Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

Okay.
If you don't want to kill her in full daylight then lets wait halfway between the parlor and the prison.
It wuld waste our chance to hurt her with the car, but at least we get our fight.

I absolutly hate the idea of dancing around her any longer.

Edit: She might kill a bunch of paramedics and cops though, if she goes through the tattoo parlor. Not like she has any reason to care.
Haste isnt speed. Impatience often just makes shit worse.
The reason we're here, now, in this situation where we're trying to juggle Cindy, Lydia and an incoming Kattrin, was because the majority of voters allowed impatience to make them skip a preliminary phone call to Lydia before they Crows of Eyes'd Cindy's location.

She does have plenty of reason to care.
Kinda hard to run a magic ritual if you're the subject of a manhunt by every LEO in Cook County.
It's Chicago. Security cameras are fairly common; she literally used them to frame Dresden.
Command Kattrin's car to crash itself now, causing at least a delay. Use the delay to get Lydia and Cindy to safety. Locate Kattrin later using Gard or one of Kattrin's thralls as the focus of the Crown. Ambush her on our own terms.
I dont think we can afford to lose track of Kattrin now.
If she gets out and steals a car, or even just flags down a taxi, she's in the wind and we're blind.

We don't necessarily need to crash the car nearby. Doing it anywhere along its route could work for our purposes, since that would at the very least delay Katrina's arrival here, giving us time to get Cindy clear and possibly even find Lydia, if she's still below ground.

Depending on the route, we might even be able to have Black Rider dump Katrina and her passenger off a bridge.

We would be losing Black Rider as a spy and potential saboteur, but we should still have the GPS data from him that would let us know where he's been since Katrina left Matthews' house. There are pretty good odds that wherever she just left from is where we need to go. She really shouldn't have any reasonable suspicion that we were spying on her, either, even after Black Rider crashes. From her POV and prior experience, it would be much more likely that she or the car had been targeted thaumaturgically with a curse or magical attack of some kind.
Its a hundred and twenty thousand dollar Mercedes AMG.
The passive safety measures in the car design of a car that expensive would keep a lot of normals alive in car accidents, let alone a Norse demigod necromancer. I honestly wouldnt expect her to take any damage even with the airbags disabled.

And once she's out of the car, she's in the wind.
She kidnapped Cindy, and she has her grandfather. She has their hair. Dresden tracks people with hairs from their head; its a common enough technique that Binder shaved his head to get rid of Dresden's ability to follow him.

Im beginning to think we need to hand Cindy off to Hendricks and retrace our steps underground.
Well depends on how quickly emergency get here right? Gonna be frank, I can easily see 911 not really responding quickly to reports of gun violence in a lower income primarily black neighborhood. Not to mention this culture tends to be one where you don't even tell the cops something as basic as the sun is bright when questioned.

Of course we'd get a ton of attention in general and civilians recording, but I assume the Maquerade has ways of dealing since video phones and camcorders have been a thing for a whole now.
Urban response time for EMS is less than 14 minutes. Usually 7-10 minutes IIRC.
We called EMS for a scene with an AK and sawnoff thirty minutes ago.
The cops are going to be there.
 
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How bad is the traffic? Because causing a car crash now seems like it would buy us at least an hour or so, if they are 45 minutes out in a car, unless they are in a traffic jam.

Or... we could call cops on them. Can we report the car as stolen or something?

Or maybe simulate a malfunction. It's a luxury car, it could fake an issue with electronics, I think.

Basically, 45 minutes out is a lot of distance. A loss of the car now would essentially buy us all the time we need

You are not sure what Katrina would do in the event of an accident. I mean on the one hand she does seem to be in a hurry, on the other hand that is a very expensive car and if she just abandons it, well that is going to be really hard to get back. There is also the inconvenience of the fact that you would put her through a bad crash, one that would get the paramedics called certainly... and leave her suspiciously unharmed. A crash would cause a hard to discern, but large snarl in her plans as far as Molly can tell. Of course if you intend to plan around it you would have to explain what you did to Gard and so far you were careful not to tell her about the machine control.
 
Haste isnt speed. Impatience often just makes shit worse.
The reason we're here, now, in this situation where we're trying to juggle Cindy, Lydia and an incoming Kattrin, was because the majority of voters allowed impatience to make them skip a preliminary phone call to Lydia before they Crows of Eyes'd Cindy's location.

She does have plenty of reason to care.
Kinda hard to run a magic ritual if you're the subject of a manhunt by every LEO in Cook County.
It's Chicago. Security cameras are fairly common; she literally used them to frame Dresden.
Trying to max out your information advantage until it is too late to act is something I'm much more worried about that premature confrontations.

