Meguca Micro Empire Quest (PMMM)

What should I do regarding a change in system?

  • Notgreat's proposed simplification of hunting, leave rest intact.

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • Chapter system vastly simplifying everything.

    Votes: 4 44.4%

  • Total voters
    9
  • Poll closed .
I would honestly prefer at that meguca cost to go to Hunting Plan 1 to free up vetpower, rather than impinge on Morale actions. I do think it'd be worth it though. The sooner we can get Tokyo's DS up to less soul crushing levels the better.

Edit: It also makes it alot more likely that we can snatch up significantly larger swathes of Tokyo.
Ah, yes, had forgotten about that.

Also found I had to make a correction on the dinner action, though. helix's first answer was ambiguous (could have meant 1 vet, could have meant 0), and when I confirmed which interpretation I was using, he didn't say it was wrong. However when Haman asked later, he said it was.

So, 1 extra vet I need to account for.

However, I got 0.5 extra elite because of the general allocation for Tokyo, that wasn't used in the original version 1. I could even get another 0.5 from Taya and her vet, if we didn't assign her fulltime there while the rest were halftime. It's actually a fairly reasonable change, because leaving her there fulltime last month wasn't exactly good for her.

So, 0.5 Taya to dispatch to free up 1 vet. Another 0.5 vet from Taya's teammate. 0.5 elite added to hunting to free up 1 vet.

Final:
Hunting (1a): 1 elite, 8.5 vets
Support: 1 elite, 7 vets
Jobs: 14 vets
Training: 0.5 elite, 3.5 vets
Research: 3 vets
Morale: 3 vets
Tokyo: 2.0 elite, 12 vets

Total: 4.5 elite, 51 vets

Then would need to drop 0.5 Pet Whisperer to have enough space for 0.5 Mami/5.5 vets on Tokyo Sensor Net. Doable without dropping any morale stuff, except...

Cube harvest would be 53.7, which means final cube buffer would be 45.8 before Tokyo drops/bounties. Again, the drops we expect from Tokyo should easily bring us back up to par (just 3 kills would put us at 75 buffer), but the uncertainty of that is definitely annoying.

To be honest, we should make that amount on the first day of testing. Makes me think we could consider swapping the 5.5 vets between the sensor net and the hunting, depending on the first day's results. IE: Prove to the group that there shouldn't be any worries about our cube harvest.
 
Cube harvest would be 53.7, which means final cube buffer would be 45.8 before Tokyo drops/bounties. Again, the drops we expect from Tokyo should easily bring us back up to par (just 3 kills would put us at 75 buffer), but the uncertainty of that is definitely annoying.

I disagree. Remember that in character, the tokyo drops/bounties happen before the hunting results are in. The girls will see the cube buffer skyrocketing, long before they see the hunting is insufficient. IC, I don't think there is any uncertainty, that's just an artifact of how we're doing stuff OOC.
 
  • Leather: $250 x 5 = $1,250
Still not sure if we can even use these. We're not sending anyone into Tokyo with leather armor, are we?

Also @Kinematics and @Elder Haman I wonder if we should allocate up to say $9,000 for cell phones for the sensor net plan? The point is to get a network of clairvoyants to canvas Tokyo for Class 3s as well as set up for the post-cleanup hunts that will need to take place to bring up DS levels; to get that done we'll need to get a good dispatch service going over all of Tokyo, and that requires that the clairvoyants have cell phones to call things in as they happen (and, hopefully, for teleporters to have cell phones to respond to those calls. It's maybe a bit optimistic to assume that there are a combined 200 vet-level clairvoyants and teleporters in Tokyo, but if there are that many then we're going to be very well off in the post Class 3 future.
 
I'm going to take the advice of the GM, and back off a good deal from the crazy contingencies. Trust the characters to be able to plan and act rationally without step-by-step instructions (particularly since our own ability to assess the situation as written has been shown to not really match up very well *coughKyoukocough*).

Eh... I took the hint more as a comment on the low return to the amount of effort we were putting into it. But at this point I think the extra effort is worth it for whatever edge it gets us.


