Mauling Snarks (Worm) (Complete)

So much this. I made it halfway though before I scrolled past. This entire chapters just felt like the author trying too hard to be clever.
Well, it could have been worse - the genre standard is for this kind of thing to have all the characters playing the Pronoun Game (as CinemaSins puts it) as well, but with no context for the name tags the guest POVs were given among the constellations of known characters they might just as well have been numbers. As for the rest, and with the caveat that I only got a bit past the second POV shift, it's a whole lot of words spent not explaining who is talking, what their goals are, why they are pursuing them or in conflict with the regular cast, where they are with any more than continent-scale granularity (I'm not asking for GPS coordinates here, just a bit of stage setting so they're a character in a room rather than a bunch of texts in a blank IRC window) or how they are trying to do anything. There are a few hints to say when they were meddling, but not when their real goals have a deadline, if they do, and that is a lot of text to tell us very, very little more than the scene in the previous chapter where Alexandria says "Some motherfuckers are yanking our chains. Contessa, what you got?" and she replies "Jack Shit, that's what, and I don't mean the one that rolls around with his posse painting towns red." (There may be some paraphrasing involved in that quote ;) - especially since this is a non-sucky S9-in-name-only this time, who've raised the bar for all other alt-S9s high indeed.)

Now, my tolerance for antagonist-POV parts is really low to begin with because they always throw me right out of the narrative, but this was a particularly big block of it. I'm not here to tell @CmptrWz how to write his story and I certainly won't be dropping it or even putting it on the long-loop reading list to build up a backlog and binge later, but I wanted to explain why that part doesn't work for me, and did a poor job of that in the heat of the moment.
 
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it's a whole lot of words spent not explaining who is talking, what their goals are, why they are pursuing them or in conflict with the regular cast, where they are with any more than continent-scale granularity (I'm not asking for GPS coordinates here, just a bit of stage setting so they're a character in a room rather than a bunch of texts in a blank IRC window) or how they are trying to do anything.

This. I don't know who these people are. The Omniscient Council of Vagueness and Petty Assholery (The OCVPA for short) isn't even remotely interesting as presented. Thousands of words, but nothing was said. At all. Other than "Look at how petty and assholish we are!". They aren't funny, they aren't entertaining, and they spend so many words talking around anything of substance that I can't even take them seriously. Seriously, the OCVPA can go fuck themselves.
 
If we go with the Endbringer assumption, Helvetia is Tohu, given the reference to power copying. And we finally have part of an answer to what happened to Taylor and Amy: they each have an extra partner/snark now.
 
Where do you people even get "look at how petty and assholish we are!"? Maybe it's just me having read the entire thing, but they seem more annoyed and bored than petty and assholish. Hell, an apology is the exact opposite.
 
I did read the entire interlude. And while it's confusing, you do get a sense of the character of each of the PoV. You also get the impression that they have a... nonstandard?, yeah that's a good word, nonstandard view. Gorden was messing with the PRT documentation as a prank. They all consider Cauldron to be "annoying", and possibly consider David to be The Idiot. Two or three of them want to do Nice Things for Taylor and Amy, but accidentally cause them problems instead. It's implied the situation with L33t was an "apology/gift" attempt by Gorden.
 
Elizabeth, Margaret, and Gordon are The Simurgh, Leviathan, and Behemoth respectively.
Askaline, Helvetia, and presumably Jørgen and Cheng are un-activated Endbringers.

Interesting Endbringer Facts:
- Behemoth figured out how to access PHO, and shared with The Simurgh and Leviathan. Likes to troll the PRT / Protectorate.
- Leviathan watered the plants of Alexandria and Taylor as a prank on "The Annoying Ones" (Cauldron?). Also, is a woman.
- The Simurgh's purpose is supposedly "Inciting curiosity", and is accustomed to snow and ice.
- Before interference from "The Idiot", the Endbringers seem to be experimenting on isolated human communities to manipulate their development.
- The Endbringers are compelled to behave in certain ways, and the "Anti-Master Device" would not help them.
- The Endbringers (mostly) refer to "The Idiot" (probably Eidolon)
- The Endbringers refer to Scion as Zion, and some notice he ignored "The Trigger Event".

