spear's invulnerability I think. For Purchases, I'm leaning towards the Marriage Ring for that combat teamwork so Xinya + Manuel can do assassinations together in the Yuan War, where there's multiple Nascents we can kill for loot. Anvil's loot got us 3 extra Purchases, let's get more.

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Given that the Stone Spear eats Nascents when it kills them, and that Xinya is going to be vulnerable at first because new Nascents have a ramp-up time, I'd hesitate to throw the two of them at a single experienced enemy Nascent if the goal is loot. Because then we're either forced to send our dangerously inexperienced new Nascent in to land the killing blow, or the Spear which will eat all the loot.

 

[TehChron]

If these were ordinary circumstances, yeah. But this scenario is rife with ambush bait, and Lady Jiao did us a fairly large favor in showing how matchups amd ambushes can enable small realm jumping between Nascent Souls.

Ambushes like creating an entire Defensive position that's really an elaborate trap for an enemy Nascent Soul or two

 

[Alectai]

My major concern is assuming the beast will die, rather than decide to attack us because the Heavens guide it to our most important locations where it rampages, hurting our most critical endeavors.

We know that Beasts are basically proxies for the Heavenly Will, if one can't fulfill its function (Presumably serving as Border Patrol to keep the monkeys from leaving their containment zone), it'll presumably be freed up for new tasking. Which will assuredly be "Fucking us up in particular"

That's what I fear happens if we decide to bomb the nesting grounds of the Devil Bees.

 

[TehChron]

Well, theres a lot of variability in execution haha...

 

[Simon_Jester]

Yeah. All these Nascent super-bees and Nascent Owls and so on... they're Heaven's idea of the "baby form" of the true proper rulers of the universe. They are to the Emperor Turtle what the Bronze Devils are to Heraclius, so to speak.

 

[ConfusedCanuck]

Well now I am all for this gamble biggest concern here is if Old Cannibal isn't fooled and doesn't take a step back and be cautious when we/Manuel makes our move it could be a problem for us. Especially if he decides to take the chance and go for Manuel's head as well in an attempt to settle old scores. Because that could put Manuel in serious danger even with the spear on hand given his wounded state.

 

[Immenotyou]

Well now I am all for this gamble biggest concern here is if Old Cannibal isn't fooled and doesn't take a step back and be cautious when we/Manuel makes our move it could be a problem for us. Especially if he decides to take the chance and go for Manuel's head as well in an attempt to settle old scores. Because that could put Manuel in serious danger even with the spear on hand given his wounded state.

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.... OC isn't allowed to go in the desert and to attack Manuel in Yuan territory requires he goes over turtle bone mountain. Which doesn't make any sense.

 

[ConfusedCanuck]

.... OC isn't allowed to go in the desert and to attack Manuel in Yuan territory requires he goes over turtle bone mountain. Which doesn't make any sense.

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Wait I thought OC was near around Yuan territory leading that push? Did misunderstood where he was and if so never mind then, still trying to get everything in order my bad.

Cause if he was near Yuan territory and Manuel goes out to hunt Nascent's like TehChrons plan implied around that area I would have thought he'd want a rematch with his rival.

 

[Immenotyou]

Wait I thought OC was near around Yuan territory leading that push? Did misunderstood where he was and if so never mind then, still trying to get everything in order my bad.

Cause if he was near Yuan territory and Manuel goes out to hunt Nascent's like TehChrons plan implied around that area I would have thought he'd want a rematch with his rival.

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Yuan territory is NORTH of turtle bone mountain. The sorrowfull blacksmiths who OC is attacking are SOUTH of it.

The Ma emperor with Noble Knowledge Sect support is the attack heading for the Yuan.

 

[ConfusedCanuck]

Yuan territory is NORTH of turtle bone mountain. The sorrowfull blacksmiths who OC is attacking are SOUTH of it.

The Ma emperor with Noble Knowledge Sect support is the attack heading for the Yuan.

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Ahhhh ok yeah I mixed it up my bad.

 

[Immenotyou]

Ahhhh ok yeah I mixed it up my bad.

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All good.
Heres the year 240 map if you want to look at it.

Hmmph... this junior is a good seed [Cultivation Management Quest] Original - Fantasy

Run your own Xianxia faction! Offend old monsters! Raise good seeds! Face heavenly tribulations! And remember, always support your Young Masters, no matter who they offend.

forums.sufficientvelocity.com

 

[occipitallobe]

I know you're not really a fan of the pill forges, but something that occurred to me comes from the phrasing of the option.


If we look at this as setting up a baseline we can expand on later to actually improve our growth, I think this has more potential value than just stretching our reserves.

