BoredMan
It seems there was some brain damage after all
I am well aware lol.
It's almost as bad as revealing the Crown so no. Prophetic powers in this setting aren't anywhere near as exact and leverageable as NWS.
Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)
- Thread starter DragonParadox
- Start date
- Crossover Fantasy
[X] Lie, your reputation precedes you (Manipulation+Subterfuge)
-[X] Stunt: You tilt your head in a manner that signals 'walk with me' as you begin your explanation, "Ever heard of divination? The psychometry to grab a name from your history isn't that difficult. Not a true name of course, those have built-in metaphysical defenses, but something close enough to make you hesitate is simplicity itself. I'm sure there are those in your organization that can do similar, given its continued survival," you pause, kicking the floor a bit as you look around, "now, a question of my own: Where is the bathroom? I wasn't lying about needing it."
Technically nothing said there is false. Divination can be used to steal knowledge like that, and it's not that difficult. Molly just doesn't know it.
-[X] Stunt: You tilt your head in a manner that signals 'walk with me' as you begin your explanation, "Ever heard of divination? The psychometry to grab a name from your history isn't that difficult. Not a true name of course, those have built-in metaphysical defenses, but something close enough to make you hesitate is simplicity itself. I'm sure there are those in your organization that can do similar, given its continued survival," you pause, kicking the floor a bit as you look around, "now, a question of my own: Where is the bathroom? I wasn't lying about needing it."
Technically nothing said there is false. Divination can be used to steal knowledge like that, and it's not that difficult. Molly just doesn't know it.
Just dont answer.So Dispersal is only good for fast travel not stealth for anyone who may be looking. GTK we are even less sneaky than we thought.
@uju32 Not calling you out here but since it was your idea to call her by name I hope you have a plan to dodge or answer the question of where it came from.
I mean, she doesnt genuinely expect Molly to reveal an intelligence source.
She might wish it, but not expect it, just like we didnt ask Lara about how she found out about Molly's meeting with Mab, or the Merlin about how he knew that Molly opened a gate in Chicago.
But since she shared some information, we share some back. Show of good faith. Or bargaining.
I mean, she's apparently a senior operative. That makes her senior enough, and with a long enough career that a lot of people will know who she is. Martin was canonically on the FBI watchlist of international terrorists; I suspect that someone this senior will be on several watchlists herself, especially if she's going into the field
A bald, slightly overweight bum in a shabby overcoat and cast-off clothing shambled down the sidewalk with vacant eyes—but he was moving a little too purposefully toward us to be genuine. I was watching his hands with my shield bracelet ready to go, expecting him to pull a weapon out from beneath the big coat, and it wasn't until he was a few steps away that I realized it was Martin.
He stopped on the sidewalk next to the passenger window of the van and wobbled in place. He rapped on the glass and held out his hand as if begging a handout. I rolled down the window and asked him, "What happened?"
"The FBI did its legwork," he said. "They tracked our rental car back to my cover ID, got my picture, put it on TV. One of the detectives we shook down confirmed my presence and told them I'd been seen at your place, and they were waiting there when we came back to get you. Susan created a distraction so that I could get away."
"And you left her behind, huh?"
He shrugged. "Her identity is genuine, and while they know she arrived with me and was seen with me, they can't prove that she's done anything. I've been operating long enough that the Red Court has seen to it that I'm on multiple international lists of wanted terrorists. If I were caught, both of us would have been taken."
I grunted. "What did you find out?"
"The last of the Red King's inner circle arrived this morning. They'll do the ceremony tonight," he said. "Midnight, or a little after, if our astronomer's assessment is solid."
"Crap."
Martin nodded. "How fast can you get us there?"
I touched a fingertip to my mother's gem and double-checked the way there. "This one doesn't have a direct route. Three hops, a couple of walks, one of them in bad terrain. Should take us ninety minutes, gets us to within five miles of Chichén Itzá."
