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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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DragonParadox said:
I mean think about how the mechanics work. You made the Black Feast, an obscure necromantic ritual that imitates whatever horror animates the Black Court go from 5 successes to 15, you made it twice again as effective than Arawn could using the remains of Katrina's prep. Freaking out is warranted... as is the notion that this is valuable and important
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Hmm. We definitely want the remnants then.
If we can figure out the relationship to the Black Court's rituals, we can figure out how to turn their own animating power against them when we inevitably run into a scourge of Blampires.

Or maybe how to fix Renfields.
JayTar said:
Lydia is already going to be getting whatever her dad left for her. She doesn't need this, and we can use it very very well.
Can I also suggest we use the sub as a focus to find something out about Evil Bob? Like what his plans are, his knowledge of the Thule society or his name?
[X] Write-in: Use Crown of Eyes on the sub to find out what Evil Bob's plans are.
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1)We dont know what her Dad left her. If it was stuff she can wear day to day, he would have already given it to her.
So its probably armor she cant wear day to day.

2)Evil Bob is not an immediate priority. When he is, we'll learn the appropriate spell and summon him.
bengalqueen said:
We can do just as well just as easily with another Excellency, and without invoking the name of a Neverborn. Also more relevant to stuff we're likely to do in the future.
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Black Feast shit is not stuff we can do with another Excellency.
And figuring out what makes Black Court vampires tick is well worth knowing in its own right, as does knowing how to disrupt this Black Feast thing if anyone else tries it.

Current Tally:
Adhoc vote count started by uju32 on Oct 18, 2022 at 4:07 PM, finished with 77 posts and 23 votes.
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[X] Snap a picture of the circle before Harry melts it
[X] Leave them for the others
[X] Write-in: Crown of Eyes to ask what Mab knows about our Exaltation. Focus is museum door she passed through.

uju32 said:
Budget of 30XP?
Off the top of my head, I would go:

  1. Rage Recast Flight: 6XP
  2. 1x Ox Body: 3XP
  3. Viridian Legend Exoskeleton: 6XP
  4. Allies/Followers 2(Cyberdevils): 6XP
  5. Demonic Primacy of Essence: 4XP
  6. Naked Wicked Souls: 3XP
  7. Etiquette 3: 2XP
Total 30XP

-Flight because it allows us to negate terrain obstacles and to run away if necessary.
-Ox-Body for additional HP.
-Viridian Legend Exoskeleton gives us +4 Soak when activated.
-Allies/Followers 2 gives us Cyberdevils who can hack, greatly improving our ability to acquire information. Everything from personal emails to checking if a person has a criminal record or outstanding warrant. Maybe even fucking with their bank accounts.
Essential for keeping an eye on the Daedalus people and Chicago PD. Or on Lydia's lawyer. Secrets = Essence regen.
-Demonic Primacy of Essence for negotiating with or intimidating lesser creatures of darkness
-Naked Wicked Souls for vetting people or interrogating them. Also, uncovering secrets gives us Essence regen.
-Etiquette 3 improves our ability to navigate formal negotiations
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I would totally support this plan if you trade Naked Wicked Souls for MiS or FSB, as there's a group of Wampires near our future Dragon's Nest and I really want to make them our servants. Not to mention the opportunity to have new servants, we're also going to be helping the needy, isn't that great?

Naked Wicked Souls is good but I think it's better to choose one of the other two to take advantage of and get faster minions, after all they, like Cyber-devil Allies, are best achieved the fastest to have maximum effect.

Every future plan that has Demonic Primacy of Essence and MiS or FSB will have my vote.
 
uju32 said:
1)We dont know what her Dad left her. If it was stuff she can wear day to day, he would have already given it to her.
So its probably armor she cant wear day to day.

