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An Extra Primarch

Should the Quest switch to a Narrative Base?

  • Yes, it will streamline things.

    Votes: 345 40.5%

  • No, I prefer the current system.

    Votes: 127 14.9%

  • Yes, but not until the Crusade begins/Prologue ends.

    Votes: 379 44.5%
  • Total voters
    851
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[] perk plan Research!
-[] Level 50 Perk. Is That All? I've literally done that in my sleep. -250 to difficulty of all Checks. +5 Minor Actions.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 60 Perk. That Should Have Been Destroyed! Not with how much I spent on it! Durability of Extravagant items is doubled, after extravagant bonus is applied.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 80 Perk. Over-Engineered. Extravagant items perform even better if you put more effort into them, rather than just more resources. 25% increase in boost to specs provided by Extravagance.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 100 Perk. Castle... On Top Of Your Castle. If it weren't so effective, you'd think it was stupid too. 50% increase in boost to specs provided by Extravagance.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 140 Perk. Worth It's Weight In Gold. While using actual gold would be stupid, painting it gold is fine, and helps denote how insanely expensive it was. +10% to Extravagant builds. Requires 1 of preceding Perks.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 160 Perk. Totally Worth It! Despite how incredibly expensive it was, the product is proving it's worth. +10% to Extravagant builds. Requires 2 of preceding Perks.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 180 Perk. Worth More Than Gold. This thing makes gold seem downright cheap. Let's hope it was worth it. +25% to Extravagant builds. Requires 3 of preceding Perks.
-[] Invention: Extravagance: 200 Perk. Extravagant. While Extravagant items are expensive, they are also worth it for exceptional people, such as the Champions or yourself. +50% to Extravagant bonus. Requires 4 of preceding Perks.
-[] Education: Advanced: 60 Perk. Multi-Doctorate. You have the kind of intellect and knowledge that the majority of people simply can't follow your conversation unless you intentionally alter your vocabulary to compensate. +700 to all Checks. Must have Intellectual.
-[] Education: Advanced: 80 Perk. Omni-Doctorate You have the kind of intellect and knowledge that the vast majority of people simply can't follow your conversation unless you intentionally alter your vocabulary to compensate. +800 to all Checks. Must have Multi-Doctorate.
-[] Education: Seer: 60 Perk. Esoteric Techniques. Your knack has developed into a full-fledged technique for creating things from/using Warp energy, and discovering new ways to do so. +1400 to Psyker Checks. Requires Esoteric Technique.
-[] Education: Seer: 80 Perk. Esoteric Skillset. Your knack is developing into a full-fledged set of techniques for creating things from/using Warp energy, and discovering new ways to do so. +1600 to Psyker Checks. Requires Esoteric Knack.
-[] Education: Cultural Analysis: 40 Perk. Linking Up. You can absorb polities that aren't much larger than your own with ease. +2 Free Integration actions. Requires Joiner.
-[] Education: Cultural Analysis: 60 Perk. Benevolent Absorber. You can absorb polities that aren't much larger than your own with great ease. +5 Free Integration actions. Requires Linking Up.
-[] Education: Cultural Analysis: 80 Perk. Prepare To Be Uplifted! You can absorb polities that aren't much larger than your own with extreme ease. +10 Free Integration actions. Requires Benevolent Absorber.
-[] Psyker: Sorcery: 40 Perk. Omni-Manipulation II. While enough to make you an Omnimancer by itself, that is only a technically. +1200 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Omni-Manipulation.
-[] Psyker: Sorcery: 60 Perk. Omni-Manipulation III. You are just barely a real Omnimancer. +1400 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Requires Omni-Manipulation II.
-[] Psyker: Sorcery: 80 Perk. Omni-Manipulation IV. You've nearly reached the skill level of the absolute peak of known Omnimancers, which is generally about the level most psykers achieve in the field they focus on. +1600 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Requires Omni-Manipulation III.
-[] Psyker: Spirit: 20 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence. Weaker Daemons weaken in your presence. +1000 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Purifying Presence.
-[] Psyker: Spirit: 40 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence II. Weaker Daemons weaken greatly in your presence. +1200 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence.
-[] Psyker: Spirit: 60 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence III. Weaker Daemons fade in your presence. +1400 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence II.
-[] Psyker: Spirit: 80 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence IV. Daemons weaken in your presence. +1600 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence III.
-[] Psyker: Navigator: 20 Perk. Fleet Navigator. You can navigate for entire fleets, though large ones may cause strain. +10 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Storm Ender.
-[] Psyker: Navigator: 40 Perk. Fleet Navigator II. You can navigate for entire fleets, though very large ones may cause strain. +20 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Fleet Navigator I.

