One of the Group of Six told Amanda that Shiplords kill any Hive Mind they encounter during Second Contact. I can find the chapter if you'd like.

Ah hell, sorry. Must have slipped through the cracks of my memory. Thanks. Also well done on finally putting into words something that I've been waiting about two years for someone to do. That's no small feat.

@spikethehobbit you chose the right time to come back, though, given your latest post. Finding answers is the largest part of what Secrets' Crusade is all about.
 
These are indeed things that a race as old as the Shiplords could feel towards the Secrets and younger races using them if they're as potent as you've implied. If they are is another matter.

I don't think I've ever said that Shiplords outright kill any hive mind that they come across, but PW is a big thread and my memory isn't perfect. Insight could certainly look into finding one, though the Group of Six isn't aware of any.
I went looking for the name of the expert information-warfare species, and found this:

"None of one mind ever survive the passing of the Shiplords."

That could mean the Shiplords deliberately exterminate hive mind species, or it could mean that the Shiplord process of brutalization towards all species is so inherently destructive to the fabric of a hive mind that they do not survive the process.

I am going to give you exactly one hint. You're focusing too much on specific over general.
Hm.

[Recalibrates]

More generally, the Shiplords clearly don't fear powerful technology, as such. The Fifth enables ships that can match theirs in maneuverability. The Sixth enables utterly ridiculous swarms of ships, based on the Nileans immediately recognizing a "planetary nanoforge" and being able to make accurate estimates of its age. Which strongly implies that the Mercury nanoforge is not the first or only construct of its kind- and the ability to turn a whole planet into spaceships is pretty powerful, and apparently commonplace. The Third, well, that's clearly a powerful asset in its way as well. The Luminaries haven't been exterminated for having it.

The key point being, the Shiplords easily could ban Secrets to an extent that would make it impossible for other races to compete with them. They could enforce a tech ban that would make it literally impossible for any race or coalition in the galaxy to threaten them. Instead, they don't. They do otherwise. Their preferred methods almost certainly involve a lot more work and active subversion because they have to constantly disrupt the formation of hostile coalitions, for the good and simple reason that a galaxy-wide coalition could beat them.

The Shiplords appear convinced that they do not have reason to fear other races developing advanced military technology to whatever extent those races see fit to do so before becoming Uninvolved.

They place bans on recent Tributary races leaving their star system and place bans on the exact manner in which post-Tributary races that have defeated a Tribute Fleet can travel (or rather, loiter) between the stars. But that's still a more flexible First Secret ban- races are not forbidden from having the First Secret entirely.

But they DO rigorously and almost absolutely ban the Second Secret, with much more thoroughness than the First, making an exception only in one known case for a race that was not reproductively viable without it.

Hmmm...

[I don't have an answer yet, but hm.]
 
But they DO rigorously and almost absolutely ban the Second Secret, with much more thoroughness than the First, making an exception only in one known case for a race that was not reproductively viable without it.

The exception for the Confederacy was due to it being a tight-knit multispecies polity built around ideals of a shared existence. Their mods allow them to share worlds with each other, and everything else. They weren't needed for those races to keep on existing.
 
Rain fell upon Oshanta. And the Shiplords swore that this would be the last time. Or to put it the plain way there is a problem with the Secrets in that when they are unrestricted most Races will do things with them when they discover how to do them instead of when they discover how to do them without causing the equivalent of a nuclear meltdown with the specific Secret.
That would still be pretty specific. Combining it with my own observations, the thing the Shiplords are almost certainly trying to control is the Second Secret or something related to it.

This also explains why species that can't kill at least one Shiplord ship during the first encounter are executed since the Shiplords are probably using that as a measuring stick for whether the race can ever even live trough encountering whatever remains of the bad old days in the void between the stars.
The thing is, if that were 'necessary,' why are the Group of Six apparently unaware?

As for why Shiplord outright kill any Hive Mind that is clear at this point since a Hive Mind is basically already an Uninvolved with multiple physical bodies in this existence. In other words a threat to the current order with it's very existence.
There is no evidence that being a hive mind would give a species the kind of 'super-Practice' powers the Uninvolved apparently have (but fear to use for fear of Shiplord attack). Unless they started monkeying around with a collective soul, or unless just having such a soul has that effect. In the latter case, you'd think someone would recognize Practice from some hive mind species apparently having it before the Shiplords killed them all.

