Firebird, a Worm AU/Xover?

Why would she want to serve under such people.
Because they offer a plethora of resources and aid that she would find useful. As she said, she doesn't have a real reason, just a desire to be totally free and independent. Not an uncommon desire for a teenager, but one that often leads down a bad road. If it was a matter of not wanting to fight crime, or to go the corporate sponsored route it'd be more understandable, but so far her major complaint is that it wasn't her idea.
 
Because they offer a plethora of resources and aid that she would find useful. As she said, she doesn't have a real reason, just a desire to be totally free and independent. Not an uncommon desire for a teenager, but one that often leads down a bad road. If it was a matter of not wanting to fight crime, or to go the corporate sponsored route it'd be more understandable, but so far her major complaint is that it wasn't her idea.

Actually, she never fully put her reason in words. But it is probably more complicated than that.
 
Eh, even if the wards in general offer a lot of benefits, the Protectorate as individuals and an organization have made a terrible impression on Taylor, enough that I would be majorly surprised if she could move past it easily. I'm not really the kind of person that could just forgive the absolute ignoring of my privacy or the general manner in which they went about recruiting.
 
Largely because she doesn't have a good reason beyond that(and the fact that they kept pushing, which made her balk). She doesn't want to, and in her mind that should be enough. But she realizes it isn't, so she's trying to find something more concrete. And, if it wasn't clear, there's things she hasn't told Danny, because she knows they'd likely taint any case she tries to make.

ETA: Well, not entirely that she doesn't have a good reason. She wants to be a hero, on her own terms, not someone else's, and not as part of an organization that might have taken Sophia in. Taylor hasn't told her dad about the incident with Sophia and he only has the broadest strokes from Armsy. Unfortunately... that isn't enough of a reason for a dad worried about what his daughter is doing at night.
I can think of several good reasons. Sophia tried to murder Taylor and the PRT immediately went into action to cover it up in order to recruit her. This makes it pretty damn clear that they are after Taylor as a power grab rather than giving a shit about her well being. The sheer speed with which they decided an unrepentant attempted murderer should join up with them paints a very terrifying view of what Taylor can expect from her teammates in the wards. How can Danny trust that the "support" she is getting isn't going to be a greater danger to her life than the villains she would be fighting as an independent.

Their plan A when recruiting her was to try and force her in rather than asking nicely and that was after weeks of covert spying, once again not the behavior of anyone she should trust with her life. Even during the conversation with Piggot she basically said that if Taylor didn't toe the line and be a good minion after the form was turned in he would use violence and imprisonment to force compliance.


Wards are also required to go on regular patrols on predictable routes which basically screams "ambush me", while as an independent hero she can act whenever she wants and keep the initiative.

Because they offer a plethora of resources and aid that she would find useful. As she said, she doesn't have a real reason, just a desire to be totally free and independent. Not an uncommon desire for a teenager, but one that often leads down a bad road. If it was a matter of not wanting to fight crime, or to go the corporate sponsored route it'd be more understandable, but so far her major complaint is that it wasn't her idea.
From what we see in the actual story the resources for non-tinkers is pretty damn slim. They don't get formal training, there isn't a PRT approved therapist in the city at the moment so they are essentially forbidden to get mental help due to what they would need to talk about being classified. The wards seem to be expected to patrol alone or in pairs with no adult supervision or assistance. They get sent into potentially lethal combat situations with no equipment beyond their powers, and no support from the PRT. This is followed up by them being lectured and having their pay taken from them as punishment for not behaving as professional trained adults despite the lack of any such training or adulthood. All of those statements can be inferred just from the Bank Robbery and such can't be justified as it being a unique crisis.

I find the lack of support form PRT squads the most damning as their foam guns are better than half the powers of the wards for that kind of situation.
 
I read this update, and then went back again and looked for Protectorate and Taylor interaction.

