[X] Tiffany's plan, get a confession to hand to the police
I'm good with letting Tiffany have some fun. I gather that the plan is for her to get the killer to choose her as his next victim then give her a monologue?
Thing is so are a bunch of vampires and worse things. You guys know it's a mortal serial killer, some random sorcerer with divination or white court vampire with Auspex or mortal minor talent with a twinge of divination does not without looking and that takes time and effort.
Supernaturals know their business though, presumably the red court doesn't let magical pollutants build up unless they're harnessing it for something. Even in the case where it did happen they're more likely to pick up on it and be able to defend themselves. So I'd expect the revenge from beyond the grave angle to be less relevant for them on that alone.
In terms of other living supernaturals they might not literally pick him up in traffic, but the more he kills the more marks he'd be picking up, and the more he'd stand out if someone was looking while he was around. They might not use their abilities at random, but a vamp looking at something unusual or just searching for interesting prey is probably going to turn on their Auspex and sweep the crowd. A minor talent might peek at things freaking them out, or have a passive system like the woman who met us from the Ordo with her spirit companion.
His victim profile is probably in direct competition with minor supernatural predators too, which increases the likelihood of him being around when they're hunting.
I'm not saying it's impossible, just that if someone is running around looking for people to disappear and a whampire for example gets an eyeful of them they're probably going to become dinner. Either because it's an easy meal or because anyone struggling with their conscience will have an easier time stomaching it.
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if there was fistfuls of young former human predators of various stripes that go through a Dexter style hunting other killers phase until they get desensitized to murder.
Lydia doesn't know how things are going, but we spent some time helping her explain how death works to our priests from the city of the end, preparing them for the arrival of ghosts from reality.
The Sihi must have started to arrive in Chicago this turn, so we'll see. And the question of Wan Xian testes (which I personally find very unlikely) has to wait for us to explore the entire Labyrinth, and thus control it, to verify the existence or not of this, and it will not be a quick task.
Supernaturals know their business though, presumably the red court doesn't let magical pollutants build up unless they're harnessing it for something. Even in the case where it did happen they're more likely to pick up on it and be able to defend themselves. So I'd expect the revenge from beyond the grave angle to be less relevant for them on that alone.
In terms of other living supernaturals they might not literally pick him up in traffic, but the more he kills the more marks he'd be picking up, and the more he'd stand out if someone was looking while he was around. They might not use their abilities at random, but a vamp looking at something unusual or just searching for interesting prey is probably going to turn on their Auspex and sweep the crowd. A minor talent might peek at things freaking them out, or have a passive system like the woman who met us from the Ordo with her spirit companion.
His victim profile is probably in direct competition with minor supernatural predators too, which increases the likelihood of him being around when they're hunting.
I'm not saying it's impossible, just that if someone is running around looking for people to disappear and a whampire for example gets an eyeful of them they're probably going to become dinner. Either because it's an easy meal or because anyone struggling with their conscience will have an easier time stomaching it.
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if there was fistfuls of young former human predators of various stripes that go through a Dexter style hunting other killers phase until they get desensitized to murder.
No, when I said that I think it is improbable that there are Wan Xian proving grounds, it's because there isn't even a reason for something like this to exist in our world, which is literally our soul, and exaltation would also have no reason to add this spontaneously, as it is so much older than this interaction of reality and it has always remained in the parts deepest and most polluted among these realms, far from any place that the Emperor of Heaven would logically place the training ground for his heroes.
The only reason we're discussing this possibility is because of an unfounded theory/hope of a ancient Wan Keui to which Molly and the topic, whose collective flaw is curiosity, decided "Well, it can't hurt to look."
[X] Plan legality
-[X] Use the crown on the Halliwell's ID to learn what evidence of his crimes exist
-[X] Anonymously forward said evidence to the police, specifically people working on the related murders
[X] Use Hollow Mind Possession on his car, and order the cyber devil to have an "accident" if it looks like he's going to kill again before the police stop him.
This isn't something that's beyond mortal authorities. We've been taking a stance of treating mortals like people capable of being a part of the world. Not food or tools, but also not inherently helpless children who need to hide under the protection and wisdom of their betters. They can handle this if we just give them the evidence that they need.
Hey Yog, any chance you could throw Tiffany's confession in to Legality? Make sure that we send them a collection of evidence perfectly wrapped up with a bow.
Hey Yog, any chance you could throw Tiffany's confession in to Legality? Make sure that we send them a collection of evidence perfectly wrapped up with a bow.