2)Evil Bob is not an immediate priority. When he is, we'll learn the appropriate spell and summon him.
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1) We don't know that. He specifically said:
DragonParadox said:
There is a chest under my desk that has some gifts for you so that you do not have to go into battle in borrowed chainmail, but more importantly you will find my will, go to Signore Rici and give him the letter on top, he will know what to do with it. Emancipation... ah," he sighs. "I wish we had more time, but as a man more skilled in the leading of armies than empire once said ask me for anything but time. I wish we did not have to do this at all, but most of all in the United States. If the process falls through vanish, fall off the grid until you are eighteen. It will be hard and uncomfortable, but the risk of an enemy, someone who wishes you ill, obtaining custody is far too great."
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If it's something she can wear day to day or not? *Shrug*. I don't think it really matters. If we think she really needs something like that we can make it for her. But right now we know that she is going to be getting some neat stuff in the near future so trying to plan what equipment she needs most now seems foolish.

Also from what I'm hearing the jacket will work really well with our build. We aren't going to be getting a perfect defense soon so getting something that would save us in the case of a bad soak sounds very good.

2) We don't know that either. Knowing his plans would be able to tell us if he is going to be a problem soon or not. And leaving stuff until it is an "immediate priority" is a good way to get surprised at a bad time.
Also if we plan to be using sorcery to summon him then shouldn't we be getting his name now? Either way we should use the chance to use the sub as a focus.
 
Yog said:
So, I'd like to point this out: Mab has 20 dice when doing her best in social combat. Probably more due to UMI, but we negated that. And she is rolling against difficulty 6. Seeing how terrifying she is, and she is indeed nightmare-worthy, let's consider what a social-oriented exalt at essence 5 would be, at least when dealing with her own subjects in her kingdom.

5+5 attribute and ability + excellency. This puts us at 20 dice. Add Without Honor Without Hope. That's 22 dice. Add Boiling Sea Mastery and Demonic Primacy of Essence. That's -3 dfficulty, with the maximum difficulty being 9 to start with. That's difficulty 6. Now, assume shintai form is being used, and Crowned with Fury is selected as signature charm. That adds 5 to all social rollls. Meaning that the Exalt is rolling 22 auto successes. For spite's sake add Soul Rendering Practice at, what I'll assume is 8 banked successes, leaving the exalt at 30 successes.

Yeesh... That's a lot. Elder Exalts are terrifying.
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We can hit high enough to match 20 dice a lot sooner than that. Etiquette up to 5 for 9 XP, Charisma up to 4 for 12 XP, and then we roll 18 dice with Excellency for only 21 XP. Stunt gives +2 dice, and Mab's aura is cold enough for WHWH to give us another 2 dice, so we can roll 22 dice total at that point, more than Mab.

Difficulty reducers are another problem. I don't think Demonic Primacy of Essence works on Mab, since she might not count as a Creature of Darkness, and seems like she's on the same level as a Yama King at least, which are specifically called out in the charm description as being too powerful to affect. Generally, being in a better bargaining position gives a lower difficulty to social rolls, so that's something to aim for. Sapphire Circle Exorcism is probably our best bet here, considering how long it took Mab to clean out Nemesis infection from her subordinates in canon, and that we can do it in an hour. Add in learning the Sight from Harry for detecting Nemesis while protected from consequences by IPM, and we have an invaluable service to offer Winter.

Overall, I think we stand a good chance at actually winning social combat with Mab in 3 months, instead of just not being bowled over like now.
 
DragonParadox said:
Lydia is an exigent, she is Exalted-light mechanically, roughly no par with an E1 Dragon Blood
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I mean, an Exalted is an Exalted is an Exalted. Even a lower tier Exigent or Dragonblooded.

And that means that we've potentially found our first Circle member. Sure they won't be as good at whatever their specialism ends up being as us - but they'll be good enough, and it's a specialism we don't need to fill.
 
Azais said:
I would totally support this plan if you trade Naked Wicked Souls for MiS or FSB, as there's a group of Wampires near our future Dragon's Nest and I really want to make them our servants. Not to mention the opportunity to have new servants, we're also going to be helping the needy, isn't that great?

Naked Wicked Souls is good but I think it's better to choose one of the other two to take advantage of and get faster minions, after all they, like Cyber-devil Allies, are best achieved the fastest to have maximum effect.
Every future plan that has Demonic Primacy of Essence and MiS or FSB will have my vote.
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Cost means it doesnt fit. We cannot afford them without having to drop other stuff.

