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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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BronzeTongue said:
This is an interesting one, because even if we can take the big boss killing those guys would obligate us to move to Vegas. Which most sensible people agree is a fate worse than death.
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Arguable on three points:
1) We might be able to kill or suborn whatever it is on the other side. We have spirit killing charms, which are very setting in the setting, and we are exalted, which might matter, depending on what's out there.
2) We might be able to close the gate. Depending on how it works, and what it is, Sapphire Ritual of Exorcism might destroy the connection between Reality and Outside. It "splits apart any unnatural joining of matter and spirit". There's nothing more unnatural than a connection to the Outside
3) We might be able to replace Sin Eater with a custom god of our own design. Raise the god of Las Vegas, empowered by all the sin in it, and command it to guard the gateway.
BronzeTongue said:
Incidentally, are we past the point where that booze vote could go in? The original gift plan vote had something for them, and I'm not clear if this last vote was just for clarifying a few people or if we discarded that and only our votes for the latest gift set count.
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I hope not. We have actually voted on Carpenter presents, not all presents, as I understand it.
 
Yog said:
Arguable on three points:
1) We might be able to kill or suborn whatever it is on the other side. We have spirit killing charms, which are very setting in the setting, and we are exalted, which might matter, depending on what's out there.
2) We might be able to close the gate. Depending on how it works, and what it is, Sapphire Ritual of Exorcism might destroy the connection between Reality and Outside. It "splits apart any unnatural joining of matter and spirit". There's nothing more unnatural than a connection to the Outside
3) We might be able to replace Sin Eater with a custom god of our own design. Raise the god of Las Vegas, empowered by all the sin in it, and command it to guard the gateway.
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1) My understanding is that it's not about a specific thing on the other side, it's just a hole in reality anything can use to come through. Even killing whatever is hanging around the other side right now doesn't make it safe.

2) SCE is for targeting creatures, not spiritual landscape features. It may be possible to do this, but I doubt it's simple even for us. If it was easy then the guys who pulled up a sin eater would probably have tried something else, and they evidently had the resources to get up to some bullshit.

3) Maybe, but that's not exactly an improvement on the situation and it would lack the political connections to keep its position stable. More doable than the other options, but still would probably be fairly involved.
 
DragonParadox said:
"Hmm—" she takes a long pull of the cigarette, thin blue smoke taking flight like misshapen birds from her lips. "Not the kind your father might be interested, he's merely called that. He is a Vampire of the Rec Court, a count, perhaps he would me more, but he cannot leave for the weight of his true master's chains."
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In order of reading the underlined errors are:

interested in, he's not interested, he's

Red Court not Rec Court

would be more not would me more

DragonParadox said:
"You wish. No this was something from Outside, a being, a pathway, maybe both, Those old medicine men knew enough to be afraid for their lives and souls, for the lives and souls of their children and grandchildren unborn. So they called up a spirit of darker sort a sin eater and they bid it to hold the gate shut, bidding it to devour the unworthy who came close."
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both. Those not both, Those wrong punctuation on this one.

a spirit of a darker sort, a sin eater not a spirit of darker sort a sin eater

DragonParadox said:
"Yeah, turns out holding fast the gates of madness can't be done on the strength of eating the odd shifty wanderer forever. Back in 1905 the spirit started getting antsy, get weary maybe. He offered old bat ears a bargain: power, wealth, blood and sex the works if he would help build a city of sin to feed it into the spirits black heart. Yeah, that's right, middle aged execs blowing their kids' college funds on coke and call girls have been keeping one of the backdoors of reality safe. 'Just one more round of blackjack,' they cried and the world got to keep spinning one more day." Maeve giggles."The Dragon's a cup-bearer, no more and no less, but it gives him great power in his domain, enough that it would be difficult to shift him and even if we did..."

"Your prize would be brand new front, assuming the changeover would even work out cleanly," you finish mind whirling with dark imaginings. "I assume you sent a message about what Sandra is." Truth be told you would not put it past Maeve to not have done that just so she would have her vengeance, but Mab hs more sense than her daughter.

