Alchemical Solutions [Worm/Exalted] Thread 18: Ravaging Rapscallions Rapidly Regret Regular Rampages

So I went and looked up all the alternate Vistas, and a bit of the slaughterhouse clones arc



We'd ground to a halt, and sure enough, the pseudo-Vista on the rooftop was slowly starting to work on the buildings around us, thinning walls and twisting supports. She was spreading out the work and laying the groundwork for future collapses, I realized. The second psycho-Vista, busy trying to close the distance by folding the space between us and her and stepping across the shortened distances, was raising the street between two buildings, creating a steep incline that even Bitch's dogs would struggle to climb, cutting off one avenue of retreat.

The first one I'd noticed was still on the rooftop, spreading out her efforts, thinning walls and twisting supports. Her progress was slow, but I was willing to bet that half of the city block would be collapsing onto us in a matter of minutes. If not sooner. If I had to guess, her power operated in a different manner than the original Vista's. It affected a wider area, it was slower, and she didn't seem to be suffering for our presence.

She can warp objects in space to deform them for real instead of just temporarily changing their position and effective shape.


And I was aware of a third one. The tall Vista Grue had described. She'd stretched like taffy, her bones curving to the point that each was more a crescent than straight. Narrow, so thin it felt like she'd break, with a face twisted into a perpetual, distorted scream, she was picking her way through the rubble of the fallen building. Her power was twisting the largest pieces of rubble around her until they were wisps, chunks of concrete slowly corkscrewing in space until they were nothing more than dust.

"It's radioactive," Tattletale intoned. "Everything she's dissolving like that."
She can warp space to crush objects to subatomic dust.

The bugs that I was sending her way were having a hard time approaching. They kept veering around so they flew clockwise around her instead of straight. I had only a few bugs attacking her, but the same effect that I'd seen with her face had hardened her skin and there weren't many places left to attack. Her mouth was little more than a lipless slit across the lower half of her face, firmly closed, and only the smallest bugs could get at her eyes. She barely flinched at the bites and stings my swarm was delivering.

"She's bending space," Tattletale said. "You won't get a straight shot."
She can do something weird to change directions with warped space and redirect attacks.

Meagre as my efforts were, they still should have left her blind, filling her eye sockets with ants and no-see-ums, but her power was still steadily working on the buildings around us. Another peculiarity of her abilities? The ability to sense the layout of whatever structures she was affecting? Did that extend to sensing us?

Something basic Vista can't do but some clones can.

We caught up to a group of the faster-moving heroes who'd flown ahead. They were dispatching another Vista. She was shorter, thicker in the arms and legs, with a neck as thick around as her head was. The space around her was twisted into jagged shapes, with some raised into points. Two of the capes had been injured but were still fighting.
Stab people with warped space.

Something peeled away from Noelle's side, and when it bumped into my bugs, they weren't absorbed. The stature, the length of the hair… another Vista.

I thought maybe Noelle had produced another clone, but others started to emerge from the surrounding architecture, peeling away from nearby walls as if they'd been inside the surfaces.
Store people and things in two dimensional space. This protects them from damage, apparently perfectly since Eidolon was the one attacking, but they can't move.

"Hatchet Face incoming!"

Clockblocker, Crucible and Toggle turned around, but Vista remained fixated on the animal.

The moment the group was distracted by the incoming titan, Murder Rat appeared. She drove her elbow into the side of Crucible's throat, bringing one foot up to rake the side of his leg, but didn't get any further.

Vista fired her gun straight into the villain's back, then wheeled around and shot Hatchet Face in the chest.
She can change the distance so that it affects mental powers like Hatchet Face's range.

"Theory two is a lot easier to prove," I said. "We either need to go in through the top, and hope the roof isn't as protected-"

"-or access the interior without passing into exterior rooms," Vista said.

Shuffle could have done that, I thought. Had we sent the wrong teams to the wrong locations? It had sounded like there was a hell of a lot of offensive power at the other location.

"I'll try," Vista said. "Hold on."

