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The Secrets' Crusade

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[x] What is your goal?

Because, even though they may be opposed to the Shiplords, that doesn't mean that they want the same thing as we do. Also, a re-wording to make it work better of "what do you want", since the Vorlons already snuck a question in.
 
[x] Why should we listen to you?

They knew that and more, and they've done nothing so far. They couldn't help themselves, so what makes them think they know what they are doing?
 
On a re-read, it might be interesting to note that they didn't actually say that they could end the war, more along the lines of they knew how the war might end. Though the implications that they may be of some use are certainly here. (Especially when the Shiplords' soul weapons are brought up, maybe something to do with the Uninvolved? Though that doesn't really make much sense, given that I think it's been mentioned the Shiplords are trying to promote Uninvolved factions).

Especially given what we know of the Uninvolved so far - they're the ones who gave up, essentially. So why should their help be so important? How can they help? What do they know?

I think these are a few important questions, or at least change the conversation tone to something less accusatory and more open to learning useful information.

[X] All of them - who are you, why now, why should I trust you, what do you really want? Send it as a gestalt.

Edit 2: Here's to all the answers!
 
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Honestly, my inclination is a fusion of two questions:

[X] Why us, and why now?

Please understand - this is not so immediate as "why humans" and "why after 3rd Battle of Sol"... The answers to those would be "because Practice" and "no more time left to waste", as my inner cynic tells me. No, this is a lot more encompassing.

It is a question about why didn't they choose any champions before, or at least - none that we know of.
It is a question about what makes all those who could have been their champions in the eons past, less suitable than humans now.
It is a question about whether there were any other champion candidates, others with Practice or similar abilities.
It is a question about what was it that truly changed, what brought it all together that they HAVE to act now, in this era*, when they didn't before.

A question about both the past of the galaxy, and of its current state.

*I acknowledge that humanity may not have been the most pertinent factor, even. For all we know, suitable champions have risen in the past, but they didn't have any good allies, like we would now, to be able to bridge the gap between them and Shiplords, and that which lies beyond Shiplords.
 
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[X] All of them - who are you, why now, why should I trust you, what do you really want? Send it as a gestalt.
//
The SL do warn about the stuff that's at home in the dark, and the regulars told us 'you don't have much time'. I'm not sure about the blind trust thing for the sudden dream visitation thingie.
 
MTB said:
[X] All of them - who are you, why now, why should I trust you, what do you really want? Send it as a gestalt.
//
The SL do warn about the stuff that's at home in the dark, and the regulars told us 'you don't have much time'. I'm not sure about the blind trust thing for the sudden dream visitation thingie.
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I will make a point of saying that this is a valid vote, specifically due to how you've phrased it. However, Amanda is not altogether sure how to transmit those as a gestalt herself - Sidra usually does this for her. She is entirely willing to try, but things might get a little muddled in doing so. There will be a roll on that, in other words.
 
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Fake Sight said:
Would the nature of Speaking grant Amanda any benefits here, due to experience? Or is the properties of Gestalt messaging a little too different a field.
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The precise mechanics are somewhat different, but the basic process of transmitting the right interpretation of the right concepts as she's learnt to do with the Speaking would be very relevant. So yes, that would help.
 
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[X] All of them - who are you, why now, why should I trust you, what do you really want? Send it as a gestalt.
 
As for "Why have you waited this long".

I've little doubt that they'd have acted sooner, the problem is that in escaping the Shiplords ability to hurt them on a whim, they essentially made themselves more vulnerable to those Soulrending weapons that they used on us. A being of Pure Soul and Thought is going to be fucked up far more by a weapon that attacks both after all, and any time they act where the Shiplords can reach, they risk getting fucked by those. Remember after all that Practice was an OCP--but we know they had protocols against the Uninvolved getting involved, and those were the soulrending weapons--if I'm not mistaken, their acting theory was--indeed--that an Uninvolved had started mucking around and needed to be reminded why the Shiplords reign supreme.

The answer I think then is the same as it is for the other races.

"Until you, we thought it was futile"
 
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Alectai said:
As for "Why have you waited this long".

I've little doubt that they'd have acted sooner, the problem is that in escaping the Shiplords ability to hurt them on a whim, they essentially made themselves more vulnerable to those Soulrending weapons that they used on us. A being of Pure Soul and Thought is going to be fucked up far more by a weapon that attacks both after all, and any time they act where the Shiplords can reach, they risk getting fucked by those. Remember after all that Practice was an OCP--but we know they had protocols against the Uninvolved getting involved, and those were the soulrending weapons--if I'm not mistaken, their acting theory was--indeed--that an Uninvolved had started mucking around and needed to be reminded why the Shiplords reign supreme.

The answer I think then is the same as it is for the other races.

"Until you, we thought it was futile"
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Would be nice to get it IC. 'We need a lifeform we connect to, and Practice doesn't come around too often' would be another.
 
Alectai said:
As for "Why have you waited this long".

I've little doubt that they'd have acted sooner, the problem is that in escaping the Shiplords ability to hurt them on a whim, they essentially made themselves more vulnerable to those Soulrending weapons that they used on us. A being of Pure Soul and Thought is going to be fucked up far more by a weapon that attacks both after all, and any time they act where the Shiplords can reach, they risk getting fucked by those. Remember after all that Practice was an OCP--but we know they had protocols against the Uninvolved getting involved, and those were the soulrending weapons--if I'm not mistaken, their acting theory was--indeed--that an Uninvolved had started mucking around and needed to be reminded why the Shiplords reign supreme.

The answer I think then is the same as it is for the other races.

"Until you, we thought it was futile"
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I...ok, yeah. At this point, given what Amanda is aware of, you can take it as read that she's working towards that realisation by herself. If you don't specifically ask the question here, it's highly likely that she'll realise that the weaponry that the Shiplords have must be at least part of the reason that the Uninvolved can't or don't act. That said, she's not all the way there yet - this conversation will hopefully be a catalyst for that. I'm replying directly here because the conclusion is, as you've put it, pretty darn obvious and dancing around the point just serves no purpose, IMO.

As @MTB has said, though, getting direct confirmation of that IC would be pretty important, and could also give you some information about Practice - if other races have ever had it, for example. And there is quite a bit more going on in Uninvolved society in regards to humanity, with a lot of discussion having taken place to get them here. For those curious or new to the thread, the end of this interlude and all of this one from Practice War could help give this matter some context. Though I expect a reread with what I've said above could also prove informative for those who have been reading since the beginning.
 
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It's like I said.

Who they are is, for practical purposes, apparent. What they want and why we should listen to them, they will predictably make apparent during the conversation because they presumably contacted us with a goal in mind.

But why they waited, why now, that's important to have nailed down.
 
The other thing is that there's likely more than one reason why the Uninvolved have waited so long, and it's possible that at least one of those reasons is something we have no context whatsoever about thus far.

Part of it could even be something like that the nature of their existence makes this type of soul to soul communication something they can only safely do with Potentials.
 
It could also be they waited to see what humanity does with Practice when under pressure. As mentioned, lots of potential 'could be's', that's why asking the question and evaluating the answer makes sense.
 
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