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An Extra Primarch

Should the Quest switch to a Narrative Base?

  • Yes, it will streamline things.

    Votes: 345 40.6%

  • No, I prefer the current system.

    Votes: 127 14.9%

  • Yes, but not until the Crusade begins/Prologue ends.

    Votes: 378 44.5%
  • Total voters
    850
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ilbgar123 said:
Canon Imperium has 1.2 million worlds. However, as Lags noted, the average is 10 billion per world as a low-end estimate. Therefore, there are about 1.2 quintillion humans in the galaxy, as a low-ball estimate. This is much of the reason humanity is taking such a long time to collapse in canon. They're basically smarter Orks. They can literally drown most of their foes in bodies, and then they have their super-soldiers and Titans.
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Even the 1.2 quintillion estimate is a pretty big low ball since the average estimate is usually 4-24 quintillion for the Imperium's population.

Now you guys can see why I'm seriously considering colonizing every star in the galaxy near the end of the Great Crusade since 30k Imperium should have many more worlds and people then 40k Imperium which is already massive.
 
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Sir LagsAlot said:
The Emperor is now a confirmed Perpetual! Come on guys we're going to go turn the Omnissiah off and on again for the good of the Imperium!
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Honestly I can only applaud Games Workshop to put a very crucial plot point out there all of a sudden. Whelp time to speculate why the Emperor didn't want Guilliman to kill him other than keeping the Earth from turning into another Eye of Terror and the Astronomicon shutting down. And the demons. So many demons. And how long it'll take to revive.
 
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Wind-Up Citrus said:
Honestly I can only applaud Games Workshop to put a very crucial plot point out there all of a sudden. Whelp time to speculate why the Emperor didn't want Guilliman to kill him other than keeping the Earth from turning into another Eye of Terror and the Astronomicon shutting down. And the demons. So many demons. And how long it'll take to revive.
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Vulkan took hours to days to revive when ever he died which appears to be faster then a normal human Perpetual which implies biology and psychic power have an impact. So going off this, assuming it only takes him an hour or less to revive usually and then estimating the magnitude of the Emperor's wound. He'd probably end up taking any where from a day to a week to revive if he revived at all...

Also after 10 millennium on the Golden Throne the Emperor is either a husk of what he used to be or not the Emperor anymore if I had to take a guess. So either the Emperor can't get off without permanently dying due to his fractured soul. Or Guilliman refused to kill him when he saw what the Emperor had become due to millennium of worship, sacrifice and soul mutilating torture plus what ever that Chaos infected wound is doing.

Damn phones are hard to type on.
 
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Sir LagsAlot said:
Vulkan took hours to days to revive when ever he died which appears to be faster then a normal human Perpetual which implies biology and psychic power has an impact. So going off this, assuming it only takes him an hour or less to revive usually and then estimating the magnitude of the Emperor's wound. He'd probably end up taking any where from a day to a week to revive if he revived at all...

Also after 10 millennium on the Golden Throne the Emperor is either a husk of what he used to be or not the Emperor anymore if I had to take a guess. So either the Emperor can't get off without permanently dying due to his fractured soul. Or Guilliman refused to kill him when he saw what the Emperor had become due to millennium of worship, sacrifice and soul mutilating torture plus what ever that Chaos infected wound is doing.

Damn phones are hard to type on.
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They sure are hard to type on.

Whelp guess we don't have a "THIS ONE TRICK CAN SAVE THE IMPERIUM EVERYONE HATES IT" in canon.
 
Wind-Up Citrus said:
They sure are hard to type on.

Whelp guess we don't have a "THIS ONE TRICK CAN SAVE THE IMPERIUM EVERYONE HATES IT" in canon.
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If the Imperium can hold out long enough against Chaos so that the Necrons and Nids can get here in larger numbers we should be fine as they can deal with all the problems the Imperium was dealing with well the Emperor revives. You know since the Imperium is going to collapse completely once the Emperor dies so he'll be restarting at step 1 of the Great Crusade at that point in a much more hostile galaxy.