He stopped on the sidewalk next to the passenger window of the van and wobbled in place. He rapped on the glass and held out his hand as if begging a handout. I rolled down the window and asked him, "What happened?"
"The FBI did its legwork," he said. "They tracked our rental car back to my cover ID, got my picture, put it on TV. One of the detectives we shook down confirmed my presence and told them I'd been seen at your place, and they were waiting there when we came back to get you. Susan created a distraction so that I could get away."
"And you left her behind, huh?"
He shrugged. "Her identity is genuine, and while they know she arrived with me and was seen with me, they can't prove that she's done anything. I've been operating long enough that the Red Court has seen to it that I'm on multiple international lists of wanted terrorists. If I were caught, both of us would have been taken."
I grunted. "What did you find out?"
"The last of the Red King's inner circle arrived this morning. They'll do the ceremony tonight," he said. "Midnight, or a little after, if our astronomer's assessment is solid."
"Crap."
Martin nodded. "How fast can you get us there?"
I touched a fingertip to my mother's gem and double-checked the way there. "This one doesn't have a direct route. Three hops, a couple of walks, one of them in bad terrain. Should take us ninety minutes, gets us to within five miles of Chichén Itzá."
VOTE
[X] Plan Deflection
-[X]Decline to answer that question
-[X]Offer in return, a warning that they keep their heads down, and a contact address
-[X]STUNT: In response you smile and shake your head. "I cant possibly answer that. And if you are right" she tenses as you reach into your backpack, only to relax as you withdraw a notepad and pen "you probably dont want to be standing next to me in a Mexican airport when the Reds come looking." You finish scribbling an email address on the notepad, then hand it out. "My apologies to your medium for the ruckus. You may be assured that my business in Mexico is not directed at your association, or indeed the civilians of this nation. Beyond that, well," an expressive shrug "Security." You pause as if it just occurred to you. "Your organization might want to keep their heads down for the next couple weeks though. You'll know why by morning."
Like I said, she's been Fellowship long enough to become a captain in the organization.
She's not a secret. Her identity is not a secret.
Thats not how this shit works.
It would be like Morgan or Luccio asking us how we know who they are after they had a whole career of serving the White Council in public positions.
They know something or someone is in-country. They dont know who or what or what its aimed at.
And they also have to account for the presence and activity of their Night Lords, and any other powerful elders. Or even if any of their sorcerers had a summoning ritual go wrong, or horribly right.
They'll figure it out, just not tonight.
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And when she doesn't buy that, because you knowing her is at the very least problematic for her organization, and they were prepared to attempt assassination of a lord of the outer night in a public place?
This is absolutely how this shit works in what's essentially a guerilla resistance group. You don't operate in an enemy territory (and this is enemy territory) for a long time if you are recognizable on sight. And you definitely don't enter an enemy-controlled airport when you are a known terrorist. Osama bin Laden didn't travel by commercial air after 9/11. Rememeber, from the perspective of Red Court, she's a terrorist. And this means that she's one from the perspective of organizations and governments they control.
[X] Lie, your reputation precedes you (Manipulation+Subterfuge)
-[X] Stunt: You tilt your head in a manner that signals 'walk with me' as you begin your explanation, "Ever heard of divination? The psychometry to grab a name from your history isn't that difficult. Not a true name of course, those have built-in metaphysical defenses, but something close enough to make you hesitate is simplicity itself. I'm sure there are those in your organization that can do similar, given its continued survival," you pause, kicking the floor a bit as you look around, "now, a question of my own: Where is the bathroom? I wasn't lying about needing it."
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BoredMan
It seems there was some brain damage after all
[X] Plan Deflection
If she's a known terrorist then us knowing her name isn't that odd.
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No they don't. I didn't just call them out at leave it, I addressed pretty much all of them and the flaws in their support for your point.
The first one isn't even a prophecy; it's a guy with artificial wizard sight, which doesn't look into the future, seeing Outsider nonsense hanging off Dresden like a shroud and ranting about how they'll kill him.
