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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up

Investigate the Sea?

  • Yes

    Votes: 593 80.4%

  • No

    Votes: 145 19.6%
  • Total voters
    738
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Shard said:
Oh, I can fill Tamia's actions with Psychic Materials as buffer for Ridcully. Yesssss.

Any thoughts on wildlife most likely to be useful?
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Gnaw Worms have that Entropic Field thing, though may not be psychic.

Phase Tigers/Phase Cats for obvious reasons.

Bombardment Cati have some kind of divination effect, but not sure about it helping.

Dragon Turtles have biomancy toughness shells.

Those are the ones that leap out from those we have research on.

Illusionary Pines and Mirage Palms seem obvious candidates among those we have not researched.
 
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Enjou said:
A daemonic incursion is by no means guaranteed to happen.
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We know that 'something' is likely to happen next turn. Also it should be noted that making new cities means a spike in military casualties to wildlife. Not something we need when our army has taken significant damage from multiple sources over the last half decade and has a decent chance of being hit again soon.

Shard's plan also has a total of twelve of our existing cities made temporarily more vulnerable as their defenses are being upgraded, which puts them in potential peril if it does happen (generally in the first third of the upgrade).
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Hence 'not perfect'. However a city being upgraded has reduced defences. A city being built has none at all.
 
Enjou said:
SLOT C - Year 1 (Tamia)
-Y1: Mentoring: Beta
-Y2-Y5: IF Ridcully finished with "Where are they?" THEN Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Rotate between Mentoring: Gammas and Betas
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Rotating does not work. The Mentoring is only allowed once per psyker level per turn.

Else I like it. Just that the Rangers gets booted again...
 
Shard said:
If the Incursion doesn't happen in the first 2 years, it's probably not going to happen, IMO.
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This might especially be the case given that two of the likely lynchpins of the whole plan are dead. The Beta Diviner who could actually compete with Ridcully was almost certainly essential for the plan's continued success, because lesser Diviners would lose to him and thus the plan could be ended before it began. Then there's the possibility of the Changeling being permanently killed by Jane - replacing the top Arbiter would have been a great way to try to corrupt our Arbites, and thus make it easier for cults to spread without getting noticed. A daemonic incursion by itself would likely ultimately fail in destroying us, especially since we've upgraded all our cities to use DAoT defenses now and our people have stronger wills. So if the additional things that might have lead to success were eliminated, then committing a lot of daemons to a permanent death on Avernus would be foolish.
 
I'll take Dragon-Turtles, Phase-Tigers, Illusionary Pines, Mirage Pines, Congregation Aps in that order.

(I seriously doubt that we'd have 5 turns straight of fail, much less 3, but one plans for the worst.)

Updated Plan: https://forums.sufficientvelocity.com/posts/8447412/
Angelform said:
We know that 'something' is likely to happen next turn. Also it should be noted that making new cities means a spike in military casualties to wildlife. Not something we need when our army has taken significant damage from multiple sources over the last half decade and has a decent chance of being hit again soon.
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While we know that something is likely to happen, it is likely to occur in the start of the turn.

It is also quite likely that our actions negate it.
 
Enjou said:
This might especially be the case given that two of the likely lynchpins of the whole plan are dead. The Beta Diviner who could actually compete with Ridcully was almost certainly essential for the plan's continued success, because lesser Diviners would lose to him and thus the plan could be ended before it began. Then there's the possibility of the Changeling being permanently killed by Jane - replacing the top Arbiter would have been a great way to try to corrupt our Arbites, and thus make it easier for cults to spread without getting noticed. A daemonic incursion by itself would likely ultimately fail in destroying us, especially since we've upgraded all our cities to use DAoT defenses now and our people have stronger wills. So if the additional things that might have lead to success were eliminated, then committing a lot of daemons to a permanent death on Avernus would be foolish.
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Essentially, if they don't execute whatever remains of their plan quickly, it's going to be ripped apart.
 
@Shard, I think Construct: Repair should take priority over Construct: Mass Conveyors and Escorts, we shouldn't build new stuff without recouping or loses.
 
@Shard Looking a lot better. A few comments:

Shard said:
Diplomacy (5/5)

5 Years
Y1: Request Aid from Inquisition
Y2: Sound Out (Next Moves)
Y3: Persons of Interest (1/1) - DOUBLE DOWN (IF NOT USED ELSEWHERE)
Y4: Ear To The Ground
Y5: Diplomatic Relations (Vanaheim)

5 Years
Y1: Establish Embassy (Byzantium)
Y2 - Y3: Investigate (Byzantium) (2/2)
Y4: Persons of Interest (1/1) - DOUBLE DOWN (IF NOT USED ELSEWHERE)
Y5: Diplomatic Relations (Vanaheim), twice - DOUBLE DOWN (IF NOT USED ELSEWHERE)
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Since we get a -5 to success chance after a successful Diplomatic relations I don't think we want to do two different attempts. I suppose you could be going for a double down through the use of two actions instead of our Rotbart based double down, however I'm pretty sure we cannot combine that with a normal double down.

Since I think it likely that we will have Double Downs available on years 4 and 5 I think it would be better to organize it with a diplomatic relations attempt in Year 4 and Year 5 (year 5 targeting Svartalfhiem unless Vanaheim failed) and use Double Downs on each (if available).