Result? I have much less sympathy for Taylor and much more for Danny. Sure Taylor shouldn't have to join the wards if she really doesn't want to, but frankly she doesn't have any other good reason for it. Instead, we have Danny who's daughter is going out alone at night with a statistically huge chance of dying. And she's refusing the join the people who could protect her for no better reason than "I said so." I hate to use the "for your own good line" but frankly sometimes parents do need to act to protect their child from their own decisions. Heavens knows that I'm glad they stepped in for my twin sister a little while ago.

I symphathize with both of them but less with Danny than with Taylor. Leaving her alone with Armsmaster was, to put it lightly, bad of him and why I have a lot less sympathy for him.

If he gave her a choice between joining the Wards or not going as out as a cape (while she lives under his roof) that would be one thing. But he didn't give her a choice. He just stated what would happen and is now, after he realized she could leave, asking her to provide a reason why he shouldn't do what he wants. As it is I think he is a bad parent (as in not good at parenting) who is trying to do his best now that he realizes how bad things have gotten between him and Taylor.
 
Thank you for a great chapter. I enjoyed a lot. The use of her telekinesis to enter the house, covering her father with a blanket, trying to understand the PRT's forms, her conversation with her father, the library (both the research and attack) and her meeting with her friends all felt to me as if they fit her personality in the story.

One comment. I might be misreading it but it almost seems as if Danny doesn't want Taylor to have a real reason not to join the Wards. Maybe in part so that he doesn't have to admit that what he previously did was wrong, maybe in part so that he can shift some of his responsibilities on somebody else (he probably realizes now that he hasn't been acting the way a good father should), maybe in part so that she can (hopefully) be kept safe and maybe another part or three that I can't think of. If she gives him a good reason he'll probably be disappointed. In fact he might ignore it if he (or somebody else) can think up justification to do so.

Also, will you later reveal whether there are opt out clauses in the Ward contract that she or her father could use and what the penalties (if any) for using them are?

In a way, he doesn't. Because if she doesn't have a real reason, he can label her recalcitrance as just being obstinate as teenagers are wont to do. More or less what you said. Taylor's reading of events using her powers suggests that it doesn't matter what she says, he's still going to cling to his stance of 'You're going to the Wards and get no say', which is probably part of why her efforts were just 'I don't wanna', because she was frustrated with his intractability and the only ways she saw to break that involved being an absolutely terrible person to him.
 
I symphathize with both of them but less with Danny than with Taylor. Leaving her alone with Armsmaster was, to put it lightly, bad of him and why I have a lot less sympathy for him.

If he gave her a choice between joining the Wards or not going as out as a cape (while she lives under his roof) that would be one thing. But he didn't give her a choice. He just stated what would happen and is now, after he realized she could leave, asking her to provide a reason why he shouldn't do what he wants. As it is I think he is a bad parent (as in not good at parenting) who is trying to do his best now that he realizes how bad things have gotten between him and Taylor.

Essentially this. He's screwed up and realizes how badly, but he's going to far in trying to bridge that gap.
 
Never been done before with absolute certainty could be one of Chibipoe's OC, whether it's an existing one or one that hasn't appeared yet.
Yes. Firebird Taylor/Accelerator Taylor pairing. Because we thought she might have difficulty somewhere along the way...


Does anyone get what they want in my previous examples of writing?
Well, I was certainly getting what I wanted out of Acceleration. At least until you finished it. So I guess not anymore :p


Oh you were fine. It's a Worm thread. You have to ride herd on this because derails happen with the drop of a hat.
Speaking of hats... [/Contessaderail]
 
I get that, but on a personal level I find the lack of empathy he is showing to be a bit concerning in terms of where it can lead the narrative. (I prefer "happier" stories on average.)

Run with the logic for a few minutes -
  • Danny is not an idiot. He might not be a genius but he does understand personal interactions. (It is, after all, a job requirement for his position.)
  • Danny is aware that kids can (and do) run away.
  • Danny has to have some understanding that if Taylor decides to run away he might never see her again. Based on what (litte) he knows about her powers it is a safe bet that she could run for a long time.
End result - pushing Taylor to do something she is absolutely dead-set against runs a risk that she'll just leave.

