Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

YOU GUYS GAVE HIM TWO!?!?
I voted and argued against it we were totally ripped off and didn't need the help, but I was out voted.
why are you trading them away then? Those bodies are our crafting materials, and a likely higher quality ones than the gauntlets at that.

Because even if we buy the crafting charm right now it is going to take awhile to get though all our materials. Wonder crafting takes time and we have consistently had at least 1 major fight every month.
 
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Because even if we buy the crafting charm right now it is going to take awhile to get though all our materials. Wonder crafting takes time and we have consistently had at least 1 major fight every month.
Honestly from the arguments I've seen along with what we will be capable of with the crafting charm along with Seerer's own abilities, loot from this outing seems pretty mediocre. I guess he could give it to one of his minions? Crown foci seem like the biggest material gain here by a mile.
 
Honestly from the arguments I've seen along with what we will be capable of with the crafting charm along with Seerer's own abilities, loot from this outing seems pretty mediocre. I guess he could give it to one of his minions? Crown foci seem like the biggest material gain here by a mile.
We are an Exalted. I would actually be disappointed if we found a magic item as good as we can craft.
 
Just a thought here, but how viable would making Ortega's head into a curse splendor targeted at her father be?
I cant see why we would want to do this.

He has the resources of a supernatural nation.
Best-case we get several months of tormenting his ass before he builds up some defenses from his own resources and those of the nation he rules. I mean, its not like he isnt capable of sacrificing a person a day for magical protection.

Worst case we drive him to make bargains with some of the really bad shit for protection: Outsiders, demons, Yama Kings all will do deals to get their hooks into such a pawn. Or we force the replacement of the current erratic blood addict who heads the Red Court with someone who is potentially more competent as Red King.

Remember, there's at least thirteen Night Lords right there, whether or not he has any more kids beyond the late Arianna.
The Red Court isnt short of candidates.
 
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I voted and argued against it we were totally ripped off and didn't need the help, but I was out voted.
Good thing too.
We would have suffered significant casualties among our minions if we'd gone there alone.

Yep in exchange for people that did nothing, because Molly was fully capable of and indeed did just kill everyone herself.
This is not true.

@Yog
What if we burned our questions before we gave Seeker the bodies?
I mean, do we want to give him a means to resist Agg?
He has access to the equivalent of high-Rank Garou/Fera Gifts.
He can already soak and parry Agg.
They weren't totally useless one of them saved a hostage, but we certainly didn't need all of them.
Not true.

Shit would have gotten much dicier if we'd had to fight The Will under suppressing fire from the akuma that the Einherjar and Murphy had to take out, or without Gard specifically trying to counter the Will's buffs and counterbuff Molly.
There's a lot of after the fact triumphalism going on here.
 
Now did we kill everybody? Thats a significantly harder question to conclusively answer.
No, it's not. Not if they use those omniscient seers they (the proverbial they, all interested parties) are supposed to have.
@Yog
What if we burned our questions before we gave Seeker the bodies?
I mean, do we want to give him a means to resist Agg?
We don't have essence right now to use all of them.
 
Because even if we buy the crafting charm right now it is going to take awhile to get though all our materials. Wonder crafting takes time and we have consistently had at least 1 major fight every month.
Mediocre reagents in a fridge are still better than a complete item that doesn't even meet that standard.

I cant see why we would want to do this
Depending on what we did and when I think it could have a major impact on the war by inducing greater internal power struggles.

That said I prefer the information game idea to simply cursing him.

We could probably push them to the brink of messy civil war by dialing up the red king's blood senility, but that's a very volatile state to set up compared to giving the white council an information advantage.

Though it's worth noting that the red court being awful is the red king's fault since he was the one who made it in the first place. If we wanted to slap someone around out of spite over it he'd be the person to do it to.
 
Its probably the sort of item we eventually want to be gearing up our own friends with... eventually. Its good, just not the sort of thing that makes or breaks Empires. But its probably something we can eventually make or commission.

And horrible monsters who don't really do cheerful marketplace haggling probably find such things far more rare and precious. If Seeker wants something he pretty much has to kill to get it. The dude isn't getting a sixpack of beer without having to wash bone marrow out of his hair afterward.

Its why it sucks to be the sort of evil that doesn't really respect enlightened self interest. Still a cool dude but, yeah, its why everyone needs to at least learn how to play the game.
 
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The dude isn't getting a sixpack of beer without having to wash bone marrow out of his hair afterward.
At least anywhere that requires ID to buy alcohol anyway. He can shape into a bunch of forms, but having valid ID might be tricky.
___________
Actually how long should it take to craft magic items considering we have 10 times crafting speed?
 
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No, it's not. Not if they use those omniscient seers they (the proverbial they, all interested parties) are supposed to have.
Which they?
Mab or Maeve might well be livestreaming this right now, and will know who lived or died. Some Hells/afterlives will probably have new arrivals to ask what the fuck happened. The Reds? Will also know who should be on the plane.

The greater supernatural public dont know who else is on the plane, let alone who, if any, survived.
They are going to have to exert effort and invest resources to find out.

Now are you willing to pay the price for that information?
Because it generally isnt free; you're spending something, even if its only the seers time, that is still time your information source could be doing any of several other things.

