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Firebird, a Worm AU/Xover?

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chibipoe said:
I'm working(just chiming in on break), so I can't really take the time to sort through all the comments. Maybe at lunch though. Loads of comments to go through. @.@

I don't understand the Coil is a dumbass line of thought. Has no one seriously worked out a reasonable means that he might capture and keep captured a precognitive with telekinesis? It was one of the first things I worked out when I started.
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I'm calling him a dumbass for kidnapping a Ward honestly.

-edit-

Even if she is a reluctant one.
 
chibipoe said:
I don't understand the Coil is a dumbass line of thought. Has no one seriously worked out a reasonable means that he might capture and keep captured a precognitive with telekinesis? It was one of the first things I worked out when I started.
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Apparently you're the only one who's figured it out. Only thing I can think of is some BS anti-psychic headband-limiter thingie, and that's far from reasonable in Worm.
 
Drugs, blackmail, masters, like regent taking over her body, and well, there are more ways he could keep Taylor as she is right now contained, but some of them are rather darker, so I'm not going to say them since they wont be used in the first place.

Taylor doesn't have the full power or control of the Phoenix yet, so there are ways Coil could keep her contained as his new pet.

But probably not for more than a week tops.
 
Always Late said:
Apparently you're the only one who's figured it out. Only thing I can think of is some BS anti-psychic headband-limiter thingie, and that's far from reasonable in Worm.
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Maybe drugs? But then Coil wants her for precog so any drug that wrecks TK would likely wreck that too. You don't want your precog giving you potentially inaccurate information. Besides, Taylors TK powers are not from a shard, so targeted tinkertech drugs should not work at all.

Blackmail perhaps? Asking her to use her precog to see what happens to her friends/father if she tries anything (after having arranged things so that they really will die, so that Taylors own precog confirms it).

Heck, maybe a tinkertech cell made of material so tough that Taylors TK cannot breach it. Then basically make it clear that she gets food (and eventually tv/books/etc) IF she cooperates. Then add in somekind of code known only to Coil thats required to give food/etc, and you have a situation where Coils death automatically means Taylors slow death from starvation.

Torture is problematic. On one hand, Coil could basically torture Taylor to death in an alternate timeline, forcing the surviving Taylor in the real timeline to actually experience it. But if Coil went that far, Taylor could just use TK to kill herself to escape (no manton limit presumably means she can blow up her own brain too)? Actually, unless Coil does have some BS way to totally disable TK, that threat would always exist if he goes too far.

I assume Dinah has not triggered yet BTW, since Coil is going this far to get a precog thats also a powerfull TK that can see into his alternate timeline?
 
Franklymydear said:
You know, it was suggested before that Coil might be the owner of the building she is staying in and that is why some of the utilities still work.
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*Raises hand*

Taylor's hideout is almost certainly the temporary base for the Travelers while Coil finishes construction on his main base. I don't know how Coil plans to keep Taylor, but I think I see how this situation happened.

While Taylor dealt with the E88, the Traveler's showed up at their base and realized it was lived in. Coil immediately realized Sirin was squatting there and prepared his anti-Sirin countermeasures. He didn't deploy his own mercenaries because he didn't want the Travelers to be associated with him, and he thought they would have a better chance to capture her. When Taylor returned with Lisa of all people, he split timelines. In one timeline, he had the Travelers hang back and in the other, he had them eavesdrop on their conversation and prepare an ambush. When Lisa explained his powers, he freaked out, dropped the second timeline (he wouldn't want the Travelers to know his power), and ordered the Travelers to capture Sirin immediately.

Unfortunately for him, the Travelers aren't murderers, so he can't silence Sirin and company right now.
 
Important things to consider: He addicted Dinah to drugs for the purpose of easing the headaches she got from use of her power and to establish a leash(she wants the high/she answers the questions/gets the candy). Now, Taylor's power can create headaches if she stretches too far, but a similar, though different approach may work here. And he does have money, so hell, contacting say, Toybox and getting a drug that makes some docile, pliable and submissive(not that way, before anyone pursues the Coil is a creepy pedo line) wouldn't be outside his abilities. Keep her rolled on that and bam, his own personal drugged up Oracle at Delphi. And if the drugs start to be less effective/she develops a resistance or becomes intractable... well, there's always disposing of her since he could aim for Dinah shortly.