This was a more refined use of her power. She drew on the exterior of the building, and created a depression, but the goal this time wasn't to create a hole. She extended the depression inward, but she fed enough of the surrounding material into it to keep the resulting walls intact.

It stopped, and she merged it into another wall. I couldn't see the wall, but I could sense it with my bugs. To my eyes, it was a black void, a hole too deep for my bugs to reach.

She paused, then began opening an experimental hole in the far wall. I pulled my bugs back to make it easier for her.

I could feel the warm air blow past my bugs. I could smell it using their senses. An alien sensation, but I noted the scent of blood, the acrid chemical odor of the sealing materials.

"Way's open," Vista said.

She can make a wormhole.

Finally, she was the one who finished off Shatterbird during the Echidna fight when she was stuck in a cagematch with the freed Shatterbird after Tattletale blew the building up. Didn't know that.
 
Quest Notes: Potential Social Charms
OK, so. Operating under the assumption that we still want to get someone to fill the Public Relations (Primary) role next but want to avoid adding fuel to the POD PEOPLE fire...we have fewer choices. I mentioned Chevalier, Miss Militia, and Legend - if anyone else can think of someone who fits, feel free to speak up.

First off, can we expect this role to come with? Well, since it's public relations normally we'd associate that with Charisma, but we'll probably get high Manipulation as well since (a) we're getting the Happy Fun Spike no matter what, and (b) there are two very important charms for shifting public policy towards our own aims that require high MNP. High Appearance goes a long way towards ensuring dominance in social combat so we may see a few 4th Augs for that as well. All told, we can expect CHR 7, MNP 6/7, and APP 5~7. Plus all the actual charms.

What social charms we can reasonably expect* a PR (Primary) alchie to have:
4th Charisma Augmentation (x2) - E1, CHR 1 [1m]. Two charm slots.
1st/2nd Charisma Augmentation - E1, CHR 1 [1m]
4th Manipulation Augmentation** - E1, MNP 1 [1m]
Patriotism-Provoking Display - E2, CHR 3 [1m]
Perfected Union Patterning - E2, CHR 3 [1m]
Motivational Vocoder - E3, CHR 5 [1m]
Pattern Facilitation Module - E3, CHR 4 [1m]
Conceptual Entropy Module - E3, MNP 4 [1m]
Agenda Recalibration Protocols - E3, MNP 5 [1m]
Unobtrusive Repartee Baffles - E2, MNP 2 [2m]
Emotive Aesthetics of the Body Electric - E3, APP 4, PER 3 for submodule [1m]

PLUS
Integrated Artifact Transmorgifier - E2, APP 1 [1m]

Possible Additions (if Autochthon isn't just being thorough, he's being completionist)
4th Manipulation Augmentation - E1, MNP 1 [1m], second of two 4th Augs
2nd Manipulation Augmentation - E1, MNP 1 [1m]
4th Appearance Augmentation (x2) or 5th Appearance Augmentation - E1, APP 1 [1m]
Rogue Cell Isolation Protocols - E2, MNP 3 [0m]
Hierarchical Dogma Lock - E1, INT 3 [0m]
Radiant Iconography Array - E3, APP 2 [0m]
Programmed Catechism Rebuttal - E2, CHR 4 [1m]

Happy Fun Spike and the other charms in its charm tree are, thankfully, gratis so we don't have to worry about charm slots and mote pool restrictions. The ones that require E4 will either be dormant until we hit E4 ourselves, we naturally start with E4 (unlikely) in which case we're also going to pick up Unconditional Imperative Programming (E4 CHR 4 [1m]), or we somehow magically get to use all the POS expansions because REASONS.

So we're looking at 13 charm slots and [13m] committed, bare minimum. 19~20 charm slots and [17m] committed if we include all possible additions. Why yes, focusing on Social does take up a lot of charm space. This means that, assuming we get the full 20 charm slots thanks to picking a very experienced candidate, we have 7 or less charm slots to play with.

