Fiend: Thread Three, Thread Harder. [Exalted/Worm]

logiccosmic said:
And yet she isn't big time, already.

Why?
Because she doesn't really have much in the way of guts or ambition and she's actually not much of a joiner. In canon, she pretty much stayed in her one-horse town fighting the same capes she was reasonably sure wouldn't hurt her too much. Only when the S9 basically drafted her did she do much more. Her clone's 'teatime' with Riley makes it very clear she has a very hard time trusting anyone, but doesn't do much to back that paranoia up effectively.

Here, it's very telling that she urges Taylor to take on the form of a middle-aged woman specifically and reacts so demonstratively to being offered some TLC. I would guess very much the mommy or grandmommy issues. It's very clear that she also had a very hard time making money, even though knocking over a corner store with her powers would be just about the easiest thing imaginable. Risky? Sure. But most villains would take a few risks when they're down to the point they're driving in a shitty hobomobile and can't afford twinkies. Damsel doesn't.

Basically, she doesn't have a lot of nerve, and she's been burned at some point to the level where her joining up with Taylor must have required a pretty impressive level of desperation.
 
Just an odd thought. How does Cauldron make whatever substance gives people cape powers? Also since powers have a somewhat genetic component since some powers are inheritable, see New Wave, is there any research about genetically engineering powers from existing capes?
 
megrisvernin said:
Just an odd thought. How does Cauldron make whatever substance gives people cape powers? Also since powers have a somewhat genetic component since some powers are inheritable, see New Wave, is there any research about genetically engineering powers from existing capes?
Powers aren't inherited genetically; IIRC what happens is that the original Shard received by the parent occasionally buds off new ones that can attach to anyone. It's just that they're only likely to attach to people that they spend a large amount of time around, and who do people typically spend the absolute most amount of time in close proximity to? That's also why adopted kids can still get powers from their parents, and why occasionally a kid gets powers before their parents. Or something like that, anyway. As for how they make the stuff, it's unconfirmed but a current leading theory is that they harvest pieces of the dead Entity to make them.
 
chrnno said:
No powers are not genetic I can say that without spoilering anything. If you don't care about those and this is major spoilers, don't read if you intended to ever read Worm. You have been warned.

There are basically two Entities that all powers derive from and the powers are basically shards of their bodies. One of those Entities is dead. Cauldron seems to have access to the dead one and thus can use it's body to create more shards.

The whole being close with parahumans is that when shards mature they create another one which proceeds to bond with someone nearby(not necessarily at that point, just giving whoever it was the possibility to trigger), it is also implied that second trigger is basically when there is no normal humans nearby so the shard grows instead of going to someone else.
This contradicts a lot of what happens in Worm, but this really isn't the thread for mechanic discussions. Just going to say that i strongly believe that there are two different cases here, the 'budding' case (which is rare as heck) and the extremely common 'children' case (as in, every kids of superhuman parents get their powers, without exceptions).
 
Arcman said:
I take anything the Irregulars say with a grain of salt given we haven't seen Contessa yet and the Irregulars would have killed her if given the chance too which they failed to mention.
Not per se. Perhaps they used some kind of Grey Boy power on her, or just... displaced her into another universe. with the kinds of powers available in Worm, physically beating someone is only a tiny subset of available options.
 
logiccosmic said:
Spoiler: Yup. That, and she wants to be Lex Luthor, not Etrigan. Just the money and fame, please.
Well, she was at least paranoid enough not to give her real name. Sure, she may want to rule the world and all that, but she doesn't really want to put in the work that requires. Such a pity too. :3

Also;
Arcman said:
Atlan said:
BlackWarth said:
chrnno said:
People, canon discussion only belongs in here when it applies in some way to this story. At the moment, the arguments you are all having about Contessa have nothing to do with this story. Please take it elsewhere. Thank you. ^_^
 
Montreal.. could mean Cherish. She went to Jack Slash for protection, after all. She fits the pattern of sucking at life :D
 
Taylor is told to bring Heartbreaker in to Caulron, perhaps? I really don't know why they didn't make more use of a guy with his powerset in canon.

She ends up with all 30 Heartbroken in her gang.
logiccosmic said:
And yet she isn't big time, already.

Why?
I assume because she keeps wimping out and going home when things get tough, much like she just did.
 
