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Per Aspera (Space Agency Plan Quest)

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[X] Plan: Finishing what we started
-[X] Construct an R-3 Snow - (25R per dice, 7/80, costs 1 Build Capacity until complete) (3 Dice)
--[X] And launch everything except the new R-3
-[X] Build a Scientific Complex (25R per die, opens up new research possibilities, +1d5+5 bonus in the associated field, +1 Education for the region)
--[X] Sao Paolo Aerodynamics Centre (AERO) [CPAL, Int(C)] (171/450) (3 Dice)
--[X] Long Beach Propulsion Research Complex (PROP) [Int(D),UWF] (195/450) (2 Dice)
--[X] Mombasa Computer Science Institute (COMP) [CPAL] (106/450) (3 Dice)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (First Satellite) (Phase I) [PHYS, FUEL, COMP]
--(Phase I, 15R per dice) (126/150) <- Rollover limited to 25 progress towards Phase II (1 Die)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (Alternative Launch Systems) [AERO, PHYS] (5R per die, 0/300, ???) (3 Dice)
-[X] Conduct Supersonic Jet Research [AERO] (15R per die, requires a completed Hangar Complex and Runway to finish, can be started without, 175/240) (2 Dice)
-[X] Exploratory Propellant Research (Phase 1) (15R per dice, 0/150, unlocks fuel mixtures and further fuel development) (2 Dice)
-[X] Rocket Boxes (Phase 4) (5R per die, 371/450. Gives Rocket Boxes to every middle-school, high-school and university or equivalent in South America and the Pacific Islands. Encourages future scientists and engineers - some of whom will even come work with the IEC.) (2 Dice)
-[X] The Right Stuff (0/300, 5R per dice, gain astronaut candidates) (1 Die)

Ok, if my math is correct this costs 460R and gets a bunch of things done or close to done. Especially the science centers, as those are a big part of our promises. I held off on nuclear anything because I want to get WC permission for the power research. I think we can work that. Also I want to launch a Snow before the Dawn and this will get us extra. And more science data as well as lots of footage for the rocket reels. I'd have put more into the satellite but that rollover limit is… limiting. And alternate launch systems is just something I want to do, seeing as it might lead to orbit cannons and I want that.

@Shadows I presume that all of this is due Q1 1955, given that made these promises at the end of last year. It says they're due Q1 1954.
 
Shadows said:
[ ] Prototype Spaceplane - Your spaceplane enthusiasts returned to your office with another proposal, building off the back of the design studies they had undertaken through the winter of 1954. Their desire was to create a crewed 'space' plane that would be towed behind or carried underneath a carrier aircraft, be released, and activate a rocket engine that would take it up over the Karman line. It would have a multitude of sensors, of course, and would also need air supplies and likely a heated flight suit to keep the pilot alive and able to work. (0/300, 15R per dice)
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Interesting. This would allow us to put a man in space a lot quicker than if we use rockets, given the latter's propensity for exploding. That ought to make our paymasters in the World Congress happy.
trooperist said:
Guess we're not doing any more nuclear research until the next World Council. Hopefully we'll get a discount on PS loss since we have a legit concept to present.
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Why? The PS cost is if we complete it without permission, not start it. If anything having the practicalities partially worked out should make it easier to get that permission. The progress required and cost per die means we can't crash build it anyways.
 
blankmask said:
[X] Plan: Finishing what we started
-[X] Construct an R-3 Snow - (25R per dice, 7/80, costs 1 Build Capacity until complete) (3 Dice)
--[X] And launch everything except the new R-3
-[X] Build a Scientific Complex (25R per die, opens up new research possibilities, +1d5+5 bonus in the associated field, +1 Education for the region)
--[X] Sao Paolo Aerodynamics Centre (AERO) [CPAL, Int(C)] (171/450) (3 Dice)
--[X] Long Beach Propulsion Research Complex (PROP) [Int(D),UWF] (195/450) (2 Dice)
--[X] Mombasa Computer Science Institute (COMP) [CPAL] (106/450) (3 Dice)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (First Satellite) (Phase I) [PHYS, FUEL, COMP]
--(Phase I, 15R per dice) (126/150) <- Rollover limited to 25 progress towards Phase II (1 Die)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (Alternative Launch Systems) [AERO, PHYS] (5R per die, 0/300, ???) (3 Dice)
-[X] Conduct Supersonic Jet Research [AERO] (15R per die, requires a completed Hangar Complex and Runway to finish, can be started without, 175/240) (2 Dice)
-[X] Exploratory Propellant Research (Phase 1) (15R per dice, 0/150, unlocks fuel mixtures and further fuel development) (2 Dice)
-[X] Rocket Boxes (Phase 4) (5R per die, 371/450. Gives Rocket Boxes to every middle-school, high-school and university or equivalent in South America and the Pacific Islands. Encourages future scientists and engineers - some of whom will even come work with the IEC.) (2 Dice)
-[X] The Right Stuff (0/300, 5R per dice, gain astronaut candidates) (1 Die)