That's not a whole lot. Assuming we grab ISF (and a Stam Aug) because it's the best defensive charm available (really helps vs Behemoth and the Simurgh for starters), that means we have even less to work with. Five charms means that any combat capability is going to be limited at best (three charms min for grabbing a PD) so we're going to want someone either naturally tanky or dangerous so we can use charms to shore up the area they're lacking.

*Expect, not want.
**Only one Manipulation Aug is needed, for a few reasons: (1) Alchemical social charms revolve mostly around Charisma so any Manipulation Augs are strictly to meet charm requirements; (2) the highest stat requirement is for a POS expansion, which needs MNP 6; and (3) the two social policy charms (CEM and ARP) function identically to Taboo-Inflicting Diatribe (just with a much narrower area of applicability) which lets you choose between CHR and MNP every time you use it.
 
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We should make at least some of the starting charms into arrays, just to have more Motes.
Our peripheral mote pool is, surprisingly, not the biggest problem here. Three of the "Possible" charms have an attunement cost of [0m], for example. No, the biggest issue here is simply that in order to make a good faith effort of adhering to having Public Relations (Primary) you're going to need a whole lot of charm slots. If Autochthon is thorough and snags all the charms related to doing awesome social stuff we won't have any charm slots free (assuming 20 is the max we can get).

Plus, Grom hasn't had any of our dudes start out with Arrays so I don't think he'll make an exception here unless he feels like taking pity on our pick.
 
So I went and looked up all the alternate Vistas, and a bit of the slaughterhouse clones arc

She can warp objects in space to deform them for real instead of just temporarily changing their position and effective shape.

She can warp space to crush objects to subatomic dust.

She can do something weird to change directions with warped space and redirect attacks.

Something basic Vista can't do but some clones can.

Stab people with warped space.

Store people and things in two dimensional space. This protects them from damage, apparently perfectly since Eidolon was the one attacking, but they can't move.

She can change the distance so that it affects mental powers like Hatchet Face's range.

She can make a wormhole.

Finally, she was the one who finished off Shatterbird during the Echidna fight when she was stuck in a cagematch with the freed Shatterbird after Tattletale blew the building up. Didn't know that.

Nicely done!

OK, so. Operating under the assumption that we still want to get someone to fill the Public Relations (Primary) role next but want to avoid adding fuel to the POD PEOPLE fire...we have fewer choices. I mentioned Chevalier, Miss Militia, and Legend - if anyone else can think of someone who fits, feel free to speak up.

First off, can we expect this role to come with? Well, since it's public relations normally we'd associate that with Charisma, but we'll probably get high Manipulation as well since (a) we're getting the Happy Fun Spike no matter what, and (b) there are two very important charms for shifting public policy towards our own aims that require high MNP. High Appearance goes a long way towards ensuring dominance in social combat so we may see a few 4th Augs for that as well. All told, we can expect CHR 7, MNP 6/7, and APP 5~7. Plus all the actual charms.

What social charms we can reasonably expect* a PR (Primary) alchie to have:
4th Charisma Augmentation (x2) - E1, CHR 1 [1m]. Two charm slots.
1st/2nd Charisma Augmentation - E1, CHR 1 [1m]
4th Manipulation Augmentation** - E1, MNP 1 [1m]
Patriotism-Provoking Display - E2, CHR 3 [1m]
Perfected Union Patterning - E2, CHR 3 [1m]
Motivational Vocoder - E3, CHR 5 [1m]
Pattern Facilitation Module - E3, CHR 4 [1m]
Conceptual Entropy Module - E3, MNP 4 [1m]
Agenda Recalibration Protocols - E3, MNP 5 [1m]
Unobtrusive Repartee Baffles - E2, MNP 2 [2m]
Emotive Aesthetics of the Body Electric - E3, APP 4, PER 3 for submodule [1m]

PLUS
Integrated Artifact Transmorgifier - E2, APP 1 [1m]