here is my perk plan. it has 3 focuses.
1) invention: extravagance. essential for things like our pesonal workshop and gear. makes sure we have the best of the best. took the perks that boosted durability and performance. not the cost reducers.
2) education. took everything here. its all fantastic.
3) psyker. rest of the perks went here. 1st to omni-mancer because invention checks. 2nd to spirit cause fuck demons. last to navigator. it is needed eventually, but not right this second. so it gets the leftover points.

also grabbed the level 50 perk for the 5 minor actions.
 
hmm maybe not the navigator, unless we go with the colonization fleets and survey fleets. might get lucky and find a DAOT fleet in ruins, maybe able to salvage them to.

anti-Deamons would be great though, keeps the assholes from getting near us, works well with our other perks to deny chaos, lets spread the righteous fury people, we might even be able to weaken greater Deamons with time!
 
@tri2

from my perk plan, here are the additional relevant bonuses for research:

Invention: +4200 (psyker: sorcery perks) +1500 to all checks (education: advanced perks ) = +5700 to invention actions,

Psyker: +3000 (education: seer perks) +1500 to all checks (education: advanced perks ) +4500 to psyker actions.

also, -250 to target from level 50 perks. hard to calculate value due to us not knowing how many levels there are.

dont know what the current numbers are, but the additions for invention are listed above.
 
DarknessSmiles said:
@tri2

from my perk plan, here are the additional relevant bonuses for research:

Invention: +4200 (psyker: sorcery perks) +1500 to all checks (education: advanced perks ) = +5700 to invention actions,

Psyker: +3000 (education: seer perks) +1500 to all checks (education: advanced perks ) +4500 to psyker actions.

also, -250 to target from level 50 perks. hard to calculate value due to us not knowing how many levels there are.

dont know what the current numbers are, but the additions for invention are listed above.
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mind sending me a pm for how you got those invention and psyker numbers please? as in list the individual perks and how the bonuses added up exactly?
 
tri2 said:
mind sending me a pm for how you got those invention and psyker numbers please? as in list the individual perks and how the bonuses added up exactly?
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i kinda already did?


i just grabbed all of the available perks from the trees i listed, and added their bonuses together.

there is a lot more complexity for electronic, explosives, and medicine checks that i am not sure about, but those bonuses should be good for general invention and psyker bonuses.
 
DarknessSmiles said:
i kinda already did?


i just grabbed all of the available perks from the trees i listed, and added their bonuses together.

there is a lot more complexity for electronic, explosives, and medicine checks that i am not sure about, but those bonuses should be good for general invention and psyker bonuses.
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huh, sorry, guess I am more sleepy than I thought then.
 
tri2 said:
mind sending me a pm for how you got those invention and psyker numbers please? as in list the individual perks and how the bonuses added up exactly?
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Based on the skill bonuses spreadsheet on the character sheet, the additional bonuses (eg. +1400 psyker, +1600 psyker) get added to the bonuses, not the increment they increase (eg. +200 from the difference of the 2 perks)

I think the Rune of Self needs 11 more actions to reach 500,000.

Calc:
Education: Esoteric+Seer: 390+ Forging: Gear: 200+ Psyker: Esoteric+Navigator: 280+ 8375(Education bonus)+ 5745(Forging bonus)+ 14725(Psyker bonus)+ 1000(Workshop bonus)+3500(Eldar SL)= 34215

We're currently at 121,925 for Rune of Self, 500,000 - 121,925 = 378,075

378,075/34,215 = 11.05


Let me know if I got anything wrong
 
Kirbstomp said:
Based on the skill bonuses spreadsheet on the character sheet, the additional bonuses (eg. +1400 psyker, +1600 psyker) get added to the bonuses, not the increment they increase (eg. +200 from the difference of the 2 perks)

I think the Rune of Self needs 11 more actions to reach 500,000.

Calc:
Education: Esoteric+Seer: 390+ Forging: Gear: 200+ Psyker: Esoteric+Navigator: 280+ 8375(Education bonus)+ 5745(Forging bonus)+ 14725(Psyker bonus)+ 1000(Workshop bonus)+3500(Eldar SL)= 34215

We're currently at 121,925 for Rune of Self, 500,000 - 121,925 = 378,075

378,075/34,215 = 11.05


Let me know if I got anything wrong
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where did you get 121,925 for current rune of self progress?
 
tri2 said:
where did you get 121,925 for current rune of self progress?
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Turn 13 results:
"

-[X] Work on combining the Self rune with another. x3. Furthering your ability to combine different Runes with each other only makes sense considering how useful they are.

