Remove ads

Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Reader mode
XenonPrime said:
Problematic, although there's nothing stopping Molly from warning Arawn that Harry is bound to summon Mab when it is reasonable to do so.

Presumably he can run and hide, Mab already knows that he's in Chicago given she gave this task to Harry.
If she could find him from proximity then she could just fly over the city a few times at night.

The danger of forcing Lydia into taking his place is there, although there's not a lot that can be done there.
I presume if the Ankou dies his mantle will switch to her, Winter Court Mantles don't really seem to care about consent.

Or she convinces Lydia to take on the role willingly to save her father from one terrible fate or another.

Again, not a lot to be done as Molly is certainly not ready to throw down with Mab.

The least we can do is make sure no necromancer god is created, warn Arawn in good faith but basically accept things as they come.

Leaning on Lash is a bad idea at this point, I don't think she can be considered reliable at this point.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah, if we give Lash control she may well decide that it's in Harry's best interest to alert Mab ASAP because that's the fastest way out of his debt - be useful to Mab enough that she's willing to actually use him.

Artemis1992 said:
Solidarity among psychopomps?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Maybe, but she is a mercenary. I mean that literally. She is an ax for hire. She works for Odin, who is Santa, who is also a Father of Winter.

The only real tie she has to us at the moment is that we are a blade aimed at someone she hates. The moment we kill her target she could leave and consider her job done and done well. I don't think we should count on her aid for any task NOT directly opposing her target.
 
Last edited:
Arawn would make a very useful ally, one worth it even if we had to spend XP on a background for him.

A cross-cultural Death God opposed to necromancers could also be a very useful thing cosmologically with the heirs to Kemmler (and possibly Kemmler himself) running around.

Hooking him up with some VEE might be interesting as well:
 
Fouredged Sword said:
Or we find him and use a question focused on him to ask "How can this person escape Mab before Harry Dresden can contact Mab without hurting anyone?"
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That might actually work. DP's said before that the reason the Crown questions don't work for PtV is free will, but Mab explicitly doesn't have Free Will as a Faerie. We'd have to word it so we don't try to predict Harry's actions, but it seems feasible.
 
Last edited:
Lost Star said:
Minor thought. Harry has to summon her as soon as he can. What if he can't talk for a few days?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That would require him being unconscious. We might be able to swing that. We'd need to make some form of machine that can maintain sedation, but between the Excellency and Tool Transcending Constructs, we might be able to pull it off.

We'd need to slip a sedative into his coffee first though, or cosh him in a way that doesn't inflict permanent damage, and I'm not sure we could easily do that.

Odysseus2099 said:
That might actually work. DP's said before that the reason the Crown questions don't work for PtV is free will, but Mab explicitly doesn't have that as a Faerie. We'd have to word it so we don't have to project Harry's actions, but it seems feasible.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Mab has less free will than a mortal, and it isn't underwritten by the White God, but I think she still has some.
 
Last edited:
Alratan said:
That would require him being unconscious. We might be able to swing that. We'd need to make some form of machine that can maintain sedation, but between the Excellency and Tool Transcending Constructs, we might be able to pull it off.

We'd need to slip a sedative into his coffee first though, or cosh him in a way that doesn't inflict permanent damage, and I'm not sure we could easily do that.



Mab has less free will than a mortal, and it isn't underwritten by the White God, but I think she still has some.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It would require him to be unconscious, but for how long? Do we think Mab's target can get away with an hour head start?

Though in all honesty I am more behind plan part ways with Harry than plan knock Harry out. Knocking Harry out is plan B.
 
veekie said:
He did get away once.
I assume he has plans for what happens whrn she catches up.

Noting it may be for the best that she does eventually - debts are heritable and the kid has negligible chances of being able to pull this off
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

It's unclear to me whether Arawn actually has a debt to Mab. If he's surrendered the mantle of the Eldest Ankou the debt may well have stayed with said Mantle.

He was her vassal in return for her giving him the Mantle and the resulting ability to affect the world. Now he's given up the mantle it may well have simply ended the relationship. She has the mantle back and his requirements to be loyal to her while wearing the mantle is ended.

Just how Odin only has to listen to her when wearing the Mantle of Winter King, not when wearing the Mantle of Norse God.

In fact; I'm pretty sure that Arawn doesn't have a debt to Mab. The Eldest Ankou had obligations to him; but he's not the Eldest Ankou anymore.
 
