A Simple Transaction I

Zfglx · Sep 20, 2020

Wolfy said:
She's a vector of attack. Like, remember how people didn't vote for her dying?

She's a possible hostage and amount of utility she brings to the table is completely irrelevant compared to amount of leverage she has over the thread. It would be different if we were willing to just let her die, but we are not.

To be fair that option also had good chances of Letrizia dying, and unlike Aobaru, Aeria is not the target of an enemy with a similar speed of power advancement to us. While certainly she could be a target, who will know to specifically go after her?

BrainInAJar · Sep 20, 2020

That same "leverage" is why people want to bring her with us, y'know? It's just emotional attachment, so letting her go away and letting her die ultimately have similar results of "she's not here anymore", even if the former is leagues different from the latter.

Wolfy · Sep 20, 2020

I mean it's not like she's getting screentime to begin with..

Lealope · Sep 20, 2020

Zfglx said:
We should try and work towards getting Letrizia sorcery as that was a thing and the devouring sorceress sounds like good synergy with Versch.

Rihaku said:
She may also have an affinity for the magics of Myth!

Might be worth considering sending Letrizia off to magic school while we're here, or figuring out some way for Gisena to give her access to Sorcery through some Hyper-Reactor equivalent. She deserves a bit more than just Sharpbright for putting up with our horseshit with such good grace.

Zampano · Sep 20, 2020

runeblue360 said:
Might be worth considering sending Letrizia off to magic school while we're here, or figuring out some way for Gisena to give her access to Sorcery through some Hyper-Reactor equivalent. She deserves a bit more than just Sharpbright for putting up with our horseshit with such good grace.

It required 7 Arete and the ultra-rare pick of Slice Fate to make her into a sorceress. However, our Bloodcasting Rank is about double of when we had our last opportunity. Gisena might have newfound insight into the nature of findross, though...

Lealope · Sep 20, 2020

Zampano said:
It required 7 Arete and the ultra-rare pick of Slice Fate to make her into a sorceress. However, our Bloodcasting Rank is about double of when we had our last opportunity. Gisena might have newfound insight into the nature of findross, though...

Slice Fate also gave us a reroll every day, which was a pretty fucking wild effect in hindsight. I imagine much of the relative "power" of the option was taken up by that.

Speaking of 7 Arete advancements I'd go for over Pillars/Elixir, Slice Fate would be so tasty, though if I imagine if anybody deserves it, it would be Gisena rather than us.

TooSlow · Sep 20, 2020

runeblue360 said:
or figuring out some way for Gisena to give her access to Sorcery through some Hyper-Reactor equivalent.

Gisena already knows the singularity rune.

ImperatorV · Sep 20, 2020

So, a random thought occurred to me. Elixir gets us the Fairbright Bloodline, and Elixir is sorta the Edeldross equivalent to True Quintessence (maybe). Given that both Manifest Realm Sorcery and Augustine's magic were degraded Foremost magic, I think it's likely that the Fairbrights are distant descendants of the Foremost. Which may make Lucent Thorne a Foremost weapon.

The Fairbrights seemingly being all over the Voyaging Realm would also make sense if they were some kind of distant Foremost remnant.

TooSlow · Sep 20, 2020

ImperatorV said:
Elixir is sorta the Edeldross equivalent to True Quintessence

Elixir only makes Edeldross equivalent to Findross. We won't be able to gain true quintessence without learning the runes.

Lealope · Sep 20, 2020

TooSlow said:
Gisena already knows the singularity rune.

I think that was a meta-singularity effect rather than ascension to Sorceroushood itself. Given the specifics of Renaissance Woman, we might want something more safe for Letrizia.

ImperatorV said:
So, a random thought occurred to me. Elixir gets us the Fairbright Bloodline, and Elixir is sorta the Edeldross equivalent to True Quintessence (maybe). Given that both Manifest Realm Sorcery and Augustine's magic were degraded Foremost magic, I think it's likely that the Fairbrights are distant descendants of the Foremost. Which may make Lucent Thorne a Foremost weapon.

The Fairbrights seemingly being all over the Voyaging Realm would also make sense if they were some kind of distant Foremost remnant.

What then does it mean that the Lucent Thorn was Forged to slay the Ringbearers? Ancient enemies of the Foremost, perhaps? Maybe we should have a good long talk with the Azure and ask it to show us the history of this world, at least when Gisena has more thoroughly mastered it.

SpectatingRaven · Sep 20, 2020

Rihaku said:
Hunger didn't lose, and he may not even have had to use the Shattering Blow - that was only one possibility of many, though one Gisena was doing her best to prevent! He closed range because that was the plan to maximize openings for Gisena's Ultimate Nullity, and that plan kind of worked, if not in the way they originally intended... if he hadn't had Gisena along, Hunger would have fought with a different, less aggressive style, which may have made Augustine's location-based trap significantly less effective, though it could certainly have come with dangers of its own.

Is the Shattering Blow the different name of the Praxis technique Shatter the Pane? If so, then do we have it now or not because we didn't get the chance to instantly get it due to Gisena carrying us to victory?

