The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Enjou · Sep 8, 2018

Andres110 said:
Enjou, I know that intra-Trust relationships are intriguing, but they are not as interesting or important as asking Areatha stuff.

We could ask her about the Idra'Sakar Empire, which would then lead into contacting them and gaining an extremely powerful ally. (This would be IC. Durin said that after asking what the daemons wanted, she said it was probably the empire.)

We could ask her what Chaos has to gain from invading a planet that has such high perma-killing capabilities. Not much use in this to be honest, but the same can be said of getting Asgard/Midgard relationships, and it'd probably give more entertaining info.

We might try to get her permission to study her, which is the giant, golden, diamond-encrusted gateway to psyker genetics.

We could ask her to head-cap the leaders of Turoq raids after the cultists are dead. Durin said that it would have a major effect and he also said that she's a shit teacher, so taking her off teaching wouldn't be a big loss in the slightest.

We could quiz her on what the Dark Age of Technology was like. Knowing more about the golden age of humanity may be useful and it would certainly be something our people would want.

We could ask her if she'd be interested learning science. She's an Ancient and a human, so not only is she allowed to learn Mechanicus stuff, she's also allowed to innovate and invent freely and without restriction. That would be huge given that she has over 50 Learning. Hell, her Learning means that even if she stuck strictly to current Mechanicus practices, her aid in our Mechanicus endeavours would still be incalculably valuable.

We can ask if she knows of a way to deal with daemon worlds. She knows ritual magic, and given that ritual magic is what makes daemon worlds, it might also be what breaks them. Even if ritual magic isn't the true method, Areatha more than anyone is the most likely to know what that true method is.

I'm of the mind that we shouldn't pester her constantly. If we're asking her to deal with the cults, then she needs to be left to that.

Andres110 said:
How come these aren't all Martial Law?

Because we only have two Personal Attention actions per year. "Hunt them down" also has value because it lets us focus our efforts on the cities with the worst problems.

Shard said:
Looks good, although:

Isn't this basically a You Cannot Hide?

I'm not sure. They do kind of different things. I think I had that in my draft last night before Durin answered the question regarding being able to do it multiple times. I'll switch it out to the explicit action.

Shard said:
Also we have 3 actions, I think we should continue the Factory Expansion with that extra action.

Ah, missed that. Thanks.

inverted_helix · Sep 8, 2018

Enjou said:
Munitorum
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All
SLOT C - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All

With our number of troops down and the Trust under military threat, I'm hesitant to delay all of the troop recruitment actions, but last time we didn't go all in on Martial Law with the cultists (which is the most effective action) and it bit us in the ass because we got a low roll the first time. Not going to make that mistake this time. Four times so we can get as many cultists as possible as early as possible.

Yeah it's painful to let the recruitment waves backslide given how much we need the troops now, but I don't think I can argue with that.

Enjou said:
Arbites
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Curfew: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Cultist Hunt: All
-Y2: Cultist Hunt: All

Set the curfew immediately and put Jane on hunting duty.

I'm a little less sure on this one since she could outright finish the Blank Training Assistance action this turn if we dropped the cultist hunts, which aren't super effective anyway at only 1/3rd of success bonus.

Enjou said:
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Personal Attention: Hunt them down
-Y2: Speech: Every Man's Duty

Wouldn't it make more sense to do this in the opposite order?

Enjou said:
-Y2: Marshal of the Helltroopers (Marshal Florentina Cheshire)

This can probably wait until after we have the cults under control. We could throw another speech or martial law there.

Though I'm not actually sure if Martial law stacking is better than Cultist Hunt: All. Martial law stacks pretty much add flat +10% cultists found because of the way they work, whereas Cultist Hunt: All is 1/3rd of success, which is possibly more. Not sure how +points vs +percent works.

Nurgle said:
We are vulnerable right now and we need to take care of Avernus before we even think of helping the trust.

We still have more than enough to stop any small raiding force cold, and if we can bait Turoq into thinking we're vulnerable enough to make a major attack against that would be worth it in itself. Yes we're more vulnerable than we've been in ages. I think we haven't taken casualties this bad since the Pink Skies. However we're still more than strong enough to wreck an attack by Turoq. If they commit their all to us we'll be devastated, but we'll survive. The damage we could inflict in such a war would cripple their ability to keep up the raids though, so would be worth it.

Honestly trying to bait them into attacking Avernus would be a good thing right now.

Plus if Turoq expended themselves wrecking us we could probably legitimately ask for the Trust to pay for that rebuilding. Since we'd have served the role of sacrificial fortress world at that point.