Last edited:
U'm leaning towards finding the Ankou ( which we dont know how to do), at the moment of the Black Feast ( which we are still not sure about or where it is), where we summon Mab ( which I am unsure of. But know we will at least need a deal for, actually can Molly even summon), to have them deal with Ankou and necromancers and the rogue valkyrie in a manner in wwhich we can have Mab herself make a deal with Ankou in exchange for ( not sure what can the Ankou offer)
 
Alratan said:
We're capped at five dot merits; I think.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
6 Dot merits

So we can grant legendary sphere magic. Making any wizard gain legendary talent of any 1 field per wish. Given the lack of people to make warden swords, or able to use healing magic that is a big deal.

Sadly the only 7 dot merit we can grant is true faith in Molly. Which we would really have to find a exploit to get people up to the rez people without spending 10 years on it.
bengalqueen said:
And honestly, we should probably be careful about giving out VEE wishes to allies, since three wishes turns someone into a Creature of Darkness and makes them instinctively loyal to us, which is kind of horrible to do to family. And I think DP once mentioned that even one wish can leave a noticeable taint of hell magic if it's the right thing.

However, our little "helper kami" are already bound to be loyal to us and as tainted by our magic as it's possible to get, so if Clippy wants to wish for literally magical cell reception or whatever we should totally grant that once we get the Charm.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
3 wishes over 3 years their is a year cool-down per person. Also you can wish on other peoples behalf, or for joint stuff. Like say we buy 81% of a nice pizza place with lotto winnings. Making the company a resource listing on say 8 peoples sheet. And then the other owners wish the company finds success and bam a few weeks latter we own 80% of the entire worlds pizza places with just 8 people wishing for it. Like all things what matters is how well you exploit it, and VEE is very exploitable.

And as you pointed out we can make loyal minions with HMP. So we can do not lack for people that can make wishes on our behalf. Like that dragon nest we agreed to repair, just need a few HMP minions and we can just skip spending valuable AP on the job.
 
Last edited:
Yog said:
Oh my. Are we sure this isn't a plot to get Lydia as a replacement for her father by Mab? That would be an appropriate revenge from her, I feel, especially if Lydia being was only possible because of Ankou slipping the leash. Also Mab standoff. Shame we don't have "kill immortals" charm yet.

On the given options... Dealing with Lasciel is a bad idea. Like, totally bad. And Mab would probably know, and it would still be a breach of Harry's word. That's probably a no go. Calling Mab now wouldn't fulfill the oath - Harry still hasn't found elder Ankou.

I'll point out that Mab, as a once-human, might be susceptible to the Black Feast. So a Galaxy Brain move would be to lure her into the ritual and feed her to Molly / Lydia / Gard. That's totally a stupid idea, though.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Mab is not as far as you know vulnerable to the Black Feast, she is a proper immortal who did not use 'a shared understanding of death' to power her mantle
 
Crazyone47 said:
U'm leaning towards finding the Ankou ( which we dont know how to do), at the moment of the Black Feast ( which we are still not sure about or where it is), where we summon Mab ( which I am unsure of. But know we will at least need a deal for, actually can Molly even summon), to have them deal with Ankou and necromancers and the rogue valkyrie in a manner in wwhich we can have Mab herself make a deal with Ankou in exchange for ( not sure what can the Ankou offer)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Why would we want to summon Mab, given she's our enemy? Molly has good reasons to screw over Mab, considering she had her friends murdered and tortured her.

DragonParadox said:
Mab is not as far as you know vulnerable to the Black Feast, she is a proper immortal who did not use 'a shared understanding of death' to power her mantle
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

We may not know this IC, but as I recall Mab was a mortal who used something like but not the same as the Darkhallow to ascend, so she's in an interesting position.
 
Okay so does Ankou have the mantle?
I think we have alot more trouble going on.
We habe t found the Ankou yet might I remind everyone.
Actually do we know why Mab want sto find the Ankou anyway? Besides pride obviously.
 
We still don't know enough about Katrina's side of the plot equation, what exactly Arawn's involvement is, or what the ritual actually does. Trying to decide on how to avoid summoning Mab at this point is somewhat premature, IMO.

[X] "It's too soon to try to plan around having to deal with Mab on top of the rest of this mess. Why don't we just focus on stopping the necromancer plot for now, and play the rest by ear as the situation develops? I know that's probably not how you normally do things, but it's been working for me so far." And should we need to knock Harry out before he can summon Mab, we can make that decision if and when it becomes necessary.
 
