VolantRedX
Official Conscience of Worm Fanfiction!
Defend what? The dude is ignoring Canon for no reason.
Game of Thrones Season 7
- Thread starter Teen Spirit
- Start date
the atom
Anarcho-Kemalist Thought Leader
- Location
- Comfortably numb
It's self evidently ridiculous to anybody who has paid any attention to the series and relies on actively ignoring canon?
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
What canon?
all fictions
I hate you! (it's not against the rules!)
- Location
- Mons Regius
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I don't know who this Preston person is, but I will go with what seems to be Thor's main point:
So Spake Martin said:
So Spake Martin said:
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
Well he's free to say that, but it's not canon, because it's not in the books.
Maybe one day it will be, unless he kicks the bucket first. But that doesn't actually address most of the points raised, it can be a "Fantasy explanation" and the history of the world as characters in universe know it could still be bullshit.
Maybe one day it will be, unless he kicks the bucket first. But that doesn't actually address most of the points raised, it can be a "Fantasy explanation" and the history of the world as characters in universe know it could still be bullshit.
all fictions
I hate you! (it's not against the rules!)
- Location
- Mons Regius
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Okay fam.
- Location
- West Michigan
The old Might and Magic games took place on magical worlds that were colonized or even created by sci-fi civilizations that since fell to barbarism. It is a fun idea, but not one that's true for Planetos.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Ah yes, this Preston Jacobs guy. First time I've seen his stuff, but not the first time I've heard of him. Every single ASOIAF aficionado I follow from Race to the Iron Throne to A War of Ice and Fire isn't a fan of his works. The problem is that he actively ignores canon. The idea that the Planetos has scientific explanations is not new, like the idea that it has two moons thus something something science Long Night.
GRRM has clearly stated above that it is strictly fantasy. While sci-fi and fantasy does blur from time to time, the fact that the literal creator of the series says "no it's not two moons or anything like that" is pretty much definition of canon.
"But death of author" of shut up Martin says it's fantasy, then it's fantasy. Sometimes magic is just magic.
GRRM has clearly stated above that it is strictly fantasy. While sci-fi and fantasy does blur from time to time, the fact that the literal creator of the series says "no it's not two moons or anything like that" is pretty much definition of canon.
"But death of author" of shut up Martin says it's fantasy, then it's fantasy. Sometimes magic is just magic.
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
Well it's a good thing Martin doesn't write absolute shit now does he?
Correct. So whatever the explanation is, "Just magic." isn't it.
Mortis Nuntius
Theon Killjoy
- Location
- United Kingdom
Right because in a setting where different cultures used magic to blow up continents and break them apart and cause centuries of eternal winter at the edge of the world weird seasons can't be explained by magic. There probably is an answer somewhere like the others or after shocks of the Long Night or something but science sure doesn't come into it as we know it.
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
"As we know it" is irrelevant. It comes into it somewhere.
Doesn't matter if you acknowledge it or not. Somewhere, at some point, magic has to deal with physics. You can't have living, breathing human beings without physics, we're made out of physics. So obviously, somewhere, no matter what the magic was doing, physics was there, and there has to be an explanation for how this shit works.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
Magic to a storyteller is a tool. Martin uses it for the mix of bronze age and medieval cultures, the explanation of unnatural weather, literal zombies, etc etc.
It's magic. It's not the most explained magic, but it doesn't need to be. I suppose LoTR also has scientific reasons for all the stuff it has in its world? I don't think so. Even a setting like Elder Scrolls with magic science and spaceships still boil down to "things things because Aetherius and Oblivion."
If I was Martin, and people keep insisting two moons and stuff, I'd be pretty annoyed too. It's not "OUR" physics anymore than Fallout's science is ours.
Polokun
Dragonheart
Who says?
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
Me.
And you know, basic logic.
LoTR is shit writing.
I never said it had to be "Our" physics. But it has to be physics. It has to be rules.
You'll note that the world got along just fine without magic for centuries. It's only now that there's a bunch of dragons and white walkers and shit roaming around that magic is sticking it's unwanted nose into a perfectly orderly physical universe that was doing fine without it, thank you very much.
Mortis Nuntius
Theon Killjoy
- Location
- United Kingdom
Yeah. We're made of physics. Westeros is fictional, its rules such as they are are subject to author whims.
Inventing moons and shit to explain magic makes no sense.
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
Seriously what the fuck is this about moons? I've literally never heard this idea.
I assume you're referring to the supposed second moon full of dragons that one of the dothraki girls I don't care about references in a story, but how that relates to this fan theory I have no idea.
Polokun
Dragonheart
Who are you that we should give two craps about how stories should be written?
Again, who says? When you're talking about magical powers, or superpowers or even way in the future science fictional abilities via tech, it's part and parcel that physics as we know them are going to get violated.
Mortis Nuntius
Theon Killjoy
- Location
- United Kingdom
Its one of the explanations that pops up every now and then. The Seasons are totally mundane, just an extra moon throwing things out of whack that's just at the right angle and distance that nobody in Westeros has noticed and they're all too stupid to judge the tides or anything.
Basically trying to force science on the setting that has dragons and fire ladders and resurrections, wargs and ice zombies You get the picture.
So when you're insisting physics guiding how the world of Westeros works and posting links to an asshole who tends to pop up in such "its all science really" debates that's what you look like.
Hykal94
Orange Estus Kitteh
- Location
- Firelink Shrine
In my setting, water isn't wet.
There. That's my rules.
If Martin walked up to you and says, "no, it's magic" are you gonna argue?
- Location
- Challenge God? y/n
Good god I've been through this so many times; NO ONE. It doesn't matter what my opinion is, you should be able to see this for yourself and come to the same conclusion, that you can't isn't my problem.
So your water is all frozen? Must make living human beings pretty hard to make. Funnily enough they're walking around just fine in Martins universe, so I guess his water obeys the same laws of physics ours does.
Well, no, that doesn't make any fucking sense and I'd never suggest that. Jacobs doesn't either.
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Polokun
Dragonheart
Pretty much everyone else here is arguing that no, we don't have the same conclusion as you. I mean, ultimately it's just a matter of people having two different levels of SoD.
VolantRedX
Official Conscience of Worm Fanfiction!
Isn't the whole point of using magic as a narrative device that you don't need to use actual science to explain things. "It's magic" is the end all be all. It's fairy dust and dream sand. There isn't anything to be analyzed because its very existence precludes analysis. I mean magic is supernatural, which by the meaning of the word is something that transcends natural laws. It can't be broken down by science because it is beyond science.
