Harry Potter and the Skittering Spouse

[Ravenwood240]

Not necessarily; Jacob was able to use Legilimency to send visions to his brother in Hogwarts Mystery. It does appear to require some kind of connection to use Legilimency over distances without eye contact, which Voldemort's soul fragment provides, but it's not soul fragment exclusive. Queenie was also able to passively use Legilimency in an area around her without making eye contact, proving that it is indeed not necessary.

Voldemort also explicitly uses Legilimency to send Harry those visions; the soul fragment provides the connection, but it is Voldemort's use of Legilimency that is the actual cause of the visions, which is why Harry never got any visions before Voldemort discovered the connection.

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Uh...
If Harry Potter can be used to define legilimency as "not mind reading", then Marvel comics can be used to define mind reading...

In which case, you're completely right; legilimency is a wizard attempting to recreate telepathy and failing miserably.

However:

You can't really compare the two, because legilimency is a single source power, while hundreds of people over hundreds of years have created or altered telepathy, meaning you can't narrow it down to this one defined power.

There's a hell of a difference between Spock and Professor X after all.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

If Harry Potter can be used to define legilimency as "not mind reading", then Marvel comics can be used to define mind reading...

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Could do worse than use pre-Potterverse, pre-Marvel, definitions of Telepathy derived from real-world parapsychology, maybe occultism?

If I wanted to, I could refer to Van Vogt's novel Slan (1940), if wanting a fictional source... As Taylor's mother was an English Literature prof, who know what she might be familiar with?

Also, time-travel. Annette is currently alive (on Earth Bet) at the Potter-verse date. Is this likely to occur Taylor, at some point, as "Could I somehow save my mother from her car accident?" ?

EDIT:

'Classical' Telepathy, 'mind reading', is arguably surface thoughts only, and only receives - 'normal' limits (for all but well-known targets) is line-of-sight - 'meeting their gaze' may be required.

Send thoughts? A sort of mental 'speech' (still basically unvoiced speech, no deeper), is 'Telepathic Projection', 'Mind Speech', or some such. 'Mind Probing' is digging deeper, and is generally slow and needs special preconditions. Want to alter memories? Ditto. Also, control people, mentally, do tricks like use their senses. Project illusions into the mind? A different talent.

Prof X Astral Projection? Ha! A totally different talent. Then, there's all the different sorts of mind shielding, stuff like 'subtle mind probing', etc., etc.

Note, the Simurgh, which is argued to be the only known telepath in the Worm-verse. Also, ha! Gallant reads emotions, and there's likely loads of other not-really-a-telepath cases. Taylor's knowledge of such will be limited, though. Her friend Lisa claims (falsely) to be 'psychic'...

 

[sunsunsunsunsun]

Also, time-travel. Annette is currently alive at the Potter-verse date. Is this likely to occur Taylor, at some point, as "Could I somehow save my mother from her car accident?" ?

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Only if Earth-Wizard and Earth-Bet somehow share enough history to Produce Annette, despite Earth bet not having a secret wizard society. Annette was alive in Aleph after GM, and she didn't need Taylor's help, so I doubt it's going to come up.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

Only if Earth-Wizard and Earth-Bet somehow share enough history to Produce Annette, despite Earth bet not having a secret wizard society. Annette was alive in Aleph after GM, and she didn't need Taylor's help, so I doubt it's going to come up.

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Earth Alph was supposed to be (mostly) real-world. So is the Potter-verse. On that basis, there might be a local Annette. Somewhere (likely, in the USA). Or, maybe she's at a UK university?

But. If Taylor has 'moved in time' to get to the Potter-verse, could a related phenomena be used to 'get back' her Annette, not a foreign one?

 

[sunsunsunsunsun]

Earth Alph was supposed to be (mostly) real-world. So is the Potter-verse. On that basis, there might be a local Annette. Somewhere (likely, in the USA). Or, maybe she's at a UK university?

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Earth Aleph is not at all "the real world" They had Parahumans and they had a Brookton Bay. The Travelers are From Aleph and they mention Aleph Parahumans in their interlude.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

Earth Aleph is not at all "the real world" They had Parahumans and they had a Brookton Bay. The Travelers are From Aleph and they mention Aleph Parahumans in their interlude.

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Earth Bet is 'the real world' but history from 1980s altered by loadsa parahumans (plus Endbringers). Earth Alph is IRL, with a few parahumans (who've little affected things), contact from Earth Bet (not sure about BB, but ditto). Earth Alph history to 2011 is very, very, close to IRL. It's part of the basic conceit/logic of 'Worm'...