About the Un-Activated Endbringers:

Askaline:
- Working with a small, community on another Earth with low technology and public education.
- Pretending to be a medicine tinker?
- Seems to be currently out of touch with Earth Bet due to L33t's power's "Trigger Event".

Helvetia:
- Stuck in a bunker she destroyed.
- Previously met a mean Blue Fox. It died due to lack of food and water.
- Previously met a nice Green Fox. It died due to lack of food and water.
- Has met a "Purple Fox" that seems to be a parahuman with "A useful partner".
- Meeting the useful partner allowed Helvetia to escape with the Purple Fox.
- This is *probably* another Earth, as she can only communicate with Behemoth and The Simurgh.

Jørgen
- Mentioned only briefly, when Behemoth asked for advice on appologizing to Taylor Hebert.

Cheng
- Mentioned only briefly by Leviathan, in that Chen was asking Leviathan questions.
- Seems to have been left alone, and unwilling to give up on "The Plan" (Probably referencing the Entities' Cycle).
 
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is the power triggering somehow?
Did a snark just trigger??

This was my initial thought as well. However, even if the conditions for it were correct, I don't think that's what happened.

Elaboration:
I think that particular Shard (Innovation?) self destructed when it realized that it had been murdering all of it's previous hosts, due to erroneous data conclusions.


If it's a Shard Trigger, either L33t didn't survive, or the Shard didn't.... as I don't think a shard can be a passenger for another shard. Impact could have replaced L33t's shard, fracturing it and causing Amy and Taylor to have a bud-like (read: Half a Planet) of L33t's old shard. Amy would then have Shaper/Innovation(Bonesaw-lite? Manton Limit over self removed?), while Taylor gets a Tinker like ability with computer code... which would be good for being Ada Dragon's Mother.

Taylor is already decently computer savvy, a Tinker ability with a specialty in Computer Code would be fantastic, IMO.





Then again I could just need sleep...
 
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Helvetia:
- Stuck in a bunker she destroyed.
- Previously met a mean Blue Fox. It died due to lack of food and water.
- Previously met a nice Green Fox. It died due to lack of food and water.
- Has met a "Purple Fox" that seems to be a parahuman with "A useful partner".
- Meeting the useful partner allowed Helvetia to escape with the Purple Fox.
- This is *probably* another Earth, as she can only communicate with Behemoth and The Simurgh.

Point the 1st: What happened to Coil in this story?
Point the 4th: Who do we know who wears a purple outfit and has a "vulpine grin"?

I'm not going to be surprised if Helvetica (STANDARD!):D is Noelle/Echidna.
 
Point the 1st: What happened to Coil in this story?
Point the 4th: Who do we know who wears a purple outfit and has a "vulpine grin"?

I'm not going to be surprised if Helvetica (STANDARD!):D is Noelle/Echidna.

Me either, although it's doubtful that the bunker is Coil's. He got outed to the PRT as an infiltrator during Taylor's power testing, at which point she described exactly what his power was. He was then captured after Kid Win, Taylor, and Armsmaster built something to deal with his base's self destruct.
 
Why is a few years to short a time to be assigned a task, even a large task? It's not like Eidolon would have take previous plans into account when he pulled them. It's also not like they completed the task. In fact it sounds like they're still in the early stages if they're having trouble figuring out how to explain themselves to the local populace.
But their tasks to uplift do not make sense with the shards directive to cause conflict from Zion.

.....unless, of course, they received the orders from EDEN before she face-tanked a relativistic collision. So was Eden trying to do something different, was giving new orders to the Endbringers when she died? Could explain why communication is cut off from some of them to Eidolon. They got deployed with only half their formatting. (Also explains why Eidolon could malform 3 of them - he 'finished' the formatting, but badly)

So it seems the author might be implying the 'evolution by conflict' is Zion's idea, because as he Warrior he doesn't have a better frame of reference?
 
But their tasks to uplift do not make sense with the shards directive to cause conflict from Zion.

