Hmm... there's a thought. If he is thinking 'mortal' the natural assumption would be psyker, a very scary psyker who can go on a jaunt into the warp and not go mad. Which might bring to mind the only other god-like psyker he knows. Who says there is only one of whatever the Emperor is?
Echoes of Creation (30k/Exalted)
- Thread starter Yzarc
- Start date
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Hmm... there's a thought. If he is thinking 'mortal' the natural assumption would be psyker, a very scary psyker who can go on a jaunt into the warp and not go mad. Which might bring to mind the only other god-like psyker he knows. Who says there is only one of whatever the Emperor is?
- Location
- Someplace Somewhere
[X] Do not take the final test
- Location
- Arcadia
Well, Yzarc did say that this entity, assuming that it is actually Kairos Fateweaver, is being honest about the rewards, and the "trap" is in the test.
The prospect of gaining full 5-dot mastery of all those psychic powers now is very enticing. Alas, with the votes being as they are, it does not seem likely.
Hm, Lorgar could just work at it himself. It would require more time, which is annoying, but it could be managed.
The prospect of gaining full 5-dot mastery of all those psychic powers now is very enticing. Alas, with the votes being as they are, it does not seem likely.
Hm, Lorgar could just work at it himself. It would require more time, which is annoying, but it could be managed.
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- Location
- Africa
I am pretty sure that the age viability of space marine recruits goes up the better the medical and genetic engineering tech you have access to up to a point anyway, like if you have Daot levels of medical tech and expertise then you can likely stick to recruiting tanagers and very young adults instead of children , the reason the process works best with children is that gene seed highjacks the puberty process to facilitate its changes to the human body , so my theory goes the more advanced your medical tech the less you need to relay on the puberty process priming the body for the change the gene seed will carry out provided it is still done while the body is still receptive to said change (before puberty ends)
That's presuming we have the time. Also that emps gives us the knowledge so we can leap frog forward instead of rebuilding the wheel.
Even if we get the process with no strings attached I don't think Lorgar would use it as it is right now. It's be nice to deal with the chaos worshipers on the planet and the numbers issue but I'd eat my hat if there isn't a way to subvert them built in.
- Location
- Arcadia
Hm, so, for Lorgar, there is the matter of purchasing Mythos powers, learning other Celestial Martial Arts styles, and now having to gain full 5-dot mastery of the remaining psychic powers.
It is going to be such a lengthy and exhausting process, having become even more so with the psychic powers being added to the laundry list.
It is going to be such a lengthy and exhausting process, having become even more so with the psychic powers being added to the laundry list.
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I don't really see the point in SMs. Just make exo skeletons and weapons that can match them. Probably easier to use a mechanical solution then a biological one.
You cannot teach an exo-skeleton Terestrial Martial Arts, Marines are the poor man's Terestrials.
- Location
- Arcadia
Hm, now knowing what Lorgar does from his other self, it is interesting to wonder how he will react when he meets Guilliman in this timeline. Perhaps Lorgar will make overtures of friendship to Guilliman, try to maximize on their potential synergy born from collaboration. The fruits of a partnership between Lorgar and Guilliman could be... substantial.
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Space Marines aren't just biological. I do get what you saying but they obviously benefit from some non-biological functions in there enhancements because no Space Marine loses their mind when they look at a chaos demon of any type or description that's not to say that no Marine loses their mind period but they don't just turn tail and run or turn traitor or explode into chaos Gremlins when they see the chaos demon. Then there's the obvious benefits of having nigh physically Immortal troops that are specifically hardened against one of the four in the form of their disease resistance. He had his perfect man killers in the form of the Thunder Warriors his Space Marines were his bulwark against the terror.
I also don't like the idea of demi gods fighting wars on the behave of humanity. Especially when they can't retire, just death.
Didn't he make the gray wardens with runes to help against corruption. There has to be a way to give protection to elite soldiers that can fulfill the SM niche.
As for immortality, I'd rather have easily replaceable troops over hard to produce supermen that's hard to replenish.
I don't think there's a trap here. I just think they're giving him an impossible task. What if the being they show is a chaos god just to break him. It's not like they have to give us a test that's possible.
Edit: Also the knowledge he uncovers as the first test could be an attempt to harm with truth.