 

[sunsunsunsunsun]

Earth Bet is 'the real world' but history from 1980s altered by loadsa parahumans (plus Endbringers). Earth Alph is IRL, with a few parahumans (who've little affected things), contact from Earth Bet (not sure about BB, but ditto). Earth Alph history to 2011 is very, very, close to IRL. It's part of the basic conceit/logic of 'Worm'...

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That's just not true my guy. Earth Aleph is *closer* to IRL than any other world in the Worm Multiverse but it is categorically NOT IRL. Earth Bet diverged from Aleph in 1980, but they're both not "the real world but with parahumans papered over". I shouldn't have to keep bringing this up, but the City of Brookton Bay, with it's major Shipping Industry in the late 1800s-1900s, is a fictional place that doesn't exist in our world, but does in both Aleph and Bet. Saying "The real world but altered by parahumans" is a categorical misunderstanding. It's not a basic conceit of the setting, it's a handwave so that WB can write a Modern-adjacent setting, but without having to backload hundreds of years of alternate history exposition to come to the same spot, but the world of EB (and to a lesser extend EA) is not ours, their phones are circles, the Chinese nation is under the control of a monarch/dictatorship backed by parahumans (and those are ripple effects that definitely extend further back than 1980), etc etc. If the Harry Potter world is supposed to be even closer to ours than EA (appears as such to muggles, but given the magical BS involved with stuff like the world wars according to the backstory and poorly illuminated in the fantastic beasts movies) then we would expect there to be no such city as Brookton Bay and no such person as Annette Rose. (We never learn Annette's Maiden Name or her Married Name on Aleph in the Epilogue)

 

[CastleTrime]

Only if Earth-Wizard and Earth-Bet somehow share enough history to Produce Annette, despite Earth bet not having a secret wizard society. Annette was alive in Aleph after GM, and she didn't need Taylor's help, so I doubt it's going to come up.

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And what evidence do we have that Earth Bet doesn't have a wizarding society? Taylor assumed that earlier but that was before she discovered the existence of obliviate and how free they are about using it. And arguing Taylors power allows her to see through it could just mean their weren't any wizarding enclaves in Brookton Bay. After all depending on population estimates most wizards might live in only a small number of cities.

Of course the rise of Parahumans might result in them getting found out but considering wizarding arrogance assuming they had just managed to hide well enough is more reasonable than them not existing. Plus even Taylor might admit its plausible considering how similar there histories are until recently.

That said QA reaction of curiosity suggests magic doesn't exist on Earth Bet but its not like the characters know QA exists and has reason to be able to easily spy on the wizarding communities. So it reasonable for them to assume it does for now.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

And what evidence do we have that Earth Bet doesn't have a wizarding society? Taylor assumed that earlier but that was before she discovered the existence of obliviate and how free they are about using it.

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If it was just parahumans, even including Myrddin, and the 'magical' group the Adepts, I'd be inclined to agree with you. The Fallen might be worth considering, too.

Chucking the Endbringers into the mix rather makes me think the Magical World couldn't play their 'hidden magicals' game. Something would break. Master/Stranger protocols might collide with obliviation. Simurgh hits London (2003) - if she finds out about Magical Britain do you think she could resist using it?

So, on balance, I'm reasonably convinced there's no hidden magicals on Earth Bet (or Alph). After a bit of thought I suspect Taylor would conclude that they're extremely unlikely.

EDIT:

Wildbow has (alleged) said that Myrddin was... inspired by Harry Dresden. Yes, Marvel and DC mix magic into their supers, but unless you want to get seriously AU, they don't seem compatible with the Worm-verse. Wouldn't the Entity initial scan before landing have spotted it? And, if magic was on their 'known abilities' list, exploited it, somehow, or trashed the Earths because they were a risk?

You're going to have to work pretty hard to credibly have hidden magicals mixed in with your parahumans... But, maybe you'll come up with an approach that's workable? (I'd prefer to avoid 'Gaia hides it'...) If so, I'd read it!

 

[sunsunsunsunsun]

And what evidence do we have that Earth Bet doesn't have a wizarding society?