I don't think we should commit to Stage Two actions until we see how Stage One goes. Also, lack of plan to deal with Tokyo girls is pretty big.

Given the importance of the sensor net action, and how Helix has said things in the backlog will suffer a penalty for pulling it off, I urge you to make the sensor net an actual action rather than a backlog action.

Three things:

First of all, since I have girls committed full time to the fight for Tokyo (giving us a small combat bonus) I can't afford to do the Tokyo Diplomacy even with minimal hunting.

Second, I already have put Tokyo Diplomacy as a higher value in the backlog than the additional hunting. It's actually ranked as the most important backlog item.

Third, I don't think Tokyo Diplomacy is plausible as anything other than a backlog item, because I don't think it's safe to do at all until we have already made significant progress on clearing Tokyo, including killing the eyeball.

So I think the choices are to either try to do it this month in a rush, or wait until next month to do properly. It seems to me that this action is one that has large benefits to doing now despite the half month penalty.

Also, of the banner images I prefer #4.

Me too, I'll probably submit that one when I get home from work tonight.
 
Also @Kinematics and @Elder Haman I wonder if we should allocate up to say $9,000 for cell phones for the sensor net plan? The point is to get a network of clairvoyants to canvas Tokyo for Class 3s as well as set up for the post-cleanup hunts that will need to take place to bring up DS levels; to get that done we'll need to get a good dispatch service going over all of Tokyo, and that requires that the clairvoyants have cell phones to call things in as they happen (and, hopefully, for teleporters to have cell phones to respond to those calls. It's maybe a bit optimistic to assume that there are a combined 200 vet-level clairvoyants and teleporters in Tokyo, but if there are that many then we're going to be very well off in the post Class 3 future.

Good point, I'll look at adding some money to the network plan.
 
I very much doubt we are going to kill the Eyeball this month.

Then we shouldn't be sending large groups of unprotected vets wandering around Tokyo until we do. They'd get slaughtered.

EDIT: Also, I think there is a good chance we will in the last week. Killing it early enough to allow the Tokyo Diplomacy will be dependent on dice rolls.
 
Then we shouldn't be sending large groups of unprotected vets wandering around Tokyo until we do. They'd get slaughtered.

Why do you assume the sensor net would involve large groups of unprotected vets wandering around? I thought it was to set up coordinated solo hunting in areas that had be cleared enough to be safe?
 
@inverted_helix

If we wait to do TheEye's sensor net action until after the Eyeball dies, will we be able to do it at all this month? Or is it the kind of thing that takes time and can't be set up in a rush at the end?
 
Also @Kinematics and @Elder Haman I wonder if we should allocate up to say $9,000 for cell phones for the sensor net plan? The point is to get a network of clairvoyants to canvas Tokyo for Class 3s as well as set up for the post-cleanup hunts that will need to take place to bring up DS levels; to get that done we'll need to get a good dispatch service going over all of Tokyo, and that requires that the clairvoyants have cell phones to call things in as they happen (and, hopefully, for teleporters to have cell phones to respond to those calls. It's maybe a bit optimistic to assume that there are a combined 200 vet-level clairvoyants and teleporters in Tokyo, but if there are that many then we're going to be very well off in the post Class 3 future.

That seems way too high an estimate on money. We are not buying these girls smart phones we can't afford it.

Where are the numbers on burner phones again, because I can't find them.
 
Why do you assume the sensor net would involve large groups of unprotected vets wandering around? I thought it was to set up coordinated solo hunting in areas that had be cleared enough to be safe?

We will have a large number of vets going around talking to people.

And that's my point, there will not be any safe areas if the beholder is still around... at least we assume so. I suppose that might change through the mini-turns, but that still argues for the backlog approach, as this is not something that can be started until as significant amount of Tokyo is cleared.

I just don't see anyway to avoid the half month penalty no matter what.
 