Taylor's precog will continue to work even drugged... but the concentration for telekinesis would be beyond her. So, all he'd have to do is keep her balanced so that she still responds to external stimuli(i.e., he asks a question) but not so much that she's capable of escape.
 
chibipoe said:
Important things to consider: He addicted Dinah to drugs for the purpose of easing the headaches she got from use of her power and to establish a leash(she wants the high/she answers the questions/gets the candy). Now, Taylor's power can create headaches if she stretches too far, but a similar, though different approach may work here. And he does have money, so hell, contacting say, Toybox and getting a drug that makes some docile, pliable and submissive(not that way, before anyone pursues the Coil is a creepy pedo line) wouldn't be outside his abilities. Keep her rolled on that and bam, his own personal drugged up Oracle at Delphi. And if the drugs start to be less effective/she develops a resistance or becomes intractable... well, there's always disposing of her since he could aim for Dinah shortly.

Taylor's precog will continue to work even drugged... but the concentration for telekinesis would be beyond her. So, all he'd have to do is keep her balanced so that she still responds to external stimuli(i.e., he asks a question) but not so much that she's capable of escape.
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Plus Trickster is a good counter to Taylor. He can keep her highly disoriented until she either just becomes insensible or nukes the entire area she's in. And even that's not a guarantee that it will end him, since he is a teleporter.

This seems like an avenue for either Taylor to be forced to develop her telepathy, or force her to reveal her flames.
 
chibipoe said:
I'm working(just chiming in on break), so I can't really take the time to sort through all the comments. Maybe at lunch though. Loads of comments to go through. @.@

I don't understand the Coil is a dumbass line of thought. Has no one seriously worked out a reasonable means that he might capture and keep captured a precognitive with telekinesis? It was one of the first things I worked out when I started.
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Well, the capture part is done, so all he has to do is work on the keeping captured part. There are a number of ways he could (attempt to) accomplish this:
1) The classic hostage-taking of friends and family. Dead-man switch non-optional.
2) Plot device to inhibit/control her powers. Could be some kind of anti-psionic tinkertech, or maybe even a power-nullifying cape (not that the later would work given that she isn't a parahuman).
3) Keep her sedated/drugged-up beyond all reason. This one is unlikely since Coil probably wants to use her powers.
4) Lobotomize her. Same problem as above.
5) Trap her in something (he thinks) her telekinesis can't get her out of, like containment foam, energy fields, a massive steel prison located deep into the ocean, etc.
​
EDIT: Imp'd by the author.
 
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GiftOfLove said:
Plus Trickster is a good counter to Taylor. He can keep her highly disoriented until she either just becomes insensible or nukes the entire area she's in. And even that's not a guarantee that it will end him, since he is a teleporter.
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AoE attack would get trickster. His power has to switch things of similar shape and weight I believe in order for it to work.

Nuke the entire area and you would get him.
 
chibipoe said:
Important things to consider: He addicted Dinah to drugs for the purpose of easing the headaches she got from use of her power and to establish a leash(she wants the high/she answers the questions/gets the candy). Now, Taylor's power can create headaches if she stretches too far, but a similar, though different approach may work here. And he does have money, so hell, contacting say, Toybox and getting a drug that makes some docile, pliable and submissive(not that way, before anyone pursues the Coil is a creepy pedo line) wouldn't be outside his abilities. Keep her rolled on that and bam, his own personal drugged up Oracle at Delphi. And if the drugs start to be less effective/she develops a resistance or becomes intractable... well, there's always disposing of her since he could aim for Dinah shortly.

Taylor's precog will continue to work even drugged... but the concentration for telekinesis would be beyond her. So, all he'd have to do is keep her balanced so that she still responds to external stimuli(i.e., he asks a question) but not so much that she's capable of escape.
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So it is drugs, just tinkertech sedatives rather than morphine or whatever Coil used in canon. You sneaky snake, Coil. Your ego may be the size of Ziz's TK range, but you're not stupid. Coil's still kind of a pedo for that 'pet' line, can we not have that here?
 