We are an Exalt with a small but powerful toolset.
Being equally surprised to a Wizard with more experience and a much broader set of magical and mundane options is always a good thing.
Being able to reduce the surprise factors to one unknown undead by her side and one unexpected Valkyrie at ours is a very good exchange.

Ultimatly we can throw almost twice as many dice at the simply solution "sword it" than any mortal can, so getting towards that solution before she causes more damage or fullfils a goal and leaves the city is desirable.
 
Personally I am going to suggest we cause a wreck and then book it. Katrina eats a delay of at least an hour as she deals with that then rushes to where we are not any longer. That's time we can spend getting Cindy safe.
 
I dont think we can afford to lose track of Kattrin now.
If she gets out and steals a car, or even just flags down a taxi, she's in the wind and we're blind.
If it's a crash, and not a malfunction, then Kattrin would also likely be suffering at least some injuries, and having to deal with extracting herself from a wreck. However, there's a gentler option:
[] Command Black Rider to fake a malfunction, forcing it to stop to buy time
-[] If Kattrin leaves it behind to get into a taxi, command it to discreetly follow her to report her route
[] Use the time this buys us to get Cindy out - call Karrin Murphy to come pick her up and get her into protective custody
[] Get back for Lydia
 
-[] If Kattrin leaves it behind to get into a taxi, command it to discreetly follow her to report her route
Her car is anything but discreet...
They are about 45 minutes out accounting for traffic. Retracing your steps it should take you around 30 minutes to get back in foot through the tunnels.
We also might make it out and away before she arrives without giving anything away.

Fifteen minutes are an eternity to tail someone who doesn't want to be tailed.

I am coming around to the basement ambush though.
 
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There's a very important question to ask - can Kattrin scry Cindy? She had access to her, could have taken hair and blood samples. If so, and it makes sense, then she could both scry her remotely (kill too, if not for the oath she took with Matthews) at any time. This means that getting Cindy out doesn't solve the issue long term at all. This means we need to confront her.

@DragonParadox where is the tattoo shop located? What sort of neighborhood is it? Within 10 minutes of car travel, is there any place Black Rider could drive into and crash without causing "witnesses: YES" situation?

Because I think we have to force the confrontation now, the question is how.
 
Trying to max out your information advantage until it is too late to act is something I'm much more worried about that premature confrontations.

We are an Exalt with a small but powerful toolset. Being equally surprised to a Wizard with more experience and a much broader set of magical and mundane options is always a good thing. Being able to reduce the surprise factors to one unknown undead by her side and one unexpected Valkyrie at ours is a very good exchange.

Ultimatly we can throw almost twice as many dice at the simply solution "sword it" than any mortal can, so getting towards that solution before she causes more damage or fullfils a goal and leaves the city is desirable.
1)Baby Exalt
2)Kattrin is not a vanilla mortal, and came to the known stomping grounds of a Knight of the Cross and one of her estranged sisters. I dont think I can overstate how much preptime went into this.

We have different evaluations of the risks, I guess.

Personally I am going to suggest we cause a wreck and then book it. Katrina eats a delay of at least an hour as she deals with that then rushes to where we are not any longer. That's time we can spend getting Cindy safe.
If she simply hails a cab and leaves the scene?
I mean, its a sweet ride, but I presume that in Kattrin's value system, demigod power >>> Mercedes AMG.

If it's a crash, and not a malfunction, then Kattrin would also likely be suffering at least some injuries, and having to deal with extracting herself from a wreck. However, there's a gentler option:
[] Command Black Rider to fake a malfunction, forcing it to stop to buy time
-[] If Kattrin leaves it behind to get into a taxi, command it to discreetly follow her to report her route
[] Use the time this buys us to get Cindy out - call Karrin Murphy to come pick her up and get her into protective custody
[] Get back for Lydia
Norse demigod necromancer. I give better than even odds she comes through a car crash without a scratch.
Especially in that car.

Dresden literally suffered a similar crash near the beginning of one of the books IIRC, with someone attempting to murder him by ramming his car. Came through without a scratch.
And he was in a classic VW Beetle.
 
There's a very important question to ask - can Kattrin scry Cindy? She had access to her, could have taken hair and blood samples. If so, and it makes sense, then she could both scry her remotely (kill too, if not for the oath she took with Matthews) at any time. This means that getting Cindy out doesn't solve the issue long term at all. This means we need to confront her.

@DragonParadox where is the tattoo shop located? What sort of neighborhood is it? Within 10 minutes of car travel, is there any place Black Rider could drive into and crash without causing "witnesses: YES" situation?

Because I think we have to force the confrontation now, the question is how.
Now this... This sways me. There is absolutely nothing stopping her from scrying Cindy. That means there's no way to actually get Cindy safe other than throwing down with Kattrin.
 