That's prophecy in the same way remarking that a guy standing in front of a wanted poster with his face on it is in trouble with the law is.
My vote told them to use holy items, not their magic hand grenades. A basic symbol is a better test for reds than anything else regardless, because it affects all of them.
While annoying, it's kind of funny that what appears to be our noisiest charm is technically supposed to be used to hide.
This seems like something we need ATP to hide more than BMI. The latter is a disguise charm for seeming like a human, I'd be surprised if it applied while we're larping as an entire ocean.
With a good enough roll it becomes nearly impossible to notice Molly unless you're actively using perfect mental defenses, and those are very rare.
How magical the test would have been is unknown; you can drive off reds with a regular cross if you've got the faith after all.
As to the other bit, it's worth remembering that the aura isn't exactly a neutral little quirk we picked up somewhere. Typically you get something like that by being a heavy duty monster for a very long time.
I don't like tripping Godwin's law, but I think a good translation to mundane sensibilities is something like a 6'8" guy who dresses like a biker and has vaguely neo-nazi adjacent tattoos. For the purpose of this example there's an innocent explanation and the person in question can't do anything about it (though I strongly doubt any such situation can exist in real life), but that's still what they look like.
Is it arguably unfair for people to judge that guy so quickly? Perhaps. That doesn't change the fact that anyone who sees them is going to be at least a little concerned, especially if they live in an area where people awfully similar to that happen to be actively terrorizing the local population.
Needing to explain themselves is a fact of life for that guy, and we're pretty much in the same boat.
We were one success from a gun fight that would have blown this whole operation, and have to duck around pointlessly flaunting the crown.
I wouldn't actually call this a major win.
The taboo thing doesn't do that, it punishes them for trying to communicate.
That doesn't stop them from knowing or reacting, and all the spooky things in a major body of water fleeing on dead silence is a sign of its own.
ATP is closer to what you're looking for.
She's a member of a very covert organization and probably pretty old besides though.
She's a known factor, but we asked for her name and not what she goes by. It's entirely possible that she hasn't been called by her real identity in decades, and that knowing it isn't useful enough at this point to be worth the trouble.
Which makes it a curious thing for us to know; in a way screwy magic powers make more sense than a profile going that deep for enough the their leadership that Molly can just rattle off their original names.
Edit: typo.
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fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
We have multiple charms that work on taboo. NSS (9 Xp favored) makes an event a taboo stopping people from taking about it.
Anonymity Through Propriety (••) (8 Xp unfavored) makes people unable to notice or acknowledge us personally.
Like I pointed out?
A fair number of them are straight up on international terrorist lists. Martin is on their inner council, and is canonically was being hunted by the FBI in Changes.
This isnt a new situation.
This is absolutely not true.
IRL the Taliban had known operatives in Afghanistan while the US was there, and the same was true in Iraq. Back in the 1980s and 1990s Carlos the Jackal moved internationally just fine.
In the canon Dresden Files, Martin operated in Mexico for more than a century and half after apparently defecting to the Fellowship, and the Red Court knew who he was on sight, to the point of putting him on international terrorist watch lists.
They also knew who Susan Rodriguez was as well, and knew she was a half-Red; Paolo Ortega told Dresden this in Death Masks.
Every single Red Court dhampir that exists was deliberately created by a Red Court vampire.
This isnt a happenstance situation; the sire has to deliberately infect a victim, then wait for them to kill someone else and Change.
They know who a lot of these people are from the beginning. They are generally pre-selected.
They just cant localize them because the Fellowship has support and bolt houses outside Latin America.
Not because they dont know their original face or name.
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ATP stops them from noticing in the first place rather than forcing people to act like they haven't seen her, so I wouldn't really call it a taboo charm. Fair enough if that's what you meant though.