"The message has been sent, no answer has been received. Don't know what the old vamp of Vegas is playing at, but she is still there and a Winter warband not be welcome to deal with her, the only fey in the city are a band of wyldfae who are part of his game. But none of that applies to you... You are new. I want you to chase Sandra out of the city so we can both have a piece. I'll consider that a favor to be repaid in kind."
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getting not get

and sex, the works not and sex the works

be a brand not be brand

has not hs

warband would not not warband not

are a part not are part

So we are on a trip for fine dining and either an excorcism or an execution in Las Vegas?
 
BronzeTongue said:
2) SCE is for targeting creatures, not spiritual landscape features. It may be possible to do this, but I doubt it's simple even for us. If it was easy then the guys who pulled up a sin eater would probably have tried something else, and they evidently had the resources to get up to some bullshit.
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That's arguable, and depends on how the gateway works / to what is it anchored. Also, it's Ancient Sorcery, that's not something mortals can do. As far as we know, it's not something Mab can do, even. We shall see.

Point is - we don't know enough to say whether we can resolve this situation.
 
Yog said:
That's arguable, and depends on how the gateway works / to what is it anchored. Also, it's Ancient Sorcery, that's not something mortals can do. As far as we know, it's not something Mab can do, even. We shall see.

Point is - we don't know enough to say whether we can resolve this situation.
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It isn't arguable; the entire thing is framed in terms of a target creature and a portal is not a creature. Ancient Sorcery is inexplicably perfect at doing whatever a particular spell does, but only that.
 
write in:

[X] Agree to deal with the situation personally, but make the bargain conditional upon voluntary successful completion. Maeve will owe you nothing, if you don't deliver, but you also have no obligation to deliver, and owe her nothing if you don't. (Costs 1 AP next month)

Harry was often forced into situations like this: jump into a potentially catastrophic clusterfuck with almost no intel, while having his options restricted by a bargain with Fae Royalty. Let's not voluntarily put ourselves into the same situation.

By the current literal interpretation (so the only one that matters) of the default bargain as I understand it, we might fail it even if Sandra just dies at any point between now and before being chased off Las Vegas.
 
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[X] Agree to Maeve's terms (Costs 1 AP next month)

It's a shame that Maeve wouldn't be coming along, by the sound of it, because I can just imagine selling Charity on that trip. What's worse that "I'm off to Vegas, mom!"? "I'm off to Vegas with the Winter Lady, mom!" 😂
 
fictionfan said:
How do we plan on chasing Sandra out? Just a really high intimidation check?
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She's a muggle, I figured we'd just kidnap her. Render her unconscious with something we buy in the courts, drag her to hell, leave. All we need is a few moments alone somewhere we haven't accepted mutual guest right.

Then pump her for information, extradite her to Winter out of spite, and move on with our business.

Edit:

We should probably be careful in the exact terms of the deal to agree to attempting to remove her from the city, instead of promising something a specific as chasing her from it.
 
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BronzeTongue said:
She's a muggle, I figured we'd just kidnap her. Render her unconscious with something we buy in the courts, drag her to hell, leave. All we need is a few moments alone somewhere we haven't accepted mutual guest right.

Then pump her for information, extradite her to Winter out of spite, and move on with our business.

Edit:

We should probably be careful in the exact terms of the deal to agree to attempting to remove her from the city, instead of promising something a specific as chasing her from it.
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Sandra is, as far as Molly knows, a servant or host of Nemesis, it seems unlikely that she is wholly mundane.
 
fictionfan said:
Don't need a drug. Just need a nerf bat to hit her with enough bashing damage.
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I don't think WoD supports Hollywood rules. Bonking someone on the head doesn't exactly cleanly knock them out. We'd have to disable her by filling her health track with bashing. Which we could probably do pretty easily with MHM, but beating people that badly tends to be attention grabbing.

DragonParadox said:
Sandra is, as far as Molly knows, a servant or host of Nemesis, it seems unlikely that she is wholly mundane.
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I thought she was a baseline it used as a cutout, so nemesis would deliberately keep her as unchanged as possible to make detection harder. Fair enough though, we need to be sure she isn't a host before we let her into our hell, even as an unconscious prisoner. We don't need extradimensional herpes.

LightLan said:
She has at least contacts to outsiders I wouldn't assume for her to be defenseless.
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She's supposed to work by infiltration, remaking her into a bruiser seems like a waste of resources to me. I'd still expect that drugging her and stuffing her into the trunk of a car would work just fine.