Norse demigod necromancer. I give better than even odds she comes through a car crash without a scratch.
Especially in that car.

Dresden literally suffered a similar crash near the beginning of one of the books IIRC, with someone attempting to murder him by ramming his car. Came through without a scratch.
And he was in a classic VW Beetle.
Which is why I am proposing "fake a malfunction". This is a luxury car. Does it have self diagnostics? Will it indicate "broken fuel line / engine problems" or something like that? Basically, no crash, but something that forces it to stop. We need her delayed, everything else is immaterial.

We need to get Lydia, get Cindy our of direct line of fire, then confront Kattrin (because she almost certainly can track Cindy remotely).
 
I mean there is the basement of the tattoo parlor itself. That is well... a basement, you know typical concrete floor and walls, filled with all sorts of random stuff that was not thrown away in good time and linked to the building above with short stair. From the basement to undertown there is a narrow hole that seems to have been dug for just that purpose with a ladder in it. It would be bad to be stuck at the bottom of that when you fight.

[X] Inform the others of incoming Katrin and nonbreathing company.
-[X] Set up an ambush at the ladder of the basement


[X] We need to find another way out to the city, we can't get into a fight while Cindy is with us
 
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There's a very important question to ask - can Kattrin scry Cindy? She had access to her, could have taken hair and blood samples. If so, and it makes sense, then she could both scry her remotely (kill too, if not for the oath she took with Matthews) at any time. This means that getting Cindy out doesn't solve the issue long term at all. This means we need to confront her.

@DragonParadox where is the tattoo shop located? What sort of neighborhood is it? Within 10 minutes of car travel, is there any place Black Rider could drive into and crash without causing "witnesses: YES" situation?

Because I think we have to force the confrontation now, the question is how.
Scry? Possibly. Hard, but possible if you have the skill and setup and are willing to take the risk.
Find? Follow? Definitely.
Kill? Maybe, but thats ritual work with setup time, doesnt work through wards, and she's still under a binding oath.
 
Just looked up Black Rider's current chassis. That thing has electronic brakes rather than a traditional closed hydraulic system, as in Black Rider can completely prevent Katrina from braking at our command.

Electronic locks to prevent her from easily abandoning the car, at least for a couple seconds.

Early deployment of all side and regular airbags to leave passengers disoriented and to obscure their vision.

Full acceleration of a 500+ horsepower high performance engine.

It even has seat belts that would be under Black Rider's control. He couldn't make them unlatch, but from reading their description it does sound like he could keep them from engaging, effectively rendering them non-functional at will.

All that together is a pretty devastating combo we could deploy against Katrina.
 
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Scry? Possibly. Hard, but possible if you have the skill and setup and are willing to take the risk.
Find? Follow? Definitely.
Kill? Maybe, but thats ritual work with setup time, doesnt work through wards, and she's still under a binding oath.
Yes, but it still means that we can't actually get Cindy to safety without neutralizing Kattrin. Unless her oath would prevent her from retaking Cindy, but that is unlikely as, in that case, she wouldn't be speeding to our location.

There's also a question of whether she'll want to force her way through paramedics and cops on the scene.

Hmm... I am leaning towards trying to go find Lydia now. We have internet, we could use Lydia's photo (if we don't have it, have our brother send it to us) to locate her.

Then we confront Kattrin.
 
Which is why I am proposing "fake a malfunction". This is a luxury car. Does it have self diagnostics? Will it indicate "broken fuel line / engine problems" or something like that? Basically, no crash, but something that forces it to stop. We need her delayed, everything else is immaterial. We need to get Lydia, get Cindy our of direct line of fire, then confront Kattrin (because she almost certainly can track Cindy remotely).
We dont want to give her reason to take a hard look at her car.
I dont know if Rider would go undetected under a proper examination by a car-proud necromancer.

Note that as far as I can recall, and crosschecking with Proven Guilty's tracking scene, hairs/blood give you a trail to follow.
Unless you have a setup like Dresden's Little Chicago, Kattrin should still need to either schlep down into Undertown and trace our steps if she's using hairs, or just use it like a compass.

If we get Cindy behind the Carpenter wards, she should be safe-ish and we can go after Kattrin.
The problem is getting here there without giving Kattrin reason to turn away.
Lydia is a whole different problem.

If we didnt have Cindy to worry about, I would be voting to ambush Kattrin right here.
But if you dont eat your meat, you cant have any pudding.
 
1)Baby Exalt
2)Kattrin is not a vanilla mortal, and came to the known stomping grounds of a Knight of the Cross and one of her estranged sisters. I dont think I can overstate how much preptime went into this.

We have different evaluations of the risks, I guess.
I know we are a baby Exalted.