OverReactionGuy said:
AoE attack would get trickster. His power has to switch things of similar shape and weight I believe in order for it to work.

Nuke the entire area and you would get him.
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He can fill the difference with air. And no, that wouldn't get Trickster if he's playing smart and keeping to a distance. She would have to flatten a truly massive area, and do it while highly disoriented. Which seems to be a problem for her given this last chapter.

Even Taylor still needs focus to use her powers.
 
chibipoe said:
Important things to consider: He addicted Dinah to drugs for the purpose of easing the headaches she got from use of her power and to establish a leash(she wants the high/she answers the questions/gets the candy). Now, Taylor's power can create headaches if she stretches too far, but a similar, though different approach may work here. And he does have money, so hell, contacting say, Toybox and getting a drug that makes some docile, pliable and submissive(not that way, before anyone pursues the Coil is a creepy pedo line) wouldn't be outside his abilities. Keep her rolled on that and bam, his own personal drugged up Oracle at Delphi. And if the drugs start to be less effective/she develops a resistance or becomes intractable... well, there's always disposing of her since he could aim for Dinah shortly.

Taylor's precog will continue to work even drugged... but the concentration for telekinesis would be beyond her. So, all he'd have to do is keep her balanced so that she still responds to external stimuli(i.e., he asks a question) but not so much that she's capable of escape.
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Well, that sounds incredibly risky. Designing a drug to work on a parahuman who has an undefined set of powers and which will make one part of her power non functional while not interfering with another.

I can see Bonesaw being capable of doing it if she had Taylor tied down in front of her and was adjusting things on the fly, especially after implanting brain probes. I would be highly dubious of anyone else succeeding, especially if the drug designer is not on site monitoring the reactions and effectiveness and modifying dosing and formula accordingly.

Not that this would probably stop Coil - he seems to think that he is infallible.
 
Except Taylor's nose just healed rather quickly. With a healing factor like that, I'd be very skeptical about whether any drugs would work on her for very long.
 
Not being injured in the most recent chapter suggested Taylor had regeneration, which generally comes with a boosted metabolism. I also feel like, considering the personality that comes with the powers, it wouldn't be a surprise if trying to control Taylor made her explode.
 
GiftOfLove said:
Plus Trickster is a good counter to Taylor. He can keep her highly disoriented until she either just becomes insensible or nukes the entire area she's in. And even that's not a guarantee that it will end him, since he is a teleporter.

This seems like an avenue for either Taylor to be forced to develop her telepathy, or force her to reveal her flames.
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Yeahhh but look at it from Trickster's point of view, this is like juggling live grenades. I imagine he doesn't want to be doing that any longer than he absolutely has to.
 
Always Late said:
Alright, so Krouse can switch a barrel for a baseball. That's cool.
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To the nearest I can recall, it takes him time to draw in a sufficient mass/volume of air to fill the difference, resulting in a delayed switch. That's the last I'm gonna say on it though, because it's not all that relevant to the story at hand.
 
Fredo said:
Well, that sounds incredibly risky. Designing a drug to work on a parahuman who has an undefined set of powers and which will make one part of her power non functional while not interfering with another.

I can see Bonesaw being capable of doing it if she had Taylor tied down in front of her and was adjusting things on the fly, especially after implanting brain probes. I would be highly dubious of anyone else succeeding, especially if the drug designer is not on site monitoring the reactions and effectiveness and modifying dosing and formula accordingly.
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Its even worse than that, and I would assume that it would be hard even for Bonesaw. Why? Because Taylor does not have a shard and her powers do not come from a spacewhale! Unless the spacewhales have had the opportunity to capture and dissect the PF, they should have no clue how its&Taylors powers work. And by extension, neither would any tinkers (atleast not without significant study), whose knowledge come from spacewhale shards.

I could see basic drugs such as morphine and the like (things that make her dizzy and weak) working, but specific anti-parahuman tinkertech drugs should fail utterly since they by default rely on an utterly false assumption. Taylor is NOT a parahuman, and does not have a spacewhale shard giving her powers. Heck, this was actually confirmed at the start when Armsmaster had Taylors brain scanned (everyone is just assuming that Taylor somehow faked the results).
 
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