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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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BoredMan said:
Did you read the rest of that post? I made a statement then provided context on my thoughts to elaborate. The implication and statement was that I believe he sometimes throws them in when it's not strictly necessary (as we obviously aren't socially combating Mab or Lara Raith here and have better social dots than most of the setting)
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No I very explicitly did read the rest of your comment you very specifically had a reason why you were concerned with willpower cost. I'm saying because you included a flippant statement that someone is arbitrarily, after they write up a paragraph long stunt deciding to include charms or abilities it comes off as ragging on for no reason.

When you include statements that completely ignore context or are dismissive for no apparent reason like you have a tendency to throw random things in. It comes off as flippant and kind of shitty for no reason especially when it's not paired with a suggestion to do something else or your own suggestion of a plan.
BoredMan said:
Because I'm rather sure based what I've observed of plan composition habits and other postings that I'm one of the most if not the most cognizant of resource expenditure person here. What that means is if people are voting between two plans and only one segment is different, and it's cost related, they're probably going to be inclined to go for whomever they prefer or are more confident/comfortable with who presented the plan over other considerations. As people aren't entirely rational.
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This completely makes sense we've had conversations about Essence economy and people being concerned about that but not really wanting to spend any XP or AP to possibly do anything about that ever I get it.

Though the examples are rare I'm sure it's happened multiple time in this thread suggesting a plan that is the same just cheaper but that you feel is still likely to work is not a bad thing to do by any stretch even if people don't vote for it even if people don't agree with you it's still better then literally nothing.

BoredMan said:
Not that I think it's an issue now as I was told after that we have 8/9 though that doesn't mean I think it's necessary either.
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Fair enough.
 
Degorium said:
No I very explicitly did read the rest of your comment you very specifically had a reason why you were concerned with willpower cost. I'm saying because you included a flippant statement that someone is arbitrarily, after they write up a paragraph long stunt deciding to include charms or abilities it comes off as ragging on for no reason.

When you include statements that completely ignore context or are dismissive for no apparent reason like you have a tendency to throw random things in. It comes off as flippant and kind of shitty for no reason especially when it's not paired with a suggestion to do something else or your own suggestion of a plan.
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These are contradictory statements. You can't say that I "very specifically had a reason" then say "for no reason" or "for no apparent reason" in the same breath. People will acknowledge statements and take them based on how thick their skin is.

Degorium said:
Though the examples are rare I'm sure it's happened multiple time in this thread suggesting a plan that is the same just cheaper but that you feel is still likely to work is not a bad thing to do by any stretch even if people don't vote for it even if people don't agree with you it's still better then literally nothing.
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I didn't do literally nothing. I've convinced Yog to change aspects of his votes before. He convinced me recently to alter part of the last plan I presented when he said that a Crown question I wrote could be problematic. This is a proven method of action that has saved me time and is more likely to work in these scenarios. If he said no and the remaining willpower was nearly gone I would've done as you've suggested but trying the first method make more sense.
 
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[X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
-[X] ATB with willpower, subterfuge excellency,
-[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
 
Adhoc vote count started by Anaja on Dec 7, 2024 at 12:21 AM, finished with 28 posts and 3 votes.
  • [X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
    -[X] ATB with willpower, Subterfuge excellency
    -[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
Click to expand...
 
[X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
-[X] ATB with willpower, Subterfuge excellency
-[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
 
BronzeTongue said:
Interesting that the survivors correspond to the last remaining great dragons. I wonder if it's just coincidence, or if it legitimately became harder to sustain the lineage as the others died.
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On one hand, there might be some correlation. On the other, death of the god who provided the exaltation's power should not affect the exaltation. And dragonblooded are exalted. Still, this is going on the pile of "investigate later" and possibly motivates me to remake Syriothrax a bit more.

On the whole settlement - I guess publically we could act as an investor? In any case, this is putting us on the collision track with Odin. This is squarely his area of influence. We'll have to navigate this very carefully, because there are two prizes here - the dragonblooded breeding population, and the (almost certainly lunar) exaltation in the belly of the dragon. Also possibly the dragon himself, who might be on the way to becoming The Great Elemental Dragon of Water.
 
Yog said:
On one hand, there might be some correlation. On the other, death of the god who provided the exaltation's power should not affect the exaltation. And dragonblooded are exalted. Still, this is going on the pile of "investigate later" and possibly motivates me to remake Syriothrax a bit more.
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I was thinking more in the sense that the death of the Dragon might make it harder for the blood to pass on. Later day dragon bloods already have problems reproducing, it wouldn't be surprising if the waning influence of their element made it harder for them to take the second breath.

