The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%
  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%

  • Total voters
    738
Another reason to not try for a straight battle right now is that it plays to the Abomination's strengths and not playing to our ambush admirals speciality. Like Durin said the Abomination is really weak to harassment so why don't we save some of our fleet so that we can actually take advantage of that weakness.
 
Considering you call it brittle in the next sentence I think you meant "hard", not "durable".

Thermal conductivity and melting point are unrelated, if anthing it should be
"Second it conducts heat incredibly well, though this property is of limited use because of Blue Metals extremely low melting point, it only takes even a very weak flame for it to start melting."

I think you meant "largest of their kind in the Trust Colonies", "largest of their kind outside of Core/Nine Worlds" or something along those lines.

And I agree with others that Blue Metal is lame name. Even quick google for "blue in latin" gave me "caeruleum", which can be easily mangled (when in doubt about naming something in 40k, just mangle some Latin) into Cerulum or something along those lines.
Yeah done.

OH Please forgive me I only wrote all that at 2 in the morning when I was completely fucking exhausted.
 
just as a note on the discussion. even with all in it is highly likely you will not gain fleet dominance. the reverse is more likely.
I should also mention that the information bonus is not quite as large in this phase, information advantage is bigger in harassment then in a straight fight

Okay, ballparking the possibility of Trust Fleet reinforcements:

Lets assume that we manage to pop Da Crumpa in the next void turn, seriously wreck the Ork presence at Mar Sara sufficient that we can re-assign some ships from that front to Helheim in 2.

@Durin
1. Roughly how long will it take to complete 2 void turns over Mar Sara?
2. Roughly how long would it take for any reinforcements from Mar Sara to reach Avernus?

3. Possible FAQ Updates:
3.a. Could you add FTL speeds to the FAQ, or are they already in the datasheets somewhere and I just missed them?
3.b. The Ridcully section states that he can't re-roll a 1, I thought that had evolved to him having a 50/50 chance of re-rolling a 1? Is this correct?
3.c. Saint Lin's rate of aging recently increased, might want to amend that in his section

4. Ballpark, how many dice do you have to roll for each of these combat turns?
1. you expect the battle over Mara Sara to be finished in a few weeks
2. around two months
3.a I will. it is currenty 1.25LY a day with Navigator
3b. yes
3c. yes
4. only a dozen or two
You lot have very little confidence in our fleet.

We're intended to be the heaviest fleet (well until the guard get battlebarges, which is a while off) we're being led by the best commander in the trust who can make a ship appear practically Creed like, while being supported by our cities WHILE they're going into a mine field AND we have their plans which our super admiral can exploit the shit out of.

I think that we can do a lot of damage here AND not take significant casualties.


I didn't realise that was doctrine?

I also don't see the point of not using our fleet, the light elements might take some damage, the more important part is that they will loose good chunks of their heavier elements so our light elements can rip them to shreds.

Unless they're willing to put battleships on ferrying duties (very silly because we can probably destroy groups of two battleships or more quite easily) then suddenly our job becomes much easier.

@Durin
1. Given that we've upgraded our defences will the bonus for the defences be increased. When we fought Garkill for the orbitals he took a minus 20 penalty?
2. I can't remember if any one has asked this, but how long will it take Valinor to get their transports to Valinor and back?
1. yes
2. around a week
We could write-in for Sarnow to keep the lighter elements alive. I'd imagine they can keep out of the thick of the fighting, threaten the transports and keep part of the enemy fleet occupied just covering against them.

Aren't.
I don't see any part where it says they can't possibly spare reserve fleet elements for Avernus. Besides, the void battle around Mar Sara seems much more promising than the void battle here, so the fleet elements that we specifically need should be possible for Mar Sara to spare.
But we can just find out.

@Durin
1. Can we call in the reserve fleet from Vanaheim to Avernus at some point?
2. Where are the reserves stationed at?
3. If we can get reserves, how long would it take for them to arrive?
4. How do Valinor deal with our ground-to-void guns and AA when landing their troops?
5. How long do we estimate it takes for Valinor to go back and forth between Avernus and Valinor with their transports and conveyors?
Sorry for asking what the Pear Wombat already asked, but it's important.
6. If we manage to keep the orbitals over Dis, will that stop Valinor from landing their ground forces?
7. Will holding the void space over Dis meaningfully keep them from making Kamikaze attacks on Dis?
8. Are Avernus' orbital defences outside the range of the city guns?
1. yes
2. scattered over the trust, mostly acting as anti-piracy and warding off other powers getting interested
3. a week for some, three weeks for half the reserves
4. avoid it, orbital suppression fire and fighters. plus some sorcery
5. please wait until I have actually answered something before asking again.
6. no, it will just force them to land further away
7. it will make it harder but not stop them
8. they are in range but ships firing on them are not
@Durin

1. Does the crusade fleet still have ground based or orbit to ground attack craft?
2. If they do, how effective would they be in defending their landers?
2a. From space attack craft?
2b. From ground based attack craft?
2c. From ground AA batteries?
1. yes
2. a. very, though the atmosphere is even better
2b. they are capable
3. no effect
 
Cobalt: The Armory

Cobalt is the world after which the subsector it is located in is named and it is renowned for being a near unassailable bastion of orky ingenuity.