The exception for the Confederacy was due to it being a tight-knit multispecies polity built around ideals of a shared existence. Their mods allow them to share worlds with each other, and everything else. They weren't needed for those races to keep on existing.
Ah. I misremembered. However, that's still a very delimited use of the Second Secret- I imagine the Shiplords hedged it about with all sorts of regulations and constraints.

So it doesn't really tie into the Second Secret's true potential as a thing the Shiplords might be afraid of, which almost certainly would revolve around its potential for creation of entirely new orders of intelligent life including both AI and complex powerful bioforms.
 
That would still be pretty specific. Combining it with my own observations, the thing the Shiplords are almost certainly trying to control is the Second Secret or something related to it.

The thing is, if that were 'necessary,' why are the Group of Six apparently unaware?

There is no evidence that being a hive mind would give a species the kind of 'super-Practice' powers the Uninvolved apparently have (but fear to use for fear of Shiplord attack). Unless they started monkeying around with a collective soul, or unless just having such a soul has that effect. In the latter case, you'd think someone would recognize Practice from some hive mind species apparently having it before the Shiplords killed them all.

Ah. I misremembered. However, that's still a very delimited use of the Second Secret- I imagine the Shiplords hedged it about with all sorts of regulations and constraints.

So it doesn't really tie into the Second Secret's true potential as a thing the Shiplords might be afraid of, which almost certainly would revolve around its potential for creation of entirely new orders of intelligent life including both AI and complex powerful bioforms.
o_O 👇
Ah hell, sorry. Must have slipped through the cracks of my memory. Thanks. Also well done on finally putting into words something that I've been waiting about two years for someone to do. That's no small feat.

At least analyze this comment by the OP as well if you want to keep to your own theory.
 
o_O 👇


At least analyze this comment by the OP as well if you want to keep to your own theory.
Look, my responses are a bit scattered because of how my computer displayed posts and my brains being scrambled from work. Give me a break and let me figure out what's going on here?

[thinks]

OK, um.

My original theory has basically evolved into "there is something about the Second Secret and its power to create, in particular, that the Shiplords fear in a way they do not fear the other Secrets." I feel that this is a necessity because otherwise it's hard to explain why this is the only Secret the Shiplords outright ban (with one carefully delimited exception known to us).

If the Shiplords were trying to stop races from becoming to militarily powerful or from building up huge piles of tech, they'd probably ban one or more of the Third, Fifth, and Sixth Secrets.

If ALL the Secrets were predictably dangerous they'd have expressed bans on ones we've never heard of (if I remember @Snowfire correctly, there are eight, and we only know what five of them do).

I think the Second Secret is potentially much more dangerous to the Shiplords than the others, in some way we don't fully understand but may be able to guess at.

...

Your theory is basically "the Shiplords are trying to prevent some old horror from re-emerging," and my theory is basically "the old horror has to do with the one Secret the Shiplords almost never let anyone touch in any way."

I don't see a conflict now that I think about it?
 
My original theory has basically evolved into "there is something about the Second Secret and its power to create, in particular, that the Shiplords fear in a way they do not fear the other Secrets." I feel that this is a necessity because otherwise it's hard to explain why this is the only Secret the Shiplords outright ban (with one carefully delimited exception known to us).
The most answer on that front is that it's related to souls.

I find it telling that some unknown factor is preventing non-Shiplord species from developing true AIs (until humanity cheated their way up the tech tree), and as far as we can tell, the only ways to artificially create brand new souls through means other than natural reproduction are AI and the Second Secret.

And during Second Contact it was mentioned that it feels as if there's a hidden ban on AI (which could just mean that other bans prevent species from finding the path to it).
 
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Look, my responses are a bit scattered because of how my computer displayed posts and my brains being scrambled from work. Give me a break and let me figure out what's going on here?

[thinks]

OK, um.

My original theory has basically evolved into "there is something about the Second Secret and its power to create, in particular, that the Shiplords fear in a way they do not fear the other Secrets." I feel that this is a necessity because otherwise it's hard to explain why this is the only Secret the Shiplords outright ban (with one carefully delimited exception known to us).

If the Shiplords were trying to stop races from becoming to militarily powerful or from building up huge piles of tech, they'd probably ban one or more of the Third, Fifth, and Sixth Secrets.

If ALL the Secrets were predictably dangerous they'd have expressed bans on ones we've never heard of (if I remember @Snowfire correctly, there are eight, and we only know what five of them do).

I think the Second Secret is potentially much more dangerous to the Shiplords than the others, in some way we don't fully understand but may be able to guess at.