That does not have to the true technically, one could kidnap a vampire and bleed them to infect other humans with their blood. Now has anyone in the Fellowship ever done thing? Molly feels it is unlikely given their internal culture, as she understands it, but it is only internal culture not metaphysics, far stranger things have happened
fictionfan
Please sir, may I have some Meows?
- Location
- Tempe, AZ
Mostly basing it on the name. Also it does more then making people not notice us. They actively avoid interfering in our affairs. An invisible charm has problems walking though a crowd, but Anonymity Through Propriety has the crowd part before us well everyone carefully ignores and quickly forgets the elephant in the room. Not a "Not my problem" field, but more like being a member of the secret police in an especially oppression country. So I guess a "Hopefully not my problem" field where they are willing make sacrifices to avoid it being their problem.
At least that is the impression I get.
The Infernal wraps herself in a mantle of Essence which devours the attention of the weak-willed, making it feel like an impossible burden to notice the Exalted or interfere in her affairs.
System: Spend 1 Essence and roll Charisma + Etiquette against difficulty 4. Anyone whose Willpower rating is equal to or lower than the resulting successes cannot notice or acknowledge the Infernal unless she directly interacts or interferes with them. If she's taking some indirect action that would distress a character were he to acknowledge it (such as reading his diary or murdering his spouse), and that character has Willpower 5+, they can spend a point of Willpower and make a Willpower roll against difficulty 7 to attempt to acknowledge and confront the Infernal. This Charm lasts for one scene.
System: Spend 1 Essence and roll Charisma + Etiquette against difficulty 4. Anyone whose Willpower rating is equal to or lower than the resulting successes cannot notice or acknowledge the Infernal unless she directly interacts or interferes with them. If she's taking some indirect action that would distress a character were he to acknowledge it (such as reading his diary or murdering his spouse), and that character has Willpower 5+, they can spend a point of Willpower and make a Willpower roll against difficulty 7 to attempt to acknowledge and confront the Infernal. This Charm lasts for one scene.
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A red knowing and the red court as an entity knowing aren't necessarily the same thing.
They're more organized than the white court, but there's a lot of them and they're all over the place. They also have a significant contingent of variably rational people in their community, even discounting the ones that are legitimately feral.
given how they go through fodder I'd be surprised if they bothered with some sort of registration program.
Knowing her real name, instead of an alias, and knowing it on sight is odd.
We are currently in an airport. If she was a terrorist known with this face and name, she wouldn't be here.
As you keep pointing out, this isn't 1980s and 1990s. This is post-9/11 2006, in Mexico, which is close to USA. If she was a known terrorist (known by this name and/or face), she wouldn't be here.
No, spooking a fanatic terrorist leader in a middle of an airport with their real name by recognizing them on sight and then just trying to buldoze over it is just asking for them to start shooting.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[x] uju32
I like this plan.
I like this plan.
[X] Yog
1)No evidence of Outsider nonsense hanging off Dresden.
We've seen spirits literally sense black magic from his childhood in his aura, but make no comment of Outsider anything.
2)Literally the same series of posts points out that mature wizard Sight includes precog.
Luccio outright states it in Small Favor.
1)Your vote told them to use holy items whose provenance, or effect on Infernals is unknown.
And it assumes they were carrying holy items, instead of, say, magic ones.
2) No it isnt.
Symbols canonically dont necessarily work on Reds.
I provided a citation previously with regards to Susan at Bianca's ball.
Vindication about Molly's magic signature being a security risk.
And about Molly having been tracked since she entered the country of Mexico.
I think that was pretty clearly demonstrated.
1)Pretty old looking just means that she was infected when she was around that chronological age.
Martin is more than two hundred and twenty years old, and he looks like a young man.
Her accent appears to suggests she's significantly younger than he is.
2) See how Red Court vampires are made. The victims are pre-selected by whoever it is that is making them. Its not like some werewolf myths where you become a werewolf because you were bitten.
The older ones do use false identities, but I dont think any half-Red is under the impression their original identities arent known.
