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Cliches you can't stand

I would hesitate to claim that not liking colonialism is somehow inherent human trait considering that there still remains not insignificant chunk of humanity that would love nothing more than some good old colonialism (as long as it is done by them).
 
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bluntblade said:
Can I recommend The Algebraist by Iain M. Banks then?

Though I'm not sure that "urgh, periods and shunting babies out the hoo-hah" is gonna go down that well...
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It's meant to be subversive as it mentions a trait typically associated with human women as Humanity's main defining factor. Plus the periods gross aliens aren't meant to reflect humans views.
 
Valmond said:
Authors treating their cultural quirks as universal rules is very common.
I mostly notice it in japanese media, but that is almost certainly because it is harder to notice your own cultural quirks being treated that way.
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In a lot of cases I think this is probably a worldbuilding shortcut as much as anything. (An example is addressing older siblings as "nii-san," etc., rather than by name, even in otherwise very Western settings, e.g., Fullmetal Alchemist. This actually fits Al's rather un-assertive character, which provides an ironic contrast with his appearance; but my point is that I can't actually think of an anime character who does address their older sibling by name, regardless of setting or characterization.) But there are definitely some isekai stories that sort of assume that any sapient being that isn't a mustache-twirling villain would enthusiastically adopt 21st-century Japanese culture if they were exposed to it, which is pretty uncomfortable.
 
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Silver2195 said:
regardless of setting.) But there are definitely some isekai stories that sort of assume that any sapient being that isn't a mustache-twirling villain would enthusiastically adopt 21st-century Japanese culture if they were exposed to it, which is pretty uncomfortable.
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That's common in western stories to. And some stories like Asensidece of a Bookworm play with this. With not everyone just accepting 21 ceuntry Japanese culture
 
Valmond said:
Authors treating their cultural quirks as universal rules is very common.
I mostly notice it in japanese media, but that is almost certainly because it is harder to notice your own cultural quirks being treated that way.
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I wonder if Soviet scifi had all the "good guy" aliens be communists. And had villainous alien corporations
 
Silver2195 said:
In a lot of cases I think this is probably a worldbuilding shortcut as much as anything. (An example is addressing older siblings as "nii-san," etc., rather than by name, even in otherwise very Western settings, e.g., Fullmetal Alchemist. This actually fits Al's rather un-assertive character
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I think that's just translation for the audience. Like how in Chernobyl is in English. When in reality they should be speaking Russian
 
The problem with western miniseries featuring Russia is that they always find English As Fuck actors who play the accent and not the role. Which is why we get The Queen's Russian.
 
Valmond said:
I would hesitate to claim that not liking colonialism is somehow inherent human trait considering that there still remains not insignificant chunk of humanity that would nothing more than some good old colonialism (as long as it is done by them).
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But the caveat of "(as long as it is done by them)" rather demonstrates the point; everyone does dislike colonialism. Inflicting it isn't the same thing as suffering it. Rather like murder, rape, or torture, approval is strictly limited to the perpertrators and not the victims.

Arawn_Emrys said:
Soviet scifi had all the "good guy" aliens be communist
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IIRC, it was part of their dogma that all advanced species would have to be Communist.

The premise of Leinster's story is debunked, in part by pointing out that in order for a planet's civilization to become space-faring, they would need to be at peace among themselves and presumably have organized themselves into a planet-wide classless communist society, a point Yefremov had made earlier in his novel Andromeda. Thus the aliens must necessarily be peaceful.
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I suspect if ancient romans or Egyptians had fantasy and science fiction stories you'd set a of roman and Egyptian cultural quarks popping up...

And now I am picturing fantasy undead being warded off by beans being thrown by a roman patriarch over his shoulders to protect his family perhaps with a vampire being really confused and frustrated about it...
 
Arawn_Emrys said:
I wonder if Soviet scifi had all the "good guy" aliens be communists. And had villainous alien corporations
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Funnily enough, Soviet scifi was really big on cooperation and interstellar friendship more than anything, though this whole "any interstellar polity has to be communist to have reached space" idea is still present. There are far more criminals, wild animals (in survivalist stories), and generally just random evil/mad groups of people. I can't remember even a singular case of a villainous alien corporation in Soviet sci-fi.

In fact, from what amount of it that I've read, Societ sci-fi often didn't even have an overt antagonist. They did exist, of course, but rather noticeably rarer.
 
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DestinyPlayer said:
Funnily enough, Soviet scifi was really big on cooperation and interstellar friendship more than anything, though this whole "any interstellar polity has to be communist to have reached space" idea is still present. There are far more criminals, wild animals (in survivalist stories), and generally just random evil/mad groups of people. I can't remember even a singular case of a villainous alien corporation in Soviet sci-fi.
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The 1924 Soviet film Aelita: Queen of Mars has an evil Martian aristocracy that gets overthrown by the Martian proletariat. But I haven't heard of any Soviet sci-fi with evil alien corporations specifically.
 