...

Your theory is basically "the Shiplords are trying to prevent some old horror from re-emerging," and my theory is basically "the old horror has to do with the one Secret the Shiplords almost never let anyone touch in any way."

I don't see a conflict now that I think about it?

It's about the soul. It's always been about the soul. You can't know Secret without also getting proof that the soul exists. Also:

The existence and deeper mechanics of the soul breaks this. Iris can have biological kids. They'd be human.

Iris' soul is Human. So what you are saying about the Second Secret is technically correct in that the Second Secret is the most easily abused to get to soul modifications (and lets not forget that the Second Secret is the reason Practice is a thing since it created Dragons) and cause the clusterfuck the Shiplords are afraid of. Don't forget that advancing too fast and/or in the wrong way is also reason for a Shiplord Warfleet to give a species an Exterminatus.
 
It's about the soul. It's always been about the soul. You can't know Secret without also getting proof that the soul exists.
I can certainly buy the thing the Shiplords are afraid of having to do with 'crazy' experimentation into soul mechanics.

Also:

Iris' soul is Human. So what you are saying about the Second Secret is technically correct in that the Second Secret is the most easily abused to get to soul modifications (and lets not forget that the Second Secret is the reason Practice is a thing since it created Dragons) and cause the clusterfuck the Shiplords are afraid of.
Well, yes. I don't think the other Secrets are considered remotely the same tier of threat, really, with the possible exception of the First- which could be used to evade Shiplord monitoring.

The Sixth? About the worst thing you can plausibly do with the Sixth is create some kind of von Neumann swarm, and if the Shiplords were worried about that they wouldn't tolerate the continued existence of planetary nanoforges besides their own. @Snowfire , just to clarify about that, the Nileans clearly recognized the Mercury nanoforge for what it was, on terms that suggested that they are familiar with such constructions by type. Is this something that a significant fraction of known younger races eventually develop, assuming they unlock the Sixth? How well known are such things to the Nileans, and how common are they, roughly? Do the Shiplords have a habit of descending upon them in wrath? Am I wrong about this?

And the Fifth? I dunno, maybe you could somehow fuck up and accidentally create a black hole. Likewise the Third; neither is obvious as a potential interstellar threat that the Shiplords would have any trouble handling or that could pose an existential threat to them, except of the old-school "someone builds up a ton of weapons and beats the shit out of us" variety.

The Fourth, Seventh, and Eighth might be different in that regard- but then, the fact that the Shiplords didn't even bother to tell us not to investigate those, and do not forbid a species from learning new Secrets, suggests otherwise.

Don't forget that advancing too fast and/or in the wrong way is also reason for a Shiplord Warfleet to give a species an Exterminatus.
I mean, in fairness yes- but the Shiplords only seem to be doing that to species they doubt their own ability to monitor and control- that's why species that advance too fast get targeted this way. A species that can grow exponentially in power over the 10-20 years of a typical Shiplord decision loop that leads from one fleet's arrival to the next... well, that's a species that the Shiplords can never be sure they've got under control. And yet at the same time, the Shiplords have tolerated the existence of a galactic state of affairs where if the various other species subjugated by them could all rise up at once, they would be in great danger of being overthrown.

...

What it comes down to is that the Shiplords seem to have two largely separate motivations for enforcing restrictions on the galaxy and brutalizing it via the tribute system.

One is the desire to ensure the conventional military security of their race. They obviously take that seriously, but the limit on how seriously they take it is constrained by @Snowfire 's canon statement that they accept a level of galactic development where if everyone dogpiled on them they could very well lose. They don't have to accept such a state of affairs, and they're certainly ruthless enough to use force to prevent such a thing from happening if they don't want to.

The other is clearly the desire to avert some esoteric threat, something weird and unknown whose very possibility they try to keep hidden from the younger races. That is probably the explanation for the Second Secret ban, and the thing that you've been talking about is likely related IMO.

The combination of how the Second gives its users more access to soul engineering and the power to create life (including machine life; AIs in this setting are pretty powerful and a real threat to their enemies), and how it is specifically the Secret the Shiplords are most inflexible about banning, is probably not a coincidence.
 
@Snowfire , just to clarify about that, the Nileans clearly recognized the Mercury nanoforge for what it was, on terms that suggested that they are familiar with such constructions by type. Is this something that a significant fraction of known younger races eventually develop, assuming they unlock the Sixth? How well known are such things to the Nileans, and how common are they, roughly? Do the Shiplords have a habit of descending upon them in wrath? Am I wrong about this?