Ok, if my math is correct this costs 460R and gets a bunch of things done or close to done. Especially the science centers, as those are a big part of our promises. I held off on nuclear anything because I want to get WC permission for the power research. I think we can work that. Also I want to launch a Snow before the Dawn and this will get us extra. And more science data as well as lots of footage for the rocket reels. I'd have put more into the satellite but that rollover limit is… limiting. And alternate launch systems is just something I want to do, seeing as it might lead to orbit cannons and I want that.

@Shadows I presume that all of this is due Q1 1955, given that made these promises at the end of last year. It says they're due Q1 1954.
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Yes.
 
Vehrec said:
Skinner Maneuver Test Satellite: Do you hate pigeons? Do you want to test a pigeon's ability to perform tasks in a slowly overheating metal box, in zero gravity, while surrounded by tanks of hydrogen peroxide as it bakes alive? This proposal is a cruel pigeon-killing machine that doesn't actually teach us anything because we can't observe the bird except for the result as it pecks at tiny control levers to boost itself into a higher orbit where it will die.
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As someone with a number of disabled pigeons living in our house who are delightful pets, I despise this. Good job.
 
[X] Plan: R-4 Reserves
-[X] Launch 1 R-2 for weather studies, 1 R-3 sounding rocket
-[X] Construct an R-4 Dawn (35R per dice, 0/120, costs 1 build capacity til complete) (4 dice)
-[X] Build a Scientific Complex:
--[X] Sao Paolo Aerodynamics Centre (AERO) [CPAL, Int(C)] (171/450) (3 dice)
--[X] Long Beach Propulsion Research Complex (PROP) [Int(D),UWF] (195/450) (2 dice)
--[X] Mombasa Computer Science Institute (COMP) [CPAL] (106/450) (3 dice)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (Alternative Launch Systems) [AERO, PHYS] (5R per die, 0/300) (2 dice)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (First Satellite) (Phase I) [PHYS, FUEL, COMP] (15R per dice,126/150) (1 die)
-[X] Balloon Tanks [MATSCI] (15R per dice, 0/200) (2 dice)
-[X] Conduct Supersonic Jet Research [AERO] (15R per die, 175/240) (3 dice)
-[X] Weather Studies (Phase 4) [PHYS] (10R per die, requires a 2-Stage Sounding Rocket, requires Mobile Launch Operations, 14/240) (1 die)
-[X] Rocket Boxes (Phase 4) (5R per die, 371/450) (1 die)
-[X] Creative Sponsorships (10R per die, 0/400) (2 dice)

Total Resources Used: 475R, leaving us with 5R in the bank.

Courtesy of @C_Z and I.

This concentrates facilities dice on our promises because we have enough tracking stations to get us to orbital insertion and at that point we can just wait to the satellite to come around again, so completing tracking stations is not urgent.

We're allocating resources to building an R-4 stockpile so we can just salvo them when we have satellites, and as insurance against one blowing up.

edit: Updated number of dice, put another dice on Alternative Launch Systems.
 
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If anyone's worried about Satelite design, I'm putting my 5 point omake towards it if it comes to that.

[X] Plan: R-4 Reserves
 
CyberFemme said:
[X] Plan: R-4 Reserves
-[X] Launch 1 R-2 for weather studies, 1 R-3 sounding rocket
-[X] Construct an R-4 Dawn (35R per dice, 0/120, costs 1 build capacity til complete) (4 dice)
-[X] Build a Scientific Complex:
--[X] Sao Paolo Aerodynamics Centre (AERO) [CPAL, Int(C)] (171/450) (3 dice)
--[X] Long Beach Propulsion Research Complex (PROP) [Int(D),UWF] (195/450) (2 dice)
--[X] Mombasa Computer Science Institute (COMP) [CPAL] (106/450) (3 dice)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (Alternative Launch Systems) [AERO, PHYS] (5R per die, 0/300) (1 die)
-[X] Conduct Design Studies (First Satellite) (Phase I) [PHYS, FUEL, COMP] (15R per dice,126/150) (1 die)
-[X] Balloon Tanks [MATSCI] (15R per dice, 0/200) (2 dice)
-[X] Conduct Supersonic Jet Research [AERO] (15R per die, 175/240) (3 dice)
-[X] Weather Studies (Phase 4) [PHYS] (10R per die, requires a 2-Stage Sounding Rocket, requires Mobile Launch Operations, 14/240) (1 die)
-[X] Rocket Boxes (Phase 4) (5R per die, 371/450) (1 die)
-[X] Creative Sponsorships (10R per die, 0/400) (2 dice)

Total Resources Used: 470R, leaving us with 5R in the bank.