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This is less useful to improve growth overall unless the pass is closed long-term, or the Clan goes to war against the Righteous Path in the future. It's more insurance against trade routes failing than actual economic improvement. The Clan has to spend a lot more in terms of Qi to grow herbs (or import them in pre-pill forms) and so tends to just buy finished products most of the time. The Gardens and Forges are not very good investments in a world where the Clan can just buy pills, but excellent ones where they can't.

@occipitallobe , i have a question that will matter a lot for plans going forward.

Did Manuel also regained his sneaking abilities, with how entwined it is in his style, or like his administrative abilities, it is still in the memory soup, waiting proper digestion?

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From a gameplay perspective you can give him any task you like, he'll just underperform a bit because he's wounded - and if it's a dangerous task he risks more serious injury. The voted task will likely determine in-story what parts of his memory he aims to decrypt first.

Can Bloodhammer be affected by a droplet of Rust and Ruin?

Hu Ai might be allowed to fight if only to have her gain fighting experience against 'equals'. I think Old Fish can be relied upon to fuck over OC at the worst time, but what about Bloodhammer?

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No, the thing about Weeping Anvil was he went with a Achilles style of defense. 'Put all your weaknesses in one spot and hope nobody finds out about them'. Exceptionally strong except when it wasn't. Even if Bloodhammer did the same sort of thing, it wouldn't be the same weakness.

 

[Resonant]

This is just leaving potential on the table we need to be at our best now and while I care less about the price of supplies the use for our nascent soul corps should be used now and not in the hop that it could be used later.

The three options we have are good enough and can really change the coming few turns, sometimes waiting for a better option is the play, this is not such a time. things are coming to a head in the next few turns there is no guarantee we'll get a better option in that time.

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The supplies vote isn't very controversial - it will be adjusted in the medium term based on circumstances: if the Pass reopens quickly, it will go back to Low Prices. If the Pass remains closed, it will default to High Prices. In this case, we want to hedge our bets and play conservative by going with High Prices, especially as we're already investing a ton into Yuan's defense - 2 Nascent traps, 2 Nascents to fight, fortifying, missions, existing Yuan defenses, etc.

The 3 options for Anvil's corpse are frankly lackluster: minor combat boost to Cores, puppets to boost our already great battlefield prowess, or upgrading the Beast Tide Trap for a THIRD time. None of these are optimal, and the long-term plan has been to save Anvil's corpse made of Nascent Metal for building a Nascent Flying Fortress (called the WTF).

I would either put our more experienced and fighty Early into the Yuan conflict (this might reasure folks who worry about deploying Manuel) and have Casia focus on administration to prep our cash reserves for a big push next turn.

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There is a matter of Nascent synergy to consider - Xinya + Manuel will be a monstrous assassin duo. Kleisthenes is older and more experienced than Xinya, so let's say it's an equal trade-off between sending Manuel/Kleisthenes vs. Manuel/Xinya. For Blood Oak diplomacy, we need to send Kleisthenes at minimum - Casia is a fresh Early and has an incredibly weak Dao for combat, thus sending Casia (alone) would be risking her death.

So Kleisthenes locked into Diplomacy, Manuel + Xinya locked into Yuan defense, that leaves Casia's action. She could be used for administration, but extra Wealth is less crucial now that we've got 4 Nascent actions per turn, compared to the need to secure the last wild card in the region (Blood Oaks). We can parlay diplomatic latitude gained with the Blood Oaks to all manner of strategic gambits like the planned WTF raid, or even Qiguai annexation.

This is a risk; manual can die or get more seriously injured because your sending him already injured. An unnecessary risk. Send the other two in his stead. Should be more then enough and would get them some nascent combat experience.

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To recap: we made a Nascent Oath to defend the Yuan Clan and let the Yuan Nascent recover, so we're bound to send our Nascents to help. The invasion consists of Ma Emperor (Mid Nascent) and some support from Noble Knowledge who have 1 Mid + 2 Early Nascent. Noble Knowledge can send 1-2 Early, so we need to counter 1 Mid and 1-2 Early.

Against that match-up, we literally cannot substitute Manuel with anyone else. Even if we sent all 3 of our Early Nascents, they will get absolutely crushed since 2 of them are new. Manuel is in fact the lowest risk option - he still has the Stone Spear making him almost invincible in Mid-Nascent, plus he's getting further buffed by Xinya's marriage synergy.

I've already explained above how we need to send Kleisthenes for Blood Oak diplomacy at minimum, and Casia is more unsuited for battle than a wounded Manuel. So the only choice is to send Manuel + Xinya.