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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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Speaking of the Blackstaff, as in the actual staff that comes with the title and allows one to sidestep the effects of breaking the Laws, that thing is so far out of the regular magic paradigm of the Dresden Files setting that it would be a great example of a remnant artifact from a bygone era, such as however many iterations of reality it's been since Exalts walked the Earth.
 
Goldfish said:
Speaking of the Blackstaff, as in the actual staff that comes with the title and allows one to sidestep the effects of breaking the Laws, that thing is so far out of the regular magic paradigm of the Dresden Files setting that it would be a great example of a remnant artifact from a bygone era, such as however many iterations of reality it's been since Exalts walked the Earth.
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I think its been implied to have something to do with Mother Winter. As to where the fae and stuff come from...thats a good question.
 
firefrog600 said:
I'm not overlooking what he can do I'm looking at how much heat he can acquire dresdens good the books have made it clear a lot of people are better than him in many ways and taking a fucking beating multiple times in EVERY SINGLE BOOK.
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Better at what?
Dresden is genuinely top fifty in magical muscle in the White Council. He lacks the experience of the really old guys, but he was a genuinely terrifying magical threat even before he got a Fallen Angel in his head, died, came back and became Winter Knight.

There's a reason Warden Captain Luccio looked at his summoning of Sue during Dead Beat with no preptime and was impressed.
Why he's got the reputation of a boogeyman that lotsa nasties gave Chicago wide berth.

And his regularly taking a beating means nothing compared to the fact that he has always walked away.
All his enemies have generally avoided taken beatings; that just means they leave very pretty corpses when the tables turn.
I mean, we're talking about the guy who killed the Summer Lady several books ago, and killed multiple Denarians in Small Favor.

In-universe, Dresden is scary.
Go read Backup again and see how his brother describes him, or how Murphy talked about him in Aftermath.
the DragonBard said:
True, though I should point out, most of those who are better than him are old enough to measure their age in 'centuries' rather than decades.
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I would argue that even that is mistaken.

When Mab was accused of killing the Summer Knight and stealing his power, she didnt pick a member of her Court to investigate, or hit up Odin for one of his several thousand year old minions, or approach a seasoned, venerable wizard to be her investigator in exchange for a favor(and the favor of the Winter Queen is very valuable).

She chose Dresden.

When Morgan, who had attempted to kill Dresden before, and shared a mutual dislike, was on the run from the White Council, he didnt approach any of the many contacts he'd made over his long life, or the Summer Court who owed him a favor, to help investigate the circumstances of the crime.

He called Dresden.

When Mavra of the Black Court needed to track down the Word of Kemmler in order to deny it to the Heirs of Kemmler?
She didnt show up herself, or mindwhammy a bunch of professional gumshoes to go looking, or kidnap the loved one of another wizard and send them. She blackmailed Dresden to do it.

When Strength of a River had a part-human son who was falling sick for no apparent reason, he called Dresden.
When the same son was being predated by a White Court Vampire, he called Dresdem

Up and down, major and minor, if there's a big mystery that needs unravelling that involves magic, friends and foes turn to him.
Because he is genuinely the best magic investigator that there is in the setting.
There are some better fighters, better spies and spymasters, better wizards.

There are no better magic detectives. And this calls for a detective.
 
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[X] Offer it to Ebeneezer, you trust the canny old man even on such short acquaintance

To the guy legally using Black Magic on the Senior Council: This Denarian affiiiate bragged about how one of you uses Black Magic
 
Adhoc vote count started by uju32 on Jul 30, 2022 at 11:01 PM, finished with 53 posts and 23 votes.
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[X] Keep it for Harry alone, he will try to investigate it until he has some other source to quote to the Council
 
[X] Keep it for Harry alone, he will try to investigate it until he has some other source to quote to the Council
 
On a tangential note, those poor monks must be really freaked out by this point.

They just wanted their stuff back, and they've been attacked by nazis twice already, then had to hide from the police in the bedroom of a strange full blown wizard they just met.

All of which is taking place half a world away from their home, making it really hard to get help if something goes wrong.

Are we sure that bag of ancient desecrated saints' bones isn't cursed or something? Cause they sound like the sort of thing that ends up cursed, and so far everyone to handle them has gone on to have a shitty day. :V
 
uju32 said:
In order of age, by my best guess, and looking at the names:
-Lucian aka Thorned Namshiel (circa Christ)
-Marcus Drusus (Western Roman Empire)
-Katrina Sigfridottir (First millenium/early second millenium Norse)
-Johann of Cleaves (Dark Ages/Medieval Europe)
-Speer/Theodosius Cristos(post-Renaissance)
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That's pretty vague.
Lucien might, going by name alone, be as old as you guess, or just from some time in the renaissance. I think Nic was the only Denarian who consistantly kept his coin and life since the death of Christ?