They're relatively significant resource sinks to produce and, really, you don't need more than a few. But most polities of note will have at least a couple, yes.

Now, let's have a look at the vote.

Vote Tally : The Secrets' Crusade Original - Sci-Fi | Page 19 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 476-520]
##### NetTally 3.0.3
Task: Mary
[15][Mary] Yes
[3][Mary] No


——————————————————————————————————————————————
Task: Begin
[13][Begin] Write-in: Start at the beginning - 'I need to tell you as it happened, so we can discuss afterwards what it means from different point of view. That being said - last night, I had a dream that wasn't. What it actually was was ...'. After telling the tale, highlight the pertinent points, and let our president decide where to start.
[5][Begin] To Give Freedom – The Uninvolved are beings of vast power, you know this, but the truth of their ability to wield that power is very different. So different, in fact, that humanity is capable of offering them something. Explain the Shiplord web, why the Uninvolved fear them, and how humanity might be able to change that.
[1][Begin] A New Shape – Get the bombshell out of the way. That there might be another way out of this war, and that the Uninvolved are offering you a way to find it. It needs said. Everything else is secondary.

Total No. of Voters: 20

Looking pretty conclusive, but I'll leave this up until at least tomorrow before I close it out.
 
They're relatively significant resource sinks to produce and, really, you don't need more than a few...
I mean yeah, they're significant resource sinks, but then they turn into a goddamn resource fountain afterwards. Even by the thousand-year timescales younger races think on in this setting, people are playing a long enough game that the investment is justified.

If they're reasonably common then, that sort of underlines my point that the worst immediately plausible scenarios I can think of for "Sixth Secret gone wrong" are something the Shiplords would probably yawn about.
 
[X][Mary] Yes
[X][Begin] Write-in: Start at the beginning - 'I need to tell you as it happened, so we can discuss afterwards what it means from different point of view. That being said - last night, I had a dream that wasn't. What it actually was was ...'. After telling the tale, highlight the pertinent points, and let our president decide where to start.
 
X][Mary] Yes
[X][Begin] Write-in: Start at the beginning - 'I need to tell you as it happened, so we can discuss afterwards what it means from different point of view. That being said - last night, I had a dream that wasn't. What it actually was was ...'. After telling the tale, highlight the pertinent points, and let our president decide where to start.
 
Hi!

I've been following the Practice War for... a long time? Not the beginning, but I honestly can't recall just when.

(I got here from the banner ad. "Could this have anything to do with The Practice Effect?" I asked myself, and yes it did!)

I've never joined in before because... well, to be honest, the whole thing was kind of overwhelming and I've never felt qualified to so much as comment, never mind vote.

...now I kind of do though, because I think I saw something that everyone else has misread, and if I'm right it's going to color interactions with the Tahkel in a way that might at minimum be embarrassing for humanity?

(If I'm wrong, then I'll be embarrassed enough to probably creep back into hiding.)

"Those who were old when the oldest among us now were young," Tahkel replied, and something flickered in those brilliant eyes. "Our lifespans are not infinite. We begin anew, grow, change, age, and then fade. If it was not the case, then we would know why the Shiplords did what they did."

@Snowfire , am I right from reading this and a later fragment that the Tahkel can and do reproduce in their Uninvolved state? That as a whole they aren't in any particular danger of dying out due to racial senescence?

... anyway, thank you @Snowfire and crew for an amazing quest, and even if I never speak up here again, know that I'll be cheering you all on quietly. :ninja:
 
@Snowfire , am I right from reading this and a later fragment that the Tahkel can and do reproduce in their Uninvolved state? That as a whole they aren't in any particular danger of dying out due to racial senescence?

... anyway, thank you @Snowfire and crew for an amazing quest, and even if I never speak up here again, know that I'll be cheering you all on quietly. :ninja:

That's certainly a way of looking at it. From what Amanda got from the gestalt that was shared with her, however, it's not what happens. Her best guess is that they start life anew after becoming an Uninvolved, grow, change, age, and then fade out of existence/into another level of existence entirely/go into hibernation. She's not really sure which, assuming she's right. That said, that's a really interesting perspective to pull from that line! Kudos to you! I hope you continue to cheer us on, and maybe even get involved on occasion. I'm really glad you've enjoyed things thus far.