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Are you seriously, geniuinely asserting absence of evidence as evidence? We know earth bet doesn't have a wizarding society, because Cauldron who invited every group with enough force to shake a stick to their big "Khonsu is fucking us" meeting and they did not invite any wizards. (As well as the whole, WB was writing a superhero story where magic gets dunked on, not urban fantasy.) if you want to go write a fanfic where EB/EA is actually EP, that is within your rights, but the default assumption is the one with the least contradictions, and that is "no wizards on bet"

 

[CastleTrime]

Are you seriously, geniuinely asserting absence of evidence as evidence? We know earth bet doesn't have a wizarding society, because Cauldron who invited every group with enough force to shake a stick to their big "Khonsu is fucking us" meeting and they did not invite any wizards. (As well as the whole, WB was writing a superhero story where magic gets dunked on, not urban fantasy.) if you want to go write a fanfic where EB/EA is actually EP, that is within your rights, but the default assumption is the one with the least contradictions, and that is "no wizards on bet"

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Are you seriously citing canon events that haven't happened yet as justification? In canon magic doesn't exist but this is a crossover where it does exist and has for all of history. By that logic the wizarding world can't exist and Taylor is delusional/mastered or the entire society was created whole cloth in the last two decades.

Anyway I was mostly thinking about it from an in-universe perspective rather than a meta one. The wizards are totally the sort to believe magic must exist on this other world that looks so similar to there own. Especially since myths of magic exist just like the ones that on there world were inspired by real events. Under that logic the absence of evidence of magical life simply means the secrecy is working despite the issues.

If it was just parahumans, even including Myrddin, and the 'magical' group the Adepts, I'd be inclined to agree with you. The Fallen might be worth considering, too.

Chucking the Endbringers into the mix rather makes me think the Magical World couldn't play their 'hidden magicals' game. Something would break. Master/Stranger protocols might collide with obliviation. Simurgh hits London (2003) - if she finds out about Magical Britain do you think she could resist using it?

So, on balance, I'm reasonably convinced there's no hidden magicals on Earth Bet (or Alph). After a bit of thought I suspect Taylor would conclude that they're extremely unlikely.

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This is a fairly sensible reason to believe the magical communities doesn't exist. I actual did comment about the rise of parahumans might have gotten them found out but noted the wizarding arrogance would probably make them believe they are avoiding the muggles rather than don't exist.

As for the entities well you merely have to make them aware of magic and factor it into there calculations. Unless its so potent as to be immensely dangerous to the entity the cycle might go ahead like canon anyway.

But again I was arguing that Taylor and wizards aren't going to simply assume magic doesn't exist on Earth Bet without a lot more evidence than a muggles never heard of it. By that logic after all most muggles on this world would insist it doesn't exist after all!

 

[Fencer]

Harry potter and the half blood prince contains some of the most idiotic dialogue and and romance it has been my displeasure to endure in recent memory the ham handed shipping is bad enough but the outright idiocy and blind lockstep around the various conspiracies and intrigue is enough to make me shout at air and damn it all if you open with collapsed bridges and violent murders how do you make it to Christmas with the cast still not treating their life like the prelude to war!

Fucking Rowling!

 

[Alexander Snow]

Harry potter and the half blood prince contains some of the most idiotic dialogue and and romance it has been my displeasure to endure in recent memory the ham handed shipping is bad enough but the outright idiocy and blind lockstep around the various conspiracies and intrigue is enough to make shout at air and damn it all if you open with collapsed bridges and violent murders how do you make it to Christmas with the cast still not treating their life like the prelude to war!

Fucking Rowling!

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Welcome to the club, we have meetings every Saturday. We have snacks and booze, lots of booze.

 

[Fencer]

Welcome to the club, we have meetings every Saturday. We have snacks and booze, lots of booze.

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Thanks you I just needed to know I wasn't alone in this!

All seriousness, I got the audio book to listen to at work because I couldn't make myself keep reading it for research in my free time and I'm just…. I'm so glad Taylor is there to help me burn this shit show to the ground. So so so glad.

 

[Jormuungaand]

I read the last two books once. And only once. And I read everything that held still long enough to.

 

[Code-Perseus]

Thanks you I just needed to know I wasn't alone in this!

All seriousness, I got the audio book to listen to at work because I couldn't make myself keep reading it for research in my free time and I'm just…. I'm so glad Taylor is there to help me burn this shit show to the ground. So so so glad.

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I recall at least one fic where, while it's not confirmed, it's heavily suspected by Harry(the MC, obviously) that Dumbledore was potioning the trio during 6th year, for whatever reason, because not a god-damn thing that happened that year makes sense otherwise. For example, Ron showing interest in Lavender Brown, a girl so vapid that she misspells the word rock(for context, in that fic it's explained that Ron can only handle so much blatant stupidity before he becomes scathingly impolite, see every interaction with Crabbe and Goyle), or Hermione questioning everything Harry does and being super Rules-focused, when previously she had been doing stunts like brewing Polyjuice in the bathroom.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

As I understand it, some authors do not do well when publishers keep coming up to them, and slapping them around the face with cheque-books, where extra zeroes keep getting added on the end of advances... Also, past a certain point, authors need both a good editor, who can say 'No', and make it stick, and/or a circle of helpfully critical friends. I'll leave it to others to comment on exactly where... certain settings might suggest an apparent lack of these...