If it's that much of a problem we can make an essence vessel for cheap, then kill her and trap her soul like a Pokémon for later interrogation.
 
[X] Agree to deal with the situation personally, but make the bargain conditional upon voluntary successful completion. Maeve will owe you nothing, if you don't deliver, but you also have no obligation to deliver, and owe her nothing if you don't. (Costs 1 AP next month)
 
BronzeTongue said:
I don't think WoD supports Hollywood rules. Bonking someone on the head doesn't exactly cleanly knock them out. We'd have to disable her by filling her health track with bashing. Which we could probably do pretty easily with MHM, but beating people that badly tends to be attention grabbing.
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Melee Exellency and a baton or other blunt weapon would propably fill her healthtrack easy enough, if she is human-ish.
 
Artemis1992 said:
Melee Exellency and a baton or other blunt weapon would propably fill her healthtrack easy enough, if she is human-ish.
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So would MHM, but my point was that we'd basically be beating her half to death and that shit isn't subtle. People make noise when you start fracturing bones and bruising organs.

I can see smuggling her out in the FCF if she's not a nemesis host, or arranging for a death that allows us to steal her soul without being directly held responsible, but not beat her ass black and blue in a major metropolitan area without someone noticing. Especially if she knows people are hunting her and is trying to avoid making it easy on them.

It's too bad the Library would probably insist on keeping Sandra if we involved them, support from the feds would be great here. They could detain her and we could ride along to make sure they didn't get clowned on for trying.

I bet being the side with the stronger supernatural support would be noble for them too.

Librarian watching Molly slap the stupid out of an outsider cultist: "Is this what fire superiority is like? It's been so long I'd forgotten"
 
[X] Agree to deal with the situation personally, but make the bargain conditional upon voluntary successful completion. Maeve will owe you nothing, if you don't deliver, but you also have no obligation to deliver, and owe her nothing if you don't. (Costs 1 AP next month)