Possible Additions (if Autochthon isn't just being thorough, he's being completionist)
4th Manipulation Augmentation - E1, MNP 1 [1m], second of two 4th Augs
2nd Manipulation Augmentation - E1, MNP 1 [1m]
4th Appearance Augmentation (x2) or 5th Appearance Augmentation - E1, APP 1 [1m]
Rogue Cell Isolation Protocols - E2, MNP 3 [0m]
Hierarchical Dogma Lock - E1, INT 3 [0m]
Radiant Iconography Array - E3, APP 2 [0m]
Programmed Catechism Rebuttal - E2, CHR 4 [1m]

Happy Fun Spike and the other charms in its charm tree are, thankfully, gratis so we don't have to worry about charm slots and mote pool restrictions. The ones that require E4 will either be dormant until we hit E4 ourselves, we naturally start with E4 (unlikely) in which case we're also going to pick up Unconditional Imperative Programming (E4 CHR 4 [1m]), or we somehow magically get to use all the POS expansions because REASONS.

So we're looking at 13 charm slots and [13m] committed, bare minimum. 19~20 charm slots and [17m] committed if we include all possible additions. Why yes, focusing on Social does take up a lot of charm space. This means that, assuming we get the full 20 charm slots thanks to picking a very experienced candidate, we have 7 or less charm slots to play with.

That's not a whole lot. Assuming we grab ISF (and a Stam Aug) because it's the best defensive charm available (really helps vs Behemoth and the Simurgh for starters), that means we have even less to work with. Five charms means that any combat capability is going to be limited at best (three charms min for grabbing a PD) so we're going to want someone either naturally tanky or dangerous so we can use charms to shore up the area they're lacking.

*Expect, not want.
**Only one Manipulation Aug is needed, for a few reasons: (1) Alchemical social charms revolve mostly around Charisma so any Manipulation Augs are strictly to meet charm requirements; (2) the highest stat requirement is for a POS expansion, which needs MNP 6; and (3) the two social policy charms (CEM and ARP) function identically to Taboo-Inflicting Diatribe (just with a much narrower area of applicability) which lets you choose between CHR and MNP every time you use it.

I admit, it is nice charm collection for purely PR-oriented Vista, but I don't really think it is the really good specialization for her. Vista doesn't strike me as someone, well, striking. She does not command attention. She does not have magnetic personality. She is not centre of attention. It's just not her personality. She is nice, honest, well meaning, determined and strong-willed. But not charismatic.

Else, I'm reading her incorrectly.

Anyway, her age works heavily against her. PR-related person needs to be seen as serious partner in a conversation. PTR director causes problems? PR-specialists is sent to convince him otherwise. This is why social specialist is needed. Vista is everyone little darling, and fits well in such role, but it also means, she is seen as a child - and her opinion has much lesser weight for that.

All in all, Vista is motivational, I admit that. But she is not the best fit for purely social alchemical.


EDIT: I'm stupid (and tired). You are speaking about general social specialist, and I've got fixated on Vista.

(sigh) Time to go to bed.
 
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She's one of the best social characters we see in Worm who's not using their power to bullshit their way through, aside from Yamada.

All she did is the best she could.
 
Tattletale would make a great one... if she wasn't, you know, completely against us and thinking we were replacing everyone instead of actually giving people new bodies.

Working on a post S9 omake where Taylor tries to deal with Jack's PR bomb against Auto-kun.
 
Tattletale is using her power to bullshit her way through by manipulating them to self destruct instead of making friends. We need her if we're facing hostile people who need their heads screwed off and then screwed back on.

Missy actually makes friends, and helps people with her socials. She's better at making neutral people helpful and friendly people less traumatized.

I wonder how much extra starting XP she's getting from what the Nine are doing to her though. There are adult capes who hadn't gotten as much suffering.
 
I am now tempted to go back and remove the specific mention of less than Adonis like features from my Omake and then write a follow up where EPAHF seduces everyone due the changes to his shards behavior modifications.




Do it.....the world wants Accord Moe-bot!Starmetal, the world NEEDS Accord Moe-bot!Starmetal. The fools just don't realize it, yet.
 
