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The World Turned Upside Down - A 20th Century Nation Game (HIATUS?)

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KnightofTempest said:
@Shynka according to the OP nobody has Strategic Nukes, only Tactical Ones. I'm not sure how much further you can escalate from "Small Scale" nukes
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I mean, a nuclear weapon of the same rough strength as the ones used on Hiroshima and Nagasaki could still inflict considerable devastation on an urban area if used. It just wouldn't be the civilisation-destroyer that later nuclear weapons are.

It sounds a lot like the level of nuclear weapons is more to the level of fission bombs rather than fusion bombs which is a huge difference in terms of power. Not to mention several developments such as MIRVs which massively increase the destructive capability of nuclear weapons were probably never made ITTL.

Shynka said:
Multiple small scale nukes used on cities as opposed to one used on some troops
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I mean, if we're going all-out, certain bits of infrastructure might also be under consideration such as dams and dikes: the destruction of which could cause massive flooding.

However, this would obviously be a huge escalation that might be seen as heinous even in response to chemical weapons use against civilians. Not to mention it of course encourages the CSA to do the same. So I'd imagine the SSR's military and civilian leadership is divided as to how far to take the response.

KnightofTempest said:
That kind of defeats the spirit of the scenario, doesn't it? The Strategic Ban was meant to avoid everyone nuking each other willy nilly as so often happens in these games because nobody here knows the meaning of the word de-escalation
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The mere existence of nuclear weapons always invites the possibility that they will be used.

The only 100% guaranteed way to avoid nuclear war is not to have them.
 
Heavy W. Guy said:
I mean, a nuclear weapon of the same rough strength as the ones used on Hiroshima and Nagasaki could still inflict considerable devastation on an urban area if used. It just wouldn't be the civilisation-destroyer that later nuclear weapons are.

It sounds a lot like the level of nuclear weapons is more to the level of fission bombs rather than fusion bombs which is a huge difference in terms of power. Not to mention several developments such as MIRVs which massively increase the destructive capability of nuclear weapons were probably never made ITTL.



I mean, if we're going all-out, certain bits of infrastructure might also be under consideration such as dams and dikes: the destruction of which could cause massive flooding.

However, this would obviously be a huge escalation that might be seen as heinous even in response to chemical weapons use against civilians. Not to mention it of course encourages the CSA to do the same. So I'd imagine the SSR's military and civilian leadership is divided as to how far to take the response.



The mere existence of nuclear weapons always invites the possibility that they will be used.

The only 100% guaranteed way to avoid nuclear war is not to have them.
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The problem is that our playerbase can't de-escalate. WMD's kill games just as surely as OOC Drama does
 
KnightofTempest said:
However, this would obviously be a huge escalation that might be seen as heinous even in response to chemical weapons use against civilians. Not to mention it of course encourages the CSA to do the same. So I'd imagine the SSR's military and civilian leadership is divided as to how far to take the response.
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I don't believe my IC at any point suggested a nuclear strike was on the table at the moment.

The IC served as primarily a warning to both the Confederacy and nations around the conflict that action needs to be taken in order to avoid a nuclear disaster. There aren't any missiles being prepped for launch, I'm not even sure if I have any nuclear weapons. But even if I didn't I would still threaten to use them.

Also - if you are really worried about nuclear escalation - raise this in the IC thread. That's the whole point.
 
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KnightofTempest said:
The problem is that our playerbase can't de-escalate. WMD's kill games just as surely as OOC Drama does
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People say that, but I don't actually remember the last prominent NG where WMD use happened on any large scale.

Frankly, they're a part of modern politics, if players choose to use them, then we should follow the consequences through to their logical conclusion.
 
I held off on some posts until it was clear that the game was moving forward, good to see we've resolved everything.

Arrow said:
If people are choosing to mod, unless they're doing something specific like mapmod or modding a specific region, they should step down from playing a nation tbh. There's a huge conflict of interest if a North American player is also playing a country in North America.
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Both @Heavy W. Guy and @DonFitz were playing minor American powers; Kentucky was explicitly moving toward unification with the US, and Virginia's room to maneuver was pretty limited following the Kentucky crisis. Their participation in the conflict between the SSR and the CSA is pretty minimal, and I trust both of them to keep things straightened out.
 
btw -- in order to reinforce my impartial status I'm leaving VA on NPC. I'll be Hawaii now.
 
So do we add HumanityDark to all our conversations that had chaoticgenius on them or have they been forwarded?

Also, thank you for your service Cg and wish you the best on your personal matters.
 
Since I should probably at least give a proper reason for dropping out... basically, Britain just has too much stuff it's involved in for me to keep track of and I rapidly burned out.

Like I realized I should probably have been doing something about China, because a massive revolt overthrowing the government that I had a working relationship with is absolutely something I should have been paying attention to and getting involved in...

But I just didn't have the mental energy to pay attention to that and the South Africa mess and the Mesapotamian war and the chaos in the Americas and the brewing German crisis and...

So yeah, if @Bismarck can do better there, best of luck to them, but I found myself staring at the literal pages of notes I had on everyone's geopolitical situation and just sort of giving up.

If nothing else it was an excellent lesson in why governments have fully staffed State Departments and Foreign Offices and so forth...
 
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