Some series of books work better as trilogies, where the author then takes a break to 'refresh', maybe write a stand-alone novel, or two, before writing the second trilogy. Or not. YMMV.

 

[Kinsfire]

Half-Baked Plot was the first and only book I've ever actually thrown across a room in disgust when I was done with it. It's why I won't try to finish reading Worm - I've tried, and I get that urge before I reach the end. I can't afford to replace my laptop. (And people usually laugh when I say that, because they think I'm joking.)

 

[Skrattybones]

Harry potter and the half blood prince contains some of the most idiotic dialogue and and romance it has been my displeasure to endure in recent memory the ham handed shipping is bad enough but the outright idiocy and blind lockstep around the various conspiracies and intrigue is enough to make me shout at air and damn it all if you open with collapsed bridges and violent murders how do you make it to Christmas with the cast still not treating their life like the prelude to war!

Fucking Rowling!

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The only concrete thing I remember about HBP is picturing Alan Rickman dramtically declaring, "I AM PAGLIACCI." when he finds out Potter has his old book.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

The only concrete thing I remember about HBP is picturing Alan Rickman dramtically declaring, "I AM PAGLIACCI." when he finds out Potter has his old book.

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Pagliacci? Is this a reference to the fanfic But Doctor, I am Pagliacci? (No, I've not read that fanfic.) If you wanted to, you might want to explain that association...

'Fraid I don't see it... Snape finds out how much of his potion skills-development Potter and co. now know? He thinks he's a clown and why didn't everyone know that? Total communications (modelling of other's understanding) failure? Sorry...

 

[Functionality]

Thanks you I just needed to know I wasn't alone in this!

All seriousness, I got the audio book to listen to at work because I couldn't make myself keep reading it for research in my free time and I'm just…. I'm so glad Taylor is there to help me burn this shit show to the ground. So so so glad.

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You could just…not read harry potter and make shit up for the fic if you want.

 

[Ace Dreamer]

You could just…not read harry potter and make shit up for the fic if you want.

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Do that thoroughly enough, and, does it turn from a fanfic into an Original Work? In general though, fanfics don't seem to legally enforce 'Truth in Advertising'...

OTOH, 'I was inspired by what I heard about it' does seem to have been a common approach in (Hollywood) movie making, to the extent original authors have asked their name to be removed from any connection with the movie...

 

[Fencer]

You could just…not read harry potter and make shit up for the fic if you want.

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I mean with Taylor on hand that is absolutely a thing that will happen because raging incompetence isn't something she will allow to continue. So I'm going to have to start making things up. On the other hand I ended up with a half dozen "quick make a note moments" already. Because the book is just… so out there.

Completely forgot that for some reason all of a sudden Rowling had half the girls in the castle giggling after Harry (what the fuck why?! No I get the shallow attraction bit but some of their friends and families are being murdered what the fuck are these priorities?!) which means they'll all hate Taylor.

Or that Ron and Hermione are insane this whole year over the dumbest shit and how that could influence Taylor's relationship with those two.

The Malfoy conspiracy isn't going to make it out of the cradle just nope no nah uh Taylor can absolutely figure this shit out in no time at all and then I just need to decide how she will react. Which will prompt reactions from others and so on and so on and so on. This craps pretty useless for major plot points but it's giving me ideas for background stuff. Like I completely forgot that Lupin just fucks off to fail at restraining the werwolf packs this book. Which is a whole reason for Tonks to be miserable and for Taylor to call all of them idiots because no shit that won't work why are you waisting time trying?

*head desk* It's a good practice in general and it is giving me things to work with it's just that it is also stupid and frustrating.

Edit: also! I totally didn't realize when I started but voldy left his followers to rot in jail for awhile. Except that doesn't make any sense because the Dementors were already on his side at the start of the book! Rowling, what the fuck? Why would he steal the prison guards but leave his followers, just to come and break them out later? What were you smoking?!

 

[Teatime42]

Edit: also! I totally didn't realize when I started but voldy left his followers to rot in jail for awhile. Except that doesn't make any sense because the Dementors were already on his side at the start of the book! Rowling, what the fuck? Why would he steal the prison guards but leave his followers, just to come and break them out later? What were you smoking?!

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Make it so that those in charge of the ministry can somewhat plausibly continue to pretend Voldemort doesn't exist anymore?

 

[RealOtto]

Why would he steal the prison guards but leave his followers, just to come and break them out later?

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PR Fear Factor, Perhaps?