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Does anyone consider Tran-Chosen Emulator useful, not for the Anima Banner change but more the ability to use other disguise charms without having to worry about the anima banner affecting it (actually the existance of the charm makes me question whether or not Alchemical disguise charms are broken by Anima Banners even if Stealth charms are broken)
 
Does anyone consider Tran-Chosen Emulator useful, not for the Anima Banner change but more the ability to use other disguise charms without having to worry about the anima banner affecting it
Where are you getting this?

(actually the existance of the charm makes me question whether or not Alchemical disguise charms are broken by Anima Banners even if Stealth charms are broken)
Given that our Anima Banner negates IAT above 4 motes, the answer is yes.
 
Where are you getting this?


Given that our Anima Banner negates IAT above 4 motes, the answer is yes.
Ok, what does Trans-Chosen Emulator do?
Does it or does it not allow someone to mimic exalts other than Alchemical?
What is the point in a charm that allows someone to change their anima banner into said types of anima banner if they continued to look like a robot
It would be obvious at a glance that a Alchemical isn't a Solar, Lunar, Siderial, or Dragon Blooded even if the anima banner looked like one of those.
It only stops working at Iconic Anima, and there is a sub-module for that, this means it works at non Iconic

Now if it just changed the caste mark fine, but it changes the appearance of the anima banner as well
Edit: double checked anima to confirm the anima banner does disrupt disguise charms but the existance of trans-chosen emulator confuses me because of it
Edit: It might be the case that it is supposed to be used with Husk Scupting Apparatus's Self-Sculpt sub-module, but that is not a requirement but if it does work that way does that mean that Self-Scuplt allows someone to permanently look human because otherwise IAT would still be disrupted by the anima banner and you have to use IAT to hide charms in the first place regardless,
 
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That doesn't really jive with what we learn in Vista's Interlude, mainly that he was the one who kept the team together, handled Sophia, and was good friends with Missy.

He's not Lisa in that he actively uses his power to manipulate people (that we see), but more like Taylor, the heart of the team.
Basically, if Dean was actually, truly skilled (ie: had dots in the relevant Abilities), then he could make Yamada look like a chump. The thing is, Dean is nice and thus doesn't exploit his power to actually do this, as it'd be manipulative as all hell even if he was doing it for good reasons. Because of that, my interpretation of him in canon (Vista's comments in her Interlude, other snippets before then) give me cause to believe that Dean likely subconsciously avoided pushing his power's limits (because he really is a good guy) and just coasted on the feedback from his base-line emotion reading to navigate his social life and keep the status quo going. He was the "heart" of the team because it was absolutely trivial to become so, but the fact that there remained any sort of emotional problems in the social circles around him was only because he didn't push himself (and his power) hard enough to root them out.
Grom, what is your take on Vista's canon powers? What would an observer standing below a continent-sized shortcut see when looking up at the sky, and likewise, what would someone traversing that same shortcut see when looking up?

(I suspect Bellisario's Maxim is going to apply. Sometimes you just have to do that, though.)
She controls the distance between fundamental particles of the universe, though there are limits to her powers set by her Shard for safety (mostly hers) and power consumption reasons. With all the limiters off, as hinted by the psychoVistas from Noelle, she can overcome the Strong and Weak Nuclear forces trivially and likely even generate Neutron Star- or Black Hole-level spatial anomalies.

For visibility, I believe it depends entirely on what she's doing.
- Is she compacting an entire continent so that you can cross it in one step? Then anyone around the effect sees the warped space - this is what allows her to make statues in the epilogue.
- Is she creating a narrow shortcut through the intervening space? Then unless you're next to or in the shortcut, no one can see the difference - this is how she "tunnels" into otherwise-enclosed spaces.

Those seem to be consistent with her canon powers, but feel free to correct me.
We should make at least some of the starting charms into arrays, just to have more Motes.
Autobot isn't using arrays when he's making this new Assembly. There are reasons behind this decision.
Ok, what does Trans-Chosen Emulator do?
Trans-Chosen Emulator serves two real purposes:
- Allows an Alchemical to disguise themselves as another Caste. This is critical for any Adamant operating within populated areas.
- For an Alchemical to disguise themselves as another Exalted. This would have been used by any Alchemicals sneaking around Creation.