Power Check: 5 Checks passed.

Control Check: 4 Checks passed.

Learning Check: 3 Checks passed. -650 to Check difficulty.

Combined Score Checks: Education: Esoteric+Seer: 255+ Forging: Gear: 200+ Psyker: Esoteric+Navigator: 215+ 2235(Education bonus)+ 4245(Forging bonus)+ 6025(Psyker bonus)+ 1000(Workshop bonus)+3500(Eldar SL)= 17675 X 3= 53025 +68900=121925. 49350 for compatibility between Self Rune and other Runes. Passed. 99350 for 6 Rune Arrangements. Passed. 121925/149350 for 7 Rune Arrangements."
 
@Kirbstomp 121,925 is for rune arrangement not rune of self, rune of self is 19420 if the bonuses are calculated right
so total actions needed would be 15
 
Combat: Melee: 40 Perk. Brawler. You are always armed. Provided you can use your limbs at least. +20 to Combat Checks.

Combat: Melee: 60 Perk. Commanding Officer. You are a skilled fighter, and those under your command know it. +30 to Combat Checks. +10 to morale rolls for forces you command. Requires one of the preceding Melee Perks.

Combat: Melee: 80 Perk. Crusher. You are a supremely skilled fighter. Your mere presence nearby is demoralizing to the enemy. +50 to Combat Checks. Malus of 10 to enemy morale rolls when arrayed against forces you command. Requires 2 of the preceding Melee Perks.

Combat: Melee: 100 Perk. Champion. You have achieved the limits of mortal combat when fighting in the close-range. You can embolden your forces and terrify the enemy by your mere presence, and the enemy champion is the only one that may do more than buy time with their lives should they get too close. +75 to Combat Checks. Bonus of 25 to morale rolls for forces under your command, Malus of the same to enemy morale rolls when you are present on the planet. Requires 3 of the preceding Melee Perks.

Combat: Melee: 120 Perk. Supreme Champion. You have exceeded the limits of mortal combat when fighting in melee. Your forces are emboldened by proximity to you, and enemies falter, as you are essentially death incarnate to any but a Warp Horror. +100 to Combat Checks. Bonus of 50 to morale rolls for your forces, Malus of the same to enemy morale rolls when you are in the same system. Requires 4 of the preceding Melee Perks.

Psyker: Sorcery: 40 Perk. Omni-Manipulation II. While enough to make you an Omnimancer by itself, that is only a technically. +1200 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Omni-Manipulation.

Psyker: Sorcery: 60 Perk. Omni-Manipulation III. You are just barely a real Omnimancer. +1400 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Requires Omni-Manipulation II.

Psyker: Sorcery: 80 Perk. Omni-Manipulation IV. You've nearly reached the skill level of the absolute peak of known Omnimancers, which is generally about the level most psykers achieve in the field they focus on. +1600 to Combat, Tactics, Medicine, Electronics, Invention, and Explosives Checks. Requires Requires Omni-Manipulation III.

Psyker: Spirit: 20 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence. Weaker Daemons weaken in your presence. +1000 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Purifying Presence.

Psyker: Spirit: 40 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence II. Weaker Daemons weaken greatly in your presence. +1200 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence.

Psyker: Spirit: 60 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence III. Weaker Daemons fade in your presence. +1400 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence II.

Psyker: Spirit: 80 Perk. Anti-Daemon Presence IV. Daemons weaken in your presence. +1600 to rolls/Checks against Daemons and the corrupted. Requires Anti-Daemon Presence III.

Psyker: Navigator: 20 Perk. Fleet Navigator. You can navigate for entire fleets, though large ones may cause strain. +10 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Storm Ender.

Psyker: Navigator: 40 Perk. Fleet Navigator II. You can navigate for entire fleets, though very large ones may cause strain. +20 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Fleet Navigator I.

Psyker: Navigator: 60 Perk. Fleet Navigator III. You can navigate for entire fleets, though extremely large ones may cause strain. +30 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Fleet Navigator II.

Psyker: Navigator: 80 Perk. Fleet Navigator IV. You can navigate for entire fleets, though ridiculously large ones may cause strain. +40 to fleet travel rolls. Requires Fleet Navigator III.