The defences of the world were formidable, and it took the genius of Rotbart the Great to eventually batter them down. Even after this there was still several years of fighting before the orks were eradicated and colonisation could begin as planned.

Cobalt is for the most part a rather black world despite its name. Its climate has been severely polluted by thousands of years of orkish industry. The soil is however, very fertile, mostly due to the amount of ash mixed into the soil*. When combined with the climate and meteorology of the planet which allows for almost permanently blue skies (from which the planet really draws its name) plant life is actually flourishing on the planet, feeding on the large amounts of carbon dioxide.

In terms of natural resources Cobalt is a bounty, as expected of a Factory world. Massive seams of metal run deep within the planet, and the fertility of the world has produced large underground lakes of promethium ready for extraction.

A unique metal too, has been found on cobalt. Dubbed "Colarium" by the Mineralogists, the locals refer to it as Cobalt. The material has several strange properties. First it is extremely Hard. Second it conducts heat incredibly well, although its low melting point does not allow it to take advantage of this property, indeed it only takes even a very weak flame to start melting the metal, although this does make it very easy to process it. Finally, the metal is useless for weapons. In its base form it is incredibly brittle and will break almost instantly if hit with a sword.

However, that is not what its truly useful for as its true purpose lies in alloying it with other metals. Blue Steel is perhaps one of the planet's most well-known products and it is simply steel alloyed with blue metal. The end result is three times as strong as regular steel for the same weight. The metal can be alloyed with many other metals, though currently it has not bonded with either high grade adamantium or angel steel. However, a more interesting alloy has been blue gold. When alloyed together blue gold is around as durable as bronze, but it is an extremely effective psycic conductor, even more so than regular gold**. Because of this, despite its expense many psykic artisans utilise blue gold in the construction of force implements.

While the planet itself may be rich in metals, the rest of the system is as well with asteroid fields dense in valuable minerals a small fleet of mining ships extracting their bounty, several planetoids and small moons already operating small mining colonies and finally three gas giants from which additional promethium is being extracted.

The incredible speed at which the system has been converted for the Trust should be of no surprise it was directly managed by the low council itself and had a large amount of expertise and resources poured into it to facilitate its role as sub sector capital.

The planet's populace is incredibly diverse, even by the standards of the Trust's colony worlds. Being a subsector capital, it was decided that no one group should form too large a majority, save for the Midgardians of course, so there were groups pulled from all over the Trust to provide their skills.

This has payed off in impressive fashion in many sectors.

Economically the planet still sees weapons of war as its primary function and so its foundries are at work day and night creating new armaments for its growing PDF, or building new macro cannons to add to the cities defences. Of course, it still produces much material and other goods to sell and drive its economy of course.

The most dramatic way this can be seen is in the Cobalt shipyards, the largest of their kind in the Trust colonies. Created quickly by piggybacking the remains of the ork ship yards, they are the largest of their kind in the colonies, a single large ship yard with three small ones, though thanks to the sponsorship of the Trust plans have already been made to expand them even more.

The reason for this is that instead of focusing on large ships, these ship yards focus on escorts. The primary construction being the Soldier Class Destroyer, the cheap ever reliable work horse of the Trust Fleet, it is anticipated that Cobalt will become the central manufacturing plant of these ships in years to come. From these ship yards, over one hundred have already been commissioned into service with many hundreds more on the way.

The planet's defences are considerable, unsurprising given its importance, however they are constantly being upgraded ever higher by the fevered efforts of the populace. More importantly the military of the world are extremely determined, well trained and equipped, with a large number of power armoured troops. More importantly than that they are very experienced. The orks of Cobalt may not be as dangerous as Dead Man's rock, but they are determined none the less.

The Governor selected for this task is Bridget Rosa. An Avernite by birth she was an early recruit for the Trust Guard having risen to the rank of colonel of a 105st regiment of Helltroopers who were raised to join the Guard. A graduate of both the Avernus officer academy and the Trust academy on Midgard she worked her way steadily up the ranks with an impeccable record. The regiments under her command were always extremely well run, with incredibly low casualty counts compared to other commanders. She also became known as the Whip due to her intolerance of mediocrity, mentoring many soldiers and officers whether they showed promise or not. Despite her occasionally draconian methods she has many friends in the Trust due to her beating many a young man or woman into shape. She finally retired from active service following the end of the Expansion War and was selected as Governor of Gehenna by the low council, a task she has excelled at, balancing the needs of the people to make them one of the most content of the colonies, but also keeping the best interests of the Trust at the forefront of her mind.
*Ash from burning the ork biosphere to nothing
**Gold does have relatively minor force conducting abilities, which is why it and other precious metals see frequent use in psycic rituals.

