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Chronicles of Nations - Civ Quest

Should the world be a Low Fantasy setting?

  • Yes

    Votes: 63 70.0%

  • No

    Votes: 27 30.0%
  • Total voters
    90
  • Poll closed .
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Random Member said:
Do not negotiate with the terrorists, no peace with those filthy barbarians! We are the greatest civilization on earth, we must show those unwashed savages our superior might! Only then will they fear us and submit to our glorious rule!
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You're not helping.

Anyway, people should remember what Urth's goal was, and his failures and limitations.

Oshha said:
Normally that wouldn't be a problem except a fundamental part of my blessing is a body like this. The end result is that someone born with this blessing is always female and I can only pass it on to females. No boys may be born with the blessing and it refuses to get passed on to a man. Given how this makes my blessed dependant on an outside source of men, I seek to correct this and Cadlon Brys here just happened to march up to my home and provide me with a male version of the Arthwyd royal family blessing.

And then we have Gwyn here, the faith companion of the ones she loves, but who will never love her back. The Greatest of the Catclaws. Slayer of several hundred of my soldiers. I have tested spreading my blessing to some children captured from the floodplains, but I have to see how it will interact with someone who has Arthryn's blessing. Gwyn is someone I consider to be worthy of such an honour. All I will need to do is bite your neck and replace some of your blood with mine."
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Firstly, in order to create a proper uber-menschen army he needs to acquire the male half of the Royal blessing. Now, while we can count on the Arthwyd not giving it, the problem is that the blessing is not limited to them. We share a royal family with the Maradysh, and has been shown in this update, they appear to be extremely vulnerable to Urth's manipulations.

If Urth succeeds in acquiring the blessing, or, given his magical prowess, engineers their own, then we will lose any future military confrontation. After all, he'll get the mass legions of undead, and the boosted levies of his own living soldiers. In the past we could defeat quantity with quality, but that will not work once the enemy reaches a level playing ground on the quality field.

In addition, the spread of Urth's blessing is limited by the speed of reproduction, but that is a rapidly expanding exponential function. By the end of the peace treaty we can be certain that every member of the Caradysh will be blessed.

Furthermore, Urth was interested in messing about with the native Arthwyd blessing. Again, he's not going to get it from the Arthwyd, but seducing the Maradysh, who also possess it, should be trivial.

Basically, Urth has stolen most of what he wants, and believes he can get the rest through diplomatic means. If we allow him the time needed to consolidate these gains, we will render ourselves incapable of resisting any future attacks.
 
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10ebbor10 said:
Basically, Urth has stolen most of what he wants, and believes he can get the rest through diplomatic means. If we allow him the time needed to consolidate these gains, we will render ourselves incapable of resisting any future attacks.
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We can't do anything because our armies can't defeat Urth. So there's no point in throwing good men in meatgrinder until we get some intel.
 
Kiba said:
We can't do anything because our armies can't defeat Urth. So there's no point in throwing good men in meatgrinder until we get some intel.
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We did a single Secundary attack on Urth, and that heavily damaged his civilization Just because that single action failed to wipe him out completely doesn't mean he's invulnerable.
 
People forget one thing: Just because our blessing is hereditary, doesn't mean that it is the same as genetics. Our goddesses can selectively revoke the blessing for those who do not follow their rules. That is why it is called a blessing.

blessing (plural blessings)
  1. Some kind of divine or supernatural aid, or reward.
thus per definition, a blessing is revokable.
 
Kiba said:
Strategic level intel. Not where the next army is.
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Still doesn't render your claim that we can't defeat Urth true.

We inflicted severe damage in a single attack, to the point that he's now throwing an entire bag of shinies at us just so that we leave him alone. That alone suggests that the attack and the blessing has heavily impaired him.
In addition, even if we needed that info we don't need an entire century to gather it.

Besides, even if we don't decide to attack, a war is better than peace. It precludes the possibility of Urth openly fraternizing with our civ.