I very much doubt we are going to kill the Eyeball this month.
With the blistering pace of Class 3 kills that both plans set up, it's actually unlikely that we won't run into the eyeball this month. Even at @Kinematics's more leisurely pace of two combat sorties per day, we're still killing a quarter of the Class 3s in Tokyo in the first week; by the end of week two the Class 3s will either have to concede the western half of Tokyo or be so spread out that they will be unable to back each other up. If the Class 4 hasn't shown up by then it's probably running, which is a whole new set of problems.

Why do you assume the sensor net would involve large groups of unprotected vets wandering around? I thought it was to set up coordinated solo hunting in areas that had be cleared enough to be safe?
What @Elder Haman is worried about is our girls running around in unsecured areas of Tokyo, trying to hand out cell phones and collect phone numbers, a concern I agree with. That's why I'm thinking diplomacy makes more sense as part of a backlog plan, rather than something we're committing to on Day 1/2.
That seems way too high an estimate on money. We are not buying these girls smart phones we can't afford it.

Where are the numbers on burner phones again, because I can't find them.
$90 for a burner with two months prepaid. I was saying "up to $9,000" just in case there were a lot of clairvoyants, relative to total population: after all, they would have an advantage in avoiding Class 3 demons, especially compared to say teleporters.
 
Your first miniturn event went quite well, you picked up another elite, a couple vets and some territory and didn't even lose any of your own girls.

Wow... that went very well.

EDIT: Wait... How did we pick up territory?!?

Did the Tokyo girls we rescued just suddenly elect us as their supreme ruler or something? I'm smelling a crit on the relationship roll.

I hadn't thought about it but we probably need more kevlar... unless we want to start dropping girls off the vet team as we get more girls from Tokyo. That might not be a bad idea...

I've only bought enough for 3 extra sets. @inverted_helix Can I adjust the number of kevlar purchased still?

With the blistering pace of Class 3 kills that both plans set up, it's actually unlikely that we won't run into the eyeball this month. Even at @Kinematics's more leisurely pace of two combat sorties per day, we're still killing a quarter of the Class 3s in Tokyo in the first week; by the end of week two the Class 3s will either have to concede the western half of Tokyo or be so spread out that they will be unable to back each other up. If the Class 4 hasn't shown up by then it's probably running, which is a whole new set of problems.

Actually, I also am only doing 2 combat runs per a day. And both of us are alternating days for now. My plan has the girls doing after action reviews and training, Kinematics has them on more normal pursuits.

What @Elder Haman is worried about is our girls running around in unsecured areas of Tokyo, trying to hand out cell phones and collect phone numbers, a concern I agree with. That's why I'm thinking diplomacy makes more sense as part of a backlog plan, rather than something we're committing to on Day 1/2.

Exactly.

But not in large groups. From the way Helix has been talking these girls will have to spread out to reach people.

And it can't be that dangerous for Magical Girls or there wouldn't be any left at all.

I will not support any plan that tries to send solo girls into demon infested Tokyo just to try and make contact a little earlier with some Tokyo girls. It's premature and takes too much risk for too little gain.

EDIT: Also, it still doesn't address the problem that I simply do not have enough girls to do this except in the backlog.

$90 for a burner with two months prepaid. I was saying "up to $9,000" just in case there were a lot of clairvoyants, relative to total population: after all, they would have an advantage in avoiding Class 3 demons, especially compared to say teleporters.

Okay... added for now while mulling it over. I wish I had a link to the post that discussed all the burner phone options. I have to head to work, so I don't have time to dig through the thread right now.
 
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Also, from my informal count we are now tied with 3 votes for Kinematics plan, and 3 votes for my plan. Fortunately we pretty much agree on the stage one part, so helix can get started on the mini-turn.
 
Vote tally:
##### 3.19
[X] Plan Kinematics (Halftime)
No. of votes: 3
Kinematics, Aranfan, Powerofmind
[X] Plan Elder Haman (Backlog)
No. of votes: 3
Elder Haman, Skelm, TheEyes

Haman is correct with his informal votecount. I'm going to wait to tag the people who usually have some activity in the thread until Kinematics wakes up and finishes deciding what he wants to do with the Sensor Net and hunting.
 
Wow... that went very well.

EDIT: Wait... How did we pick up territory?!?

