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The Amber Age: Pantheon Edition (Collaborative)

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Oshha said:
Not all Pros and Cons are equal. Pros and Cons have meaning to them beyond putting another point in a category.
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Very true. Let's take a look.

veekie said:
Pros:
-Establishes relationship with Hero King to do what we want. This is important, because a King who had not listened to us in life is unlikely to do so post-ascension
-Examines anomaly while it's fresh. Possibility of Place of Power or Spirit encounter.
-Builds towards Faith upgrade and thus Torpor improvement. This means we can get more with less sleep.
-Grabs special resources before others claim them. Gems are required to perform one of our rituals.
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veekie said:
Pros:
-Establishes relationship with Hero King to do what we want. This is important, because a King who had not listened to us in life is unlikely to do so post-ascension
-Examines anomaly while it's fresh. Possibility of Place of Power or Spirit encounter.
-Builds towards Faith upgrade and thus Torpor improvement. This means we can get more with less sleep.
-Performs recon of area
-Attempts to request more shrines. If successful, will greatly expand Influence.
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Both:
-Establishes relationship
-Examines anomaly
-Builds towards Faith upgrade

Kingdom Only:
-Grabs resources

Mystery Tile Only:
-Recon of area
-Requests more shrines

So... that being said, I'm assuming the consensus is "Going for resources" > "Recon + Shrines"?
 
Pandemonious Ivy said:
So... that being said, I'm assuming the consensus is "Going for resources" > "Recon + Shrines"?
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Personally, I just want either one of those plans to win over sleeping getting an avatar at this point so I'm voting for the one more likely to win so that might be another possible reason. Combining that reason with 'going for resources' and you get two separate factions of voters going for the same play as it is the one which benefits them best.
 
Also, there's most likely another tribe next to the cattle. Which would make our king happy... And busy whilst we're sleeping.

My plan is actually to go to sleep in two turns.

This turn set things up for the kingdom to grow stronger. Next turn set things up so we can sleep safely, and get things like shrines at all of our villages. Turns after, sleep and upgrade whilst the King makes the kingdom stronger and does a few nice things for us.

As for the Clairvoyance... I'll add it in, with a note that only the 0 DE options are to be used, if no one complains soon.

... The DE cost for Clairvoyance is because of distance right, now random cost between the two values, no matter the distance?
 
I would like to point out that it is possible for us to reach Faith 3 while sleeping, provided Goldie spreads our worship enough for the population to reach that point.

So we cannot assume that staying up to get Faith will let us achieve Avatar faster. (In fact, if it was just Ashform it could never pay for itself, 4 turns at Faith 3 versus 5 turns at Faith 2)

veekie said:
-Lizard Peerage bonus is currently not useful as we have no Peerage to be boosted.
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I've seen you say this before, but I would actually argue that this is inaccurate.

I'd say we benefit from a Peerage boost precisely because we currently have a 0 in it. It doesn't boost our Peerage by 5%, it boosts our success rate by 5%. And having 0 in a skill is not enough for an auto-lose in all situations IIRC, meaning that we actually boost our worst skills with that move.
 
Why is that people are against our Death Spirit being a Death Spirit?

I mean, I championed the main counterplan to that, and I'm not even a quarter as against it as some of you guys are.
 
Oshha said:
I don't get what you are trying to say here.
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People say that they don't want our Death Spirit to do X because X leans into our Death Aspect.

Not wanting to throw out Say Living without appropiate targets? I get that, that's just the common sense I generally lack. But not wanting to build shrines that venerate the dead because oh no it's death? That I cannot grok.

I'm even considering throwing my weight behind Plan Poking, simply because I have more Faith in the shrine construction than rapid expansion.
 
Omegahugger said:
I would like to point out that it is possible for us to reach Faith 3 while sleeping, provided Goldie spreads our worship enough for the population to reach that point.

So we cannot assume that staying up to get Faith will let us achieve Avatar faster. (In fact, if it was just Ashform it could never pay for itself, 4 turns at Faith 3 versus 5 turns at Faith 2)


I've seen you say this before, but I would actually argue that this is inaccurate.