So, I've been trying to come up with something to mend the tears in the world, to close the gateways to Outside, and to otherwise protect Creation from such situations... Haven't had much luck. Barring permissive interpretation of the Sapphire Ritual of Exorcism, the best I could come up with was this:
The Splendor takes the form of something that is evocative of death. It might be a funeral
garment, or an old bone, or decorated with skulls. It might be smeared with crematory ash. This
Element defines the Splendor's physical form and gives it a character, and that character is
aligned with the power of death. Other Elements may draw upon this fact.
The Splendor can be summoned directly into the Underworld when made to manifest, if its
owner desires. As the basis for an Adornment, it grants its user the ability to see and interact with
ghosts on the other side of the Shroud. As the basis for a Fascination, it can interact with both the
land of the living and the Underworld.
The Splendor takes the form of something that is evocative of the fantastic. It might be a child's
toy, a brightly-decorated banner, a monster or carnival mask, or a treasure chest. It might be a
kaleidoscope, or a bundle of bright balloons. This Element defines the Splendor's physical form
and gives it a character, and that character is aligned with the power of the Dreaming. Other
Elements may draw upon this fact.
The Splendor stands out as a powerful work of magic when seen with chimerical eyes or mystic
scrutiny, but it seems nigh-impossible to credit it with any specific significance if observed with
purely mundane senses. Even when presented with compelling evidence that there's something
weird about the object, anyone who hasn't made a magical survey of the Splendor must make a
Willpower roll against difficulty (4 + Splendor's rating) to accept such a conclusion.
As an Adornment, it raises the difficulty to affect the user with hostile works of Glamour by one.
As the basis for a Fascination, it may have one minor impossible feature such as floating in
defiance of gravity, reflecting people's true selves when looked into, or aging backwards in time.
The Splendor takes the form of something otherworldly. It may be a religious symbol, an overtly
magical object such as a wand or pentacle, or a strange haze. It may be an inchoate thing of
coalesced light which can be held and touched. This Element defines the Splendor's physical
form and gives it a character, and that character is aligned with the power of the Spirit World.
Other Elements may draw upon this fact.
The Splendor can be summoned directly into the Umbra when made to manifest, if its owner
desires. As the basis for an Adornment, it grants its user the ability to see and interact with spirits
on the other side of the Gauntlet. As the basis for a Fascination, it can interact with both the
physical world and the Spirit World.
The Splendor causes a transformation in accordance with its character, as defined by Form
Elements such as Form of Graceful Air. The nature of the transformation depends on the Form or
Forms in play, but might include transformation into things like a sparrow (air), pig (earth), a
living flame (fire), a fish (water), a stag (wood), a walking corpse (death), a semitranslucent
spirit (spirit), or a fantastic beast such as a sphinx (dreams). These are meant to be examples, and
not an all-inclusive list.
As an Adornment, this Splendor requires a point of Willpower and a turn spent in transformation
to either assume the characteristic form or return to the user's native form.
As part of a Fascination the maximum duration of the transformation (assuming it isn't cut short
earlier by fulfilling some criteria built into the Splendor) is one day for a 1-2 dot Splendor, one
week for a 3-dot Splendor, one month for a 4-dot Splendor, and one year for a 5-dot Splendor.
The Splendor manipulates and reshapes that which resonates with its character, as defined by
Form Elements such as Form of Crackling Fire and Form of Ash and Dust. The benefits
provided depend on whether the Splendor is an Adornment or Fascination, and on which Form or
Forms it has incorporated.
Incorporated into an Adornment, this Element allows the Exalt to use Craft actions to sculpt
wind, water, and fire as though they were clay, creating impossible works of art or short-lived
elemental tools. Living wood can be induced to grow into patterns the Exalt desires in the same
fashion, while the difficulty to work with stone or metal is reduced by two. The difficulty to craft
dead flesh into Arcana may be reduced by two as well. The Exalt can raise or lower the Gauntlet
by one degree per success on a Crafts roll to modify it, and can rework the chimerical identity of
things.
Incorporated into a Fascination, this Element allows the Splendor to rewrite the details of
landscapes and objects, rerouting the paths of a graveyard, changing the appearance of a corpse,
repairing a rundown wooden shack, or making a barren landscape green and verdant.
The Splendor is loathe to relinquish its hold on those it claims. Select one Element of the
Splendor whose effects last for a limited time. That Element's maximum duration is increased by
one category (from one scene to one day, one day to one week, etc). If the duration is already
"one year," the Element can be rendered permanent.
This Element can be taken more than once to enhance multiple Elements.
A powerful tool that both hearkens back to, and would be utterly impossible in the long forgotten Ages, when impossible was made common, and mankind, led by the glorious heroes bestowed with the Mandate of Heaven took upon itself to reshape Chaos so to would become Reality. It takes a form of a brush, seemingly just dipped in paint, and yet the color of the paint is impossible to discern - it is at once red as a freshly spilled heart's blood, golden as the glow of the perfect sun, green as grass and hell, silver as change itself, and other colors that have no name in mortal languages. In the hands of a mortal, or even an unattuned exalt it would do little, weighing far more than it seemingly should, and always slipping through one's fingers. In the hands of its master, however, it allows them to remake reality itself. Draw upon the fabric of Creation, the essence-rich "paint" seeping through the tattered fabric of reality, and binding it anew, the changes made as permanent, if not more, than what they were applied to.
Using Creation Redefining Brush its master repaints reality around them, transforming it according to their vision, both literally and metaphorically. The changes made are permanent, and touch both Reality and NeverNever equally. Each change requires expenditure of essence in proportion to the change being made, the raw potential of Exalt's might to defy destiny transformed into paint to color the world's canvas. When trying to remake ensouled or supernatural artifacts and features, Exalt makes an opposed Willpower roll to assert their vision of reality against what is already there
Basically, Celestial Brush. Make it, then use it to transform the gateway so it doesn't lead to NeverNever. Best I could come up with.
 
Yog said:
Make it, then use it to transform the gateway so it doesn't lead to NeverNever. Best I could come up with.
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As far as I understand the problem is that said gateway doesn't lead to Nevernever. Nevernever is a buffer state between Creation and Outside. And the gateway in Vegas leads either directly to Outside or so close that it still causes problems.

In Exalted you could just walk Outside if you walk long enough. In Vegas you don't even need to go that far it truly has everything.
 
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