Did the Tokyo girls we rescued just suddenly elect us as their supreme ruler or something? I'm smelling a crit on the relationship roll.

I hadn't thought about it but we probably need more kevlar... unless we want to start dropping girls off the vet team as we get more girls from Tokyo. That might not be a bad idea...

I've only bought enough for 3 extra sets. @inverted_helix Can I adjust the number of kevlar purchased still?
He's talking about the mini-turn where we fought the Class 3 demon and picked up Seto's group.
 
I'm not sure the Tokyo Network option is feasible this month, but Haman's backlog logic loop sort of addresses that. One thing though: I don't see any mention of furthering Serena's group in Japanese and our group in English like in Kinematics' plan. Communication may be hindered. Even so, The list of backlog actions interests me, though I'm leery of the Heaven's Chosen and Osaka Junta groups.

[X] Elder Haman
 
I'm not sure the Tokyo Network option is feasible this month, but Haman's backlog logic loop sort of addresses that. One thing though: I don't see any mention of furthering Serena's group in Japanese and our group in English like in Kinematics' plan. Communication may be hindered. Even so, The list of backlog actions interests me, though I'm leery of the Heaven's Chosen and Osaka Junta groups.

[X] Elder Haman
You know, you're right about that. I figure we'd be better off looking at the magic company first, maybe even explore the area around Tokyo, before sticking our faces into the Kyoto quagmire.
 
I disagree. Remember that in character, the tokyo drops/bounties happen before the hunting results are in. The girls will see the cube buffer skyrocketing, long before they see the hunting is insufficient. IC, I don't think there is any uncertainty, that's just an artifact of how we're doing stuff OOC.
The girls are handling the hunting schedule. They can add up what the projected harvest is going to be. It certainly won't be a 'surprise' for them to find out later in the month.

So the problem is that everyone will know how much we should be harvesting from normal hunting right from the start, but won't have any clear certainty on what we'll be getting from Tokyo. We know how much we should be getting, but it's still an uncertainty.

Still not sure if we can even use these. We're not sending anyone into Tokyo with leather armor, are we?
Are we planning on possibly handing out any armor to the Tokyo elites who we might possibly get to join us? That was estimated at 6 to 12, and we have no idea what equipment they might have. Presumably if we do, they'll keep it for the remainder of the time they're working for us. (I'll assume that if/when this happens, we'll get the paired kevlar vests from Nagoya, so not adding that right now.)

Because I have no idea what we might be using there, I was just leaving the non-kevlar hunting armor at leather (which is all that's needed for any of the plans). Of those, I need 5 more sets of leather for hunting plan 2, and 1 more set for hunting plan 2a. Since the choice now seems to be between plans 1a and 2b, I don't actually need any additional leather armor for those.

So, I can drop the leather purchases, and can just call in extra purchases later if we find we need that.

I don't think we should commit to Stage Two actions until we see how Stage One goes. Also, lack of plan to deal with Tokyo girls is pretty big.
Stage 2 is mostly to note that there is a stage 2, and we only go there if we find the results of stage 1 acceptable (which pretty much has to be a player confirmation).

Dealing with the Tokyo girls is also a thing to vote for if/when it happens. Like many of the other contingencies, it's setting the answer to a possible future vote, when we could just have the vote as the event goes along.

Third, I don't think Tokyo Diplomacy is plausible as anything other than a backlog item, because I don't think it's safe to do at all until we have already made significant progress on clearing Tokyo, including killing the eyeball.
This bothers me as well. Connecting with people will be difficult, and we don't want to be sending people through the city while the eyeball is still out there (and even without the eyeball, it's still risky).

On the other hand, I can't imagine this being at all useful if we haven't gotten started on it right from the start of the month. It's going to take at least a week, probably two, to get enough of this set up to even start being useful. If we kill the beholder at the end of the second week, and only start things up after that, the sensor net does us almost no good at all, and is just a waste of manpower.

Because of the way this was described (an information tree), I've been assuming we'd be starting contact with the girls we already are in contact with, and get them to find/contact others, who in turn find/contact others that they know, and so on and so forth. Some of those further contactees will have phones, and we can add them to direct contact points, but we wouldn't be handing out phones to everyone.

