Echoes of Creation (30k/Exalted)
- Thread starter Yzarc
- Start date
- Crossover
[X] [Holy Aspect]
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
[X] [Holy Aspect]
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
Please people, consider that the combination of Rebirth, Rebel and Speed doesn't really work for a physical Primarch given that we need at least two of the three to be present to trigger the enhanced multiplier.
We're at serious risk of squandering our opportunity by having an anti-synergistic combination here that's exceptionally rare to find scenarios where two of the keywords apply.
It also really doesn't fit the True Name, which is about killing evil, not being swiftly reborn.
It might be different if we could get Mythos powers for him, but we can't. The only benefit from the choice of aspects is when we can have two of them active to increase the success multiplier.
The problem is that they're not, that I can see. What kind of scenarios will commonly come up in the conquest of Colchis and the Great Crusade that will use two of the three of Rebel, Retribution, and Reflection? I just don't think it's that common. For example during the Great Crusade well usually be on the offensive so Retribution won't apply. There are also few scenarios for physical combat where Reflection would seem to be naturally triggered.
As I say, it doesn't matter if one of the Keywords is triggered, that has no effect. We need two or more.
Purge, Destruction and Rebel are useful for physically defeating tyrants such as the Covenant and oppressors of humans and other worlds, but they also work perfectly well for using Social skills to tear down unjust institutions and leaders and to remove corruption from within institutions, whether mundane or lingering chaos cultists. There are plenty of social situations where all three would apply, and even more when the first two would.
We also have Lorgar to do high end social for us. What we need is something that will be reliably applicable for physical rolls.
We're at serious risk of squandering our opportunity by having an anti-synergistic combination here that's exceptionally rare to find scenarios where two of the keywords apply.
It also really doesn't fit the True Name, which is about killing evil, not being swiftly reborn.
It might be different if we could get Mythos powers for him, but we can't. The only benefit from the choice of aspects is when we can have two of them active to increase the success multiplier.
The problem is that they're not, that I can see. What kind of scenarios will commonly come up in the conquest of Colchis and the Great Crusade that will use two of the three of Rebel, Retribution, and Reflection? I just don't think it's that common. For example during the Great Crusade well usually be on the offensive so Retribution won't apply. There are also few scenarios for physical combat where Reflection would seem to be naturally triggered.
As I say, it doesn't matter if one of the Keywords is triggered, that has no effect. We need two or more.
Purge, Destruction and Rebel are useful for physically defeating tyrants such as the Covenant and oppressors of humans and other worlds, but they also work perfectly well for using Social skills to tear down unjust institutions and leaders and to remove corruption from within institutions, whether mundane or lingering chaos cultists. There are plenty of social situations where all three would apply, and even more when the first two would.
We also have Lorgar to do high end social for us. What we need is something that will be reliably applicable for physical rolls.
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[X] Plan: He kills the Evil Ones
[X] Plan: He kills the Evil Ones
I don't know exactly what to vote for but this seems close enough I guess
I don't know exactly what to vote for but this seems close enough I guess
[X] Plan: He kills the Evil Ones
[X] Plan: He kills the Evil Ones
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
Keeping this in reserve.
Keep in mind, he is NOT on par with a Primarch. His boosts are like this:
Base - x4
2 - x5
3 - x6
He is a lesser Demigod. That said? He can gain Merits and abilities that Compliment that aspect, like Immortality, Perpetual, etc.
So you are choosing to focus him vs utility.
Now can wish grant it to him? Some. Others may be rejected by his mythos if it goes against it. This is true of Lorgar as well.
I would not reveal the last part as it is spoilers but best you know now. So some mutations will not take for some demigods.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] [Holy Aspect]
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
If we give him rebirth we could grant him Perpetual which would be very useful in combat for obvious reasons. Also keep in mind what which he cannot fall to chaos Dharok can still die from Perils since he has to roll them. So giving him Rebirth so it can work with the Perpetual Merit will make him the closest thing to another safe caster.
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
He no longer suffers from Perils. Perk of being a demigod. Not to say rebirth will not be useful in other ways using the warp but he does not suffer from Perils.
- Location
- Reno Nv
[X] [Holy Aspect]
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
Having someone who just doesn't die would be an amazing boon for fighting chaos. They already have undying troops, so we are taking there stuff as well.
-[X] Rebirth
[X] [Light Aspect]
-[X] Speed
Having someone who just doesn't die would be an amazing boon for fighting chaos. They already have undying troops, so we are taking there stuff as well.
So just thinking about what we just made here and what it is going to look like to the Emperor if we go with the DAoT survivor excuse. Corvus might not be the only one making the obvious comparison. I mean Old E himself has to be at least a DAoT survivor and he made primarchs out of himself. Fan apparently found one of said primarchs, figured out they could make marines... and proceeded to buff one of them, his own nephew as high as he could go within those parameters. The similarities are eerie... 
- Location
- India
He is interconnected with Mythos of Lorgar. How that effects him and Lorgar vice Versa?
Is it possible for him to get a spiritual bond with Lorgar greater than current one? Maybe Like the Alpha Legion Primarchs where both of them part of same Archetype. Here Lorgar can be more spiritual part while he more physical part of Religious Archetype aka Crusader or warrior Monk aspect.
Can he increase his potential further to a Primarch Level or his growth is capped?
Daemons can feed on Souls and Faith to grow in power. Can he kill demons permanently to grow in power as well?