ImperatorV said:
So, a random thought occurred to me. Elixir gets us the Fairbright Bloodline, and Elixir is sorta the Edeldross equivalent to True Quintessence (maybe). Given that both Manifest Realm Sorcery and Augustine's magic were degraded Foremost magic, I think it's likely that the Fairbrights are distant descendants of the Foremost. Which may make Lucent Thorne a Foremost weapon.

The Fairbrights seemingly being all over the Voyaging Realm would also make sense if they were some kind of distant Foremost remnant.

Elixir turns Edeldross to a substance on the same ontological level of Findross but that just means bringing it up to speed compared to being merely a component/predecessor. True Quintessence meanwhile is a meta-singularity of Findross so there maybe an equivalent EFB for our Element. On the other hand, Fairbright Bloodline seems to be a different beast. Getting it is more of an interaction between the EFBs Elixir and Crimson Flare, conceptually refining our bloodline with the help of the refined Element. Instead of being closer to the Edeldross version of Maidenhood, I think its a different system altogether.

Lealope · Sep 20, 2020

SpectatingRaven said:
Is the Shattering Blow the Praxis technique Shatter the Pane? If so, then do we have it now or not because we didn't get the chance to instany get it due to Gisena carrying us to victory?

Given the talk of grevious consequences and spending of ourselves, I assume he's talking about what Hunger did to burn himself up against the Tyrant, or perhaps something like what would result in the Scars of Myth.

Zfglx said:
To be fair that option also had good chances of Letrizia dying, and unlike Aobaru, Aeria is not the target of an enemy with a similar speed of power advancement to us. While certainly she could be a target, who will know to specifically go after her?

The Apocryphal exists. All this is why I think we should just have Aeira be Letrizia's full time bodyguard and develop a resurrection ability for when she falls in the line of duty. Between her stealth skills and combat ability, I think she'd do quite well at the task while giving Letrizia much more survivability outside of Versch.

LordOfMurder · Sep 20, 2020

Rihaku said:
No time for certainty. Barely time to act. The Jewel of Artifice flared on her finger as Gisena Allria scribed with her Graces a rune, whose meaning was Singularity, and whose purpose was ascension.

There was light.

In that moment, Gisena at last understood the Maiden's reasoning. Why was she the Sorceress whose only Grace was Nullity?

Simply because, a genius needs nothing else.

[X] Renaissance Woman

This is my favourite update of the entire quest. I teared up. It was incredible. Gisena interlude was everything I could possibly have wanted.

Swimmingly · Sep 20, 2020

SpectatingRaven said:
Is the Shattering Blow the different name of the Praxis technique Shatter the Pane? If so, then do we have it now or not because we didn't get the chance to instantly get it due to Gisena carrying us to victory?

I think it's more likely that the Shattering Blow is what Hunger used last time - you know, when he shattered his sword and sacrificed huge swathes of his body and identity.

Hirorubie · Sep 20, 2020

Well, I've read this over enough times I should probably dust off the ol' pick and get to minin' proper.

3350 words of simpin for Gisena this week! Join me next week as we move onto Letrizia after she shows off with her armament!

Rihaku said:
The Truth Manifest

I'm so excited I almost don't want to play around with title musings. But almost is a far cry from don't wanna, so lets play.

The most interesting thing about the title, for me, is that Truth, so often paired with that amazing hue of BLUE, was subsumed by Princess Reagent Gisena Allrias' pink. Not the light purple of the sorceress, but the hue of a ~~Princess~~ err a Maiden?. Checking back, that color was the original designation of the RW upgrade, so I'm curious if this will turn Gisena options going forward pink as well. Only time will tell, we'll have watchdogs on the lookout for her pallet.

In other news, It's pretty obvious she has the little ring under her thumb. For all it's power, it can't even retain dominion over its own word once adorned by a genius of Gisenas' caliber. Given the fact that we didn't treat the ring unjustly, it make sense that it wouldn't put up too much of a contest this early in the game though & I trust it to mind its manners, for the next couple hundred or thousand years. Not sure how long the ring will consider itself in debt, but probably long enough to be outside need for the threads concern, barring huge time skips which we've deftly avoided like the plague thus far.

And frankly, I don't see the ring winning a 1v1 vs Gisena anyhow.

"Stay close," Hunger commanded, as his Cloak writhed and snapped like a striking whip against the air.

Gisena smiled faintly. She knew the Cloak of his panoply would do them no harm, but it wasn't every day that the Lord Hunger cut so unintentionally hilarious a figure! Idly she preserved the image in her mind's eye as they strode forth upon the Protector's tower.

Implying Hunger would ever try and look funny, I'm not sure he's had that type of humor! Actually, given that he's burned away that which was most precious to him, I wonder if he did have a stellar sense of humor back in the day. Interesting thought at least.

I'm curious what Gisena has in mind with this Hunger in a bottle she has. As a genius in all facets, I'm sure she could whip up quite an artful representation of this moment! I do hope she one day shares with the class, silly Hunger photos should definitely be shared behind his back.

Magics assailed her vision, daunting spellcraft in vertiginous lines, flashes and fluxes of green witchfire and nauseating distortion that pressed at her temples against the shield of her Nullity. The Lady Protector was an adept magus, a twisted sorceress of the highest order. It was more than fitting that Gisena would stand against her today.

We certainly under thought the use of Gisena. We sort of boil her down to a pokemon that has 1/1 Nullity Sea and 99/99 Dispelling bolt.