In that manner, it's taking time to make contact with each additional network node, all of which will be feeding information upwards to the ones we are in contact with. And that takes time to set up. If we're lucky, by the end of the second week we'll have enough set up to be a functional tool for the needs we have for tracking down the teleporters in the last half of the month.

Though, again, this assumes we need this complexity for tracking down and killing the teleporters. Well, most likely it will only be needed for the last handful of really annoying and hard-to-catch teleporters, but those are also the ones that could most likely prevent us from having a complete finish of the city within the month. And the general information network is itself valuable, in terms of connecting us to all the Tokyo locals.

So the final question is, how is this being carried out? If it requires physically canvasing the city for a couple weeks, I'm very leery about it (though it's still possible to do, using the type of contact arrangements Nagoya did when they were passing out aid supplies). However if it's just a very long run of "Call A, who calls B, who can tell you how to get in touch with C, etc", then it seems more viable.

We will have a large number of vets going around talking to people.
Not exactly. Even if I'm somewhat concerned about it, making physical contact with groups the way Nagoya did with their aid system mainly needs a lot of manhours arranging contacts and contact points, with a lesser amount of time sending a few people to speak in person (if necessary). More likely, it's five girls constantly tracking down leads across the city, and then handing the phone to Mami for a bit of talking (with my split of 0.5 Mami/5.5 vets).

Again, though, this is going to be a GM call: @inverted_helix - What type of involvement and activity would building the sensor net entail?

Okay... added for now while mulling it over. I wish I had a link to the post that discussed all the burner phone options. I have to head to work, so I don't have time to dig through the thread right now.
In this post, the second comment has @TheEyes' initial estimates, and helix's response on it.
 
The girls are handling the hunting schedule. They can add up what the projected harvest is going to be. It certainly won't be a 'surprise' for them to find out later in the month.

So the problem is that everyone will know how much we should be harvesting from normal hunting right from the start, but won't have any clear certainty on what we'll be getting from Tokyo. We know how much we should be getting, but it's still an uncertainty.

Remember when those stealth girls threw off our calcuations by poaching? Our girls know shit can happen, I don't see them actually taking a morale hit from being dependent on tokyo clearing to make ends meet. Our girls believe in the SIMP, I don't think they'll doubt unless and until things start going south.
 
Wow... that went very well.

EDIT: Wait... How did we pick up territory?!?

Did the Tokyo girls we rescued just suddenly elect us as their supreme ruler or something? I'm smelling a crit on the relationship roll.

I hadn't thought about it but we probably need more kevlar... unless we want to start dropping girls off the vet team as we get more girls from Tokyo. That might not be a bad idea...
I assumed like you did that helix was talking about Tokyo, not Seto.
He's talking about the mini-turn where we fought the Class 3 demon and picked up Seto's group.
I was indeed in that post talking about past mini-turn events. Not present. Context was wondering why you guys went super-Batman on this miniturn.

I've only bought enough for 3 extra sets. @inverted_helix Can I adjust the number of kevlar purchased still?
Sure. As long as you're buying through Nagoya this can be considered a "free action" that just costs money but very little time. (Unless you start getting into outrageous amounts.)

The girls are handling the hunting schedule. They can add up what the projected harvest is going to be. It certainly won't be a 'surprise' for them to find out later in the month.

So the problem is that everyone will know how much we should be harvesting from normal hunting right from the start, but won't have any clear certainty on what we'll be getting from Tokyo. We know how much we should be getting, but it's still an uncertainty.
So long as things go well enough in Tokyo you won't get dinged over this. Because there's an expectation of cubes from there. Just like the times I model training as being all front loaded at the start of the month your cube stockpile diminishes in that period but there's the expectation you'll make it up.

More likely, it's five girls constantly tracking down leads across the city, and then handing the phone to Mami for a bit of talking (with my split of 0.5 Mami/5.5 vets).

Again, though, this is going to be a GM call: @inverted_helix - What type of involvement and activity would building the sensor net entail?
This is essentially how I see it.
 
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