Naked Wicked Souls is a favored 1 dot charm. 3XP.
Mercy in Servitude is an unfavored 1-dot charm. 4XP.
False Springs Beckons is a favored 3 dot charm. 9XP.

If we try to swap out Naked Wicked Souls, we need to find an extra 1XP for MiS or extra 6XP for FSB.
The opportunity cost means its not feasible this turn.
JayTar said:
1) We don't know that. He specifically said:

If it's something she can wear day to day or not? *Shrug*. I don't think it really matters. If we think she really needs something like that we can make it for her. But right now we know that she is going to be getting some neat stuff in the near future so trying to plan what equipment she needs most now seems foolish.

Also from what I'm hearing the jacket will work really well with our build. We aren't going to be getting a perfect defense soon so getting something that would save us in the case of a bad soak sounds very good.

2) We don't know that either. Knowing his plans would be able to tell us if he is going to be a problem soon or not. And leaving stuff until it is an "immediate priority" is a good way to get surprised at a bad time.
Also if we plan to be using sorcery to summon him then shouldn't we be getting his name now? Either way we should use the chance to use the sub as a focus.
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1)Like the citation said? Its wargear.
Its not stuff for day to day wear. And in the Dresdenverse milieu, a lot of combat does not give you time to go home and get kitted out. Thats why Dresden has an enchanted trenchcoat.

So for Lydia, something she can wear day to day with the rest of her clothes matters.
Molly already has chainmail that she can wear under her clothes comfortably, and is getting an armor charm, is training an additional soak technique, and can make an armored jacket if she wants.

2)EvilBob has been free for at least ten months already, since when Bob cut him loose after the Darkhallow.
He needs TIME to get up to additional mischief, and a sponsor, because he's a spirit.
And we just killed his previous crew.

3)We know his Name. Its EvilBob. He's born of Bob, the one in Dresden's basement.
We can confirm by literally walking over and asking Mathews, who spent several hours with him here as he wedged himself inside the submarine.
 
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Yog said:
So, I'd like to point this out
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Demonic Primacy of Essence does not proc on Mab. She is too strong. Anything at or above 4th gen Vamp level doesn't fall under DPE as of right now.

That aside, yes, there is a lot of space to supercharge Molly's social. Key and The Kingdom signature effect adds another -1 difficulty reduction. One of the Burrowing Maggots charms adds another -1.

There are also charms that do the opposite of that to the enemies; as I mentioned, DC adjusters can make things very silly. Somebody who rolls 20 dice with DC 9 only gets 2.5 sux average.

None of this is also holds a candle to elder celestial exalts, but that is just not relevant right now, so I am going to go do in depth about it.
 
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uju32 said:
Uriel cant? Or wont?
Can I get a citation for the claim? I would love to see the exact phrasing used.
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From the YouTube transcript notes you posted a few pages back:

uju32 said:
-Uriel might not have known about Justine being infected in Ghost Story, stuff from the outside can't really be detected with magic.
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It's not explicit, but I took Uriel not knowing and outsiders being difficult/impossible to detect with magic as connected items.

It's not like he owes those guys anything, if nemesis isn't in a mortal he's probably be allowed to press the smite button.
 
Here is my proposal for the xp turn.

[] Plan Combat and social
-[] Lanka Charm: By Rage Recast (••): Gives you access to another Shintai Aspect in your human form 6 XP
--[] Flight
-[] Lanka Charm: Scar-Writ Saga Shield (•): Permanently lowers the difficulty of all soak rolls by one. 3XP
-[] Lanka Charm: Ox-Body Technique (•): Permanently gains two Wounded (–2), one Mauled (–2), and one Crippled (–5) health levels. 3 XP
-[] Lanka Charm: Viridian Legend Exoskeleton (••): Adds the highest of her Strength, Stamina, or Charisma to her soak rolls for the rest of the scene, but raises the difficulty of all Stealth attempts by +1. 6 XP
-[] The Hell of Burrowing Maggots Charm: Mercy in Servitude (•): Our minions no longer suffer torment while serving our will. 4 XP
-[] The Hell of Burrowing Maggots Charm: Demonic Primacy of Essence (•): Lesser Creatures of Darkness recognize your dread majesty making it easier to sway them. All social rolls with such beings reduced by 2. 4 XP
-[] Kakuri Charm: Naked Wicked Souls (•) Find out what deed the target is most ashamed of with more being revealed depending on degrees of success – 3xp