Andres · Sep 8, 2018

@Durin

1. Would we annoy Areatha if we use the Ask Areatha action too much?
2. If so, how should we pace ourselves to avoid annoying her? You told us we need to do 1 year every 5 to avoid Jane getting rusty, for example.
3. If we have her do a continuous action like hunting cultists, would asking her for information in the year after we make that request interfere with her hunting cultists?

Doomed Wombat · Sep 8, 2018

Andres110 said:
We could quiz her on what the Dark Age of Technology was like. Knowing more about the golden age of humanity may be useful and it would certainly be something our people would want.

I dunno I was a kid. I barely saw the outside of my room in the labs.

Nurgle · Sep 8, 2018

inverted_helix said:
Yeah it's painful to let the recruitment waves backslide given how much we need the troops now, but I don't think I can argue with that.

I'm a little less sure on this one since she could outright finish the Blank Training Assistance action this turn if we dropped the cultist hunts, which aren't super effective anyway at only 1/3rd of success bonus.

Wouldn't it make more sense to do this in the opposite order?

This can probably wait until after we have the cults under control. We could throw another speech or martial law there.

We still have more than enough to stop any small raiding force cold, and if we can bait Turoq into thinking we're vulnerable enough to make a major attack against that would be worth it in itself. Yes we're more vulnerable than we've been in ages. I think we haven't taken casualties this bad since the Pink Skies. However we're still more than strong enough to wreck an attack by Turoq. If they commit their all to us we'll be devastated, but we'll survive. The damage we could inflict in such a war would cripple their ability to keep up the raids though, so would be worth it.

Honestly trying to bait them into attacking Avernus would be a good thing right now.

Plus if Turoq expended themselves wrecking us we could probably legitimately ask for the Trust to pay for that rebuilding. Since we'd have served the role of sacrificial fortress world at that point.

Baiting Turoq to attack right now is a horrible thing we need to protest Avernus first and get the order build that Sarnow wanted done we just have to do it two more times and we got the minimal he wanted .

Enjou · Sep 8, 2018

inverted_helix said:
I'm a little less sure on this one since she could outright finish the Blank Training Assistance action this turn if we dropped the cultist hunts, which aren't super effective anyway at only 1/3rd of success bonus.

It only results in the action backsliding a year for each year Jane puts it off. There won't be any long term negative effects, which is confirmed by Durin. Given what happened last time we underestimated the cultist problem, I'm of the mind "everything helps".

inverted_helix said:
Wouldn't it make more sense to do this in the opposite order?

I don't have the Personal Attention slots available to do it in the opposite order.

inverted_helix said:
This can probably wait until after we have the cults under control.

Maybe? The Helltroopers are going to be fighting cultists though. They should probably have a Marshal.

Shard · Sep 8, 2018

I was fairly sure we did an action which basically duplicated Hunt Them Down every turn.

Shard · Sep 8, 2018

Nurgle said:
Baiting Turoq to attack right now is a horrible thing we need to protest Avernus first and get the order build that Sarnow wanted done we just have to do it two more times and we got the minimal he wanted .

IMO it would hurt but would be worthwhile.

Enjou · Sep 8, 2018

Shard said:
I was fairly sure we did an action which basically duplicated Hunt Them Down every turn.

I think that works under normal circumstances, but might need someone to focus on it during a planet-wide outbreak like this. Not sure why we'd get the action otherwise.

inverted_helix · Sep 8, 2018

Enjou said:
It only results in the action backsliding a year for each year Jane puts it off. There won't be any long term negative effects, which is confirmed by Durin. Given what happened last time we underestimated the cultist problem, I'm of the mind "everything helps".

I actually think this is more similar to the cleanup after the Abomination invasion than the Slaanesh incursion though. Slaanesh caused more casualties in the initial incursion and was more corruption focused. The Abomination crusade hardly caused much of an issue despite having largely split our actions rather than going all in on cultist containment.

Enjou said:
I don't have the Personal Attention slots available to do it in the opposite order.

I'm just not sure there's much point in a Hunt them Down action in the first year at all. It doesn't really tell us how many cultists are left to deal with considering how much that can be altered in the second year.

Nurgle said:
Baiting Turoq to attack right now is a horrible thing we need to protest Avernus first and get the order build that Sarnow wanted done we just have to do it two more times and we got the minimal he wanted .

You've failed to establish why Turoq attacking us is a bad thing. They're going to keep stealing tech from the Trust until we can cripple them somehow. Them attacking a meatgrinder like Avernus would cripple them. The damage they would inflict to us is insignificant compared to the damage they'll inflict to the Trust over the decades as they gradually steal our tech and reverse engineer it. It's entirely possible for them to outpace our defense increases by teching up.

Shard · Sep 8, 2018

I'm wondering what kind of epic feat would Ridcully have to do to hit Transcend?