Yes, higher-level peripheral essence expenditures will disrupt IAT, but if the Alchemical is covered head-to-toe (cloak, armor, etc.) then that doesn't really matter. Anima banners go through all clothing/armor, so that's really what this is intended to help disguise. Note that the charm doesn't allow the Alchemical to copy the anima power, however, so there is still a way to notice the disguise beyond seeing the Alchemical's physical form.

The only real point of this charm for us on Earth-Bet is the sub-mod that allows the Alchemical to customize their Totemic Anima to whatever they want for the scene, which could be really useful for a Social character in making their anima work for them (visually).
 
Basically, if Dean was actually, truly skilled (ie: had dots in the relevant Abilities), then he could make Yamada look like a chump. The thing is, Dean is nice and thus doesn't exploit his power to actually do this, as it'd be manipulative as all hell even if he was doing it for good reasons. Because of that, my interpretation of him in canon (Vista's comments in her Interlude, other snippets before then) give me cause to believe that Dean likely subconsciously avoided pushing his power's limits (because he really is a good guy) and just coasted on the feedback from his base-line emotion reading to navigate his social life and keep the status quo going. He was the "heart" of the team because it was absolutely trivial to become so, but the fact that there remained any sort of emotional problems in the social circles around him was only because he didn't push himself (and his power) hard enough to root them out.
Fair Enough.

I think a lot of problems the team had - the only real problem really - was that Sophia was both a good actor (apparently actually following the rules set up by her parol officers and attending therapy) and kind of a mega-bitch who enjoyed making others miserable.

Kind of like Bitch if her Shard somehow made her violent against everyone.
 
Fair Enough.

I think a lot of problems the team had - the only real problem really - was that Sophia was both a good actor (apparently actually following the rules set up by her parol officers and attending therapy) and kind of a mega-bitch who enjoyed making others miserable.

Kind of like Bitch if her Shard somehow made her violent against everyone.
In the Dr Yamada Interlude, Missy mentioned making an effort to work with Sophia's issues, but Weld and Yamada agreed she was beyond helping. The boys didn't care that she was a bitch, only that she was attractive.
 
In the Dr Yamada Interlude, Missy mentioned making an effort to work with Sophia's issues, but Weld and Yamada agreed she was beyond helping. The boys didn't care that she was a bitch, only that she was attractive.
Correction: Clockblocker thought she was attractive and eye-candy.

We don't know what Chris thought and apparently according to Dennis, Gallant treated co-patrolling with Shadow Stalker like a public execution.
 
So she wasn't that good an actor. Just played along enough that she didn't get punished, or wasn't worth the effort of punishing.

It's interesting that Missy tried to help someone who was such an utter bitch to her.
 
So she wasn't that good an actor. Just played along enough that she didn't get punished, or wasn't worth the effort of punishing.

It's interesting that Missy tried to help someone who was such an utter bitch to her.
Good enough to fool management and her fellow Wards for quite some time.

Doesn't mean she can't be unpleasant. She just can't be a mega-bitch around her work.
 
The Wards knew she was a jerk though, especially how she treated Missy. Management, maybe they knew and didn't care because no harm was done to anyone important, or maybe they didn't have time to pay attention to her. But Sophia isn't important, she's left the scene, hopefully for good.

Missy's stance towards someone being a jerk to her is important.
 
The Wards knew she was a jerk though, especially how she treated Missy. Management, maybe they knew and didn't care because no harm was done to anyone important, or maybe they didn't have time to pay attention to her. But Sophia isn't important, she's left the scene, hopefully for good.

Missy's stance towards someone being a jerk to her is important.
There is a huge discrepancy between being an unpleasant person all around and then being a psycho who tries to tear people's ears off.

The Wards thought she was unpleasant, because that's all she showed them, and they dealt with it because being a jerk isn't a crime. Gallant at most focused on just keeping everyone in a good mood.

They had no idea of the fact she killed several people and psychologically tortured another till she triggered, then continued to do so. That would have changed the dynamic significantly had they known, as this very Quest shows.
 
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