Arkeus said:
This contradicts a lot of what happens in Worm, but this really isn't the thread for mechanic discussions. Just going to say that i strongly believe that there are two different cases here, the 'budding' case (which is rare as heck) and the extremely common 'children' case (as in, every kids of superhuman parents get their powers, without exceptions).
Actually, they are definitely linked:
The female's was among the most mature. Seasoned by conflict, heavy with information, lessons learned, tactics, applications, organization. It had already fragmented once, heavy enough with information that it could afford to handle other roles. The fragment would have a derivative ability, and given proximity, it would hopefully remain close enough to exchange information with the shard that it had split off from. There were no signs of that exchange. The female had separated ways from the fragment.
"It's him," Charlotte said.
"Aidan. Hi Aidan."
"He triggered yesterday. It… didn't take much. Which is probably good."
Aidan hung his head.
"That's excellent," Tattletale said. She looked at the seven year old. "How are you?"
"Okay. Had a nightmare for the first time in a long, long time. I woke up and I was sleepwalking, and I didn't know where I was… I got scared, and then it happened."
"What happened afterwards?" Tattletale asked.
"Birds."
"Birds. I see. Interesting," she said. Her eye moved over to the boards that marked the perimeters of the room. Each was packed with information in her small, tight, flowing handwriting. Messy, but she'd gotten good at putting pen to paper these past few years
"I push and the birds go where I pushed. Or I pull and they fly away from that spot. It's hard to do. I can see what they see, but not while I'm controlling them."
"Like Taylor, but birds, and not that flexible. I see."
"We suspected he would trigger," Charlotte said.
Tattletale looked up, surprised.
"Aidan had a dream one night, back when the nightmares stopped. He drew that picture."
Not all the cases seem/would come from this, but I suspect the vast majority of them are.
Also, it's not said that being the child of a Parahuman guarantee's you'll be one. The odds are heavily in your favour, but not 100%.​
chrnno said:
The whole being close with parahumans is that when shards mature they create another one which proceeds to bond with someone nearby(not necessarily at that point, just giving whoever it was the possibility to trigger), it is also implied that second trigger is basically when there is no normal humans nearby so the shard grows instead of going to someone else.
Can you direct me to where it's implied that second triggers are caused by the "budding" process? Nothing I've seen implies that.
 
Gore17 said:
Actually, they are definitely linked:


Not all the cases seem/would come from this, but I suspect the vast majority of them are.
Also, it's not said that being the child of a Parahuman guarantee's you'll be one. The odds are heavily in your favour, but not 100%.​
Can you direct me to where it's implied that second triggers are caused by the "budding" process? Nothing I've seen implies that.
Yeah if anything I would say that a second trigger is simply a shard rerouting around some of the crippled areas to regain some lost functionality see:
18.y said:
"It's not confirmed, it's just an idea, but the idea the powers are sentient? Well, either the second trigger event opens up communication, frees the powers to act on their own more, or if you don't buy that stuff, it breaks down the mental barriers between the altered part of the brain that controls the powers and the part that doesn't.
For evidence
.
 
Gore17 said:
Actually, they are definitely linked:


Not all the cases seem/would come from this, but I suspect the vast majority of them are.
Also, it's not said that being the child of a Parahuman guarantee's you'll be one. The odds are heavily in your favour, but not 100%.​
What you just quoted me is WHY i believe what i said- It describes something that is incredibly rare, as the shard in question was the most developed in an area where many, many seasoned capes were battling. OTOH, if capes have many children, they will all have the powers by default. You don't need them to be the best of best of capes OR them living together.

Likewise, they might trigger years and years after seeing their parents.

I'll have to look up the interlude where a certain someone trigger, but i am pretty sure it's said there that Second generations -will- trigger.

EDIT: Damn it, i said this shouldn't be talked here- i'll stop now.

Oh, and i personally much prefer Taylor getting Dragon because of Saint killing, but heh, given the themes used Dragon is quite a bit too much of a major character to get into the team.
 
Arkeus said:
What you just quoted me is WHY i believe what i said- It describes something that is incredibly rare, as the shard in question was the most developed in an area where many, many seasoned capes were battling. OTOH, if capes have many children, they will all have the powers by default. You don't need them to be the best of best of capes OR them living together.

Likewise, they might trigger years and years after seeing their parents.

I'll have to look up the interlude where a certain someone trigger, but i am pretty sure it's said there that Second generations -will- trigger.
Actually, it's noted to be one of the most mature shards, not the most mature, which was Jack's. Besides Taylor and Jack, there was Foil, Tecton, Parian, Golem, Hookwolf and various clones, at least two of which utilized dead and damaged shards, which may not be able to mature at all.