Hmm... Let me think. In principle, there's nothing wrong with Tiffany's proposal (as long as she has "Infernal in a perfume bottle" security system equipped). It involves us more directly in the case, which delays us, but a confession is useful. I'll have to think for a moment.
No, when I said that I think it is improbable that there are Wan Xian proving grounds, it's because there isn't even a reason for something like this to exist in our world, which is literally our soul, and exaltation would also have no reason to add this spontaneously, as it is so much older than this interaction of reality and it has always remained in the parts deepest and most polluted among these realms, far from any place that the Emperor of Heaven would logically place the training ground for his heroes.
The only reason we're discussing this possibility is because of an unfounded theory/hope of a ancient Wan Keui to which Molly and the topic, whose collective flaw is curiosity, decided "Well, it can't hurt to look."
The tests for the Wan Kuei are not in Heaven, they were long ago, but for the last few ages of the world, how many even they do not know, they have been in Yomi. To escape Yomi is to pass the test.
Maybe avoid using the Crown again if there's an essence free way of going about it. I'm having flashbacks to the Boston situation in which we used more essence than we needed to on the alchemist and when we had to fight we did so starting with 3 or less motes in the tank.
The two examples you used were unnatural influence (possession, mind control, mental suggestions, etc.). I'm talking about normal social combat (natural influence) which you, as you understand a little of Exalted's mechanics, should understand the mechanical difference and using them as expressions is arguing in bad faith.
So you must be forgetting that guy, a member of Ants, who was wasting his willpower to deny Thomas's charm, praying and crying so much, because Thomas was doing exactly that, emptying his will, to scared Molly.
And I already said, it's not about rolling any dice, because that only happened if we couldn't leave our neighborhood, that's what it means to spend willpower in social combat when you're losing, ignore the other side and get out of the area.
This was the mechanic we used throughout the quest. Michael and Harry didn't do it because they also wanted to convince us otherwise (continue the social combat) and not just ignore us and do what they wanted anyway (abrupt termination of social combat).
Yes, I agree that won votes should not be litigated again but you have the bad habit of when you lose a vote or a vote which you don't like won, to keep saying how things could be different with all the world passive-aggressive energy "didn't I say?" or "I know better than you", several times throughout the topic, made worse by the fact that you and Yog are the ones who make the most plans but he almost never does it. Or when you starts discussing something about the DP configuration he confirms several times without ever letting go, using the phrase "my opinion" to prolong the conflict to no end.
Maybe you didn't mean that (almost certainly not, because you don't seem like a bad person at all), but that's always been the feeling I got from some of your posts.
And it's good that you don't recognize when the GM corrects you on something (Alphas patrolling), and I also remember that it was mentioned several times at the beginning of the quest as a reason why we should meet with them, when we were just starting out and without allies. And Olivia in the Interlude she had with Thomas asked to do basically the same thing, as part of her desire to protect other little talents, which Thomas convinced her to ask for help from wizards in training instead of doing it alone for safety.
1) The Intimacy mechanic for Exalts is supposed to work against all sources of persuasion or coercion,whether mundane or magical. By right, Lydia's Intimacy would have provided her a last ditch defense against Corpsetaker's possession once she showed her true colors. Im guessing she rolled badly.
I AM talking about natural social combat, by the way.
Molly has won every social combat by simply overpowering her opponent in successes. Im not sure that Infernals in ExWoD have access to unnatural social influence at all, short of turning someone into a bakemono and controlling them that way.
2)Thomas was never engaged in social combat with an Ant.
He was using Presence 4 to summon the dude from a distance, and the guy was spending Willpower for resistance rolls against Mental Magic. Thats not social combat, though it can be used in social combat.
3)You are mistaken about how social combat works in ExWoD.
Specifically, thats not how Willpower works in ExWoD. Let me quote its uses:
This is not a complete game. In order to use Exalted vs World of Darkness, you'll need access to at least one of the 20th Anniversary Edition World of Darkness core rulebooks:Vampire: The Masquerade 20th Anniversary Edition, Werewolf: The Apocalypse 20th Anniversary Edition, Mage: The Ascension 20th Anniversary Edition, Wraith: The Oblivion 20th Anniversary Edition, Changeling: The Dreaming 20th Anniversary Edition, or Vampire: The Dark Ages 20thAnniversary Edition. Vampire is probably the easiest and most "baseline" book to operate from, but any of them will work. You should probably also have an Exalted corebook (any edition will do) to have the context for what in Hell is going on in this game, but it's not technically required.