EWilanO said:
People forget one thing: Just because our blessing is hereditary, doesn't mean that it is the same as genetics. Our goddesses can selectively revoke the blessing for those who do not follow their rules. That is why it is called a blessing.
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Can't revoke it from Urth, as he knows to hijack it. So unless you plan to pre-emptively revoke the blessing from massive swathes of our affliates, it won't help.
 
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10ebbor10 said:
Still doesn't render your claim that we can't defeat Urth true.

We inflicted severe damage in a single attack, to the point that he's now throwing an entire bag of shinies at us just so that we leave him alone.
In addition, even if we needed that info we don't need an entire century to gather it.

Can't revoke it from Urth, as he knows to hijack it. So unless you plan to pre-emptively revoke the blessing from massive swathes of our affliates, it won't help.
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Never said we can't defeat Urth. I said we need intelligence, not speculation.
 
Kiba said:
Never said we can't defeat Urth. I said we need intelligence, not speculation.
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Kiba said:
We can't do anything because our armies can't defeat Urth.
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I rest my case.

In addition, as said before, gathering intel will not take an entire century. In this turn, we could build a new settlement (to deal with the pop crisis) and gather intel, and then launch raids in the midturn, with follow up in the turn after that.
 
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Unless you all are voting to attack Urth next turn and do so continually from this point on, there is no reason to not take peace.

If you reject it and don't attack her, she just builds up in peace without giving us shit.

If we accept it, we get goodies while also having time to get ourselves together and resolve our burgeoning crisis at home (overpopulation/Maradysh).

Constantly throwing ourselves at her when we already know we're at a disadvantage (we lost both our Martial heroes last time if you recall) is foolish.

As an aside @Oshha is there a reason why we didn't just solve our overpopulation issue through mass emigration into the Maradysh?
 
Raichu1972 said:
Unless you all are voting to attack Urth next turn and do so continually from this point on, there is no reason to not take peace.

If you reject it and don't attack her, she just builds up in peace without giving us shit.

If we accept it, we get goodies while also having time to get ourselves together and resolve our burgeoning crisis at home (overpopulation/Maradysh).

Constantly throwing ourselves at her when we already know we're at a disadvantage (we lost both our Martial heroes last time if you recall) is foolish.

As an aside @Oshha is there a reason why we didn't just solve our overpopulation issue through mass emigration into the Maradysh?
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Those jerks I think have a value about people should stand on their own two feet and wouldn't like us basically going 'hey neighbor! Mind if we room with you for a bit?', same way they got mad when we tried to help them out earlier, we accidentally dissed them by implying they couldn't stand on their own.
 
Raichu1972 said:
Unless you all are voting to attack Urth next turn and do so continually from this point on, there is no reason to not take peace.

If you reject it and don't attack her, she just builds up in peace without giving us shit.

If we accept it, we get goodies while also having time to get ourselves together and resolve our burgeoning crisis at home (overpopulation/Maradysh).

Constantly throwing ourselves at her when we already know we're at a disadvantage (we lost both our Martial heroes last time if you recall) is foolish.

As an aside @Oshha is there a reason why we didn't just solve our overpopulation issue through mass emigration into the Maradysh?
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We can actually solve our overpopulation problem next turn and get the third action at the same time. We just need to build one settlement after all.
 
10ebbor10 said:
What can we do to the Caradysh as a vassal state. Could we order them to end their perversion of the blessing?

I mean, our nation used to be a theocracy, and I don't think that's completely gone yet. So, why do we not have any religiously affliated option to dealing with the walking blasphemy that is Urth.

In addition, we really should demand that Urth and his progeny be exiled from all our territory. Because otherwise it's near certain that he'll maneuver one of his daughters to take over the Maradysh.
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No to the ending of Urth's blessing, but the Caradysh would help you in any wars and as I told @Raichu1972 in the discord, you would unlock a megaproject to turn the Cursed Forest into a Sacred Forest.