It should be mentioned that Tecton, Foil and Parian had far less fights and horribly bad situations under their belt then Taylor. Also, Golems shard is called a fragment here:
A confrontation had started between a young male and an older one. A fragment of a shard against a very mature shard. The most mature shard in this area, at a glance.
And more evidence:
In hosts, too, there will be variations. The shards might seek out different hosts, if others are in range, as the perception-altering one did. They will fragment and transmit to other hosts, as they grow and develop.
So, yeah, I think fragmentation isn't a rare event, like you believe, but a incredibly common event amongst more experienced capes in the Superhero/Supervillain scene.

And no, it's not guaranteed, just far more likely and easier:
"I… I don't really know. It's supposed to be ten times easier to get powers if you're second generation. But we don't have research on third generations yet. It's only pretty recently that we had the first third-generation cape on record. The baby in Toronto."
 
Like the Contessa discussion, budding shards have exactly jack shit to do with the current story. If you want to continue your dick waving contest please take it to the appropriate thread.
 
4
Black Nadir 6.3

"And I wanted to talk to you," I ground out, nearly crushing the phone in my hand. "You forgot to mention something."

"If you are referring to the last member of the Travellers, no I did not. You hung up before I could warn you that they were sheltering something," he replied, voice calm. Battery stepped back, out of hearing range, and waited, watching me.

"Usually, you put the biggest threat first. The one most likely to be a problem. That makes sense to me," I said, angry at him, and angry at myself. Mostly myself, for not being patient. For rushing off to rescue Damsel, without gathering enough intelligence. For making a bad situation worse. I... really had to stop doing that.

"My apologies. I will endeavor to make our communications more clear in the future. However, as I said before, I am calling in the favor I earned from supplying you with the information," he chastised, voice cool.

"And what do you want? I don't know if you're paying attention, but we have a slight problem. My schedule isn't clear," I said, irritated. The Simurgh was attacking Montreal, and could quite possibly go onto a third city. And the Number Man was calling in a favor now, and for all I knew he wanted me to go to the grocery store, or something equally inane. Even if it was something serious, it could wait, with the Simurgh attacking, right now.

"You will not fight the Simurgh," he ordered.

I saw green. I was furious, nearly beyond rational thought. I sputtered, a jumble of words running into each other. He wanted me, who he had acknowledged as vital to fighting the Endbringers, to stand down? To not try? Everything I had done, since meeting him, had been for two goals. To stop the Endbringers, and to clean up crime in the process. The former had been the goal I had been striving to above all else. Fighting, and eradicating crime had been a nice diversion, and a beneficial side-effect to my actions. To prevent others from suffering as I and others, had. But fighting the Endbringers had been my atonement, meaning, and purpose. To get stronger, better, ready. Everything.

And he was telling me no?

"Fuck. No," I all but shouted, sending Battery and Sundancer back in surprise. Sundancer looked concerned, while Battery turned away, guilt showing on her face. She walked away, back into the auditorium, hands wringing. I was about to pull the phone from my ear, to let him know in no uncertain terms what I have thought of his plan, before he spoke.

"First, please don't hang up. Second, this time let me explain," he asked, unflappable.

"Fine." He had would either have to have the best explanation in the world, or give up on his ridiculous idea.

"You aren't ready, and I have a way that you can be of more help than just being a large rock with limbs."

"That's not a real convincing argument," I pointed out.

"If you will recall our first conversation, you are possibly immune to all known forms of precognition. It would be better to find out what that entails, now, when we can observe her reactions, than to find out you have no effect on her in that regard," he explained, his voice never wavering or raising.

"Oh," I replied, stunned. That made sense. I should have thought of that. He had even said that, that night.

"Yes. I do have a good reason for not wanting you to engage the Simurgh," he chastised, "but you will still be playing a vital role, to help negate her precognition."

"How? What sorta vital role?" I asked, my anger sputtering out into curiosity.

"I have arranged the services of a teleporter. He will take you in a to-be determined pattern, across the continent. In addition, I would like you to stay in contact, over this phone."

"Ah. Wait, if I'm being sent all across America, how can I contact you," I pointed out. By now, embarrassment had eclipsed any lingering feelings of anger.

"It is a PRT phone, and it can connect, after a brief adjustment time, regardless of your location in North America. And, as I am certain you are concerned with the actual fight, with the Simurgh, I have confirmation from reliable sources that Eidolon and Alexandria are already on the scene."