Courtesy of @C_Z and I.

This concentrates facilities dice on our promises because we have enough tracking stations to get us to orbital insertion and at that point we can just wait to the satellite to come around again, so completing tracking stations is not urgent.

We're allocating resources to building an R-$ stockpile so we can just salvo them when we have satellites, and as insurance against one blowing up.
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It's a solid plan, but if I may, I'd like to make a small suggestion as to a potential tweak? Perhaps trade out Balloon Tanks with Lifted Body, so we can use all of our dice? I know you aren't the biggest fan of spaceplanes, but you have to admit that using them would put us a whole lot closer to getting a man in space than our all-too-explosive rockets.

Now, sure, we could probably do most if not all of the same scientific tests with just rockets, but that's not the point. The Interplanetary Exploration Cooperative was not founded solely for the purposes of scientific exploration. It was also founded to foster much-needed unity among the diverse cultures of the world. Quote below:
Shadows said:
This has caused tensions that have since crystallized into new cultural (and occasionally physical) battle lines that are likely to become the primary fault lines of the new global order and the defining issue of the post-capitalist world. As a way to help ease these tensions and try to find some way to work past them and come together as one world, the new Interplanetary Exploration Cooperative was set up in an attempt to spread peace, goodwill, investment, and scientific advances without discrimination or regard to old lines in the sand.
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Fact of the matter is that astronauts are a pretty good way to spread unity. They're something everyone from Anchorage to Zanzibar can dream of becoming.
 
[X] Plan No Sleep Til Long Beach

-[X] Construct an R-4 Dawn - 3 dice, 105R (35R per dice, 0/120, costs 1 build capacity til complete)

-[X] Build a Scientific Complex - (25R per die, opens up new research possibilities, +1d5+5 bonus in the associated field, +1 Education for the region)
--[X] Sao Paolo Aerodynamics Centre (AERO) [CPAL, Int(C)] (171/450) - 2 dice, 50R
--[X] Long Beach Propulsion Research Complex (PROP) [Int(D),UWF] (195/450) - 3 dice, 75R
--[X] Mombasa Computer Science Institute (COMP) [CPAL] (106/450) - 2 dice, 50R
-[X] Tracking Station Construction (Phase I) - 1 die, 30R (30R per die, 183/350, adds equatorial tracking for rocket launches)

-[X] Conduct Design Studies (First Satellite) (Phase I) [PHYS, FUEL, COMP] - 1 die, 15R (Phase I, 15R per dice) (126/150)
-[X] Balloon Tanks [MATSCI] - 1 die, 15R (15R per dice, 0/200, unlocks balloon tankage for use in later rockets)
-[X] Lifting Body - 2 dice, 20R (10R per die, 0/150)

-[X] Conduct Supersonic Jet Research [AERO] - 4 dice, 60R (15R per die, requires a completed Hangar Complex and Runway to finish, can be started without, 175/240)

-[X] Rocket Boxes (Phase 4) - 1 die, 5R (5R per die, 371/450)
-[X] The Right Stuff - 2 dice, 10R (0/300, 5R per dice)

So the main principle here is that the sooner we can complete one of the scientific complexes the sooner it is that we can engage further resources on the others. With that in mind I'm proposing we go full steam ahead on Long Beach for the moment - especially since that is a goal on its own - and then we can reorient dice when it's close enough that a 1-2 die commitment will get it over the finish line.
 
Hunter531 said:
It's a solid plan, but if I may, I'd like to make a small suggestion as to a potential tweak? Perhaps trade out Balloon Tanks with Lifted Body, so we can use all of our dice? I know you aren't the biggest fan of spaceplanes, but you have to admit that using them would put us a whole lot closer to getting a man in space than our all-too-explosive rockets.
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Spaceplanes aren't an alternative to rockets, they're an alternative to capsules. All spaceplanes ever produced have required rockets to get into space.
 
Hunter531 said:
It's a solid plan, but if I may, I'd like to make a small suggestion as to a potential tweak? Perhaps trade out Balloon Tanks with Lifted Body, so we can use all of our dice? I know you aren't the biggest fan of spaceplanes, but you have to admit that using them would put us a whole lot closer to getting a man in space than our all-too-explosive rockets.