Or perhaps it's the other way around, where a proper Dragon keeps the elemental essence just a little more lively for the terrestrials lucky enough to share an alignment. The difference would largely be academic.


Yog said:
On the whole settlement - I guess publically we could act as an investor? In any case, this is putting us on the collision track with Odin. This is squarely his area of influence. We'll have to navigate this very carefully, because there are two prizes here - the dragonblooded breeding population, and the (almost certainly lunar) exaltation in the belly of the dragon. Also possibly the dragon himself, who might be on the way to becoming The Great Elemental Dragon of Water
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I think you're putting too much stock in the idea of dragon evolution too soon. We don't have a reason to think it's impossible, but equally there's no indication that it isn't or that it's practical to do on the necessary timeframe.

In terms of investment I don't think we can outbid Odin, and it wouldn't be wise to try. These guys could have material resources in trade for working with people like him but haven't done so, that says something.

What we need to do is leverage our unique capabilities to give them something they can't get elsewhere, and potentially build a relationship around the shared exalted connection if they're open to it.

I think tabling the lunar for the moment is the best option. Practically speaking we don't know if we can replace it or avoid a stupid accident playing around with the most contrarian type of celestial spark afterwards if we did. Making moves at it is likely to piss off the terrestrials and the huge dragon babysitting them, complicating diplomacy.

That might even be part of our in with them; being the party who can help them but won't try to steal their ancestral treasure. After we've gotten a good relationship going, preferably with some Dragonblooded officers in our growing earthside organization, we can potentially approach it again.

To be clear; I still stand behind my arguments about celestials, so I have a bias, but from a pure strategic standpoint the best play to get anything here as far as I see is to start with getting the terrestrials and treat the lunar as a long term project. Grabbing for it too quickly will likely cause us to fail at getting either.

Edit: error
 
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BronzeTongue said:
I think tabling the lunar for the moment is the best option. Practically speaking we don't know if we can replace it or avoid a stupid accident playing around with the most contrarian type of celestial spark afterwards if we did. Making moves at it is likely to piss off the terrestrials and the huge dragon babysitting them, complicating diplomacy.

That might even be part of our in with them; being the party who can help them but won't try to steal their ancestral treasure. After we've gotten a good relationship going, preferably with some Dragonblooded officers in our growing earthside organization, we can potentially approach it again.

To be clear; I still stand behind my arguments about celestials, so I have a bias, but from a pure strategic standpoint the best play to get anything here as far as I see is to start with getting the terrestrials and treat the lunar as a long term project. Grabbing for it too quickly will likely cause us to fail at getting either.

Edit: error
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The issue with tabling the lunar shard is that it is actively causing the dragon suffering. The logical favor to do is to provide some manner of suffering-free way of maintaining, or, ideally, boosting, dragonblooded breeding. We can do this through:
1) VEE (Background: Destiny to make sure they exalt, and Bacground: Breeding to increase the chances of their children exalting)
2) Splendors-like crafting - either to better contain the lunar shard, or to provide some alternative power source
3) Manse raising - turning the powerful Dragon Nest into an outright Manse would probably help. This could probably be done on both ends - both for the lesser nest in the town, and for the greater nest where the dragon is.
 
Yog said:
The issue with tabling the lunar shard is that it is actively causing the dragon suffering. The logical favor to do is to provide some manner of suffering-free way of maintaining, or, ideally, boosting, dragonblooded breeding. We can do this through:
1) VEE (Background: Destiny to make sure they exalt, and Bacground: Breeding to increase the chances of their children exalting)
2) Splendors-like crafting - either to better contain the lunar shard, or to provide some alternative power source
3) Manse raising - turning the powerful Dragon Nest into an outright Manse would probably help. This could probably be done on both ends - both for the lesser nest in the town, and for the greater nest where the dragon is.
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By tabling it I meant tabling acquiring it. Helping the dragon is different depending on what we try to do, but still a sensitive subject.

I'd also caution against assuming too much in advance about exactly what the problem is and how easy it is to replace the shard. I wouldn't be surprised if it went to all this trouble because there's something specific about exalted essence that makes the the whole thing possible and we can't just replace it with something as simple as a city size AoE splendor of Invincible Assertion: Missionary Position.

Not that it's hopeless, but I don't think we should assume this is a simple problem to solve - or that it will be simple to convince them to let us try certain solutions.
 