I was relieved. Two of the Triumvirate, and the third was coming. That was plenty of cape-power. I knew, academically that the Simurgh was dangerous, but knowing the entire Triumvirate would be there was a great comfort.

"Who's the teleporter?" I asked.

"You can call him Portal. The number has been programmed into the phone. Just call him, and the phone's tracker will let him know your location. However, as a condition of his arrangement, you must not be seen, at least by capes. And it is my belief that you will distract the Simurgh, at what could be a critical juncture. "

"I'm not entirely pleased, but I can see the benefit. I'll do it," I agreed, somewhat torn. If I could distract the Simurgh when she was about to be blasted by Legend, it would make running away from the fight that much more palatable.

"Thank you. Good luck, Defiler," he said, genuine, and hung up.

"What?" Sundancer asked me impatiently as the call ended.

How to break it to her? The only reason she wasn't a mess, or more of a mess, was that I had given her purpose. To stop Simurgh, from attacking NYC. Maybe I had been mistaken where the Simurgh was originally, but she was still out there, and we could still help.

I'd have to phrase this delicately, "I've been given a way to possibly make a significant difference against the Simurgh."

Her eyebrows furrowed, as she tried to digest my words. She asked, "Isn't that why we are here?"

"Yes," I equivocated, "But more than ineffectually pounding at her, before Scion can show up, or the capes can drive her off. A way that could reduce casualties, significantly."

"Where?"

I paused, wetting my lips. She was giving me a hard stare, evidently not amused by what could be interpreted as running away.

I revealed, "I can block or disrupt precognitives. Someone called in a favor, and offered up a new plan. If I move across the country, frequently with the help of a teleporter he contacted, it could disorient or at least distract the Simurgh."

"Oh," she said, eyes wide. She stayed silent, thinking. She ran a hand through her blond hair, troubled by her thoughts. Sundancer shook herself, and looked me in the eyes. "This will definitely hurt the Simurgh?"

"Yes," I lied. I didn't add the, 'probably.'

"I'm coming with. I owe the Simurgh, a lot," Her voice hardened, and I could see her resolve stiffen.

A door across from the auditorium caught my eye, and I motioned for Sundancer to follow me, quietly. That hall was empty, and I didn't want to be seen running away. Or appearing to run away, as I knew that this might matter more than what a pair of capes could do on the front lines. I checked the entryway of the auditorium, and see that everyone was clumped together in their own groups, not paying attention to the hall, I went for the room behind me.

I opened the door, looking in. An actual conference room, a single long table flanked by a dozen chairs. I tried to lock the door, but it only had a smooth handle, without a lock. I pulled a chair over, and propped it against the door. Sundancer pulled another chair, stacking it with mine, as I flicked through the phone's contacts, selecting 'Portal'. Two rings later, it was picked up.

"Portal?" I asked, after waiting for several silent moments.

No one answered me.

"I need a portal?" I tried. Nothing.

"Alakazam?" Zip.

"Click my heels?" Sundancer added, leaning against the table, faintly amused.

"Me and Sundancer in Las Vegas?" I joked.

"Who's gonna be Hunter Thompson, then?" Sundancer pointed out.

Answering her, a pale rectangle had appeared, and additional rectangles folded out from it, exponentially expanding. In a few seconds, it went from the size of a playing card, to almost half the wall. Revealing a parking lot lit by pale yellow lights. A collection of cars half-filled it, and I could see bright lights in the distance.

"This is cape country," Sundancer said, half-sarcastic, half-serious. She walked through the portal, and then shouted, "It's Las Vegas!"

I followed her through, and with a whoosh of displaced air, the portal closed.


Author Notes: Defiler and Sundancer's Las Vegas adventure. (No Mushrooms).
 
I'm not sure how teleporting Taylor around will mess with Simurgh's precog. She is a walking violation of fate, but unless she pulls off a blasphemy I don't see what this would do. I would have thought Simurgh was used to Taylor's presence by now.
 
You'd think Taylor actually being at the fight would disrupt the Simurgh more than being somewhere else in the country. Unless they're using her to diffuse some of her time bombs.
 