.....unless, of course, they received the orders from EDEN before she face-tanked a relativistic collision. So was Eden trying to do something different, was giving new orders to the Endbringers when she died? Could explain why communication is cut off from some of them to Eidolon. They got deployed with only half their formatting. (Also explains why Eidolon could malform 3 of them - he 'finished' the formatting, but badly)

So it seems the author might be implying the 'evolution by conflict' is Zion's idea, because as he Warrior he doesn't have a better frame of reference?

Alternatively, conflict doesn't have meaning if the groups are too primitive to work with. Or, it could be their self-assigned mission.
 
Where do you people even get "look at how petty and assholish we are!"? Maybe it's just me having read the entire thing, but they seem more annoyed and bored than petty and assholish. Hell, an apology is the exact opposite.

Well, they sabotage computer networks to keep potential life saving information from people who need it, actively sabotage law enforcement agencies, and cause problems resulting in lots of overtime and time not spend with family. How many families broke because of their 'pranks'? Because of the stress they inflicted upon others for fun? How many people died because they lacked info they should have had or the PRT/Protectorate were busy dealing with the prank and couldn't safe them?
Petty and assholish are very complimentary terms. Where Eidolon wants to be a hero and causes problems because of a mental illness he isn't aware of, these guys deliberately and with malevolent forethought screw things up for everyone else. Usually I consider the Endbringers victims rather than villains, but for this story they are indubitable villains and need to be dealt with. I guess this story is now the first I've read with actually evil Endbringers, so kudos to the author for that.
 
The EB coud also be a long term experiment conducted by Abadon, it is never confirmed where Zion and Eden stumbled into him, and this fic is AU enougt for it not to matter anyway.
 
assuming scion is the idiot in question and not eidolon ... just to play devils advocate

Don't know if anyone else responded to you already, but I'm pretty sure the idiot is Eidolon, not Scion. They refer to Scion directly a couple of times .
Hmm... Elizabeth does once refer to 'Zion' ignoring the coms channel while usually complaining about 'the idiot'. No other being in the chapter used a reference I could find to refer to Scion other than potentially 'the idiot'.
Not absolute proof that the idiot is Eidolon instead of Scion, but does give evidence to that.
Alternatively, I imagine when someone really fucks up to a really high level we often use different/non-standard naming of them, eg. a mother yells the full name of her children when upset. The author is also known for trolling.

Probably won't find out until another chapter which probably won't be for a while.
 
You know, considering what this fic has crossed with, these members of the OCVPA could be the Varga's siblings that we've lost track of. They certainly share it's humor. (And yes, this would be a vote for FK's "Other Supernatural".)

Personally, I think this'd be more interesting, as the mucking-with-the-world's-view-of-the-Endbringers bit has been done before. Plus, these being the Endbringers is too obvious for CmptWz.
 
Just finished reading this today.
... this is not a very nice stopping point for a binge read in my opinion. It is almost entirely telling how strange things in the past were orchestrated by Mysterious Others, which in my opinion ends up being a form of "explaining the joke". This is not actually the reveal, just a teaser that there is going to be a reveal. This is not an actual explanation of what happened, just confirmation that one exists. A pile of hints about where we're going without any payoff.
This is basically the equivalent to a spoiler filled trailer to a mystery film.
 
Just finished reading this today.
... this is not a very nice stopping point for a binge read in my opinion. It is almost entirely telling how strange things in the past were orchestrated by Mysterious Others, which in my opinion ends up being a form of "explaining the joke". This is not actually the reveal, just a teaser that there is going to be a reveal. This is not an actual explanation of what happened, just confirmation that one exists. A pile of hints about where we're going without any payoff.
This is basically the equivalent to a spoiler filled trailer to a mystery film.