The religious option to get rid of Urth is to reject the peace.

You can't demand to get rid of Urth or his daughters from Caradysh territory as part of the peace deal is accepting keeping Urth as the leader of the Caradysh (as he isn't going to keep up that position, even to one of his daughters) and letting him keep the blessing he has created.

Raichu1972 said:
we lost both our Martial heroes last time if you recall
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You only lost one Martial Hero last time.

Raichu1972 said:
As an aside @Oshha is there a reason why we didn't just solve our overpopulation issue through mass emigration into the Maradysh?
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They don't want to leave their community to leave amongst barbarians.
 
Raichu1972 said:
Unless you all are voting to attack Urth next turn and do so continually from this point on, there is no reason to not take peace.

If you reject it and don't attack her, she just builds up in peace without giving us shit.

If we accept it, we get goodies while also having time to get ourselves together and resolve our burgeoning crisis at home (overpopulation/Maradysh).

Constantly throwing ourselves at her when we already know we're at a disadvantage (we lost both our Martial heroes last time if you recall) is foolish.

As an aside @Oshha is there a reason why we didn't just solve our overpopulation issue through mass emigration into the Maradysh?
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I disagree strongly for a number of reasons.

1) The peace lasts 3-4 turns. Thus, as long as the plan is to attack in any of those turns, you have to vote war.
2) Rejecting the peace and remaining at war prevents Urth from openly infiltrating the Maradysh, by utilizing one of his sex spies to marry their leader. This would also result in the leaking of the full royal blessing, which would be a complete disaster
3) Urth got seriously hurt by that last exchange. If that wasn't true, they wouldn't be suing for peace. Yeah, sure, we lost a martial hero, but heroes aren't required for warfare.
 
10ebbor10 said:
I disagree strongly for a number of reasons.

1) The peace lasts 3-4 turns. Thus, as long as the plan is to attack in any of those turns, you have to vote war.
2) Rejecting the peace and remaining at war prevents Urth from openly infiltrating the Maradysh, by utilizing one of his sex spies to marry their leader. This would also result in the leaking of the full royal blessing, which would be a complete disaster
3) Urth got seriously hurt by that last exchange. If that wasn't true, they wouldn't be suing for peace. Yeah, sure, we lost a martial hero, but heroes aren't required for warfare.
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The idea that they have been "seriously hurt" is pure speculation.

It's just as likely that all we're really doing is tying up their action economy and being a nuisance, and thus Urth wants us to stop bothering them for a bit.

I can speculate too :p
 
I want to reject piece so Urth cannot focus on godhood, I'm not interested in a fight for the next few turns but I don't want Urth to stop spending resources on preparing for a potential battle with us soon.
 
Raichu1972 said:
The idea that they have been "seriously hurt" is pure speculation.

It's just as likely that all we're really doing is tying up their action economy and being a nuisance, and thus Urth wants us to stop bothering them for a bit.

I can speculate too :p
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We burned many major villages, and left a holy site planted firmly inside his core territory.

I highly doubt Urth can afford those kind of losses constantly.

[X] Refuse this the undead abomination and reject all of the offers it is making. (???)
 
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10ebbor10 said:
We burned many major villages, and left a holy site planted firmly inside his core territory.

I highly doubt Urth can afford those kind of losses constantly.

[X] Refuse this the undead abomination and reject all of the offers it is making. (???)
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The fog of war and interpretation of outcome in the direction you wanted to take is a potent combination. This is why you should consider multiple outcomes instead of the one position you kept advocating for.

Strategic reconnaissance will let us get the lay of the land and STOP US from endless speculation.
 
[X] Urth is offering tamed animals from the lowlands as gifts to the People. (Chance of Gaining Stability, ?
Adhoc vote count started by Parzival95 on Mar 13, 2019 at 12:39 PM, finished with 8720 posts and 40 votes.
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