Especially given the conclusion to this update, I feel we should concentrate some more of our time and effort on giving her the time to shine. I don't mean sit her down and make all our graces for us either, I mean in an encounter like this we should be speculating on the sorts of things Gisena could notice and warn us about. How if we've seen X+Y instances of the same phenomena, how she should be able to better steer the ship.

I greatly want one of her first masterpieces of artifice to be a scrying focused piece. What this woman can do with information just isn't right, and I want to abuse that fully. I also don't see myself wanting to be too far apart from her. The apocryphal is a bitch, sorry apo-chan, but I don't want you to pick off our girl.

Their enemy was limited chiefly by time, secondly by resources. That Augustine had spent precious moments crafting the runes of this initial assault, an attack totally incapable of felling Lord Hunger, meant that her purpose had not been to finish - or even deter - them with this strike. It was part probing attack, part feint: testing esoteric vectors to see if any would register disproportionate effectiveness, while simultaneously feigning weakness to encourage overconfidence on Hunger's part.

At first glance, a light thrust that cost Augustine little and which might reveal a critical weakness in her foes - or create the weakness of hubris for the Protector to further exploit. Likely the follow-up strikes would be designed to test for overconfidence before Augustine was forced to do battle in person.

We had discussed as much, that time was of the most import. I'm curious how effective Methodical but Quick would have been. Denying her a majority of the probing, and perhaps the Rank Trap to begin with. But could we have performed the RoQ+ Artful Thorn strike on her when we made it? Not sure, also not sure if Gisena would have been able to come to terms with the need to ascend if we hadn't been trapped so. Not an instant kill trap, time for her to think and act, yet only a moment. Just enough to force her into that do-or-die style gambit.

These are great tactics in general though, honestly. I'll have to keep them in mind, if not for this quest, for others. It sort of reads like a 'duh' scenario, but most logically sound well thought out plans have that quality. I especially like the overconfidence tester. Let your foe tank some easy hits. Give similar strikes in coloration and speed to tank. Then introduce the lethal/crippling variety.

But Gisena had now seen the iron runes which produced Augustine's magic: the intricate sigil appeared only momentarily before self-incinerating to ignite its spell payload, but that was time enough for her to capture it in memory.

When Augustine had stolen Verschlengorge Gisena had seen only a single rune. A single data point was worthless, but two allowed for correlation, and correlation was the mother of hypothesis. From the comparative structure of the runes and their associated magics Gisena constructed a rough understanding of Augustine's spellcraft. A few more such runes and she could derive the basic language! Not that Gisena could wield it herself, but all the better to counter Augustine with.

I do love the setup here, queing everyone in on her capabilities. Sure you read it here and sort of file it away, but later when she puts it into practice your jaw drops. Or at least mine did, I knew she was a genius, but how could I have ever known what that actually entailed? I'm stuck back here in remedial math and this gal tested out after the first class.

To Lady Gisena Allria had been given the power to perceive all magics and to touch none, for her touch was magic's unmaking, the very antithesis of wonder. Sometimes she still wondered at the Maiden's intentions in crafting so cruel a gift; but only wistfully, like toying with a broken bauble or picking at an old scar.

The only comparison I can think of in scope would be to have a touch of poison. To want to love and be loved, yet to ever lay hands on another would bring the gift of death. You can wear gloves, or in Gisenas case a Ring of power, but it's just not ever going to be the same.
Though it's painful, it's nice to see that beneath the genius she is still a human. Even if she is a once in a species prodigy she still can't help but twist her own knife every so often, though it avails her not.

In the ledger of cosmic concerns it barely rated notice, relevant only by its inescapable vantage. Everywhere she looked she saw what she could not have; yet still, better to embody the destruction of magic than not to be gifted at all.

I suppose this is the one place I would take comfort in her position. In her field, she's a class of her own. Even if I hated the subject matter, there is a catharsis in being the undisputed best in your craft.

Perhaps only one that felt as such could acquire the Grace she held. It was a thought she'd had many times, and each time equally meaningless. In the absence of a guiding star, a powerful mind was a vessel only for going nowhere quickly. Hunger had his vengeance, but what purpose was her own?

I wonder if this was part of the reason the Accursed paired us together. In the absence of a star, how could she fail to perceive Hunger when he appeared. Broken, ragged, with a comedy of a weapon. But imagining the infinite depth she saw instead of the broken veneer he presented, I'm much more understanding as to why she came with us. Until she comes to terms with her own desires, I can't see her abandoning Hungers mission.

In her mage-sight Hunger was a constellation of infinite depth, power beyond reckoning extending into dimensions higher and lower, beyond even the furthermost limits of her Nullity. Even his current world-filling might was but a pauper's veneer, tissue-thin shell around the incandescent potential at his core.

I love this description of Potential. I love even more that it shows despite how far we've come, how far we have yet to go. We can't even be said to have scratched the surface of what our gift is capable of. We've managed to becoming one of the foremost powers in the VR within the dalliance of a season... Unlike the Hidden ones, there is a higher power that delivers. We'll be passing out pamphlets at the end of this lecture, feel free to stick around and pick yours up.