The Mysterious Others are in fact the Endbringers, the majority to all of them, not just the ones currently 'active'. In the absence of orders, they took to uplifting various groups in order to grow them sufficiently to make any potential conflict relevant to study prior to fucking with them in various ways, until The Idiot (Also known as Mr. Emulator, also known as Crazy Steve who can't keep his need for a worthy foe in his pants). After being 'activated', the first three were forced to Bet and forced into their monstrous forms (they may have been mistakable as mutated capes before) and took to fucking with the PRT and Cauldron in various ways. They (specifically Behemoth/'Gordon') first noticed Taylor when she undid one of his shiggles 'pranks' that involved the misapplication of security classifications to internal documentation and enjoying the consequences. 'He' passed on the word to his sisters (Liz, who is Ziz and doesn't give that much of a shit about humans and doesn't mind, and his other sister who surprisingly does care despite being Leviathan), who started watching Taylor. After that, 'he' began investigating Taylor thanks to being able to directly influence electrical signals and thus directly interact with the net. He fucked with her in various minor ways for shiggles, including the Danbury board bullshit, and screwing with the bike. However, he liked her enough along with the chaos she caused that he realized he may have gone a little too far by screwing with the manhole cover. Between what she was doing to fix various shards and generating additional ideas and info, and generally getting his game, and so on he decided to 'gift' her by arranging for Leet's shard to bud in a way that he could use it to upgrade BA. The problem is that, as Ziz noted, he's good for macro-scale brute force badassery, or tiny micro-scale precise things; and the reactor was fine-control macro-scale effect that he has problems with, resulting in going too far and overdoing the antagonization of Leet and his shard, which also brought in Pancrea. Which ended up accidentally causing a bigger event than intended, and the whole of the ShardNet ringing in Megaton Minor as things have irreversibly changed. The rest is points of view covering the same events from his 'sisters' in various places as they react to his activities, and their acts, such as Ziz screwing with PHO, and Levi-chan mischievously watering da rainbow roses.

There is an explanation of exactly what has been happening, you just have to read the interlude.
 
"Why won't anything interesting happen?" Taylor whined. Not over the radio, but she still whined.

"Nothing interesting happening is a good thing," Dean countered.

"I'm torn between the two viewpoints," Brian admitted. "Boring can be good, but it is so boring."

Well... that IS what happens when you spend well over a hundred thousand words buffing up your heroes and hero alliances while simultaneously nerfing or outright removing villains. I mean, Lung as the local bar-fighter rather than the terror of the Bay. Jack Slash as a highly regarded psychologist rather than the terror of the nation. The Undersiders as Wards. Etc. There's nothing for anyone to do because it was intentionally written that way. Others have complained around the 27-29th chapters that the story is sort of boring, and they're right.

To be fair, it was announced on page 1 that this wasn't a fic BASED ON conflict. What I gleaned from that, incorrectly it turns out, is that while there wouldn't be a fight or two every chapter, instead there would be more buildup and background between fights. More worldbuilding, less grimderp. I didn't think it would be utterly lacking in any conflict or tension whatsoever.

EVERY good story has some kind of conflict, whether it be man vs. man, man vs. nature, or man vs. himself. This isn't a story. This is a long exercise in worldbuilding. Everything that "goes wrong" is fixed within a chapter or two, usually as an excuse to garner some new buffs for the heroes as a result. There's no tension, no... plot? Just a continuous sequence of "heroes level up for free" events. It's basically a training-fic.

I just finished chapter 31 out of 66, and literally nothing important has happened. Even though the characters are slowly starting to distinguish themselves, there's still nothing for any of them to do, so they just wander from day to day doing basically the same thing over and over. Which is probably why it's taking so long for the characters to become people rather than cardboard cutouts. And yeah, canon Worm was really dark and depressing. Not every story has to be. But at least there was a reason for the characters to do things other than "Well, it's another day. What can I do today to avoid being totally bored?"

There's nothing memorable or interesting about this fic. I kept waiting for all of that buildup to go somewhere, for the heroes to actually DO SOMETHING with all of their powers, and it never happened. Maybe it will in the next 35 chapters. But I'm not going to be reading about it. I can't keep going with this.

Watching Taylor blunder from unintentional victory to unintentional victory is far worse than watching her blunder from failure to failure. At least when she fails there was something she was striving for. Here, she just exists, and I'm out of patience waiting for that to change. It's mostly my own fault for reading a story explicitly declared as not being based on conflict. I misinterpreted just how absolute that was, and wasted two days waiting for something never intended to happen.