To be fair to Danny (and chibipoe as the author) he is willing to listen to her. Unfortunately when she isn't convincing on no notice, with no prep time to figure out how to explain her position.. he shoots her down. He isn't dismissive but he is being very blunt. That comes across as an "unreceptive audience."

I do hope that they can continue to talk about the decision before someone makes a decision they'll regret (note my money is on Coil being Coil and Danny making an executive decision), but I also don't think that they will magically resolve all their emotional issues quickly. That will take some time.

.. and kudos to chibipoe for writing a story that has characters instead of caricatures. Emotional depth, valid reasons on all sides, and so on.

Well, Danny did say that they would talk about it again in a few days time... After Taylor flat out stated that she wouldn't allow him to force her into anything... So he is willing to listen if he gets an idea that the alternative would probably be goodbye. Of course Piggot might decide to have a chat with him before then to convince him about what would be best. Same with Armsmaster or Miss Militia. And I don't think he's currently in the best frame of mind to consider all the possible options.
 
Well, Danny did say that they would talk about it again in a few days time... After Taylor flat out stated that she wouldn't allow him to force her into anything... So he is willing to listen if he gets an idea that the alternative would probably be goodbye. Of course Piggot might decide to have a chat with him before then to convince him about what would be best. Same with Armsmaster or Miss Militia. And I don't think he's currently in the best frame of mind to consider all the possible options.
I've actually deleted a long analysis that would just be headed off into derail land.

Here's the short version - Piggot, Armsmaster, and Miss Militia are not idiots. Armsmaster already knows that Taylor is some kind of Thinker. (By their standards.) As such it would be monumentally stupid for them to get in touch with Danny.

Why? Because Taylor can figure that out in short order - she's a Thinker! Of course she'll know!

Now if Danny contacts them the best thing they can do is ask to talk to both Danny and Taylor. That way they can try to prove that they're listening to Taylor, not just forcing her to do something.

Plus they might be able to get her to articulate why, specifically, she doesn't want to work with them. If she can't, well, maybe that's the standard "parahuman psychosis" that keeps Piggot up at night. If she can, well, Piggot and Armsmaster are both practical, goal-oriented personalities. (With issues, but still..) Whatever issue Taylor has might be something they can take care of.

(Note this entire analysis is based on their point of view and what they know as of the last chapter.)
 
Because they offer a plethora of resources and aid that she would find useful. As she said, she doesn't have a real reason, just a desire to be totally free and independent. Not an uncommon desire for a teenager, but one that often leads down a bad road. If it was a matter of not wanting to fight crime, or to go the corporate sponsored route it'd be more understandable, but so far her major complaint is that it wasn't her idea.

Like I said, I believe that Taylor has reasons, but hasn't had the time to sit down and think things through so she cannot yet articulate (if that is the right word) her reasons. And I don't know whether Danny would accept her reasons.

Armsmaster and as far as Taylor knows to a lesser extent Miss Militia has lied to her, spied on her, ignored her wishes, damaged (perhaps destroyed) her relationship with her father and tried (possibly succeeded) in forcing her to join the Wards against her will. They have not proven themselves to be trustworthy or honest to her. So why should she trust them, believe them and work with them? She has been given no proof that it would be better for her to do so, the opposite in fact.

Or to put it another way, Victory, Catherine and Minako who have been friendly and honest with her. Armsmaster and Miss Militia have been spying manipulative liars. Who would she prefer to spend time with? And before you say it, yes, Armsmaster and Miss Militia are not in the Wards or the whole of the Protectorate. They are however the example she has dealt with and they will colour her perception.
 
From what we see in the actual story the resources for non-tinkers is pretty damn slim.
Prior to Levi's attack in canon we see the Wards twice. The bank robbery and the charity ball. The Bank robbery was done specifically when they'd have no back up, and they were going up against people that previous experience said would run before they fought. At the Ball the whole of the city was with them. After that Levi attacked and the resources of the PRT went from small to non-existent. Canon is really bad at providing anything that can be used as a "normal" situation to base fics on.