The power of Progression was elegant. In the ordering of its forms it spelled out its name for any mind capable of perceiving it, even for those, like Gisena Allria, whose vision was limited to the uttermost shallows of that blazing sea.

This whole segment coming up is what I live for, but lets take it piece by piece. The Accursed really is a cool dude, and I can't believe we haven't gotten anyone to approach us yet based on this. I mean, I can, but it will be so cool if when walking through a city we catch some guys jaw drop. Not only did the Accursed put in the equivalent of his signature, or perhaps calling card, but he made sure that anyone who knew the barest forms of the alphabet could discern its meaning.

The Lathe of Heaven. The object, the symbol, the pattern by whose revolution the world was re-created and destroyed. Fitting heraldry for Hunger's patron, given his ultimate objective. That too was implicit in the Lathe of Heaven, for those who knew where to look.

I wish I wasn't so ignorant at times reading these quests, beyond sounding really cool I know there is a ton bottled up in 'The Lathe of Heaven.' It's possible though, that I'm not alone in my ignorance. I hope I'm able to pick someones brain, but regardless, you don't need to know the specifics to appreciate what is going on through context clues. Like I said, it's still one of... or perhaps is my favorite part of the update.

This portion I've read over several times, more impressively I've read it out loud and it still sounds damn cool. But here we go, get ready

A kinder world than this.

Rihaku is sparing with his Italics, unlike me who plasters them like a certain writer for The Wandering Inn. Yeah, I haven't read any for nigh upon a year, but I still feel the italics guiding my hand even now.

I was so happy to read this on the first pass, and no less so on subsequent touches. I could have imagined the Accursed passing out progression for many reasons. Just as bait to lessen his curses was my honest thought. Perhaps some scheme he needed allies for, and this was the only way to make loyal ones. But his penultimate goal, is it truly for such an end? If so, my apologies Mr Accursed, I sold you short, far too short. You're a being after my own sometimes-bleeding heart.

The best part is knowing that Gisena in character knows this too. Despite everything we've done and all the crazy shit we will do, she rationalizes it all by this message she's reminded of every time she glances our way.

When we tell her we have to stop the Tyrant, how can she do anything but nod her head? Our choice must seem preordained, it's emblazoned within us a thousand times brighter than the Tear of Edeldross that shines abreast our Evening Sky. She isn't one to waste her breath, and trying to argue us out of such a course must seem laughable.

Hunger swept upon the Tower like an evening storm, the boom of his cloak like rolling thunder, clarion sword-strike like lightning splitting the sky. Swiftly he cut through the ramparts of earth and mithril on his path towards the wizardess' sanctum. Adorie followed immediately behind, with Gisena carrying the flank.

Oh yeah, there is action coming up isn't there? Straight after such a riveting deluge we're taken Hunger First into the Tyrants Tower. It's interesting to think about Hunger sweeping upon the Tower, but I actually like this one as a fast read without too much deep delving. Letting my mind just pick up Hunger, Storm, Cloak, Boom, Thunder, Clarion, Sword-strike. Everything else just gets filled in and I get quite a nice scene.

Goodbye, oh tower of earth. It was for the best that we didn't take you along, and spoilers, I was mainly arguing the weaker, dangerous side to bait more interaction and thus arete. If it came down to it, I'd like to believe I would have switched off. But crazier things have happened, perhaps I would have riled myself up into a frenzy and began to truly believe what I was saying. Is this one of the forms of the self-defeating stance?

She spared a moment from the eye-candy of Hunger in action to gauge Adorie's condition. The Artificial princess was resolute as ever, uncommon grimness overtaking her features as she lent the support of her Rank to Hunger's own. The carefully-engineered magic of her bloodline was as precise and delicate as clockwork, beautiful as filigree; art ornamental as it was functional, as if designed to be directly perceived.

Oh you! I didn't know Gisena would actually check us out, damn, Hunger is IN... alright, maybe not. But it's my react and I can espouse nonsense if I want to!

I think I missed something, or perhaps this is Gisena employing knowledge she has long verified or at least a hypothetical she's considered likely. Artificial Princess? In the sense that she isn't human, or in the sense that this whole realm of myth, this scenario, is just pretend. A make believe kingdom that can't exist outside of its walls, something of that nature?

Or just in the sense that the magic that makes up her bloodline was crafted not by chance and wonder, but calculated by design. I'm guessing this is what she means, I wonder how true this 'theme park' idea really runs. Was this kingdom truly just for show, I mean, given the magic that makes her up is almost like a designer dog in a show makes me think so.

So odd to think of, but I'll go full shonen and say she's still just Adorie to me. So what if her people were made as a side show attraction a million years ago, times have changed and perhaps they've about outgrown their shackles. Though, perhaps to be truly free they would need Adories bloodline to fail... Eh, lets not outgrow our shackles anytime soon, mmkay?

In Adorie's ivory-tower innocence Gisena saw a glimpse of her own life. The sheltered Lady Allria that might-have-been, had she never attained the Maidengrace, daydreaming of magic among her books and measuring-tools. Despite herself she couldn't help but retain a fondness towards girl, even though she'd resolved to crush any rival princesses under heel...

Shame on me for not having read the precursor quest to this one, but it kind of feels like spoilers, you know? I did read the original Seram, the one where he tells that guy at the lunch table 'give me a day'. Oh my god I'm totally going to do a react on some of that, I think it was called Unnamed quest. That was some of the gooood shit. Sorry I got distracted.