Thanks to CmptrWz for posting. The basic grammar and writing structure is quite good. The characterizations slowly get better as the chapters pass. But there's never a plot, so I'm moving on to something else.
 
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Well... that IS what happens when you spend well over a hundred thousand words buffing up your heroes and hero alliances while simultaneously nerfing or outright removing villains. I mean, Lung as the local bar-fighter rather than the terror of the Bay. Jack Slash as a highly regarded psychologist rather than the terror of the nation. The Undersiders as Wards. Etc. There's nothing for anyone to do because it was intentionally written that way. Others have complained around the 27-29th chapters that the story is sort of boring, and they're right.

To be fair, it was announced on page 1 that this wasn't a fic BASED ON conflict. What I gleaned from that, incorrectly it turns out, is that while there wouldn't be a fight or two every chapter, instead there would be more buildup and background between fights. More worldbuilding, less grimderp. I didn't think it would be utterly lacking in any conflict or tension whatsoever.

EVERY good story has some kind of conflict, whether it be man vs. man, man vs. nature, or man vs. himself. This isn't a story. This is a long exercise in worldbuilding. Everything that "goes wrong" is fixed within a chapter or two, usually as an excuse to garner some new buffs for the heroes as a result. There's no tension, no... plot? Just a continuous sequence of "heroes level up for free" events. It's basically a training-fic.

I just finished chapter 31 out of 66, and literally nothing important has happened. Even though the characters are slowly starting to distinguish themselves, there's still nothing for any of them to do, so they just wander from day to day doing basically the same thing over and over. Which is probably why it's taking so long for the characters to become people rather than cardboard cutouts. And yeah, canon Worm was really dark and depressing. Not every story has to be. But at least there was a reason for the characters to do things other than "Well, it's another day. What can I do today to avoid being totally bored?"

There's nothing memorable or interesting about this fic. I kept waiting for all of that buildup to go somewhere, for the heroes to actually DO SOMETHING with all of their powers, and it never happened. Maybe it will in the next 35 chapters. But I'm not going to be reading about it. I can't keep going with this.

Watching Taylor blunder from unintentional victory to unintentional victory is far worse than watching her blunder from failure to failure. At least when she fails there was something she was striving for. Here, she just exists, and I'm out of patience waiting for that to change. It's mostly my own fault for reading a story explicitly declared as not being based on conflict. I misinterpreted just how absolute that was, and wasted two days waiting for something never intended to happen.

Thanks to CmptrWz for posting. The basic grammar and writing structure is quite good. The characterizations slowly get better as the chapters pass. But there's never a plot, so I'm moving on to something else.
Well, I would disagree with "every good story needs conflict", simply because I actually love long exercises in Worldbuilding. But if you think this is definitely not for you, well, I genuinely wish you luck finding something that you'll like. It gets somewhat difficult after you read enough Wormfics. >>w>>
 
So it seems the author might be implying the 'evolution by conflict' is Zion's idea, because as he Warrior he doesn't have a better frame of reference?

Didn't the Endbringers appear because of Eidolan not Zion?

From what I gathered, the entities were busy doing assigned task which DID NOT include attacking cities in Earth Bet. The Idiot (current consensus is Eidolan) then dragged them away from those assigned tasks and gave them other tasks which were in conflict with their original tasks.

The latest chapter seems to imply that they would happily go back to their original tasks and stop attacking but The Idiot is stopping them from doing so.
 
This interlude suggests that Eden had a completely different job for the "Endbringers", which looks a lot like being tasked to uplift cultures across the entire segment of enclosed habitat worlds to make them ready to receive later sets of snarks and buds during the research phase. Due to Eidolon's receiving a part of the control segment during his initial Eden smoothie, his subconscious has been pulling them away from their designated tasks for repurposing as his combat testing drones. Needless to say, they are not happy about this.

I also got the impression that if Zion had been the one to faceplant, humanity as a whole might've been a lot better off, since it sort of reads like Eden and Taylor would have had very compatible mindsets... up to a point.
 
Which may bring us closer to the primary point of divergence for this fic, in that the entities (while still teradicks, the next step up from gigadicks) are more focused on research than using conflict as development this time around.
 
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