An update on the next section: I'm into the in-depth explanation, which I'm skimming heavily except the points where Adriana or her Cabinet have specific questions to ask. New semester starts tomorrow, but that proved a motivator more than anything else. That I'm maintaining a reasonably steady wordcount seems good, too. Expect the update sometime in the next day or two. Due to the option which won the last vote, you're skipping a bit forward in the decision chain for this section, which could make the next vote a bit more important that I'd initially been planning. Part of the charm of write-ins is how they can often move stories on in their own ways. This certainly appears to have been the case here.
 
Yeah. I think the big point here is that Amanda has consciously chosen not to spin the narrative- to make this a "just the facts, ma'am" approach.

I feel like this is good for the whole "avert turning into the Divine Empress of Humanity" goal the quest has historically had regarding Amanda. We're playing the role, not of the national leader, but of the national leader's court sorceress (so to speak) who just had a really important vision... but one whose implications for national policy are not hers to decide even if she obviously has influence on them.
 
@Snowfire , am I right from reading this and a later fragment that the Tahkel can and do reproduce in their Uninvolved state? That as a whole they aren't in any particular danger of dying out due to racial senescence?
It read to me like they get reformatted towards the 'end' of their lifespan, to begin anew, possibly when theres too much memories and experience to continue as a coherent entity anymore.
 
It read to me like they get reformatted towards the 'end' of their lifespan, to begin anew, possibly when theres too much memories and experience to continue as a coherent entity anymore.
Hm. I think we may be getting overliteral about "begin anew," especially since that kind of reformatting would tend to wash away the Shiplord traumatization that we infer is a major factor in keeping the Uninvolved, well, uninvolved.

The parsimonious explanation is that Uninvolved racial gestalt entities have a natural 'lifecycle' on the order of a hundred thousand years long, in which they are created by the mass consensual ascension of a species, exist for a time, and then gradually dissipate/senesce/cease.

Though the next time we interact with an Uninvolved, it might be worthwhile to seek clarification on this point.
 
Yeah, the "begin anew" definitely seems like the "born again" type of poetic phrase for the process of becoming Uninvolved - which sorta makes sense because IIRC the process for becoming Uninvolved is very spiritually/philosophically rooted and seems like it may involve picking out a new collective self-identity.

I'm actually more interested in the "grow" part of that sentence, because unless there's some sort of freaky soul on soul action going on each Uninvolved isn't adding to its population because they don't have bodies to make babies with. That implies growth is more in the sense of their souls getting stronger/more experienced, with the follow on implication that the aging process they have might well be a sort of "I'm old because I feel old" type thing. Especially since it comes after "change", like some sort of spiritual mid-life crisis.
 
First week of this semester was actually busy. Update is done, currently sent to betas for checking. Will have it up tonight.
 
A Dream of Beginnings
"Please?" You asked your oldest friend as she stood there beside you before the bulkhead of shining metal. Both of you had been here before, yet now she was unsure if she should take the step forward. But she should be here for this, and not just for what you had to say. "You know they'll be asking for you if you don't."

She flushed, but it was nothing that wasn't true. Mary was humanity's foremost expert in soul science. Not having her present would only require the opening of the security seal once you were finished explaining things. Better to have her there throughout. And your invitation had never specified just you. Had that been Adriana's way of offering, without requirement? It felt like her brand of cleverness. Thoughtful of her.

"You're sure?" She asked. Her green eyes reflected total trust, but there was concern as to the wider implications there, too. It was a reasonable fear, but unfounded in this case. Assuming you were reading things right, at least.

"I am," you said firmly. And that was, well, that. Your friend nodded once, her eyes very bright. Then she stepped up to your side, took a breath, and you stepped through the bulkhead door together. It sealed behind you, and the room's security systems spun up to full power. It took a little while, long enough for you to approach the table and greet Adriana, before Iris spoke to confirm it.

"We're all locked up, Madam President," she said formally. She sounded a little distracted from where she was standing behind you, but she was operating this system for the very first time. Test runs weren't the same. And this was quite the audience.

"Thank you, Iris," Adriana nodded, before her attention returned to you, expectant. She already knew a little; Sidra had briefed her in as much as they could. But, even then…it might be better to just start at the beginning. Get things grounded, and then let those who would have to make much larger decisions take it from there. Though you had the sneaking suspicion that you'd end up much more involved in those, at least where this was concerned, in the weeks and months ahead. You were too…involved. The thought prompted a chuckle.