Where was I, ah yes, I don't know anything about the Gisena from our other quest. Probably for the best though, I like this Gisena and I don't want to color her any other way until this is over. It would be nice for analyzing this paragraph though, but such is life, I'll merely have to make do with believing the genius and taking her at face value.

I'm pretty stoked she has a soft spot for Adorie though, it makes things much easier going forward knowing that she won't eventually... ehh, take matters into her own hands.

It was not Adorie's fault that the Foremost had created her strain of humanity and set them as steward or overlord above this Realm of 'Myth.'

Given Aobaru's testimony, it was entirely possible that the princess and all her subjects were nothing more than the descendants of an elaborate theme-park attraction. How would a princess of myth react to such knowledge, that the power of her blood was ultimately a simple warranty mechanism for the masters of her progenitors' line?

Ah yeah, this pretty much says some of my speculation from earlier. I do like the following bit quite a lot, and it helps explain why she keeps so much close to her chest.

Gisena did not give voice to such theories, as she kept silent on countless matters of speculation. Theory, pattern, structure came naturally to her mind, and if she were to speak on every idle hypothesis they would lack the time to act on them. No sense, at this scale, in explicating harmful truths, so long as someone with influence kept them in mind. The twisted resemblance of the Lady Protector spell's to certain of the Maiden's Graces, the likely true nature of the Foremost, the reality of Letrizia's family strife, the underlying form of Hunger's Tyrant Curse... for all the clues she'd pieced together, the truth only mattered where such knowledge would change the actions taken in reality.

Much wiser people than I have speculated on and expanded upon her speculations, and I would suggest looking at Vali's posts for more insight.

For me though, I'll keep to comments about why she expounds on so little of her theories to the party.

First of all, she states that this would be an nigh eternal affair if she were to offer up every scrap of her insight for the parties digestion. To her, so long as someone, namely herself, keeps the info filed away during planning, then no one else really needs to be bothered. I can sort of understand this, but of course as a cat I'm naturally curious, even if it kills me.

Her next assertation is that most of these 'truths', she would consider harmful. Either to the person in regards to, or to those who must be burdened by the knowledge, I'm not sure, presumably both? I would have never considered this was her take on things, that she would bottle up everything to spare our feelings. I'm sure there is a bit more to it than this, and perhaps we'll have another insight in the future as to how her thinking works. For now, this is more than enough!

Where one's actions would not change, hurtful truths were merely hurtful.

I suppose she lives with this one, and knows quite well. Poor Gisena!

Gisena Allria was the Nullity Sorceress. Did it matter the reason behind the Maiden's decree, if the decree was absolute regardless?

Like her, Hunger's first taste of magic had resulted in the death of his dreams, though on a scale far vaster and crueler. Would he repudiate that quest, knowing what he did now? Or would he continue doggedly ahead, doing his uttermost even when the path was preordained?

As with many things, she already knew the answer. It was not in him to do anything less, no matter how much it hurt.

Aww, now it's poor Hunger! You sad lot, you need each other. Time to get you guys back into the hot tub until the kids go to sleep.

She fingered the Ring of Truth, which glowered at her earlier implication of its irrelevance. That it could monitor her thoughts, she found amusing, and would have used it as a note-taking function had she lacked perfect recall. For Truth was only knowledge, and knowledge required effort, timing and circumstance to convert into power, which was why she favored its facet of Artifice instead. Here and now, it could not avenge itself against her.

I thought I was braindead for awhile, err, well I know I'm braindead, but I think I figured this one out. The Ring of Truth was only calling back to her saying she already knew the answer regarding Hunger, I had kept thinking it was something I had missed somewhere before or another update or a callback to something offscreen. I think the light flickered on though when I considered it may just be a sentence ago.

Interesting that she doesn't liken Artifice to requiring more of the aforementioned qualities to translate its domain to power, but I suppose she is the genius. I'll take her word for it.

But the Lady Protector could. Hunger was starting to struggle, increasingly exotic attacks striking from every angle, his sheer overwhelming power the only impetus still driving him forward into the heart of the wizardess' might. They'd agreed to reserve her Ultimate Nullity for the moment of greatest leverage, but Gisena was strongly tempted to unleash it now, to clear his path and see Augustine undone, if only in the aftermath.

More !Human Gisena. Man, I can't imagine the backlash if Gisena went off script and things went poorly for Hunger. Or if anyone went off script! interesting to think about character agency even within a plan. You sometimes don't account for your allies acting differently than you might intend, but there is no reason they can't. At best we can control Hungers action, everyone else it's more hope and pray.

Reading this I wonder if we messed up, If she had ultied now would we have even needed RW to bail us out? something to think about.

She bridled such emotions. What they needed now was not her heart but her mind. Not the swiftest path to victory, but the most certain. There could be no mistakes against an enemy this capable.

Thinking about it again, moving swiftly against the trap master is a good idea.