Like @A_Somebody pointed out, you are certainly going to want to expend the resources(seer time and effort, payment for oracular spirits, access to the aircraft wreck, supernatural favors, demon sacrifices et cetera) to determine if Duchess Arianna Ortega, childe of the Red King and senior Red noble is alive or dead and what killed her.

Are you going to do so specifically for the most junior members of her retinue, assuming you even remember who they are?

People dont have unlimited resources. Even the Crown has limits.
Dresden was offered the (alleged) secrets behind how his father and mother died several years ago by a demon information trader.
The price was too high. And a trap

Or to use a mundane example, a medical doctor can go out right now and buy any number of medical textbooks
But if Im an infectious diseases resident, I would be quite unwilling to shell out ~$500 for Fischer's Mastery of Surgery.

Or, if I was an American gun nerd, my interest in weapons doesnt mean I am willing to invest the resources to drop *checks* $90,000 for a civilian M60 machinegun.
Not when I have a mortgage payment.
Depending on what we did and when I think it could have a major impact on the war by inducing greater internal power struggles.

That said I prefer the information game idea to simply cursing him.
We could probably push them to the brink of messy civil war by dialing up the red king's blood senility, but that's a very volatile state to set up compared to giving the white council an information advantage.

Though it's worth noting that the red court being awful is the red king's fault since he was the one who made it in the first place. If we wanted to slap someone around out of spite over it he'd be the person to do it to.
Oh, Im not defending Kukulkan. I just have my doubts about how important this is, both to the Vampire War and Molly personally.
Its not like we have an unlimited amount of crafting time here either, and the Red Court is, surprisingly enough, nowhere near the top of Molly's personal to-do list.

It is kinda amusing to realize that of the villains we've run into, the Red Court only rate around number 3 or 4, behind the Outsiders, the Yama Kings, the Black Council and the Fomor.
 
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At least anywhere that requires ID to buy alcohol anyway. He can shape into a bunch of forms, but having valid ID might be tricky.
One issue is that his forms tend towards the grotesque due to the nature of what he is and the magic he wields. Perhaps he can take a more normal form but its very much trying to shove a blood magic square peg through a round hole.

But that isn't the main problem. Its mostly his mentality. Theoretically he could play nice, figure out workarounds, order his taco platters via door dash... but then he wouldn't be him. The hunt, torture, the tearing of cartilage and looking in someone's eyes right as they realize that surviving their wounds would be a cruelty worse than any death...? These things sing to a true skinwalker.

Its a mentality that fucks him over... if notably less than his victims. Thus his prizes matter more.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Yzarc on Sep 23, 2023 at 12:34 AM, finished with 123 posts and 20 votes.
 
Mab or Maeve might well be livestreaming this right now, and will know who lived or died.
That is, at best, arguable, given Mab's level of knowledge in canon (if she had that level of information gathering, she would have known about Maeve far quicker, if nothing else, and also would have known about Dresden's suicide scheme).

Anyway, the treasure is, if not useless to us, then not optimized at all. We can afford to give it away. Question is - what kind of secret should we pry from it. I am content with "where can we find lore used to make it?", but maybe someone has a better idea?
 
Anyway, the treasure is, if not useless to us, then not optimized at all.
I mean considering just how much effort most things have to go through to block agg attacks usually needing level 6 disciplines it is a fairly powerful treasure. Just about any ghoul, vampire or other combat monster would love to have it and consider it worth it's weight in gold. Consider that a fey might become able to block iron weapons with their bare hands.

But for us that's cheap.
 
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That is, at best, arguable, given Mab's level of knowledge in canon (if she had that level of information gathering, she would have known about Maeve far quicker, if nothing else, and also would have known about Dresden's suicide scheme).

Anyway, the treasure is, if not useless to us, then not optimized at all. We can afford to give it away. Question is - what kind of secret should we pry from it. I am content with "where can we find lore used to make it?", but maybe someone has a better idea?
1) Mab canonically knew about Marcone's kidnapping in Small Favor before Dresden did, and Dresden was in the same city; she was literally livestreaming part of his flight, and showed a recording to Dresden afterwards.
She's not perfect, but she's alarmingly well informed.

2) We literally sent a letter to Maeve via our Malk neighbors telling Winter to keep an eye out for a high Red noble who might try to flee across Faerie in Mexico.
I'd put money on at least Maeve livestreaming this shit right now; Mab might be busy.

3) Clippy has video of the bracelets.
That serves as a focus if we need to follow up. I cant currently think of any question worth asking right now.
 
OOC: You guys might also what to start brainstorming what to do next since you have quite a bit to juggle between the humans, the prisoners and the plane itself.
  • Redirect the plane for the nearest coastline
  • Loot the plane of everything of interest: Papers, briefcases, luggage, laptop computers, potential foci, bodies. Bag and tag.
  • Bind and grapple all PoWs and evacuees, shift them to the Brass Courts for 2m, and return to the plane
  • Have Wings fry the flight recorders, then crash the plane in deep water, burning out the electronics as it does so
  • Then head home by RVD

Preferably Seeker will be gone by the time we start moving people
 
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