Andres · Sep 8, 2018

Shard said:
I'm wondering what kind of epic feat would Ridcully have to do to hit Transcend?

Ogling a few Chaos Gods would probably be a good start. Durin said that the Abomination would be the safest so we should start there.

nat_401 · Sep 8, 2018

If Turoq attacks Avernus with heavy force his ability to carry out his long term plan is almost certain to be crippled, Avernus would suffer which it does every day anyway but the Trust would benefit immensely.

Shard · Sep 8, 2018

I wonder how much bigger Avernus is on the inside as opposed to outside, simply on the Continent we are on.

Enjou · Sep 8, 2018

inverted_helix said:
I actually think this is more similar to the cleanup after the Abomination invasion than the Slaanesh incursion though. Slaanesh caused more casualties in the initial incursion and was more corruption focused. The Abomination crusade hardly caused much of an issue despite having largely split our actions rather than going all in on cultist containment.

The main difference between the Abomination crusade we faced and a daemonic incursion is that every city gets hit by the latter. With the crusade they focused almost the entirety of their efforts on Dis since their objective was primarily to kill Saint Lin, so the cultists were pretty much entirely concentrated in Dis. That won't be so here, because every city got hit to some extent.

Now, I do expect we'll do a lot better this go around than the first time. We have the benefit of prior experience and several bonuses we didn't have last time. My expectation is that we'll have the cultist problem mostly cleaned up by the end of the turn, with maybe one or two cities needing some of our remaining focus after that. That said, I'm not willing to underestimate the cultists.

inverted_helix said:
I'm just not sure there's much point in a Hunt them Down action in the first year at all. It doesn't really tell us how many cultists are left to deal with considering how much that can be altered in the second year.

Exact number of cultists isn't the primary value for it. The real value is knowing which locations have higher concentrations of cultists. Knowing that earlier is actually somewhat helpful in focusing the efforts in year 2 (there isn't an explicit option to do that, but I presume our PCs are intelligent enough to adjust on their own).

Doomed Wombat · Sep 8, 2018

Shard said:
I wonder how much bigger Avernus is on the inside as opposed to outside, simply on the Continent we are on.

It can fit a plasma ocean in it so I'd say pretty large.

Nurgle · Sep 8, 2018

inverted_helix said:
I actually think this is more similar to the cleanup after the Abomination invasion than the Slaanesh incursion though. Slaanesh caused more casualties in the initial incursion and was more corruption focused. The Abomination crusade hardly caused much of an issue despite having largely split our actions rather than going all in on cultist containment.

I'm just not sure there's much point in a Hunt them Down action in the first year at all. It doesn't really tell us how many cultists are left to deal with considering how much that can be altered in the second year.

You've failed to establish why Turoq attacking us is a bad thing. They're going to keep stealing tech from the Trust until we can cripple them somehow. Them attacking a meatgrinder like Avernus would cripple them. The damage they would inflict to us is insignificant compared to the damage they'll inflict to the Trust over the decades as they gradually steal our tech and reverse engineer it. It's entirely possible for them to outpace our defense increases by teching up.

i thought it would be self explanatory that Avernus getting attacked would be a bad thing. Avernus is a core world with tech for him for his forces to Steal. Technoloy and someone who can build it would be worth temporary crippling his fleet, because If he gets his hand on some advance technology he can bargain with the dark Admech for more ships and get them fairly easy. Or if he cripples Avernus tempory that woulld greatly help in his raids. He has two goals right now. One acquire tech. Two check the growth the trust. Destroy the Trust. He can accomplish two of them by Attacking Avernus. No matter how easy people think it is we are going to be fighting Cults and be distracted enough for a force to steal from us. he does not have to fulling invade he just needs to get a force in orbit long enough to Steal examples of tech or kidnap some tech priests.

Andres · Sep 8, 2018

@Enjou, Beergrass improved our ability to make bio-fuel by something like 500%. Because of that, I think that if you aren't going to ask Areatha something, you should instead use the Y2 action to investigate the nynye's agriculture. Alternatively, we could investigate their animal husbandry so that we can more easily make use of the native fauna.

nat_401 · Sep 8, 2018

Nurgle said:
i thought it would be self explanatory that Avernus getting attacked would be a bad thing.

Both Sarnow and Rotbart disagree with you and Rotbart actually wants Turoq to try attacking Avernus.

Durin said:
Admiral Sarnow and the majority of the Avernite fleet are still deployed offworld but he assures you that even with recent events the orbitals of Avernus should be able to inflict massive damage on any attackers. You agree with his assessment and actually hope that Turoq will launch an attack on Avernus, as any force able to breach your orbital defences would be a major commitment and would find that even now Avernus is by no means as easy target.

Nurgle · Sep 8, 2018

nat_401 said:
Both Sarnow and Rotbart disagree with you and Rotbart actually wants Turoq to try attacking Avernus.