We do not have a broad range of option to prepare for a specific fight, like an experienced Exalted might have.
Which makes it only more important to jump the dangerous person who is prepared for trouble in general but knows nothing about us specifically as early as possible.
 
No, it's a pretty busy neighborhood.
So... Not really an option to fight here. However, the same goes for Kattrin, and she doesn't know about paramedics and cops who are no doubt arriving at the scene (do we know how far out they are?).
If we get Cindy behind the Carpenter wards, she should be safe-ish and we can go after Kattrin.
That's very damn arguable. Like, super arguable at least. Michael's home is a sanctuary for his family, but only as long as they don't involve themselves. It's not just a fortress against all evil.
The problem is getting here there without giving Kattrin reason to turn away.
Lydia is a whole different problem.
Take Cindy and go find Lydia? Burn Lydia's image to find her, and go there directly. We could work from there. Possibly also call Charity to get a getaway car ready and close.
 
Now this... This sways me. There is absolutely nothing stopping her from scrying Cindy. That means there's no way to actually get Cindy safe other than throwing down with Kattrin.
Scrying requires a ritual setup and time. Unless she's some savant or a major Power, its not something I think you can do on the fly.
And depending on your exact method, you are potentially vulnerable when scrying if there is someone with magical heft on the other side.

I would worry less about scrying and more about tracking/finding.
I know we are a baby Exalted.

We do not have a broad range of option to prepare for a specific fight, like an experienced Exalted might have.
Which makes it only more important to jump the dangerous person who is prepared for trouble in general but knows nothing about us specifically as early as possible.
Six months of preptime, if you count since Gorfels started raising minions here.
She's hunting what used to be a regional death god, in territory where her estranged sister's employer essentially rules the criminal underground, and where a Knight of the Cross has residence. She didnt come to Chicago unprepared for trouble.

We'll just have to disagree.
That's very damn arguable. Like, super arguable at least. Michael's home is a sanctuary for his family, but only as long as they don't involve themselves. It's not just a fortress against all evil.
Michael's home was where Dresden canonically took Gard and Hendricks after Deirdre gutted her while kidnapping Marcone in Small Favor. Its not a fortress against all evil, but its a fair sanctuary, with people who actually understand the risks involved, and a bona fide panic room.

Take Cindy and go find Lydia? Burn Lydia's image to find her, and go there directly. We could work from there. Possibly also call Charity to get a getaway car ready and close.
We already have Hendricks driving a getaway car; we dont need Charity.

Im actually thinking that may be our least bad option right now.
If Kattrin has her hair as a tracking focus, it will point at Cindy being in Undertown instead of aboveground while we are looking for Lydia.
 
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We at least have about 30 to 45 minutes while Katrina is in transit, then she will have to skip by the mortal authorities to get into the tattoo shop's basement to enter Undertown, then make the trip to Cindy's former location.

With some help from Black Rider, we can buy ourselves much more time while possibly injuring Katrina somewhat in the bargain. That will give us a chance to look for Lydia, find another exit, and maybe get Cindy somewhere Katrina cannot easily find her. NOT the Carpenter household. The place is a haven for the Carpenters, not a safe house for anyone on the run from supernatural crap.

[X] Black Rider Will Ride Again!
-[X] Assuming he can confirm that Katrina is driving, give Black Rider the command to crash his current chassis into a nearby solid object, such as a large tree, stationary garbage truck, sturdy wall, etc. at maximum acceleration with a specific aim toward injuring Katrina as seriously as possible, perhaps even killing her, so long as doing so doesn't endanger bystanders. Going over the side of a bridge would be a good alternative, if an opportunity presents itself.
--[X] Black Rider will interface with Clippy, using information about this model of car and automobile accidents in general pulled from the internet, to insure the crash is as severe as he can manage. He will also send Clippy all of his GPS data so we can retrace Katrina's route.
---[X] Before initiating the crash, he is to lock the doors, prevent Katrina from braking, prevent the seat belts from properly engaging, and trigger all of the airbags a moment before impact in order to render them ineffective.
----[X] Assure Black Rider that we will find him a new chassis soon.
-[X] Using the extra time this buys us, we will try to locate Lydia while also searching for another exit from Undertown. Michael will keep a close guard on Cindy for the time being. Ask Gard if she has any quick and dirty means to keep Katrina from easily tracking Cindy's location, assuming she probably has hair or even blood samples from the girl.
 
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[X] Inform others of Kattrin coming, and how far away she is
[X] Use Lydia's picture (phone our brother if we don't have it and there's none in the Internet to find) and the Crown to locate her, then go find her now. She can't be allowed to fall into Kattrin's hands, if what you suspect about her ancestry is true.
 
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