Or to put it another way, Victory, Catherine and Minako who have been friendly and honest with her. Armsmaster and Miss Militia have been spying manipulative liars. Who would she prefer to spend time with? And before you say it, yes, Armsmaster and Miss Militia are not in the Wards or the whole of the Protectorate. They are however the example she has dealt with and they will colour her perception.
Thing is, that's not a good reason. Or rather it's not one a parent should accept. It's the difference between having a buddy that had been skydiving for a few years teach you rather than having a professional teach you, based solely on personal feelings. If her main issue is that she doesn't like them than Danny is just going to argue that their ability to keep her safe far outweighs any personal issues. Now it's debatable if they can keep her safer than say, New Wave, but to Danny the Protectorate is the safest option. I mean it would make more sense if Taylor didn't want to go out in costume at all, but that's not the case here. She wants to fight crime, and thus is putting herself in danger. I can relate to Danny's argument that Taylor isn't really providing an acceptable alternative. I mean if being a Ward is dangerous than being solo is even worse.
 
I've actually deleted a long analysis that would just be headed off into derail land.

Here's the short version - Piggot, Armsmaster, and Miss Militia are not idiots. Armsmaster already knows that Taylor is some kind of Thinker. (By their standards.) As such it would be monumentally stupid for them to get in touch with Danny.

Why? Because Taylor can figure that out in short order - she's a Thinker! Of course she'll know!

Now if Danny contacts them the best thing they can do is ask to talk to both Danny and Taylor. That way they can try to prove that they're listening to Taylor, not just forcing her to do something.

Plus they might be able to get her to articulate why, specifically, she doesn't want to work with them. If she can't, well, maybe that's the standard "parahuman psychosis" that keeps Piggot up at night. If she can, well, Piggot and Armsmaster are both practical, goal-oriented personalities. (With issues, but still..) Whatever issue Taylor has might be something they can take care of.

(Note this entire analysis is based on their point of view and what they know as of the last chapter.)

Granted, they're not idiots and I don't seriously expect that Chibipoe will put that in the story. However, my thoughts ran a bit more in the direction of them not hearing from Taylor or Danny, some of the Thinkers that the PRT employ stating that the chances of her joining in any capacity is dwindling and Piggot deciding that any leash is better than none. After all, whether she blames her father, blames Armsmaster or blames everyone, a signed Ward application will give Piggot legal justification to do whatever the story requires. As to a PR nightmare, I don't know. That probably depends on what the Wards contract allows the PRT to do.
 
Wards or no Wards? It doesn't really matter once Taylor goes all world eating firebird after Chibipoe inevitably kills off Danny again.
 
Wards or no Wards? It doesn't really matter once Taylor goes all world eating firebird after Chibipoe inevitably kills off Danny again.

Y'know. So many people make Danny either antagonistic and disposable, a plot motivating death, or otherwise sideline him (I know I do! :D ) That it is now canon in any story I write that he's secretly the fucking Hulk and just has that shit seriously under control.

Make note everyone. Danny's secret to controlling his temper? He's always angry. :p
 
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That doesn't answer my question. If she doesn't trust them, why would she call them for backup?

I think what Volant is trying to frame here, and this is just my own thoughts, is not if Taylor would call them, but would she need to in the first place? The entire idea in Danny's head as far as I understand it is that there would be someone there for her. Wards don't patrol alone. Or at least, not normally. They have a partner, backup if something goes hairy and immediate contact with more reinforcements if they can't run.

Which is a big thing I think people are missing.

The Wards aren't sent to handle things that they aren't expected to be capable of handling. They handle small things, while the Protectorate tackle larger stuff. Even as bad as Brockton Bay has gotten, I can never see Piggot tossing the Wards against the big names from the Gangs. Maybe the B listers or the C listers in Brockton, but never the A's.
 
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