Hunger growled, a spine-raising rumble of exertion as he pressed forth, blade lined with Praxis blue as he struck down Augustine's phantasmal servants. One by one the monsters fell, revealing behind them the innermost chamber, where the Lady Protector had prepared her final stand. Power coiled in sinuous drifts about the sanctum, magic like an onrushing river, all chained and channeled by runes of screaming iron. Here also was Verschlengorge, restrained by edicts of Foremost magic. Countless layers of protection and augmentation shrouded the Lady Protector like a mantle, enhancing all elements of her protoplasm-flesh to the very limits of her magic.

How did I miss this on every other read though? I swear Hunger wasn't growling before, but here he is, plain as day, doing so. Somehow I always skipped right to the Praxis Blue I think, because I certainly recall that. Doesn't seem like she had any summons of use, so Bring to Heel would have probably been a big fat goose egg, had we even made it to this point.

Ahh, feels nice though, being in a boss room. Like Sten, she knew that a big spherical hollow is the only place a battle to the death can logically take place in.

I wonder if Methodical but Quick would have disrupted this massive power flow she had going on, I truly don't know the cost or if we would have hit this room, but it feels like it would have been soo good.

Oh, and Hi Versch! I'm glad to see you're not eaten! Not that that was ever a possibility... Ahem... Moving on. Actually, wait! Would rescuing Versch have triggered the boss battle? Probably, now that I think about it. I'm sure moving an armament is pressing business so he's probably been here the whole time. Or perhaps we would have only been hit with this trap and some phantoms and elites, with her unwilling to risk herself yet. Food for thought, certainly.

Swift as flashing sunlight Hunger closed the distance, the Praxis lending him speed like a messenger-god as he delivered the writ of Augustine's execution. But for this and more the Lady Protector was already prepared, space like an infinite treadmill expanding between them, and though Hunger's stroke still landed it was not a lethal blow. She was maimed horribly, but now came her retaliation, a blast of transcendental magic from runes freshly - and brutally - carved into her own flesh, raggedly infused with blood and marrow. Augustine marshaled such force as to reduce entire worlds to ash, a pantheon-slaying strike of truly foremost malice.

Hunger's cloak shivered, shining with the silver of evening, and dissipated the blow at the cost of its corpus.

Refinement of Quickness is, I think, my favorite advancement. It lends so much coolness to every encounter, it's service goes far and beyond what it promised. Even still, she pulled off crazy wizard shenanigans and made us Artful Thorn anyway it seems like. I suppose her infinite treadmill was equal along the ISH? I'm still trying to figure that bit out in general.

Her counterstroke is a thing of Majesty and beauty. Letting my imagination take me to the place where a projection of magic carried with it the force to reduce worlds to ash is an exercise I'm always happy to perform. I also like that we're likened to a great monster in this, a colossus worthy of a masterstroke to fell. This is the type of thing a hero uses to smite the bad guy at the end of the episode!

Then, we ate it with our cloak. Or perhaps, it ate our cloak? I suppose this one's in the eye of the beholder!

Again Hunger channeled the Praxis, but now was interrupted by feedback as Augustine unveiled the set of runes around her: sigils of truncation in a circle of cold iron that severed the Astral itself from the material plane.

Hunger fell to one knee, Ring-hand clutching his head as his soul fought to retain connection to his body. If even so fundamental a verity could be contested, then an emergent phenomenon like Pressure stood no chance at manifestation. Within those bounds, Hunger was effectively stripped of his Rank, and the lion's share of his power thereby.

All around the chamber was a certain pattern of runes, seemingly inert, and with a sinking feeling Gisena apprehended their meaning and ultimate purpose.

I would have been quite worried had we been in Hungers shoes right now. I believe this is about the time the curtain would have been pulled back, and Rihaku would have asked us to choose how we were breaking our bonds, and informing us of what Devestating Complications each of those acts would entail.

Instead though, we get Gisenas POV. Our girl sees an awful situation, a neutered Hunger and inert runes, suspiciously inert runes.

She'd known, of course, that Augustine was capable of scrying on her, though not on Hunger himself. But she had not expected Augustine's magic to be capable of crafting so perfect a counter to the Nullity. The emanation of findross that produced the Nullity could even not penetrate that barrier to affect the runes within.

Already Augustine was unleashing further contingencies, runes becoming blades of rime-crusted matter cutting methodically through Hunger's remaining shield of Ruin.

Incredible, this Augustine had in a mere day perfectly countered all she possibly could have. I have to have a lot of respect for the effort and sacrifice she put into this. I'm honestly impressed she countered Nullity, at least in the form she had witnessed.

He would still win this, Gisena knew. Somehow he would cut through and lay low the monster, no matter the price he had to pay.

She knows us all too well.

But he should not have to pay it, not had she discerned the truth sooner and called for a temporary retreat. They had all of them grown overconfident, sheltering under the central pillar of Hunger's Rank. A single point of reliance, no matter how sturdily fortified, was vulnerable to the Apocryphal Curse.

Aww, I feel bad. Voters will never be as wise and cunning as Gisena, will she forever feel bad for underperforming due to our lack of utilizing her? We must do better, I'll delve the internet and search for a certified genius to roleplays as Gisena for us in thread.

True though about over extending any single facet of ours, balance, in all things.

Furiously Gisena's mind raced down futile pathways. She was the Nullity Sorceress. It was her duty to counter enemy mages. What would be left of Hunger if he burned his selfhood to strike true, shattering the Blade again? Was this his fate, a cycle of endless repetition, every Tyrant felled at the cost of his identity? She would not accept that.