I have been focusing on the expansion of the Avernus economy . Another attack would set back plans another decade worth of growth and city building. it is currently going to take us 12 years to build the current damage. Turoq is a very intelligent enemy who will not engage rotbart but send a force smart strong enough to raid the Forge cities we have on Avernus and steal tech.

Shard · Sep 8, 2018

Nurgle said:
I have been focusing on the expansion of the Avernus economy . Another attack would set back plans another decade worth of growth and city building. it is currently going to take us 12 years to build the current damage. Turoq is a very intelligent enemy who will not engage rotbart but send a force smart strong enough to raid the Forge cities we have on Avernus and steal tech.

There is a minimum force that must be dedicated to the attack to have a possibility of success. For Avernus, that minimum threshold is very high.

Durin · Sep 8, 2018

Andres110 said:
@Durin

1. Would we annoy Areatha if we use the Ask Areatha action too much?
2. If so, how should we pace ourselves to avoid annoying her? You told us we need to do 1 year every 5 to avoid Jane getting rusty, for example.
3. If we have her do a continuous action like hunting cultists, would asking her for information in the year after we make that request interfere with her hunting cultists?

1. yes
2. at most half of your diplomacy actions
3. yes

Enjou · Sep 8, 2018

If Turoq attacked Avernus now it would be great, but I somewhat doubt our ability to actually bait them into it. Our window of weakness is relatively small, so if they're going to do it then they'll do it in the next few years or not at all.

Nurgle · Sep 8, 2018

[X] Plan Nurgle T116

Munitorum
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All
SLOT C - Year 1
-Y1: Martial Law: All

Void Command
SLOT A - Year 2
-Y2: Construct Monitors for Avernus
-- EXPEDITE YEAR 2

Administratum
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Quarantine: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Rebuild
SLOT C - Year 1
-Y1: Continue Expand Factories: Hives

Diplomacy
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Make a Request (Ask Areatha for assistance in dealing with the Chaos cultists)
-Y2: Investigate Relationship (Asgard, Midgard)

Arbites
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Curfew: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Cultist Hunt: All
-Y2: Cultist Hunt: All

AdMech
SLOT A - Year 1 (Explorator)
-Y1: Titan Designing Step Three: Princeps Mind Impulse Unit
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 1
SLOT B - Year 2 (Free)
-Y2: Damage Control

I hate doing damage control with the Conservatives and making concessions. But reality is a liberal bias.
Ministorum
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Preach: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Continue The Nature of (Tzeentch)

Astra Telepathica
SLOT A - Year 2 (Ridcully)
-Y2: You Cannot Hide: All
SLOT B - Year 1 (Xavier)
-Y1: You Cannot Hide: All
SLOT C - Year 1 (Tamia)
-Y1: You Cannot Hide: All
SLOT D - Year 1 (Aria)
-Y1: Continue: Blank Training Assistance: Battle Psykers
SLOT E - Year 2 (Free Divination)
-Y2: Greater Divination (Eldar Choice)

Personal
SLOT A - Year 1
-Y1: Personal Attention: Martial Law: All
SLOT B - Year 1
-Y1: Personal Attention: Hunt them down
-Y2: Speech: Every Man's Duty
SLOT C - Year 1
-Y1: A New Assistant
-Y2: Marshal of the Helltroopers (Marshal Florentina Cheshire)
SLOT D - Year 2
-Y2: Personal Attention: Lesson's Learned: Strength of Arms
-- DOUBLE DOWN YEAR 2

No one believed me when I started talking about a enemy rading us instead of fighting us in a epic battle. People argued against me about setting up assassinations or getting a Waagh to attack Turoq realm. I think there is a high Chance of Turoq attacking Avernus. So the one thing I have different from enjou plan is building Monitors for Avernus so if he attacks we have as many ships as possible to keep any force from breaking the orbitals. Also we only has to do it 2 more times in order to Finish Sarnow minimal build plan of securing Avernus Orbitals.

nat_401 · Sep 8, 2018

Enjou said:
If Turoq attacked Avernus now it would be great, but I somewhat doubt our ability to actually bait them into it. Our window of weakness is relatively small, so if they're going to do it then they'll do it in the next few years or not at all.

I wouldn't want to actively try to bait him in case he smelled a trap, he basically cannot be tricked as far as I'm concerned but there is a small chance he could see a potential weakness and miscalculate in an attempt to bypass our most effective trump card in it's moment of genuine weakness.
It's all on Turoq himself to make that mistake by himself though.

[X] Plan Enjou T116

The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

Yes

No

Let's go Darling!

One and Many

One and Many

One and Many

One and Many

Let's go Darling!

One and Many