Exalted vs World of Darkness uses the Storyteller system, as detailed in the aforementioned core books.This is a decision made for two reasons. First, it's a game set within the World of Darkness, and as such it's easiest to integrate into a system designed to represent the World of Darkness. Second, translating the Exalted into Storyteller is about a hundred times less work than translating 8+ game lines into, say, Exalted 3rdEdition. If someone else out there wants to take the setting work done here as a springboard for rules-hacking this game to run the other way around, shine on,you crazy diamond.
Spending Willpower
Willpower is one of the most active and important Traits in Vampire. Because there are so many ways to expend, regain, and use Willpower, it fluctuates more than any other Trait (besides blood pool) in the game.
Willpower is a very versatile Trait, so make sure you understand how to use it.
• A player may spend one of her character's Willpower points to gain an automatic success on a single action. Only one point of Willpower may be used in a single turn in this manner, but the success is guaranteed and may not be canceled, even by botches. By using Willpower in this way, it is possible to succeed at a given action simply by concentrating. For extended rolls, these extra successes may make the critical difference between accomplishment and failure.
Note: You must declare that you are spending a Willpower point before you make an actual roll for a character's action; you can't retroactively cancel a botch by spending a Willpower point at the last minute. Also, the Storyteller may declare that a Willpower point may not be spent on a given action (such as attacking in combat).
• Sometimes, the Storyteller may rule that a character automatically takes some action based on instinct or urge — for example, stepping back from a chasm or leaping away from a patch of sunlight filtering through a window. The Storyteller may allow a player to spend a Willpower point and avoid taking this reactive maneuver. It should be noted that the impulse may return at the Storyteller's discretion; a player may need to spend multiple Willpower points over the course of a few turns to stay on task. Sometimes the urge may be overcome by the force of the character's will; at other times, the character has no choice but to follow his instinct (i.e., the character runs out of Willpower points or no longer wishes to expend them).
• A Willpower point may be spent to prevent a derangement from manifesting, with the Storyteller's permission. Eventually, if enough Willpower points are spent (as determined by the Storyteller), the derange- ment may be overcome and eliminated, as enough denial of the derangement remedies the aberration. Malkavians may never overcome their initial derange- ment, though Willpower may be spent to deny it for a short period of time.
• By spending a Willpower point, wound penalties can be ignored for one turn. This allows a character to override pain and injury in order to take one last-ditch action. However, an incapacitated or torpored charac- ter may not spend Willpower in this manner.
By spending a point of Willpower, you can get one automatic success for a single action. You may spend only one Willpower point per turn this way, but you can use several Willpower points to gain successes over the course of an extended action. See Chapter Eight, (p. 389), for details.
When your mage botches a casting roll or faces a Paradox backlash, you can avert the pending backlash by willing it not to happen. This costs a Willpower point and results in the automatic failure of whatever your mage was trying to do at the time. The Paradox doesn't hit you until the end of that scene, and may continue to add up until then. This dodge works only once per casting. See Staving Off Disaster, under The Paradox Effect section in Chapter Ten, (p. 549).
By rolling your Willpower Trait rating, you can help your mage resist the effects of Mind Sphere magick. Successes on that roll subtract from the successes rolled on the Mind attack. The roll's difficulty is usually 6, although a particularly potent or subtle attack might raise that difficulty at the Storyteller's discretion. Botching this roll might end up costing you a permanent Willpower point. Mages and other supernatural creatures get this resistance roll for free, but Sleepers must spend a Willpower point in order to resist Mind magick this way. See Resisting Psychic Assaults in Chapter Ten, (p. 544).
A point of Willpower can also dispel a delusion brought on by Quiet. This requires a successful Willpower roll (difficulty 7, or perhaps higher) as well as that point of Willpower. An unsuccessful roll will spend the Willpower point without holding back the delusions. Success also dispels a single point of Paradox. Essentially, your mage asserts control over the visions in his head... at least for the moment. See Rising Out of Quiet in Chapter Ten, (p. 556).
You can spend a point of Willpower to ignore all wound- based penalties, up to but not including Incapacitation, for one turn per point. Essentially, your mage pushes past the pain to accomplish an action or two before giving in to those injuries. See Health and Injury in Chapter Nine, (pp. 406-409).
On a similar note, you can spend a point of Willpower to resist an overwhelming urge or compulsion – the urge to run, for example, from a furious demigod, or to surrender to sleep after days without rest. If that urge or situation continues, though, you may need to spend more Willpower in order to keep going. And in the face of some awful challenge – say, in order to laugh while under torture – you may need to spend Willpower points even if you, the player, had not planned to do so. It's easy for players to remain blasé about shattering traumas, but for characters, that kind of fortitude is harder to come by and more costly to maintain.
A mortal can spend Willpower in order to get a roll against mental magic; supernaturals get that roll automatically.