This, too, she would nullify. She would find a way.

Wait... did she... she did it, she said the thing! In her own way! This is the closest thing to a ship I've seen.

Augustine's magic somehow contained the perfect answer to her Nullity. Augustine's magic resembled a twisted version of the Maiden's Graces. Augustine's powers were derived from the Foremost.

And here is the 5d chess move time, that was eluded to as a possibility wayyy up there at the top of the update. This felt completely natural as it came up.

Hypothesis: Her powers and Augustine's own were degenerated forms of the same magic.

If so, then Gisena had now witnessed two examples of long-decayed Foremost Sorcery. The runes of Augustine, and the Grace of her sister Sorceresses.

One data point was worthless. Two, was correlation.

From their commonalities she could derive the principles underlying.

Hypothesis: Augustine's runic language produced twisted results because it relied on material reagents, evident in the agonized immolation of her material runes. The proper channeling medium, was the findross of the Maidengrace.

The language was the sculptor, and findross the marble. Without a proper sculptor, the Graces of her sister-Sorceresses had been limited to finite forms. Without the proper medium, Augustine's spells lacked for power, demanding toil and bloody sacrifice.

Gisena Allria was the Nullity Sorceress. The findross she produced could only do one thing. Yet, there was no limit to the forms it could take in the pursuit of that purpose.

Lances of Nullity, tides and bolts, shields and waves, blasts and seas...

Runes.

I actually really dig the the statement, break, Hypothesis framework here. In the midst of it is some interesting insight to. Basically Augustine was using runes because she lacked Findross, but the runes were still an alphabet Gisena could use, but employ properly using Findross. I think.

No time for certainty. Barely time to act. The Jewel of Artifice flared on her finger as Gisena Allria scribed with her Graces a rune, whose meaning was Singularity, and whose purpose was ascension.

I'm not sure if she scribed the rune on her Ring, but I kind of hope she did, because that would be sick!

There was light.

In that moment, Gisena at last understood the Maiden's reasoning. Why was she the Sorceress whose only Grace was Nullity?

Simply because, a genius needs nothing else.

And there we are, I hope this means that in some way Gisena has come to terms with her Nullity-centric life. Perhaps she will truly embrace it now, rather than forever feeling its chip on her shoulder? I sure hope so, anyway.

Bravo Gisena, enjoy your time in the spotlight.

Dark Lord Bob · Sep 20, 2020

Shattering Blow might be especially risky for Hunger now that he's a Cursebearer. If the Apocryphal Curse has a Level 100 attack lined up, and we burn ourself back down to Level 60, that could be pretty bad.

LordOfMurder · Sep 20, 2020

This update was so good especially the last couple of paragraphs that I got the same feel as when I read the lancelot vs Iskandar fight.

Fumbles · Sep 21, 2020

I was reminded of that quest, too. I thought of Wu witnessing Merlin's work.

Lealope · Sep 21, 2020

I wonder if its worth distinguishing between types of Heroes. From what I can tell there seem to be two: the Destined and the Chosen. The former encompass those like Hunger would've been in his original isekai world or Spring from EFB (those empowered by Fate for a task) while the latter is something like Aobaru, Caroline and perhaps even Young Seram (those chosen for a greater purpose on the basis of their talents). The distinction seems fairly intuitive to me and while we've not learned too much about the meta-verse lore regarding these recurring themes, it might be something worth keeping in mind.

If this is a worthwhile distinction, I'm curious that type Jotarun might've been. With more knowledge, we might understand the basis of Geas tasks somewhat better.

SpectatingRaven · Sep 21, 2020

Swimmingly said:
I think it's more likely that the Shattering Blow is what Hunger used last time - you know, when he shattered his sword and sacrificed huge swathes of his body and identity.

I initially thought its different because I remember only that in the final battle between Hunger and the Tyrant, the Sword got broken and he was reduced in power.

Dark Lord Bob said:
Shattering Blow might be especially risky for Hunger now that he's a Cursebearer. If the Apocryphal Curse has a Level 100 attack lined up, and we burn ourself back down to Level 60, that could be pretty bad.

Apocryphal Curse scale with us though. It doesn't matter what power level we achieve whether upwards or downwards, it always throws a problem whose difficulty always makes things exciting. It won't be interesting if it just decides to flatten us by sending enemies based on the peak of power that we achieved, not our current capabilities. It has to give us a chance.

Lealope · Sep 21, 2020

Hmm. We should really start planning for the enemy we chose with Long Voyage. RW is a godsend in that regard, with divination and utility and such but we should diversify our build a bit because you know the Apocryphal is going to equip them with a bunch of stuff to fuck us over completely. Working towards To Shatter Heaven in the Praxis would be very good in that regard since it would let us gain more timeskip picks that we could put directly towards Refinement of Battle, to cash in on the power of Whiteout. This wouldn't cost too much Arete either, especially good considering how much we've got on the docket.