That's why I originally organized it that way.

Also, I think Persons of Interest is a very low priority for using a Double Down. There isn't any significant penalty for failure, nor is the benefit very large, so I don't see the point of using a Double Down there.

Shard said:
Ridcully - 5 Years
Y1 - Y?: Where are they? - REPEAT UNTIL CONCLUDED, DOUBLE DOWN EACH TIME
Y2-Y5: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs - DOUBLE DOWN

Tamia - 5 Years
Y1: Psychic Materials: Dragon Turtles
Y2: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Phase Tigers
Y3: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Illusionary Pines
Y4: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Mirage Pines
Y5: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Congregation Asps

Xavier - 5 Years
Y1: Mentoring: Beta
Y2-Y3: Simple Anti-Psyker Wards: Void Shields - EXPEDITE (2/2)
Y4: Simple Anti-Psyker Wards: SAM Batteries - EXPEDITE (1/1)
Y5: Masterwork Force Weapons: Primaris Psykers (1/6)
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I actually really liked Tamia investigating the Black Crystal Breastplate. Since starting Neo Astropaths in Y3 is acceptable timing, I'd this would be a better organization achieve the flexibility you want:

Ridcully - 5 Years
Y1 - Y?: Where are they? - REPEAT UNTIL CONCLUDED, DOUBLE DOWN EACH TIME
Y2: IF RIDCULLY IS FREE - Mentoring Gammas
Y3-Y5: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs - DOUBLE DOWN

Tamia - 5 Years
Y1-Y2: Research: Black Crystal (Breastplate)
Y3: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Dragon Turtles
Y4: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Phase Tigers
Y5: Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs IF RIDCULLY BUSY - Psychic Materials: Illusionary Pines

Xavier - 5 Years
Y1: Mentoring: Beta
Y2-Y3: Simple Anti-Psyker Wards: Void Shields - EXPEDITE (2/2)
Y4: Simple Anti-Psyker Wards: SAM Batteries - EXPEDITE (1/1)
Y5: Masterwork Force Weapons: Primaris Psykers (1/6)

You might also want to ask durin if we can expedite Force Weapons. I can't remember if he was asked that before, but it seems like something that could be Expedited. It might be marginally better to expedite that than Shipyards.

Shard said:
Compiled Double Downs (In priority order, DD the action on the left if possible, then move down to the right if actions aren't possible/done for some reason.)
Y1: Where are they? (Telepathica)
Y2: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs
Y3: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Persons of Interest
Y4: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Persons of Interest
Y5: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Diplomatic Relations (Vanaheim)
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Again, I really do not like using Double Downs on Persons of Interest. If you make the changes I suggest to Diplomacy and Telepathica then this would be my suggestion for Double Downs:

Y1: Where are they? (Telepathica)
Y2: Where are they? ELSE Investigate (Byzantium)
Y3: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Psychic Materials: Dragon Turtles
Y4: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Diplomatic Relations (Vanaheim)
Y5: Where are they? ELSE Research: Neo-Astropathic Choirs ELSE Diplomatic Relations (Vanaheim) ELSE Diplomatic Relations (Svartalfheim)

Double Down on Psychic Materials is obviously better than Persons of Interest (if only from action economy since Telepathica actions are more valuable).
With Neo-Astropaths not starting until year 3, a double down is available (assuming not repeating Where Are They) so decided to throw it at Investigate Byzantium (which again seems more valuable than Persons of Interest).
Then Double Down priority is Neo-Astropaths, followed by Diplomatic relations.

If you make those changes (or something roughly similar) I'll vote for your plan.

Shard said:
And besides, don't we have to Hold Ground before Founding City in the Iota region?
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That's left over from before we had any settlements in Duat and a regional military.

Personally I don't have strong feeling for founding a city versus defense improvements. So if you do decide to found a city it won't change my vote.
 
DeusFerreus said:
@Shard, I think Construct: Repair should take priority over Construct: Mass Conveyors and Escorts, we shouldn't build new stuff without recouping or loses.
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I'm the one pushing for Mass Conveyors and Escorts for a few reasons:

1: It will be completed by end of the turn and decisions made at the council for next turn may require them
2: We are going to do trades again and we have a massive amount of metal and promethium available to trade, so we really need more transport space
3: The main advantage of the Repair action is that we get back a few cruisers. Since most of our immediately surrounding enemies are escort heavy I don't feel it's as critical as getting our escort fleet increased.

There does not seem to be any penalty for waiting a few turns to do the Repair action.
 
Did we start distributing the new Juvenat surplus from the expanded factories?

[X] Plan Enjou T88

I chose Enjou's plan because it doesn't compromise defences during this period of uncertainty.
 
Elder Haman said:
3: The main advantage of the Repair action is that we get back a few cruisers. Since most of our immediately surrounding enemies are escort heavy I don't feel it's as critical as getting our escort fleet increased.
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Repair will result in 533 escorts over the course of 7 turns (and many will most likely be finished by 5 year mark), Mass Conveyors and Escorts will result in 165 over the course of 5 turns, Repair is definitely a better way to increase number of escorts.
 
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