I just hope that Chaos, Nids, Krork, the New Devour, Orks, the Tau, the Eldar and all the Imperial remnants are enough to weaken the Necron enough that the Emperor can conquer the galaxy again.
 
ilbgar123 said:
Canon Imperium has 1.2 million worlds. However, as Lags noted, the average is 10 billion per world as a low-end estimate. Therefore, there are about 1.2 quintillion humans in the galaxy, as a low-ball estimate. This is much of the reason humanity is taking such a long time to collapse in canon. They're basically smarter Orks. They can literally drown most of their foes in bodies, and then they have their super-soldiers and Titans.
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Was the estimate for alpha psykers? or for stable alpha psykers? as that throws things off. is it like one in a million alpha psykers are stable or something?

Like would 1.2 quintillion people mean like 100 alpha (and pluses), or 900 instable ones and 100 alphas?

Plus with the massive rates of birth and death, it would be a number fluctuating highly.
 
Zavvnao said:
Was the estimate for alpha psykers? or for stable alpha psykers? as that throws things off. is it like one in a million alpha psykers are stable or something?

Like would 1.2 quintillion people mean like 100 alpha (and pluses), or 900 instable ones and 100 alphas?

Plus with the massive rates of birth and death, it would be a number fluctuating highly.
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Alphas are one in a trillion. Of those, one in a million would be naturally stable. This means that, with a population of 1 quintillion, there are a million Alphas spread across the galaxy. However, only one of that million would be naturally stable. In 20000 years, it would be one in a hundred billion people is an Alpha, and one in a hundred thousand stable. This would see 10 million Alphas and 100 stable ones.

(Ignore the above, magnitudes retconned.)

Becoming Imperial Astropaths would be a quick fix to make them stable, and basically make communication a non-issue if you weren't in a Warp Storm. Currently though, if you're an Alpha and not a Sensei, Perpetual, Astropath, Primarch, or Emps, you're basically guaranteed to die.
 
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ilbgar123 said:
Alphas are one in a trillion. Of those, one in a million would be naturally stable. This means that, with a population of 1 quintillion, there are a million Alphas spread across the galaxy. However, only one of that million would be naturally stable. Becoming Imperial Astropaths would be a quick fix to make them stable, and basically make communication a non-issue if you weren't in a Warp Storm.

In 20000 years, it would be one in a hundred billion people is an Alpha, and one in a hundred thousand stable. This would see 10 million Alphas and 100 stable ones. Currently though, if you're an Alpha and not a Sensei, Perpetual, Primarch, or Emps, you're basically guaranteed to die.
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because since if you are alpha, not stable, and not dead, then everyone else is about to die to the local gribbles both material and not.
 
ilbgar123 said:
Alphas are one in a trillion. Of those, one in a million would be naturally stable. This means that, with a population of 1 quintillion, there are a million Alphas spread across the galaxy. However, only one of that million would be naturally stable. Becoming Imperial Astropaths would be a quick fix to make them stable, and basically make communication a non-issue if you weren't in a Warp Storm.

In 20000 years, it would be one in a hundred billion people is an Alpha, and one in a hundred thousand stable. This would see 10 million Alphas and 100 stable ones. Currently though, if you're an Alpha and not a Sensei, Perpetual, Primarch, or Emps, you're basically guaranteed to die.
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Again, many writers have a really hard time understanding what the numbers they select seemingly at random actually mean. This happens in most sci-fi and fantasy. You either try to untangle them like LordsFire does in his Battlech quest with FASAnomics(commendable but insane), or you learn to ignore literally every implication from things with a number with more than three digits (lazy but far less braindamage is involved).
 
How much is from humanity growing more stable as a psychic species, and how much is it from the black ships able to catch more before a life event makes them snap?