Zampano · Sep 21, 2020

runeblue360 said:
the enemy we chose with Long Voyage

Doom of the Pendant: the enemy we chose with *Chains of Fate

It's petty of me, but Long Voyage didn't win

vali · Sep 21, 2020

runeblue360 said:
I wonder if its worth distinguishing between types of Heroes. From what I can tell there seem to be two: the Destined and the Chosen. The former encompass those like Hunger would've been in his original isekai world or Spring from EFB (those empowered by Fate for a task) while the latter is something like Aobaru, Caroline and perhaps even Young Seram (those chosen for a greater purpose on the basis of their talents). The distinction seems fairly intuitive to me and while we've not learned too much about the meta-verse lore regarding these recurring themes, it might be something worth keeping in mind.

If this is a worthwhile distinction, I'm curious that type Jotarun might've been. With more knowledge, we might understand the basis of Geas tasks somewhat better.

I've been assuming only one kind of hero, with destined and chosen being different names for the same thing, and the only difference between them is that the power they are given is proportional to the magnitude of their task. There are more heroes than cursebearers with the geas so some heroes, like Hunger in his first life, never have a cursebearer try to kill them.

...

Perhaps our three potential companions are from the past, present, and future.

Ceathlynn "Catherine" of Amarlt is specifically said to be sent forward in time. Gisena may have been sent back in time. Prolessarch's blurb says he travels between dimensions; unlike Catherine no mention is made of traveling in time. Of course no mention is made of Gisena traveling through time either, so who knows.

...

So I've been thinking about rings.

Rihaku said:
Awaken now, O Hunger ring; from blackest myth abjure:
thy band once stained, now un-profaned, to shine forevermore;

O Ring of Blood, O Ring of War, thy tide of battle fades;
cast down Their thrones in crimson gloam, unfurling of thine Age!

"From blackest myth abjure", to abjure is to renounce something. Between Wagner, Tolkien, and Plato, magic rings are well established to be very much "blackest myth", so it seems the first line is about the ring renouncing the rather extensive mythology surrounding evil rings.

"thy band once stained, now un-profaned, to shine forevermore;" it was un-profaned by the Accursed, but we can only speculate on who stained it in the first place.

"O Ring of Blood, O Ring of War, thy tide of battle fades;" I think that the tide of battle fading just refers to the ring having been profaned and useless previously.

"cast down Their thrones in crimson gloam, unfurling of thine Age!" I think this line refers to how the Ruling Ring can claim authority over all the other Rings and rule for an age. The other possibility is that it refers to Hunger's mission to topple the thrones of the Hidden Ones, but that seems unlikely given that they are both hidden and so far away that they can't reach Hunger here.

...

EFB rings and Voyaging rings are different from each other, with EFB rings being more powerful, tied to a single person, and showing no signs of a personality. But the Isekai Hunger ring and the Time ring operate under the same rules, can talk to each other, and act like they know each other. My guess is that the Forebear originally picked up the ring in the voyaging realm and then kept it until he died on the isekai world.

The Forebear spent his lives on the Procession, an endless succession of ever shittier worlds. The rings, with their endless hateful contest and profoundly evil symbolism, sound exactly like the sort of thing he'd encounter. Maybe all the rings existed before the Forebear reformatted whatever super evil universe existed previously into the human sphere/voyaging realm, and given their absurd durability managed to survive that event. We've already seen the Forebear is kinda terrible at anything that isn't cutting through so him missing a spot in his evil cleansing is normal.

Anyways, he spent some time in the reformed voyaging realm, just chilling and fishing and whatever. Perhaps he found the ring, discovered its ability to make life more fun and enjoyable, and decided to keep it. Or perhaps it was just one of the many, many other magics he wielded. The rings aren't a threat, even Gisena can deal with her ring's hatefulness. So he kept it through world after world, until the Hidden Ones killed him for real on the Isekai world. When that happened the ring was profaned, same as how the sword lost all its power. The Tyrant didn't dare take and wear the sword from the Forebear's tomb but perhaps he was more willing to wear the ring.

Zfglx · Sep 21, 2020

We really need to look into picking up the other dominions at some point. It is getting a bit ridiculous that we don't have them.

Lealope · Sep 21, 2020

vali said:
I've been assuming only one kind of hero, with destined and chosen being different names for the same thing, and the only difference between them is that the power they are given is proportional to the magnitude of their task. There are more heroes than cursebearers with the geas so some heroes, like Hunger in his first life, never have a cursebearer try to kill them.

My main issue with that is the different sources of their powers. Both the Heroine and a successful Hunger would have Fate to propel them forward whereas it doesn't seem like Seram, Caroline or Aobaru follow that pattern. All three seem more like they derive their powers from their own talents: as Aobaru's 25 Arete Advancement said, their were Chosen because they were suitable, not because destiny would make them suitable. Considering how the former can have their potential amputated due to external factors, it seems like a worthwhile distinction to draw.

vali said:
EFB rings and Voyaging rings are different from each other, with EFB rings being more powerful

I'm not sure if that's the case. Truth, for example, doesn't seem all that great compared to unlocking any of the Ring's EFBs considering most of its best abilities cost absurd amounts of Essence to use at all. It's only our access to Cultivation that made it at all viable. Majesty's powers are also kinda underwhelming unless in the hands of an ideal wielder, in which case they only measure up. Might seems a fair bit more busted but its the embodiment of an age with an absolutely disproportionate level of power compared to anything else the Cycle had ever seen before.

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