So 29 xp and gives us a good way to get minions and a social ability when dealing with "Lesser" creatures of darkness which include all beings that qualify for that moniker which are of lesser power than ancient vampires, Maeljin Incarnae, Yama Kings, Malfeans, the greatest of Black Spiral Dancer heroes, other Exalted, and the like. Jaggling or Gaffling-level Banes and all fomori are always lesser beings.

Mercy in Servitude allows us to get the White Court vampires as our minions and "fixes" them.

Our combat ability is pretty much over and we can get started on social charms too.
 
On XP expenditure, I would go for the following:

General block:
Boiling Sea Mastery, 4 XP - this is a general difficulty reduces that is almost always applicable. It also allows us to walk on water, protects us from under-liquid environmental hazards, and opens the possibilities of underwater explorations. Given literal billions in cash lying on sea floor, that's worth a lot, not to mention all those ancient sunken ruins.

Social block - exiting immediate combat, we can say that to expand we would need minions. The idea of getting White Court vampires, possibly red court half-turned victims as minions appeals to me. Plus, this improves our ability to deal with Creatures of Darkness in general.
Demonic Primacy of Essence, 4 XP
Mercy in Servitude, 4 XP

Combat block - self-explanatory.
Scar-Writ Saga Shield, 3 XP
Viridian Legend Exoskeleton, 6 XP
By Rage Recast: Flight, 6 XP
Ox body, 3 XP

Alternatively, I see dropping Scar-Writ Saga Shield and Mercy in Servitude (for now) and buying Soul Rendering Practice. Combined with Charred Sinner's renewal and a bleach bath at home, we could have multiple additional free successes per day. That's definitely useful long term, and is broadly applicable.
 
BronzeTongue said:
From the YouTube transcript notes you posted a few pages back:



It's not explicit, but I took Uriel not knowing and outsiders being difficult/impossible to detect with magic as connected items.

It's not like he owes those guys anything, if nemesis isn't in a mortal he's probably be allowed to press the smite button.
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1)Ah, so not an explicit thing. I was wondering if I'd missed something.
Thanks.

2) Or it might be that he isnt allowed to say, because Outsiders inside the Gates is the work of a mortal human with free will, representing a loophole for Outsiders. Like when the porn star sorceresses in Blood Rites were summoning He Who Walks Behind to murder potential rivals at the direction of Papa Raith.

The vibe I get though is that Butcher hasnt actually decided.
When he does he'll come up with some post facto justification.
 
Yzarc said:
-[] The Hell of Burrowing Maggots Charm: Mercy in Servitude (•): Our minions no longer suffer torment while serving our will. 4 XP
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What exactly qualifies as a minion? Could our younger siblings be minions?

If so, could we use MiS to mitigate the suffering they experience when doing chores or attending school? :V
 
Goldfish said:
What exactly qualifies as a minion? Could our younger siblings be minions?

If so, could we use MiS to mitigate the suffering they experience when doing chores or attending school? :V
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It only lasts until they refuse to do what we want them to. I don't think 30 seconds of relief is worth the essence even if they are suffering from something applicable.

Edit: removed extra word
 
Goldfish said:
What exactly qualifies as a minion? Could our younger siblings be minions?

If so, could we use MiS to mitigate the suffering they experience when doing chores or attending school? :V
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As long as they swear servitude and mean it they can be minions.
Which means they can't.
Whoever claims otherwise hasn't had siblings.