Goldfish said:
We still don't know enough about Katrina's side of the plot equation, what exactly Arawn's involvement is, or what the ritual actually does. Trying to decide on how to avoid summoning Mab at this point is somewhat premature, IMO.

[X] "It's too soon to try to plan around having to deal with Mab on top of the rest of this mess. Why don't we just focus on stopping the necromancer plot for now, and play the rest by ear as the situation develops? I know that's probably not how you normally do things, but it's been working for me so far." And should we need to knock Harry out before he can summon Mab, we can make that decision if and when it becomes necessary.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

As a note you have the problem that Lydia wants Harry to find her father and she would point out, reasonably, that he is a powerful ally to have against Katrina.

Crazyone47 said:
Okay so does Ankou have the mantle?
I think we have alot more trouble going on.
We habe t found the Ankou yet might I remind everyone.
Actually do we know why Mab want sto find the Ankou anyway? Besides pride obviously.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Nope, Mab did not share that part with Harry.
 
Last edited:
Alratan said:
How could Mab even impose a cost of failure?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Debt magic and phrasing. It's functionally the same as how your power company won't give you electricity for your best attempt to pay them, they actually need to get the money.

He doesn't have to ensure it goes well, but if he fails to make the summon in a timely fashion after he learns where Ankou is then he broke faith and therefore didn't pay her back properly.

This is where the lack of definition bites him, because if he had a clause for defaulting on payment then it'd go into effect here. Since he doesn't Mab gets to set the terms as she pleases within the scope of what he owes.
 
[X] "It's too soon to try to plan around having to deal with Mab on top of the rest of this mess. Why don't we just focus on stopping the necromancer plot for now, and play the rest by ear as the situation develops? I know that's probably not how you normally do things, but it's been working for me so far." And should we need to knock Harry out before he can summon Mab, we can make that decision if and when it becomes necessary.
 
Crazyone47 said:
Okay so does Ankou have the mantle?
I think we have alot more trouble going on.
We habe t found the Ankou yet might I remind everyone.
Actually do we know why Mab want sto find the Ankou anyway? Besides pride obviously.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

The Eldest Ankou is a Mantle; I think; one that Arawn appears to have discarded or stopped wearing.

Based on what we know, obligations associated with a Mantle only apply when wearing said Mantle, as shown by Odin.

That's probably why Mab needs Harry to hunt down Arawn, rather than just calling him to Arctic Tor like she can with creatures sworn to Winter. She wouldn't need to ask for Harry's assistance otherwise.

Remember, Mab can go after non-mortals without needing an excuse, it's just mortals that she can't.

What's interesting is that rather than keeping the mantle of the eldest Ankou and being able to switch between roles like Odin does, Arawn abandoned it. That could simply be because Mab is a terrible, terrible boss, as she is to Harry, that he just quit and didn't look back. Mab seeing it as a loss of face and wanting to punish an employee for quitting fits with that. Or there could be a deeper plan.

DragonParadox said:
As a note you have the problem that Lydia wants Harry to find her father and she would point out, reasonably, that he is a powerful ally to have against Katrina.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Is Katrina in transit? We could simply go with the assassination by car plan and have Harry be part of the hit squad to mop her up if she survives, without going anywhere near her father.
 
Alratan said:
That would require him being unconscious. We might be able to swing that. We'd need to make some form of machine that can maintain sedation, but between the Excellency and Tool Transcending Constructs, we might be able to pull it off.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No, I mean literally can't talk. We afflict him with laryngitis, or make a potion that would do it.
 
[X] "It's too soon to try to plan around having to deal with Mab on top of the rest of this mess. Why don't we just focus on stopping the necromancer plot for now, and play the rest by ear as the situation develops? I know that's probably not how you normally do things, but it's been working for me so far." And should we need to knock Harry out before he can summon Mab, we can make that decision if and when it becomes necessary.
 
DragonParadox said:
You do not know where she is right now, she has not come back to her car.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Can we call her car to us and use it as a target to ask where it's owner is?

Because I am going with

[X] "I can't hand someone to Mab Harry. Not someone who got away. I know you are stuck in the deal you made, but I can't be part of that. Lydia, if you want to stick with Harry, fine, but I'm going after Katrina."
 
Last edited:
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top