Invention: Extravagance: 60 Perk. That Should Have Been Destroyed! Not with how much I spent on it! Durability of Extravagant items is doubled, after extravagant bonus is applied.

Invention: Extravagance: 80 Perk. Over-Engineered. Extravagant items perform even better if you put more effort into them, rather than just more resources. 25% increase in boost to specs provided by Extravagance.

Invention: Extravagance: 100 Perk. Castle... On Top Of Your Castle. If it weren't so effective, you'd think it was stupid too. 50% increase in boost to specs provided by Extravagance.

Invention: Extravagance: 140 Perk. Worth It's Weight In Gold. While using actual gold would be stupid, painting it gold is fine, and helps denote how insanely expensive it was. +10% to Extravagant builds. Requires 1 of preceding Perks.

Invention: Extravagance: 160 Perk. Totally Worth It! Despite how incredibly expensive it was, the product is proving it's worth. +10% to Extravagant builds. Requires 2 of preceding Perks.

Invention: Extravagance: 180 Perk. Worth More Than Gold. This thing makes gold seem downright cheap. Let's hope it was worth it. +25% to Extravagant builds. Requires 3 of preceding Perks.

Invention: Extravagance: 200 Perk. Extravagant. While Extravagant items are expensive, they are also worth it for exceptional people, such as the Champions or yourself. +50% to Extravagant bonus. Requires 4 of preceding Perks.

Level 50 Perk. Is That All? I've literally done that in my sleep. -250 to difficulty of all Checks. +5 Minor Actions.

These are the perks I wanna get, I'm as eager as anyone to get some combat bonuses but I think that it's worth it to get some levels in Extravagance because of the boosts it gives to specs and durability.
 
can anyone else confirm this calc
Calc:
Education: Esoteric+Seer: 390+ Forging: Gear: 200+ Psyker: Esoteric+Navigator: 280+ 8375(Education bonus)+ 5745(Forging bonus)+ 14725(Psyker bonus)+ 1000(Workshop bonus)+3500(Eldar SL)= 34215
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if truly is correct will free up 6-7 actions for more research
 
tri2 said:
can anyone else confirm this calc

if truly is correct will free up 6-7 actions for more research
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Pretty sure its correct. Maybe put 3 of the newly freed actions on naval weapon development, and another 3 on improving either soulstones again or improving our Psy-Robots?
 
Sorry this is what I got for Rune of self now:


Combined Score Check: Invention: Practical+Industry: 210+ Psyker: Esoteric: 280+ Forging: Gear: 200+ 13075(Invention bonii)+ 14725(Psyker bonii)+ 5745(Forging bonii)+3500(Eldar SL)=38735

500000-19420= 480580

480580/38735= 12.41

Does that look right?
 
From the almighty spreedsheet (An Extra Primarch Bonuses) itself :

Perks Bonuses :
Combat +32,045
Tactics +7,435
Evasion +2,335
Speech +23,135
Perception +2,370
Medicine +7,500
Forging +4,245
Electronics +6,875
Explosives +5,900
Education +2,235 (Applied to all)
Psyker +6,025
Invention +7,375
-----------------
Speech Diplomacy +50
? Esoteric +30
Invention + Psyker +3,500
Karma: +1,350

Conclusion : Fuck the Combat Perks.

The only interesting new trees I see are Education and Perception - the last one because it's quite weak right now and give some good bonuses if we go toward :
- Perception: People: 200 Perk. Proper Sherlock Scan. You are a true master of reading people, to the point of low-level pseudo-Divination, which works well with your actual Divination. +500 to Perception Checks. +500 to Speech Checks. +250 to Combat and Medicine Checks. Requires 8 of preceding Perks.

However, Education can somewhat cover our weakness there and all our Perception bonus come from it right now. Doubling down on Invention and Psyker is good too IMO.

It's one thing to meet our brothers, it's another one to see they're fucked up in the head.
 
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Tarnation....

The perk wars begin once more. (Mainly people pushing for combat perks, the exact same ones we've rejected a dozen times now, but that doesn't matter apparently. Nor does the logic involved. Just continuous "I want it!".)

Who was it that ran the numbers on the number of non-psyker perks we had to spare, again? Would be helpful to note.

Blah.
 
jacobplm said:
Pretty sure its correct. Maybe put 3 of the newly freed actions on naval weapon development, and another 3 on improving either soulstones again or improving our Psy-Robots?
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how about ship design?
@Kirbstomp so 12-13 actions on rune of self, how much of a boost do you think it will give to workshop points per action? so I can reduce that as well.
 
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