Nameless_Flame said:
My guess: The Simurgh has wide-scale precognition, and capes are being drawn in from all around the world to enter battle. Simurgh needs to pick and choose her targets and analyze the past and future of them for maximum effect with minimum investment, which includes places they've been and where they will go in the future. By teleporting Taylor to the home towns of various capes, places capes gather and taking advantage of Dragon's calculations, they can hopefully ruin the Simugh's greatest advantage: say a cape is being targeted by the Simurgh, and he's from Atlanta. Taylor is teleported to Atlanta and pops her Anima Banner. Suddenly Simurgh is blind for events that happen in Atlanta even though the cape she's targeting is right in front of her. From there it's seeing how the Endbringer reacts and who gets picked next.
Draculthemad said:
I think this is all about getting *doormaker* into the blind spot created by Defiler.
Which is potentially a gigantic advantage.

As soon as they have confirmation that he is occluded, they can drop whatever they damn-well-please right on top of her or somewhere else and she will not see it coming.

Edit: Actually what nameless_flame says is probably part of it too.

So temporary occlusion of combatants/reinforcements and a potentially longer term advantage for Cauldron of cloaking their primary transporter.
:3
 
The question is whether the capes actually fighting Simurgh will realize what's going on or if they'll think she just left when their backs were turned like a coward.

I kind of doubt that, though they'll probably wonder where she left to for quite some time until they hear reports her flaring her anima in a bunch of major cities.
 
logiccosmic said:
Maybe I had been mistaken where the Simurgh was original
I think that last word should be "originally" here.
logiccosmic said:
I went for the room behind me.
.
There's an extraneous period here.
logiccosmic said:
Sundancer pulled another one I flicked through the phone's contacts
I'm ... not quite sure what's exactly going on. Maybe there should be a "while" in the middle.
logiccosmic said:
"You will not fight the Simurgh," he ordered.
I so totally called it (so did a number of other people). Which I think is a good thing since it shows the story has coherency and characters behave believably ; the fact that not everyone called it shows that it wasn't painfully obvious, too, not to mention no one expected this exact twist on that order. So, good job.

I like how she sees green when she's angry.

Apparently they want to let her decide where the portals are going to go to maximize anti-precog effectiveness. I could see various reasons for them not talking to her and taking time to open a portal, but the fact that it opened to the place she named while waiting shows that they were waiting for her input. If they want to exert control over her letting her in the dark about what she's supposed to go and do and giving her control over her transport when she's not expecting to have it are the wrong decisions, so they want her to be at the helm (for now), and her Fate-messing-ness is the only reason I can see for that.
 
Nameless_Flame said:
They can't afford her NOT to be in control on the critical levels here. If someone tells Taylor where to go, the Simurgh can see that person telling the precog-blocker giving directions and she'll figure out the moving blind spot is a problem with a face and a schedule even if she can't see i. Instead, it'll look like random outages in Simurgh's precog since she can't see Taylor making the call on where to go.
Obviously. But that is all based on the assumption that their stated goal to cause blind spots during the fight is not a façade for something else. If she had some valuable powers they might want to use them, but here it'd probably be a ruse to keep her out of Simurgh's reach before she can grow powerful enough to survive the encounter.

The fact that they are granting her control is a good hint that they are actually trying to confuse the Simurgh.
 
Sojiko said:
The fact that they are granting her control is a good hint that they are actually trying to confuse the Simurgh.
I was not seeing where they say they are granting her control, but then i re-read the bit about Las Vegas....

So it basically look twofold.

First, they want to get Data on Taylor herself. Would she believe some basic bulshit about "we want you to have more impact by being away from the fight" without actually giving her direct agency in the fight? E.G, will she actually answer back to the request by a suggestion that keeps her safe the same way but has a more direct impact on that fight. Likewise, the actual places Taylor will teleport too might really help NM narrow down info on his "Taylor Database", as well as her attitude during the whole operation.

Second, they want Data on Taylor's precog disruption. Here, i am not just talking about "Her effect on the Simurgh", but also "Her effects on Precog capes in Cauldron's payroll". Basically, this is a safer was to check her anti-precog powers than if she was actually in the fight, because if she was in the fight they have no way to tell, right now, what kind of damage she could make in a 'test drive'. So this one first time, they want her as far away as possible from actually influencing the fight as possible.

This is also why i think she wasn't allowed to talk/be seen by anyone.
Endymion said:
she can certainly tell when the Simurgh being blinded by outside influence would help turn the fight.
No she can't- first because she can't see stuff involved with Endbringers, second because -Simurgh can also see when Contessa will believe she might be blinded, hence countering anything Contessa might try for indirect attacks.
 
She's immune to precogs flat out. This means that whenever she is active somewhere, the butterfly effect screws over anyone with precog. The more she interacts with a place, the longer the ripples last.
 
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