3) Curious? She's was literally telling Molly thirty seconds ago that spirits detected her entering the country.
And that they were able to track her across hundreds of kilometers.
With magic.
Note that she didnt tell Molly how they tracked her from Mexico City to Leon.
We have seen a Red Court seethe operate in Storm Front and Grave Peril, and they generally dont appear to be anywhere as free wheeling about reproduction as you suggest.
Nor are they loners; thats more a Black Court thing.
Furthermore, as demonstrated, Red Court dhampirs are a danger to their sires and the rest of the vampire community if Turned against their will. Not that it doesnt happen, because it obviously does, but there's both self-regulation and community-regulation against unplanned parenthood
Bloodslaves arent a factor.
Vampires that arent rational enough to maintain a fleshmask arent likely to have the premeditation or control to sire offspring, as opposed to tearing the poor dude apart.
Remember that making a new Red is a two-stage process.
The candidate has to first be infested, then kill some poor mortal by draining their blood. You arent picking randos off the street, even for fodder.
That is fair.
And your bringing this up now makes me suspicious that we are going to find some sorcerer using a captive Rampire to create abominations against nature with or without Red Court approval
We see Martin fly in and out of the US on international flights in the setting, and apparently that face was on watchlists.
Dont know how it was done in the books; it was never addressed.
1)Again, not actually true.
She's in the outer part of the airport same as we are. She's not trying to board a plane, she hasnt even passed any of the security checkpoints to get anywhere near where passenger boarding happens.
2) She spooked us, not the other way around.
3)Yes, this is post-9/11 Mexico.
Where RL drug cartel bosses like El Chapo can essentially have their own luxury suite in prison when captured, and have most of the staff on their personal payroll, with their own food menu, cellphone and visits from sex workers.
Where he could decide to leave in 2001, get escorted out by prison guards who turned off the cameras, and stay out until 2014 even in the face of a US-assisted manhunt. No magic, just money and loyalty.
Between the drug cartels and the bona fide Red Court vampires and vampire minions who have wormed themselves into positions of authority, security here is less....secure than it would normally be. By design.
Its not the US, even if it shares a border.
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1) he's a starborn who directly fought major walker of the outside. That's the sort of thing that leaves a mark.
2) fair enough, but I still wouldn't call this particularly prophetic.
1) Unless they brought the equivalent of enchanted items they should roughly be the same. The mechanical backend doesn't support your doom saying here.
2) They work if you have faith in them, and these guys live to fight reds, I think we can trust they aren't going to screw this up.
We've known it was a security risk since the beginning, and it being the specific mechanism wasn't something anyone here anticipated. Your last proposal was a network of minor practitioners divining our future.
1) This was the age I meant. It seems reasonably likely that she's old enough that even if she was inclined to use her original ID she can't pull it off anymore.
2) I'm familiar, but they still use their fledglings as disposable shock troops. Preselected and managed by the one who turned them doesn't imply that their boss's boss is going to track the faceless goons.
Someone killing the boss while they're still in the turning process would be enough to turn a pack of red court recruits into St. Giles members.
3) Curious in a why would you bother sense. That sort of information is a lot more involved to acquire with typical DF mortal magic. Not impossible, but there's a reason they typically trade with demons for this sort of stuff. It implies significant digging in a way the more typical magical Star Trek sensors don't.
taovkool
Forever Gone
- Location
- The Library, Department of General Works
[X] Lie, your reputation precedes you (Manipulation+Subterfuge)
-[X] Stunt: You tilt your head in a manner that signals 'walk with me' as you begin your explanation, "Ever heard of divination? The psychometry to grab a name from your history isn't that difficult. Not a true name of course, those have built-in metaphysical defenses, but something close enough to make you hesitate is simplicity itself. I'm sure there are those in your organization that can do similar, given its continued survival," you pause, kicking the floor a bit as you look around, "now, a question of my own: Where is the bathroom? I wasn't lying about needing it."