Then you met the gaze of your friend, having taken in the line of Ministers. Lina was there, seemingly recovered from the battle, and looking much better for it. You imagined she might have had a whole hour of sleep. The others you didn't know as well, but what you did know would be enough.

"I know there was a briefing packet sent to you," you began steadily, "but for the avoidance of any doubt, I think I need to tell you this as it happened." The discussion would come later. Right now, these people needed to know what you'd experienced, in detail. "Last night, after the battle, I had a dream that wasn't. For the benefit of the Ministry of Security, Siddhartha can confirm that what I experienced was not the fruit of imagination." The man sitting two places to the left of Adriana nodded once, though their expression revealed little. You took that as motion to continue.

"What actually took place last night was a First Contact with an Uninvolved, acting as spokesperson for their," you paused, realising that there was no real word for what you needed to say. "For those who share that existence," you said at last. "They greeted me with a gestalt of their existence, similar to the opening of my shared Reverie with Observer Lorelli. And caught my attention further with their words of introduction. That they wished to speak, of events that had transpired, and of how the war to which we have now committed ourselves might end."

You didn't need to say anything more in that vein; the words of Tahkel served perfectly. And the implications of those words were just as effective now, to his audience, as they had been to you. Perhaps that had been deliberate on more levels than one, to aid in your own explanations. But perhaps not. The nature of an Uninvolved did not appear to lend itself to deception, nor manipulation, but your instincts were as fallible as any others.

From there, your own explanation flowed naturally, through the motions that you had charted. Your own questions, of the Uninvolved and more. Why they had never acted, never communicated, and the…convenient nature of their timing in approaching humanity now. You couldn't answer everything; you'd known that would be the case going in. But you could offer more than you word, at least for the future.

"They promised to make contact with Insight, if Phoebe seeks them out," you explained in reply to the head of the State Department, noting with some amusement the glint of interest in the woman's grey eyes. Her department hadn't had a great deal to do in the leadup to the Third Battle of Sol, and this was an entirely new area of diplomacy to explore. Given her past involvement in founding the Diplomatic Corps, you'd expected that. "I made it clear in our conversation that whilst I could bring their case to you I was not a leader of humanity. Not anymore."

"What are they offering, then?" Lina asked, her face set in a thin line. She was finding it difficult to accept an offer of help on the heels of the losses the FSN had taken in the Third Battle of Sol. It had been difficult for you, too, but the pain in Tahkel's communications had been too real to truly hold that against them. Yet that had been your experience, and those words would not help Lina right now.

"A great deal, I believe, though not everything we might wish," you admitted. "There are many things, at least where the Secrets are involved, where they cannot offer aid for fear of drawing the attention of the Shiplords, damaging the recipient, or both. But they possess knowledge that can help us, too."

:Sidra, if you would?: You asked.

:Of course.: The Unison Intelligence connected to the room's central display console and activated it. The familiar spirals of the Milky Way took shape above the projector, but there were some new additions to the image. Dots of red light blinked steadily across it, their frequency split between two major categories. A moment later, a handful of violet icons joined them, burning steadily.

You took a moment to thank Sidra, then gestured towards the display. "The red dots represent the locations of every Shiplord relay station and fleet base in the outer spiral, as of last night. Tahkel included some deployment figures, too, though they're not complete. And these," you highlighted one of the unblinking purple symbols, "are the locations of every War Fleet that the Shiplords currently possess."

Twelve lights, to represent the most lethal concentrations of applicable force in the galaxy. It was at once a little underwhelming, and subtly terrifying. "Tahkel's best estimate puts the closest one to us less than two weeks away at maximum jump rate. However," you added quickly, countering the descent into deathly silence, "War Fleets rarely use their maximum jump rate to reach a combat zone, due to logistical and maintenance concerns. A more reliable estimate would be four to six months. Not long, I admit, but a calculation made without considering how the Shiplords will react to the Group of Six rebelling against their control."

"They could choose to expedite that transit, deal with us quickly before handling issues closer to home," Lina pointed out, her face drawn. Yet behind that concern was the same mind that had led humanity to victory twice against the Shiplords. You could almost see the steady calculation, as she tried to work out what projects could be folded into completion of the Orrery. Then she nodded.

"It'll be close, but as long as they don't burn here at max, I think we can do it." Adriana looked over at her, questioning, and Lina shrugged. "I didn't say it would be easy, Adriana. But the hardest to build part of the Orrery is already finished. It might be rudimentary, but so long as the theory behind the idea actually works, it'll suffice. We've got the construction capacity at the Ministerial level, though more would always be appreciated."