Exhausted going to bed now

@Durin
Any comments/things to fix?
to ambitions, adding a unique metal and then making it a major shipbuilder in no time is asking to much.
 
three weeks for half the reserves
Bit closer than I expected, but still not very close.

to ambitions, adding a unique metal and then making it a major shipbuilder in no time is asking to much.
Thought that might be the case.

I can go with my original plan which is to make it the intention of cobalt to build up its ship industry, but if you prefer I can remove the metal or both?

Edit: Modified the thing, no longer got its ship yards, but does have plans in the works.
 
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It seems odd that the city anti-orbital defenses were described as being able to outgun battleships but only provide a bonus to the battle in orbit, but don't directly kill any ships themselves.
 
It seems odd that the city anti-orbital defenses were described as being able to outgun battleships but only provide a bonus to the battle in orbit, but don't directly kill any ships themselves.
At least when we fought Garkill for round 3 the defences got their own shooting phase in which they killed stuff, then added a bonus to the fleet.

@Durin
Made the modifications to Cobalt, any comment?
 
So, just wanted to do a bit of a look at how the situation in the void is likely to look after this turn (more or less regardless of how we do baring statistically improbable (borderline impossible based on our knowledge) success or failure.

We will have some amount of light and heavy fleet elements left, the light elements best suited to harassment and the heavy elements to direct battle. Both of these groups will be able to retreat to Demiphobe, which should be all but impossible for the Crusade fleet to threaten.

The Crusade fleet will have two things it needs to do simultaneously—it will need to ferry additional waves of reinforcements for the ground battle in from Valinor, and it will need to hold or be able to threaten the Avernus orbitals enough that we can't use orbital bombardment on their armies and (more optionally) so that they can use it on ours.

Any fleet they have will need to be able to handle whatever remains of our heavy fleet until the other one can reinforce it if it's going to do its job. Otherwise we could hit their transport fleet with our heavy fleet and wipe out their ability to quickly ferry in reinforcements or destroy the fleet in our orbitals and do some significant damage to their army with bombardment. Depending on how large our remaining heavy fleet is and their own losses, this could end up being a massive restriction on their fleet movements.

The light elements of our own fleet will be unable to do meaningful damage to the enemy fleets outside of harassment without the massive force multipliers we had earlier in the campaign. That said, they will have a lot of opportunities to harass the transport fleet and harassment tactics have been extremely effective against them so far. It's hard to say exactly how much they'll end up doing, but I would not be surprised if they end up causing a meaningful reduction to their transport capabilities by the third wave all by themselves.

That said, given the current plans being voted on, there is a very good chance that we will have lost the surprise factor in our knowledge of their plans. We also will not have things like the minefield and orbital defenses. Because of these factors, we will not be able to achieve whatever kill ratio we get in the coming battle—the downside of stacking as many bonuses as we can get for a massive sucker-punch is that the limited resources are used up.
 
I wonder if changing the bleed the fleet plan to target leadership would be a good idea. that would probably do a lot to help the rest of the combat. Especially if they need to come up with new plans.
 
Bit closer than I expected, but still not very close.


Thought that might be the case.

I can go with my original plan which is to make it the intention of cobalt to build up its ship industry, but if you prefer I can remove the metal or both?

Edit: Modified the thing, no longer got its ship yards, but does have plans in the works.
making it the intention is fine, making it already achieved is not
 
EditEdit: Egg on my face now, it's actually 63 battleships, the cavalry can smash the crusade
It occurs to me that perhaps we should up our game if we settled on being the "heavy" fleet.
One thing I learned from these space combat turns is that we should build more carriers. Trust's abundance of skilled pilots combined with DAoT attack craft results in hilariuosly lopsided K/D ratios (we managed 12.84 to 1 vs. Orks and 16.46 to 1 vs. Abominites)
And our escorts are made of paper.
they actually have more armor than our Command Battleship and only only ~36% less HP,
Where are you getting the actual Numbers?

Can those be somewhat simplified? I.e., on a scale of 1-100 or something?
 
It occurs to me that perhaps we should up our game if we settled on being the "heavy" fleet.

And our escorts are made of paper.

Where are you getting the actual Numbers?

Can those be somewhat simplified? I.e., on a scale of 1-100 or something?
you escorts are usually outnumbered very heavily by their opposite numbers
and information is here
 
And our escorts are made of paper.

they have usually a bit more than half the armor and at most a third the hp of the next size up. They shatter like glass if a cruiser so much as breaths on them, even more so than cruisers who are noticed by battleships. I think if we were not so heavily outnumbered all the time they would do better because their main survival tactic seems to be outnumbering the guns shooting at them. Given we tend to be outnumbered but not outmatched in most fights that strategy doesn't work. That said, as cold as it is from what i can glean of the system they are a cost-effective layer of ablative armor for our more durable ships.
 
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I wonder if changing the bleed the fleet plan to target leadership would be a good idea. that would probably do a lot to help the rest of the combat. Especially if they need to come up with new plans.
Er, the bleed plans actually already has leadership as its secondary target. Per Durin that will basically be hitting the Commodore level though, as the top leadership is on the daemon Battle Barges and those are fucking tough.
 
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