-[X] Stunt: You tilt your head in a manner that signals 'walk with me' as you begin your explanation, "Ever heard of divination? The psychometry to grab a name from your history isn't that difficult. Not a true name of course, those have built-in metaphysical defenses, but something close enough to make you hesitate is simplicity itself. I'm sure there are those in your organization that can do similar, given its continued survival," you pause, kicking the floor a bit as you look around, "now, a question of my own: Where is the bathroom? I wasn't lying about needing it."
With MiS, we could do that ourself with no (mechanical) downside.
1)He fought a single major Walker; that would leave a mark.
But the Three Eye junkie explicitly was talking about more than one, and future events instead of simply past ones.
Thats not reading something that happened, thats predicting what will.
2)Agree to disagree.
1)The holy symbols we have seen onscreen (cross, pentacle)are nonspecific.
They will similarly repel Blampires and, when sufficiently empowered, Rampires. But they do nothing to Whampires or Denarians.
I do not see the Fellowship relying on items that may or may not work depending on the person wielding them and their level of faith that day.
2) Susan tells us in Changes that the only response to an Ick demon (she calls it a devourer) is to run and hope you outrun it.
The interrogation room didn't have any windows, and it was completely dark inside. Tilly appeared in the doorway, holding up a hand to shield his eyes. "Dresden?"
"Yeah, obviously," I said. "Susan?"
"I'm here," she said from the darkness, her voice shaking with fear. "I'm cuffed to the chair. Harry, we've got to go."
"Working on it," I said quietly.
"You don't understand. That thing, that drumming sound. It's a devourer. You don't fight them. You run, and pray someone slower than you attracts its attention."
"Yeah, obviously," I said. "Susan?"
"I'm here," she said from the darkness, her voice shaking with fear. "I'm cuffed to the chair. Harry, we've got to go."
"Working on it," I said quietly.
"You don't understand. That thing, that drumming sound. It's a devourer. You don't fight them. You run, and pray someone slower than you attracts its attention."
So either they dont have enough faith to empower the crucifixes and native religious symbols that are commonplace in Mexico.
Or that is explicit IC demonstration that Red Court-aligned entities arent necessarily sensitive to holy anything.
1)I have spent time here arguing with Yog about it being a potential issue.
So I think its worth pointing out. Also a little celebration at having guessed right.
2)You are definitely misremembering. I specifically said yesterday, in response to you:
But this brings us to a second point. The Fellowship lady says, and I quote:
For reference, the Lerma River alone is 750km long. The Rio Grande de Santiago is 433km.
Thats over 1100km of river length.
A third of the Mexico-US border.
They had enough magically talented people to both cover that eleven hundred kilometer track AND pick up our track.
And since we only came to Mexico around 5pm, they managed to do this in less than two hours.
Thats a network.
1)I know quite a few countries, especially in the developing world, where that wouldnt be an issue.
Even in the Carribean; lady appears to have an American accent and name, but would pass as a Jamaican quite easily.
But I'll concede.
2) I dont remember its being explicitly stated in the books, but the RPG appears to be clear that are clear that not all Reds can make new Reds. You need to be either yay old or invested with power/authority to do so iirc; hence Paolo Ortega being present at Bianca's ball, as being someone with the age/power to invest it in her, and because she was of his bloodline.
Regardless? The only Red Court operations we get a good look at are surprisingly well organized.
None of these are single man operations, and they are hardly short of minions to the scut work on this.
I actually expect keeping track and reporting upstream is a requirement, at least in the modern day.
3)I dont agree. Dresden does not appear to have had all that much issue identifying anyone whose face he's gotten a clear look at since at least the second book. Thats presumably why Cowl and Kumori have gone to such lengths to obscure their faces in Dead Beat, and why Vittorio Malvora did much the same thing in White Night.
And when the Grey Council come to Chitchen Itza, they cover their faces as well.
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