"I'll see what we can shake loose, Lina," Nathaniel, Adriana's replacement as head of the Home Office, said. The sandy-haired man had come up through the Home Office directly and worked hard to prove himself a worthy successor. He'd yet to disappoint. "But the Orrery is survival- critical. There are plenty of plans that can be pushed back for that."

"That would be appreciated," Lina said thankfully. "I'd rather have the Fleet restored before we have to fight a War Fleet." Adriana nodded, a small smile on her face as she did so. A very familiar one, in fact. You were certain you'd worn it during your own time as President, given how the competence of your cabinet had played such an extensive role in your successes then. It was good to see that Adriana had found her own.

"As useful as this information stands to be, however," Adriana's Security Minister noted, "I believe there is more to this story." You nodded in reply. "Then please, go on."

You did so.

By the end of the rest, your audience was almost uniformly grim faced, despite the sparks of hope hiding behind the eyes of a few of them. They all knew the score as Insight had given it, that victory against the Shiplords in a military conflict would be utterly devastating. Yet for another option to be offered so easily, even if truly wasn't easy, was difficult to trust. At the same time, the possibility of a way out of the predicted catastrophe was equally difficult to ignore. Even if the Uninvolved were wrong, knowing more of your enemy could be incredibly valuable.

"And you're absolutely certain?" It wasn't what Lina was focused on, however. "They can use the Artefact you created to build a drive that can jump without restrictions?"

"Tahkel believes so," you replied carefully. "They could do a great deal more, no doubt, but creations like that Artefact should allow them to act in reality to some degree without triggering the Shiplord detection web - what we may reasonably assume caught Insight's Thoughtcast before the Second Battle of Sol."

"Can you replicate them?" Lina asked, almost demanded, really.

"I," you shrugged helplessly. "I don't know, Lina. We've spent years trying to just understand that thing. Now that we know what it is, that might be easier. But replication? I don't know. We'd need time to break down how it does what it does, and given the complexity of what we're talking about here," you looked over at Mary. Your friend had been silent through the entire discussion thus far, but this was more her field than yours. She caught the look, chuckled once, then nodded.

"The issue, Lina," Mary said softly, "is that the nature of how the crystal allows for interaction without detection isn't understood. We know that Potentials can influence the world around them without detection, but that's a result of their souls being anchored to reality. The crystal allows for the same thing, in a limited sense. But the workings of that process…we'd need to observe an Uninvolved working through it to get a good idea. And I'm not sure if that's a process that could be reversed."

"We've been working on soul science for a while, Mary," Adriana said, but Mary's abortive headshake brought her to a stop.

"Not like this," she said. "Adriana, this is like the difference between…between a flintlock cannon and one of the FSN's latest generation grav disruptors. They're both weapons, yes, but one is so much more complicated than the other. I'm not sure if we have the mastery to make sense of this, yet. We can try, and of course we will, but this opportunity seems time limited."

"That's," Adri sighed, "true, yes. Damn. They aren't making this easy."

"The fact that it isn't," the Minister of Security pointed out, almost grudgingly, "is almost a good thing. The fact that it would require one of our most potent Potentials to be detached for an indeterminate period is certainly less than optimal, however."

"As well as the personnel necessary to support you," Lina added, very loudly not mentioning the realisation that you'd already come to that you'd only keep your immediate family out of this through by force. Which you weren't willing to do, especially when both could argue that there were valid reasons for their presence. Good ones, too.

There was a long silence after that, as everyone in the room processed those implications. "I'm not sure we can afford to ignore it, though," Adriana said heavily. "The UPI report gave us a good chance of victory, but if there's another one out there? We owe it to everyone we're about to ask to die to try and find it." There was a resolution behind the younger woman's eyes that you'd only ever seen a handful of times before.

"Amanda," she asked then. "Do you believe that this is worth it? I know there are reasons you trust this interaction, beyond our own. We all know the risk that we'd be courting in doing this, in sending you so deep into Shiplord territory in search of secrets they've kept hidden for millions of years. Are you willing to take those risks?"

You looked over at Mary, back to Iris, and saw through the worry and fear on their faces a match to the resolution in Adriana's eyes. They knew why this was important, just as you did. What more could you do, but answer?

What do you sa Vote aborted by previous character choices.

"How could I do anything less?" You asked gently, adding your own resolve to the room. Adriana bowed her head, but you could tell she'd expected that answer.