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Yzarc
The Spark of Madness
Space Marines benefit from their Primarch's mythos. They enjoy narrative protections in a broad scale.
What this means in game terms is that the impossible odds become improbable odds.
You can make many Enhanced Humans but SMs are the closest you are going to get to make mass produced Demigods/Dragon Blooded equivalents. They can pull off victories where they should have lost.
In essence? They hit way above their weight limits. Not as much as a Custodies or Thunder Warrior, but they are stable and mass producable.
What this means in game terms is that the impossible odds become improbable odds.
You can make many Enhanced Humans but SMs are the closest you are going to get to make mass produced Demigods/Dragon Blooded equivalents. They can pull off victories where they should have lost.
In essence? They hit way above their weight limits. Not as much as a Custodies or Thunder Warrior, but they are stable and mass producable.
There is nothing inherently stopping a Space Marine from retiring, they would hate the idea, but that is a matter of culture not any kind of genetic of magical imposition.
That said I understand your concerns, that is part of why the Heresy happened. Much is made of all the corruption and the cults, the temple of Davin etc... but one of the major reasons why a lot of Space Marines were willing to go traitor was the concern that once the Crusade ended (and it was winding down) they would no longer be necessary and power would fall into the hands of Terran bureaucrats
The thing is though we do not have any realistic means to prevent marines from existing and the fact that they do exist will be a significant part of our power base in the form of the Imperial Heralds/Word Bearers.
I think you mean the gray Knights and they're all psychers they're all powering those runes using their own psychic might which kind of goes against the idea of those runes being useful to normal people.
Also just the fucking attrition from normal soldiers like we see what happens to normal soldiers when it's them versus chaos demons 'it's oh God shoot that thing my eyes are turning inside out my flesh is inverting I've become a chaos imp.' Or 'it's beautiful' and starts firing on his former friend and finally for the most and least fortunate of the bunch 'oh my God Tom just turned into a weird imp thing and Jerry just started firing on the platoon why',
That's to say quality and quantity win the day that is why it's both the astartes and the astra militarum not one or the other. Not to mention the turnaround time on Marines is not too bad as far as trained super soldiers go. I think it's a turnaround of 10 years around there from start to finish the normal human time is you know significantly shorter than that but you can expect a marine to last anywhere from a couple decades to a couple millennia so the cost kind of even out.
- Location
- Arcadia
Looking at the potential rewards, there is another point. It is not simply about gaining 5-dot mastery of the remaining psychic disciplines. They would also become innate and second nature to Lorgar, thus allowing him to use them without spending Willpower. However, they would require action slots and cannot be flurried without a Charm or equivalent.
It could be possible for Lorgar to practice by himself until those psychic disciplines do become innate and second nature to him, but it would require even more time after reaching 5 dots in all 7 remaining disciplines. Well, perhaps Lorgar could make a wish to Fan Morgal to accelerate the process, though it might require multiple wishes.
It could be possible for Lorgar to practice by himself until those psychic disciplines do become innate and second nature to him, but it would require even more time after reaching 5 dots in all 7 remaining disciplines. Well, perhaps Lorgar could make a wish to Fan Morgal to accelerate the process, though it might require multiple wishes.
- Location
- Africa
actually, space marines in the great crusade era Imperium can retire and in fact many had plans to exactly that, Ahariman for example had a Vinyard on Prosparo that he planned to retire to with ambitions of making the galaxy's best win and many senior Ultramarines had plans to retire putting away their power armor and become fulltime administrators outright joining the adminstratum , all this went down the drain with the heresy
View: https://youtube.com/shorts/XEsSIqy_4nY?si=vwpr20FVuPqvPYHY
Worth keeping in mind we did not even come in here for psyker lore, that is a bonus. We came here to stop the visions. The visions have been stopped.
- Location
- Africa
plus we can grant that some boost to Lorger via a wish with no stings or risks attached
Yeah, we can, though that would take a lot of wishes. We would probably be better off saving them for things he cannot just learn with XP or at least things that would take a lot more XP
- Location
- Belgium
[X] Do not take the final test
Do not do it son its a bad idea
Do not do it son its a bad idea
Lorgars strongest point is his mouth. Plus he just said power isn't necessary. Another possibility is the question is a test itself..
- Location
- Arcadia