One reason I brought up wings of fire here before was because of how what would be very strong psykers among the dragons in that series, something very rare they call an animus dragon, tend to be very strong, at the cost of it destroying their soul the more they do things, tending to leave it with holes and tatters, till they go insane and basically have the mind of a daemon. Probably from power way outstripping their control. (not trying to apply that here, but trying to bring up an example of what strong powers you are not ready for can do to you.)

Though I did not know being an Astropath could make an Alpha stable.
 
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Zavvnao said:
How much is from humanity growing more stable as a psychic species, and how much is it from the black ships able to catch more before a life event makes them snap?

One reason I brought up wings of fire here before was because of how what would be very strong psykers among the dragons in that series, something very rare they call an animus dragon, tends to be very strong, at the cost of it destroying their soul the more they do things, tending to leave it with holes and tatters, till they go insane and basically have the mind of a daemon. Probably from power way outstripping their control. (not trying to apply that here, but trying to bring up an example of what strong powers you are not ready for can do to you.)

Though I did not know being an Astropath could make an Alpha stable.
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Being an Astropath basically hooks you up the Emperor's soul and is pretty much the best way of stabilizing a psyker known to the Imperium although it restricts them to doing only what Astropaths do.
 
Also, all these population counts got me thinking about how our resident map of the Primarch locations scaled to the actual number of sectors between any given location. So I did some rough counting and then estimation of the number of hexagons on the map and then compared my results to the total estimated number of sectors in the Imperium which resulted in my conclusion that each hexagon represents approximately 4 to 7 sectors in volume. Which measuring from our approximate location on the map would put us approximately 8-14 sectors from Rogal, 16-28 sectors from Horus, 20-35 sectors from Magnus, 24-42 sectors from Fulgrim and 24-42 sectors from Terra not taking into account the sectors we've already conquered just in terms of absolute distance.

Also, the Bastion only seems to control about two sectors worth of planets right now which seems really weird to me since I always thought we controlled at least two or so dozen sectors.
 
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ilbgar123 said:
I could have sworn I placed Thernus three sectors from Terra.
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I was estimating using the canon maps of full sectors we had for world numbers which was roughly 200-250 planets per sector which I then divided the total number of planets the Imperium has which came out at roughly 4000-5000 sectors which I then divided by my estimated size of the threadmarked map which was 800-1000 hexes which gave me 4-7 sectors per hex which I then used to count the number of hexes between two locations multiplied by the number of sectors I got per hex to give me the estimated number of sectors between two locations.
 
Well, in the time period between the Great Crusade and canon 40K, the Administratum/Mechanicus/Inquisition did a lot of settling to help fill in those wilderness zones, and to create resource/research colonies of varying stripes, is my explanation. The current number of worlds is significantly lower, especially as many of them are occupied by xenos races that haven't been purged.

It's really horrifying to consider that humanity is the closest the major players come to unambiguous good guys, (I'm not counting the Tau regardless of their state, because they barely qualify as a regional power in their Segmentum, and they are well-aware a supernova could cripple them beyond any hope of recovery before someone finished them off, hence their extreme focus on expansion) and they still regularly threw a few trillion soldiers into clearing out alien empires on the simple principle of them occupying worlds humans could be using. To the point that most of the time these were barely considered proper Crusades, instead being treated as exterminations of particularly hardy pests.

On a lighter note that other song is more like Chaos!Serras combat theme. This is her general theme, a la Xehanort's 'He's just talking to people.' theme.
 
ilbgar123 said:
Essentially. It's certainly problematic for cartographers. Heck, setting up colonies simply for ports of call isn't out of the question for a lot of the outlying sectors.
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So would you say each hex on the threadmarked map is the equivalent of one current sector?

Because that means the Bastion controls roughly 12 sectors in that case which would put us either already in the same sector Rogal is in or directly adjacent to it since we expanded in roughly equally in all direction.
 
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