"We'll need to confirm things with an Insight link, but assuming that works," it would, you knew, though you understood the need to confirm it. "Then I believe we will have to fit out the Adamant for your mission." You blinked. That was moving much faster than you'd expected. "Lina, how long?"

"It's a frigate analogue. I can have a berth for it tomorrow. It'll have to be a custom job, though." She considered her own words a moment. "A week, maybe two. Two more for a proper shakedown; we can't risk design faults here."

"What about looking into replication of the interface Artefact?" Nathaniel asked, and Lina grimaced.

"Depends on how long that might take." She looked between Mary and the current Minister for Science. "Mary, Anna? Any ideas how long that might take for an evaluation?"

"This is more Mary's bailiwick than mine," Anna replied.

"Assuming we throw everything at it? I think we could get a basic evaluation in a few months. More time would be better, but it might be better to get us on our way before the War Fleet gets here. Just in case."

"Wait," you said at last, finding a moment to speak between the chatter. "Adriana, Mary, Lina? You're really wanting to," you stumbled to a halt as the entire room speared you with a shared look. "Ok," you conceded, "I'm not really anyone to talk where taking leaps of faith are concerned, am I."

"Not particularly," Mary said, her voice gentle. "But you should be involved in this too, Mandy. You've heard our timelines. What do you think?" Way to turn that back on you, you thought, but only quietly. What was the optimal timeline? And hadn't you resigned the Presidency to get away from choices like this?

How much preparation time does Amanda believe the mission into Shiplord space should take? You must define a time here, as Amanda is an involved party in this decision process. If you choose to leave ahead of the War Fleet, you will not be back in time to defend against it. No write-ins this time.
[] Shakedown – Depart as soon as design, construction and shakedown of the
Adamant are complete. 1 month. Will leave little time for research, but makes departure ahead of any War Fleet assault all but certain.
[] Evaluation – Remain for long enough to complete a proper evaluation of the Void Crystal, now that you have some idea of what it does. 2-3 months, depending on rolls. Good chance of being gone before the War Fleet hits.
[] Implacable – Delay your departure until after the War Fleet assault has been handled. May take up to six months. May allow for more research time, but could also add significant delay to a potentially critical investigation. Ensures your participation in the Fourth Battle of Sol.


There will be an 12 hour moratorium on this vote.
 
My apology for taking so long on this is both heartfelt and obligatory. Opening to second semester was a little bit more hectic than planned, and then I had a long weekend full of non-studies work to deal with. But that's done - for now - so here we are. This is what I meant when I said that the route you were taking was jumping us straight towards the end of this section. Not something I expected, but also not something I can really do anything about. What shall become very obvious in this update is the direction that this story is going to take, in how I've shaped things. Whilst military victory for humanity and the rest of the Group of Seven is possible, the way humanity works will push them to try and find another option. To be clear, any such option will not be acceptable if it allows the current status quo to continue. But the possibility of another way is worth risking the few hundred lives required to staff a frigate. Even when some of those lives might be incredibly valuable.

Also, yeah, you're not keeping Iris or Mary from going with you on this. They're both too stubborn, and both of them have completely valid and rather effective reasons for coming along. Once you define time, there will be another section covering the wrap-up of this section, and then everyone's favourite part of any quest! Voting for what pieces of highly important gear to take along with you when you have a limited amount of space available to mount it all :V

Many thanks go to @Coda for betaing this for me. Any errors that remain are the fault of google docs throwing a hissy fit and refusing to parse suggestions after a version restore. I'll make a post to tell you all when voting opens. Now, I sleep.
An update before midnight, what is this, sanity?
 
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I'm very torn on this.

Obviously, getting whatever info is there sooner is great, and trying to analyze the void crystal more so that it can be replicated is amazing too, but there's another major concern I have.

The possibility of Iris not being around when the first War Fleet arrives.

Vision was able to defend our networks against the Regular Fleet's assault alone, but we have no idea how much more powerful the network assaults of a War Fleet will be, and damage to our networks would be disastrous to the Orrey, which is essential to our ability to survive the encounter.
 
[ ] Evaluation – Remain for long enough to complete a proper evaluation of the Void Crystal, now that you have some idea of what it does. 2-3 months, depending on rolls. Good chance of being gone before the War Fleet hits.

To paraphrase from Naruto Abridged; among the benefits of being a main character is that they can hare off on plot-relevant adventures rather than stick around and do boring stuff like build infrastructure or fight off elite mooks threatening your home. :V
 
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