But under no circumstances are you allowed to simply ignore an argument by spending Willpower; thats an Exalted 2E thing.
Not allowed in ExWoD.
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I dont know where you get that idea.
I avoid relitigating past votes, whether I like their results or not.
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You'll notice the QM says its as much a socialization thing for them?
When they stopped being college students with free time, they stopped patrolling; some outside the core group even stopped being Alphas altogether. And even when they did, it was a tiny area around the University.
Noone else we've seen does it.
Dresden doesnt; the Cauldron murders wouldnt have been possible if he did. The White Council and White Court dont.
Neither does Marcone. The Red Court didnt when they were still in Chicago.
The Black Court dont. Winter doesnt.
And no, Olivia doesnt do it, at least not yet; she was exploring her new powers(she's had them for maybe a month or so) and figuring out things. Patrols are a very different matter in both commitment and effort.
COMMENTARY
The perpetrator is Christopher Halliwell of Swindon, currently 42, driver of a green Toyota Avensis taxi cab.
The victim in that trunk was Becky Godden-Edwards, 20, sex worker, murdered 2003 after a night out in Swindon.
The body is in a shallow grave in a field in Eastleach, Gloucestershire.
Halliwell may also have murdered Sally Ann John, another sex worker, in 1995, but the Toyota Avensis was only introduced in 1997, so he couldnt have been using this car at the time.
IRL he'd also murder Sian O'Callaghan in 2011, which was the one he was caught at.
Anyway, modern forensics will likely not be able to pull forensics off the trunk after this long.
But cellphone records will probably have location data putting him in the same area as the body, and he may have kept a trophy. He certainly sought medical attention after murdering the lady for a swollen hand; the records exist.
Molly could use the car as a focus to identify every murder he's been involved in, then use the murder victims as foci to identify evidence, write it up and send it in to the local police. Or to the local newspapers.
Or both.
Or Lydia could simply sic a bunch of ghosts on him until he goes to the police.
Or Lash could make him confess.
They arent short on alternatives.
Molly has Craft 4 and a Craft Excellency.
Which also applies to stuff like crafting a disguise. There's absolutely no reason for Tiffany to be recognizable before, during or after this encounter.
Not that it particularly matters; its a mortal serial killer.
Getting him nicked by the cops is more a matter of style points than it is an investment of real effort on our part.
Thirty minutes at most, to ruin this dude's entire life.
Lydia would not do this unless the ghosts asked her to organize them for some reason. Unlike other supernaturals, true higher soul ghosts live a pretty precarious existence. The power they use to make things happen is in direct competition with the power they need to remain stable within the Spirit World, there are ways to replenish them, primarily human emotion and attachment, but they are either slow or unreliable... in the absence of ancestor worship. Lydia feels like it would be lovely if people would just pick up Ancestor Worship again.
Molly has Craft 4 and a Craft Excellency.
Which also applies to stuff like crafting a disguise. There's absolutely no reason for Tiffany to be recognizable before, during or after this encounter.
Molly has Craft 4 and a Craft Excellency.
Which also applies to stuff like crafting a disguise. There's absolutely no reason for Tiffany to be recognizable before, during or after this encounter.
Not that it particularly matters; its a mortal serial killer.
Getting him nicked by the cops is more a matter of style points than it is an investment of real effort on our part.
Thirty minutes at most, to ruin this dude's entire life.
Wouldn't she be at least a witness in the investigation? Thus being required to be in contact with police, possibly testifying at trial? I am not afraid of the involvement right this moment. I am leery of the amount of involvement required later.
Also, if this is a White God test, we should check if there's something biologically wrong with the murderer's brain. Ie if, for example, he's a clinical psychopath, and if Tiffany can heal him, so he can properly feel remorse.
Lydia would not do this unless the ghosts asked her to organize them for some reason. Unlike other supernaturals, true higher soul ghosts live a pretty precarious existence. The power they use to make things happen is in direct competition with the power they need to remain stable within the Spirit World, there are ways to replenish them, primarily human emotion and attachment, but they are either slow or unreliable... in the absence of ancestor worship. Lydia feels like it would be lovely if people would just pick up Ancestor Worship again.
I wonder if we could do something to launder the power from ghost hunter type shows - or just mass media in general- into something more wholesome to redistribute to ghosts that we like. How viable is making a show or commercial designed to provoke a vaguely directed emotional response and then harvesting it to feed spirits? How about songs or sufficiently identifiable internet stuff?
Consequences? I'm sure everyone will accept "powering mega ghosts with memes, music, and daytime TV" calmly and without any concerns about our activities.