Sadly MiS only works on supernatural suffering. White Court Vampire urges, ghoul urges, etc...
It won't help against Rosie's fetch and mindcontrol damage e.g.
BronzeTongue said:
It only lasts until they refuse to do what we want them to. I don't think 30 seconds of relief is worth the essence even if they are suffering from something applicable.

Edit: removed extra word
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I think you are thinking about False Spring Beckoning? It's broader, but costs essence. And more XP.
MiS does not cost essence.
 
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Goldfish said:
What exactly qualifies as a minion? Could our younger siblings be minions?

If so, could we use MiS to mitigate the suffering they experience when doing chores or attending school? :V
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It is only applicable to bakemono, and, by word of QM, at least some types of vampires:
The suffering of Hell is eternal, and as such, the
Infernal preserves her flawed and decaying servants,
that they might further serve her will.
System: Whenever a bakemono – a sort of cursed
mutant that werewolves know as fomori – acts to carry
out the Infernal's will, the various torments of its mu-
tant state are held in abeyance. If its acidic powers nor-
mally rot its body from the inside-out, they cease to do
so while it slaves on her behalf. If the spiritual corrup-
tion festering in its flesh is killing it with a variety of ag-
gressive cancers, they go into remission. If the use of one
of its powers normally causes it great damage and pain,
it no longer does so. Even derangements of the mind
inflicted by the creature's fallen state are temporarily set
aside while it does the Infernal's bidding. Basic rules for
fomori can be found on pages 428-439 of W20, while
expanded rules for playable fomori can be found in the
Storytellers Vault supplement Riot of the Flesh.
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LightLan said:
It won't help against Rosie's fetch and mindcontrol damage e.g.
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Not unless we turn her into a bakemono (we won't).
 
Earth-Destroyer said:
We want the tech excellency so our demons actually last.
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Nice to have. Not essential atm when we can simply repeat.

Yzarc said:
Here is my proposal for the xp tu
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No intel gathering.
Information has been our killer stat, and has been all through the game so far. Improving that
Tooling around blind when there are Feds poking around is...unwise.

Yzarc said:
Our combat ability is pretty much over and we can get started on social charms too.
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Point of correction: No it isnt.
We would still lack a surprise negator, a perfect defence, a shaping defense, environmental damage defense, and anti-poison charms. Basically, if your rationale is that we only need that, it actually isnt true.

Also, we're going on a field trip with Michael.
That means social, because Knights try to do a lot more talking than they do stabbing.

Yog said:
On XP expenditure, I would go for the followin
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The Cyberdevils Background is more or less essential now that we know the Daedalus Group is poking around and using extrajudicial means to exert pressure and operate.
Its essentially the only way we can be sure to keep tabs on them instead of being surprised out of the blue.

It also allows us to do things like hack police records to run background checks on people, hack surveillance camera networks to track people, hack Marcone's records if necessary, and to keep tabs on lawyers to ensure they arent fucking around with people we might be comcerned about.

And to monitor Kattrin Holt's effects to see who,if any, tries to loot them when she vanishes.
Word of QM is we need at least 2 dots to enable the hacking function.
Thats 6XP.
 
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You don't get a spy network by spending xp jest spend an AP point an get spy 5 Chicago by controlling all the infustracture, phone line and internet hubs. We can do this in a day of just driving around the city.
 
Prospalz said:
Did anyone consider City Still Stands? Automatic self-resurrection is pretty good value, especially on a chassis that is already far from fragile. Pricy, tho.
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Too pricy.
The opportunity cost of spending half our XP on one charm right now are too high.
If we were buying a 5 dot charm now, I'd be advocating for crafting.
 
[X] Snap a picture of the circle before Harry melts it
[X] Try to claim one of them, they might be useful or at least interesting
-[X] The jacket

OctarineShrike said:
It also puts us at a crime scene in worst case Daedalus scenario and freaks Harry out. Perhaps we should wait and get the Sapphire Ritual of Exorcism, research what we put down with that instead.
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We have a cyberdeamon on our phone. I really doubt law enforcement can extract anything from it without our permission. And I consider freaking out Harry a bonus.
 
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