I'd say we benefit from a Peerage boost precisely because we currently have a 0 in it. It doesn't boost our Peerage by 5%, it boosts our success rate by 5%. And having 0 in a skill is not enough for an auto-lose in all situations IIRC, meaning that we actually boost our worst skills with that move.
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Faith 2-
8 turns
6 turns if faith 3 after 1st turn of sleep (1 at faith 2 and 5 at faith 3)
6 turns if faith after 2 turns of sleep (2 at faith 2, 4 at faith 3)

Faith 3-
5 turns
4 turns if we can hit faith 5 after 1 turn of sleep (1 at faith 3, 3 at faith 5)

The later actually would be a good reason to push to faith 4 and be close to 5 before sleeping and hope golden king pushes us into faith 5 the first turn
 
I think believing we will reach Faith 5 in any reasonable timescale is unfounded. The scale only goes up to 10 and I highly doubt it's gonna get easier as we go up.
 
Omegahugger said:
Why is that people are against our Death Spirit being a Death Spirit?

I mean, I championed the main counterplan to that, and I'm not even a quarter as against it as some of you guys are.
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I will say that it may look like more people than it actually is. The people who are anti us killing people or doing anything related to death that're not 100% benevolent are... mainly just me.
 
@Omegahugger I'm actually not against building Shrines. In fact, I want that to be part of our instructions to him next turn. I'd just prefer to expand towards the Gems and Cattle this turn, so we'll know if the other tribe's got a spirit of their own we need to deal with before sleeping.

This is my next turn's plan:
1. If we've already incorporated the new tribe, Preside over Death Rituals at their settlement.
1a. If we haven't, then if there's fighting, use 'Slay' if we can on the other tribe, or the RItual of Diminishing... Provided said ritual doesn't require us staying awake beyond this turn, which I think it does. Otherwise, look at how things are going and adapt.
2. Talk to An'Wah'Hei and tell him that we're going to sleep for a few years, and whilst we're doing that we'd like the Kingdom to thrive and grow stronger, whilst also constructing lesser shrines at the settlements other than Kut.
3. Make sure that there's no other threat that we know of right now that could kill us/usurp us whilst we're sleeping, and if there isn't, go to sleep and upgrade.
3a. If there is a threat... Think about it and whether it's worth the risk, and what other actions we can do to reduce that risk.

Personally, the way I'd like to see things going is if An'Wah'Hei becomes the 'King' God for our Pantheon, we become his Queen, and focused on Death, the Afterlife, Magic and Spirits. Basically, the mystical side of things. Whilst An'Wah'Hei focuses on making our mortal's Kingdom expand and fights off the enemies... At least, the non-magical foes that don't get into physical combat.

Maybe also add a few other things to our domain. We'll have to see how things go. And yes, I'd also like it if we could have at least two forms. A 'human' form and a 'dragon' form. Again, we'll have to see how things go for how that develops.

... Hey @Pike Any reason you're going for that plan, when the leading plan Expanding the Kingdom also investigates the anomaly? Which is what I assume the mystery box you are talking about is?

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Oh, and if no one complains in the next short while, going to add 'Use 2x 0DE Clairvoyant' to the plan.
 
Indophenol said:
I will say that it may look like more people than it actually is. The people who are anti us killing people or doing anything related to death that're not 100% benevolent are... mainly just me.
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I mean, death can be neutral as we are death not murder and all things must die. And shrines are basically people worshiping us nothing to do with murder.
 
@Pyro Hawk I thought recon was important too, thought if you're gonna add 'Use 2x 0DE Clairvoyant' too, they'll be identical?

Edit: And more shrines means more growth
 
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Pyro Hawk said:
@Omegahugger I'm actually not against building Shrines. In fact, I want that to be part of our instructions to him next turn. I'd just prefer to expand towards the Gems and Cattle this turn, so we'll know if the other tribe's got a spirit of their own we need to deal with before sleeping.
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Actually, I prefer Shrines because I believe it has a greater chance of giving us Faith 3, since my plan for the next turn is to go to sleep if we don't this turn.

Also, Goldie is literally a Spirit tier unit. Unless it has some anti-mortal bullshit like we do (and Slay is the only thing I can think of in a world this young), he'll be fine on his own.
 
Pike said:
@Pyro Hawk I thought recon was important too, thought if you're gonna add 'Use 2x 0DE Clairvoyant' too, they'll be identical?

Edit: And more shrines means more growth
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Difference will be shrines vs expansion, and both are valid options at this point. Granted shrines may benefit from access to gems and stone and gold (iron is likely beyond our ability to work).

Though if shrines boost faith like I hope then it sets us up to sleep sooner
 
I'm hoping that we could Preside over Death Rites at both villages if we ask An'Wah'Hei to build shrines, though I don't understand the mechanics very well yet.
 
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