Now, sure, we could probably do most if not all of the same scientific tests with just rockets, but that's not the point. The Interplanetary Exploration Cooperative was not founded solely for the purposes of scientific exploration. It was also founded to foster much-needed unity among the diverse cultures of the world. Quote below:

Fact of the matter is that astronauts are a pretty good way to spread unity. They're something everyone from Anchorage to Zanzibar can dream of becoming.
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I've actually been exploring the trade space and I'm coming around to spaceplanes actually being potentially very useful as suborbital reusable boosters.

The reason we went for Alternative Launch Systems was cost: ALS leaves us with 5 R in the bank, and generates new ideas to explore. A lifting body is best paired with a broader spaceplane push IMO, and I'd like to see if it becomes available as a promise at the next WC so we can get PS from it.

DracoDracul said:
Spaceplanes aren't an alternative to rockets, they're an alternative to capsules. All spaceplanes ever produced have required rockets to get into space.
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Ehhhhhh. It Depends (TM).

A strong case can be made for using them as reusable boosters as long as your payloads are small (under 2 tons) and your launch cadence high.
 
Hunter531 said:
It's a solid plan, but if I may, I'd like to make a small suggestion as to a potential tweak? Perhaps trade out Balloon Tanks with Lifted Body, so we can use all of our dice? I know you aren't the biggest fan of spaceplanes, but you have to admit that using them would put us a whole lot closer to getting a man in space than our all-too-explosive rockets.
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Lifting body is probably tagged [AERO], while balloon tanks are [MATSCI]. Doing lifting body before we get the Sao Paolo aero complex is less optimal if we assume we'll be doing both projects eventually.
Strunkriidiisk said:
So the main principle here is that the sooner we can complete one of the scientific complexes the sooner it is that we can engage further resources on the others. With that in mind I'm proposing we go full steam ahead on Long Beach for the moment - especially since that is a goal on its own - and then we can reorient dice when it's close enough that a 1-2 die commitment will get it over the finish line.
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We can only use 3 dice per project, even if we finish Long Beach early. If we put Long Beach on low priority, we can put 3 on the other two projects right away, and we still have very good odds of getting Long Beach done.
 
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FYI, I'm silly and forgot to update the master template with the 5 Engineering dice you have, not 4. So if you've made a plan using only 4, here you go.
 
Updated plan.

Also, Shadows, if we do Spaceplane Prototype, do we get war surplus B-36s to convert into tow-tankers/motherships like we did with the warships into tracking stations?
 
C_Z said:
We can only use 3 dice per project, even if we finish Long Beach early. If we put Long Beach on low priority, we can put 3 on the other two projects right away, and we still have very good odds of getting Long Beach done.
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Counterpoint: we can get Long Beach done sooner and then use dice for other things while also being able to put the full 3 each on Mombasa and Sao Paulo.
 
CyberFemme said:
I've actually been exploring the trade space and I'm coming around to spaceplanes actually being potentially very useful as suborbital reusable boosters.

The reason we went for Alternative Launch Systems was cost: ALS leaves us with 5 R in the bank, and generates new ideas to explore. A lifting body is best paired with a broader spaceplane push IMO, and I'd like to see if it becomes available as a promise at the next WC so we can get PS from it.
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They should also be a good way to get astronauts into space using that tow vehicle method until we can get our rockets safe enough for human use, which will take years. I wouldn't put an astronaut into a vehicle with a less than 95% chance of not blowing up, at the bare minimum, and in the three years this quest has gone on in-universe, we've only gotten to 60% from 50%.

Um, I'm not asking you to not do ALS? It's hard to argue with 5R/die. What I'm asking is to trade the two dice on Balloon Tanks and one on ALS for three on Lifted Body. That way, we can save 5R for the next turn.

As for the possibility of getting a promise out of Lifted Body, I don't think that's likely. The project description is pretty clear that the potential civilian applications are limited at best, so why would the World Congress care? Launching a spaceplane into orbit would be worthy of a promise, for PR reasons of nothing else, but I don't think the politicians particularly care about how exactly we get it up there.
C_Z said:
Lifting body is probably tagged [AERO], while balloon tanks are [MATSCI]. Doing lifting body before we get the Sao Paolo aero complex is less optimal if we assume we'll be doing both projects eventually.
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Wouldn't @Shadows tag Lifting Body with the [AERO] tag in that case? I can't recall tags being hidden like that in this quest. All of our other projects in that category are tagged, including those we haven't yet started.
 
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