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Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
You will need to explore all of this IC
- Location
- India
Personally I am more interested in both of Their Mythos Fuse into a compact form where they can become part of same Archetype only difference will a physical and spiritual aspect. Rather similar like case of Alpha Primarchs. Can we do so with Wish or Sorcery? Canon Mythological examples will be venus. In her Greek aspect she is purely Goddess of Love in her Roman aspect aka Venus Victrix she is goddess of war. Another Example will be buddha, Shakyamuni aspect Embody his accomplishments as a sage while Vajrapani is the protector and guide of Gautama Buddha and rose to symbolize the Buddha's power. Archetype are one and same but they can be separated into different form while embodying same concepts.
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Presumably, based on those numbers, with relic DAoT power armour he'd be on a par with a physical primarch in less good armour? And CMA would stack on top of that.
Also, I note that the update says he can never fall to Chaos. Does that means we could give him the Berserker mutation for a Rage pool and related ways of spending Rage points without the risk of falling to Khorne, fluffed as holy wrath?
This would then open up later granting Gifts that require Rage to fuel, as well as Gifts that allow better control of Rage, and mutations like Regeneration that can be supercharged by spending Rage points.
In terms of mutations that can't be granted, ai'd hope that the baked in rebel aspect allows us to grant Shapechange into human form, as becoming the everyman, the instigator hidden in the crowd casting down a tyrant, seems very on brand.
The issue remains that Rebirth, Speed, and Rebel don't synergise together or with his true name of 'I Kill the Evil Ones'. We'd be making him much more likely to be defeated and have much less impact on a campaign in general. On top of that, being a Perpetual isn't that great, I think. In most scenarios where he'd be killed, a perpetual would instead be captured, and that could very much be a fate worse than death, particularly in a starfaring setting where you can just throw a perpetual into a star to burn forever or into a black hole.
It's better to be good enough not to be defeated in the first place.
And we can probably grant him mutations like Regeneration anyway.
Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
This is complicated. Against "evil" i.e Daemons, really bad xenos that actively preys on humans or Chaos tainted anything, it stacks. Against anything not that, it does not stack.
So against a primarch only the higest applies. Except CMA as that always stacks
I forgot about this but it would not work. He will not fall to chaos but risks what is essentially the black rage, even if it is temporary. He has a version for him though. Will post it in char sheet.
He can freely sub Willpower or Essence for any Resource.
If the voting was at the beginning I might be tempted by a combination of something like Rebirth, Destruction, Rebellion.
Both for a Yin-Yang dualism, but also because it's a cohesive narrative about what a rebellion is. You destroy the old so that society can be reborn.
Actually, I'm going to vote for it:
[X] Plan: Pheonix from the Ashes
-[X] [Holy Aspect]
--[X] Rebirth
-[X] [Light Aspect]
--[X] Destruction
I think this last pairing along with Rebel combines versatility in terms of having a theme that's both broad enough to encompass a lot of merits/mutations, is coherent enough to be built on and to have a strong narrative impact, and also should have at least two aspects apply in lots of situations
I think we'd be well advised to hide an awful lot of this from the Emperor on worlds he never visits or on Expeditionary Fleets far from the part of the galaxy he's in.
That's part of why I hope we can give both Lorgar and Malum Caedo the Shapechange mutation, and have the later wage war wearing the former's appearance while he infiltrates the Covenant's oppressed underclass.
That way, people would remember that it was Lorgar who conquered the planet, and Malum Caedo wouldn't be an obvious anomaly.
This seems like it could give a really nasty surprise to a fallen Primarch that thinks that he's only as good as his armour and then gets blindsided by a punch in the face when his multiplier goes from x7 (or x8 with CMA) when they sparred during the Crusade to x13 (or x14 with CMA) when they face off during the Heresy.
Both for a Yin-Yang dualism, but also because it's a cohesive narrative about what a rebellion is. You destroy the old so that society can be reborn.
Actually, I'm going to vote for it:
[X] Plan: Pheonix from the Ashes
-[X] [Holy Aspect]
--[X] Rebirth
-[X] [Light Aspect]
--[X] Destruction
I think this last pairing along with Rebel combines versatility in terms of having a theme that's both broad enough to encompass a lot of merits/mutations, is coherent enough to be built on and to have a strong narrative impact, and also should have at least two aspects apply in lots of situations
So just thinking about what we just made here and what it is going to look like to the Emperor if we go with the DAoT survivor excuse. Corvus might not be the only one making the obvious comparison. I mean Old E himself has to be at least a DAoT survivor and he made primarchs out of himself. Fan apparently found one of said primarchs, figured out they could make marines... and proceeded to buff one of them, his own nephew as high as he could go within those parameters. The similarities are eerie...
I think we'd be well advised to hide an awful lot of this from the Emperor on worlds he never visits or on Expeditionary Fleets far from the part of the galaxy he's in.
That's part of why I hope we can give both Lorgar and Malum Caedo the Shapechange mutation, and have the later wage war wearing the former's appearance while he infiltrates the Covenant's oppressed underclass.
That way, people would remember that it was Lorgar who conquered the planet, and Malum Caedo wouldn't be an obvious anomaly.
This seems like it could give a really nasty surprise to a fallen Primarch that thinks that he's only as good as his armour and then gets blindsided by a punch in the face when his multiplier goes from x7 (or x8 with CMA) when they sparred during the Crusade to x13 (or x14 with CMA) when they face off during the Heresy.
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Fair enough, this does have better synergy than speed
[X] Plan: Pheonix from the Ashes
[X] Plan: Pheonix from the Ashes