Katrina Sigfridottir is a name that could be a millia-old valkry, or she could be a hundred years old Iclandic person or she could be born yesterday, just from the name alone.

On the other hand, Theodosius Christos could have been born in Greece anywhere in the last two millenia.

The only person that I think is really dated is Hans Ulrich Speer, both because that's a relativly modern name-structure and because the Bone Digger was propably in service of the Nazis gathering these bones we found today.

Edit: Speer might even be Gorefel's actual name. I don't think he was excluded by the way we asked the question.
 
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the DragonBard said:
True, though I should point out, most of those who are better than him are old enough to measure their age in 'centuries' rather than decades.
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yes which is a lot of people due to the setting being what it is.
uju32 said:
Better at what?
Dresden is genuinely top fifty in magical muscle in the White Council. He lacks the experience of the really old guys, but he was a genuinely terrifying magical threat even before he got a Fallen Angel in his head, died, came back and became Winter Knight.

There's a reason Warden Captain Luccio looked at his summoning of Sue during Dead Beat with no preptime and was impressed.
Why he's got the reputation of a boogeyman that lotsa nasties gave Chicago wide berth.

And his regularly taking a beating means nothing compared to the fact that he has always walked away.
All his enemies have generally avoided taken beatings; that just means they leave very pretty corpses when the tables turn.
I mean, we're talking about the guy who killed the Summer Lady several books ago, and killed multiple Denarians in Small Favor.

In-universe, Dresden is scary.
Go read Backup again and see how his brother describes him, or how Murphy talked about him in Aftermath.

I would argue that even that is mistaken.

When Mab was accused of killing the Summer Knight and stealing his power, she didnt pick a member of her Court to investigate, or hit up Odin for one of his several thousand year old minions, or approach a seasoned, venerable wizard to be her investigator in exchange for a favor(and the favor of the Winter Queen is very valuable).

She chose Dresden.

When Morgan, who had attempted to kill Dresden before, and shared a mutual dislike, was on the run from the White Council, he didnt approach any of the many contacts he'd made over his long life, or the Summer Court who owed him a favor, to help investigate the circumstances of the crime.

He called Dresden.

When Mavra of the Black Court needed to track down the Word of Kemmler in order to deny it to the Heirs of Kemmler?
She didnt show up herself, or mindwhammy a bunch of professional gumshoes to go looking, or kidnap the loved one of another wizard and send them. She blackmailed Dresden to do it.

When Strength of a River had a part-human son who was falling sick for no apparent reason, he called Dresden.
When the same son was being predated by a White Court Vampire, he called Dresdem

Up and down, major and minor, if there's a big mystery that needs unravelling that involves magic, friends and foes turn to him.
Because he is genuinely the best magic investigator that there is in the setting.
There are some better fighters, better spies and spymasters, better wizards.

There are no better magic detectives. And this calls for a detective.
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note I'm not even disagreeing dresden is an amazing investigator he is. also he has a fuck ton of oomph a fuck ton of people beat him in their specialties or have larger breath of skills just to being way older. There's also supernatural being who on average are far stronger than dresden (magic resistance wise, sheer strength, ability to murder and some skills etc etc.) normally usually bound in rules though. Also you know dresden is relatively squishy even with magic he can boost himself hes not much of a brawler though even if hes you know been in a loooooot of scrapes. Also I think several thousand year olds is an exaggeration no idea if odin (or at least the mantle that is odin he could always have some even older mantle over the years) is even that old himself thousand year olds probably though. Dresden is still very much young and while hes beaten things way out of his league again with wit, some strength, and a stupid amount of will hes still not the best in a lot of things. mortal wizards aren't actually on the top of the food chain essentially they can just do a lot and have just enough power to fuck shit up and a fair number of well numbers.
 
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Yog said:
[X] Offer it to Ebeneezer, you trust the canny old man even on such short acquaintance

@DragonParadox would looking at Little Chicago allow us to ask a question like "what are the mystically significant locations of Chicago?" or "what are the addresses of currently unoccupied mystically powerful locations of Chicago best for establishing a base of operations?". Would such questions work off a map?

And would a question "How to summon / bind / make loyal Genius Loci of Chicago?" be valid?

Yes. But there's an argument to be made that we (the side of good / White Council / Molly) gain more by making all the White Council be aware of this, even if it leads to the warlock among them learning that we know. In fact, we could burn the question on each of them, asking "what is all the black magic X has ever performed?". Swear an oath that the question will be such and that you won't lie when revealing the results, and I think the White Council will agree to get looked into by the Crown, save probably Ebeneezer and maybe Rashid. After all, it makes them immune to further Crown use.
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I don't think little Chicago exists yes, but once you have something like that you could use it to get what is basically an extra Chicago question. You could ask one of those questions right now just by looking out the window, since you can both see the city and unlike the universe you can conceptualize the scope of it.
 
think demonreach would try to imprison us? Demonreach its one of those places I think actually reasonably could trap us. Place probably has beings as strong if not stronger than mab in it.
 
uju32 said:
@DragonParadox
Potential crafting idea with mundane utility: Magicbane shield (0-2 dots)
Faraday cage/shield against the techbane, for one(1) technological device. Must be in contact with said device to offer its protection, and may be made i appropriate form factors.