If we want to figure out exactly what best to do here, then we're probably going to have to use some of the people as foci to ask questions about the how and why of dragonbloods.
 
I think the simple reason why to keep Lunar shard away from Odin and away from drastic actions from us is the old interlude where Sanya fights the cultist. Luna may not be dead and we don't need to return her to the scheme. Frankly, the situation is still quite simple, we will steal the artifact so that Odin does not do anything drastic with it. He thinks that he can control it or use it somehow. Personally, I think that he can bite off more than he can live with.
 
Adhoc vote count started by Anaja on Dec 7, 2024 at 11:51 AM, finished with 38 posts and 5 votes.
  • [X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
    -[X] ATB with willpower, Subterfuge excellency
    -[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
Click to expand...
 
[X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
-[X] ATB with willpower, Subterfuge excellency
-[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
 
Vote closed. Not sure if I can get to this today, but I will try
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Dec 7, 2024 at 2:14 PM, finished with 41 posts and 6 votes.
  • [X] Drop more obviously magical hints in conversation, see if she bites
    -[X] ATB with willpower, Subterfuge excellency
    -[X] Stunt: "Do you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, your voice empathizing the dragons just enough to trigger the necessary association, a seemingly casual movement of your hand through your hair briefly revealing the glint of ebon scales underneath your clothes to the girl, visual and audial cues coming together to reinforce each other.
Click to expand...
 
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Arc 15 Post 14: On More than Maps New
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    • On More than Maps​

    26st of February 2007 A.D.

    "D'you have any of the old maps here? I always liked those - you know, where they write "here there be dragons" at the edges of the world, over where places like this would be later discovered" you ask in a conversational tone, emphasis on the 'dragon' a seemingly casual motion of the hand opening your jacket to show the ebon scales underneath.

    She stops to look you up and down then, in a tone that's just a little forced she continues. "Mostly they didn't do that, the proper medieval phrase is 'here there be lions', not to say there aren't a lot of maps with dragons around the edge, but that was just the illuminator showing their skills. Medieval people didn't really believe in dragons as part of the every day world. Sure there's a dragon in the Book of Revelations and one in Ragnarok but normally..." she trails off. "Well other than sailors I guess, not hard to believe in sea serpents with everything the sea holds: horned whales and giant squid..."

    "Underwater volcanoes," you pick up what she's putting down. "I imagine if you saw a pillar of fire rising from the water one night a dragon blowing it out like some kind of improbable whale would make as much sense as anything. Ever think of where dragons came from. Is it just people being scared of snake and imagining the worst snake, the one no one wants to fight..."

    Kristin starts to answer twice, stops herself, then finally gets out in a rush that belies the seemingly ordinary words: "Dragons are old, maybe the oldest legends in the world. When the Norsemen carved them into the prows of their longships the stories had already been told through the millennia. Sky gods fight dragons as men tame the land and make it ready for agriculture."

    "But the story is always about someone else far away fighting the dragon, a god a hero, you never hear of a bunch of regular people taking down something as powerful and all encompassing as a dragon." You sigh wistfully. "It's not like there aren't still plenty of mysterious places in the world. Who knows where a dragon might be hiding, on or off the maps."

    "Well you know what they say about dragons and the poking thereof..."

    "Aargh! My hair's on fire?" you laugh and get a laugh in turn, but it's fleeting.

    Her voice drops to a whisper as she adds: "Dragons like gold and they like.. riddles. Why are you here really?"

    Lost 1 Essence -> Now at 12/18 (Excellency)
    Lost 1 Willpower -> Now at 7/9 (ATB)

    [] Because these waters have suddenly become of interest to many powers, some with whom you might be familiar with, others with whom no one should be

    [] Well payment in actual gold might be a little awkward, but I'm sure I can work something out with the... dragon in charge

    [] Write in

    OOC: Hopefully all the double talk is understandable, but if something is confusing do not hesitate to ask.
     
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    • [X] Because these waters have suddenly become of interest to many powers, some with whom you might be familiar with, others with whom no one should be
    -[X] And if it is gold you seek, well, I may be open to investing

    I am so tempted to use "take me to your leader" line. In any case, things seem to be going good so far. We have an in.
     
    [jk] "I'm starting an endangered supernatural species dating service. Evidence suggests there could be a lonely dragon in these parts. I might be able to introduce them to a potential life partner."
     
    [X] Because these waters have suddenly become of interest to many powers, some with whom you might be familiar with, others with whom no one should be
    -[X] And if it is gold you seek, well, I may be open to investing
     
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