Konradleijon said:
When Humanity Fuck Yeah! Fiction and other types of science fiction say humans are different then other species it's often Means traits Western liberal Culture has. Like a technological progress fetish, hatred of the rules man, individualism and other shit.
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I'm reminded of Babylon 5, where the "unique" quality about humans was that they build communities. They had an episode where races were asked to demonstrate their religious beliefs and humans had a long line of people because everyone in the line was a different religion.

It was the visual representation of "writers make everyone except the humans a Planet of Hats". All planets have a single religion, a single caste system, a single climate, etc. except the humans., and this is supposed to mean that humans are special, rather than that writers are lazy.
 
arromdee said:
I'm reminded of Babylon 5, where the "unique" quality about humans was that they build communities. They had an episode where races were asked to demonstrate their religious beliefs and humans had a long line of people because everyone in the line was a different religion.
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Any alien species in fiction have different cultures? Like the blarbians have thousands of different linguistic groups, and several nation states per planet. And they have hundreds of planets
 
Konradleijon said:
Thank G-D the same thing happened with the last Witcher book. You can truly tell when fantasy oppression narratives are written by white guys
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I don't want to revisit that conversation again but have my thought on what you've said here. I really hate to break this to you but Caucasians can in fact understand both oppression and being oppressed. There is no such thing as a 'white' monolith.

But yes, you can tell when oppression narratives are written by popular majoritarians.
 
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Astrid Fornhoff said:
I don't want to revisit that conversation again but have my thought on what you've said here. I really hate to break this to you but Caucasians can in fact understand both oppression and being oppressed. There is no such thing as a 'white' monolith.

But yes, you can tell when oppression narratives are written by popular majoritarians.
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I'm American so I have a American Based system of race, plus I remember some absurd defense of the Witcher 3 not having any non-white people because "Poland has no history of racial oppression and that's why it's not taught about in Polish schools"

I guess their where never Jews in Poland. Or Roma. I know the Sami and Roma exist and are shat upon

what are some actual good oppression metaphors? Valkyrie Chronicles seems to actually do this pretty good with The Darcsens being no different biological from anyone else and the reason people hate the Darcsens being a bullshit lie Told by people in power.
 
Valkyria Chronicles is a great example of oppression politics in fiction, it's based on the same shit real oppression is based on, lies, deceit and packs of lies and a desire of the majority to hate something other than themselves.
 
Astrid Fornhoff said:
Valkyria Chronicles is a great example of oppression politics in fiction, it's based on the same shit real oppression is based on, lies, deceit and packs of lies and a desire of the majority to hate something other than themselves.
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Yeah Valkyrie Chronicles despite being a JRPG silly Anime game probably understands oppression more then "serious" BioWare RPGs
 
Konradleijon said:
I'm American so I have a American Based system of race, plus I remember some absurd defense of the Witcher 3 not having any non-white people because "Poland has no history of racial oppression and that's why it's not taught about in Polish schools"
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That's just a weird complaint; the Witcher series isn't set on Earth, there's no reason to assume its demographics have any particular relationship with ours. Plus, it has nonhumans instead, who are clearly there to fill the "persecuted minority" niche. It's not set in Poland either, so racism in Poland or the lack thereof says nothing about the setting.

Neither the complaint nor the alleged defense makes any sense.
 
Avernus said:
That's just a weird complaint; the Witcher series isn't set on Earth, there's no reason to assume its demographics have any particular relationship with ours. Plus, it has nonhumans instead, who are clearly there to fill the "persecuted minority" niche. It's not set in Poland either, so racism in Poland or the lack thereof says nothing about the setting.

Neither the complaint nor the alleged defense makes any sense.
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I know, like why can't their be brown skinned people in the Witcher's game universe theirs Jinn so Muslim supernatural creatures are in but not Arab looking people. Why can't their be dark-skinned people in Westeros? It's not like it takes place in our Middle Ages theirs dragons and shit
. why can't their be dark skinned people amd them not being oppressed. Because skin color isn't always how oppression works.

Also a cliche I hate is Both sideing systematic oppression. Or saying systematic oppression exists in this world but doing nothing with it.Bioshock Infinite somehow does both while spending the beginning of the name saying Columbia is racist . (Through considering the time period Booker is from its not like their that much vitriolicly racist then Mainstream America is)

but in the last part it goes into quantum realty shit, like do you know the rules of story telling you don't establish something at the very beginning then drop it half way though. While also having the Poor and Non-white revolutionaries turn out exactly as bad as Comstock and Columbia with no build up. Just they bad now.
 
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One of the newer VC games has a literal beach episode. It's still an anime that takes place in not!World Wars. It has recognisable tropes from Japanese media. The silliness of the anime tropes of VC does not overshadow its war stories or vice-versa. It achieves a balance of lightheartedness and grimdark that few can.
 
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