Example being a protective case(or a sticker) for a mobile phone; sticker might go inside the battery compartment to be lowprofile.
Or a set of grounding cables for a refridgerator or computer or TV.

0-1 dot(a pack of multiple copies count as 1 dot): Standard. Protects against the ambient techbane of serious magic practitioners
1-2 dot: Heavy-duty. Protects against weaponized effects aimed at an area.
2-3dot: Combat grade. Provides some protection against directed effects, and will shut down your device so it can be rebooted laterwithout permanent damage.

The aim is not to providr protection against techbane spells aimed specifically at your device at short range, just like a bullet at short range will go through most bulletproof vests.
But against AoE To Whom It May Concern effects or long range potshots, it should provide fairly reliable protection.
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You guys could make it, it's basically a materials science problem. Hell if you could find the right material you could even make it on mass with mundane crafting. Unfortunately the only place you can think of that would have those materials on mass is 'the parts of Yomi Wan meant to hold magicians'. So one offs need magical crafting, anything more than that needs you to go hell-diving or similar.
 
firefrog600 said:
think demonreach would try to imprison us? Demonreach its one of those places I think actually reasonably could trap us. Place probably has beings as strong if not stronger than mab in it.
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It could hold us now.
In the long run we could propably develope something like the Hungry Tiger Technique to cut any ward or gate, but if the mind in the island knows that it might also put us in permanent sleep to prevent us from getting XP and learning new tricks.

Depends a lot on how well the Demonreach understands the Exaltation. If it treats us like a regular prisoner of our current power we will escape eventually, if it is appropriatly cautious we might not.
 
offhand we'll eventually do a couple things like visit demonreach or visit some of the hells. What questions would we probably ask about demonreach the targets can be the island, the genius loci, the prison itself, maybe the tainted leylines? Also at what level of essence should we probably wait before going to one or multiple of the hells? Can we reasonably even conquer some hells at essence 5 I genuinely don't know enough about exalted to know?
 
Artemis1992 said:
That's pretty vague.
Lucien might, going by name alone, be as old as you guess, or just from some time in the renaissance. I think Nic was the only Denarian who consistantly kept his coin and life since the death of Christ?

Katrina Sigfridottir is a name that could be a millia-old valkry, or she could be a hundred years old Iclandic person or she could be born yesterday, just from the name alone.

On the other hand, Theodosius Christos could have been born in Greece anywhere in the last two millenia.

The only person that I think is really dated is Hans Ulrich Speer, both because that's a relativly modern name-structure and because the Bone Digger was propably in service of the Nazis gathering these bones we found today.

Edit: Speer might even be Gorefel's actual name. I don't think he was excluded by the way we asked the question.
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I am assuming the QM is choosing these names deliberately.
If they're random, ignore.
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1)Lucian is a Hellenized name dating back to Roman times, and his town of origin, Cephaloedium, dates him back to the Roman Empire.Its a Sicilian town that was founded by Greeks and captured by the Romans during the First Punic War in the third century BC. Given as the Denarians only became thing after Christ's death, thats an easy one to localize.


2)Katrina is not an Icelandic name,(they use Katrín), and neither apparently is Sigfrid(I think they use Sigurd).Nor is the name spelled in Icelandic orthography with all the symbols. Dottir is old Norse for daughter, and old Norse was spoken in Scandinavia between 7th and 15th century AD. So this seems easy to localize as well.


3)Theodosius Cristos is one of the harder ones.

Theodosius was a latinized form of the Greek Theodosios, and dates back to the Roman Empire.
Could be Greek, could be Eastern European, could be any of half a dozen nations where the Catholic or Orthodox Church has influence. Cristos, otoh, is Spanish. Maybe Portugese as well, but definitely Spanish. So either Spain or Latin America.

Latin America would date him to the Renaissance period or later, when the Spanish conquered Latin America.
Spain would date him to the 12th century or later, when family names began to become common.


4)Speer is almost definitely not Gorfels name.
In no universe is he a magical peer of Kemmler or a thousand plus year old Denarian. Not on the performance we've seen.
And if he was that valuable the named six would be arranging a rescue, not a hit.
 
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DragonParadox said:
I don't think little Chicago exists yes, but once you have something like that you could use it to get what is basically an extra Chicago question. You could ask one of those questions right now just by looking out the window, since you can both see the city and unlike the universe you can conceptualize the scope of it.
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It exists.
He canonically used it last week in Proven Guilty when he was trying to locate Molly after the fetches grabbed her.
 
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