- Location
- The Bayou, Everglades
Yeah, I think that's what I'm advocating right now.
[X] Plan Subtle Ambush
-
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The Long Night Part One: Embers in the Dusk: A Planetary Governor Quest (43k) Complete Sequel Up
- Thread starter Durin
- Start date
[X] Plan Subtle Ambush
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Yeah waaay too many.
Its a demon mate, there are very few ways that a demon isn't better than a regular human even a chaos enhanced one.
They don't get tired (normally) they don't fear, they're very skilled, they all incredibly powerful, they've likely all got mind bending powers and on Avernus they can stay around for longer than normal because of its warp touched nature.
It might backfire because Demons on Avernus HATE HATE HATE HATE HATE HATEEEEEEEEE.
As I said that MAD may back fire because it gets Guardians or Weapons involved.
He hasn't, what I think he means is that Julius and Horatius said they're very unlikely to change their plans, not that they can't.
BTW which one is subtle Ambush?
Medium, Light Forces, Subtle use.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Cheers.
Mmm, I'll withhold my vote for now
[X] Plan Wreck the Fleet
I'm divided mostly on the info use because I think we should exploit their plans as much as possible and make them at best paranoid as crap at worst just make them simplify their everything.
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Not where I thought when I went to look it up. Hmm.
OTOH Ridcully's divinations include a lot of undetected spying so we should have their planned contingencies too. Their current plan set is the best they've come up with with years of work so forcing them to come up with new plans on the fly is a victory in itself. Especially since now they're here/close Ridcully can get updates much more easily.
Nor is there a guarantee that they won't realise even if we're less blatant.
Overall I think we have to assume that advanced intelligence has a limited shelf life and try to get maximum benefit for it now. After all, if this wave gains the upper hand then we won't be able to mount a good ambush of the next.
- Location
- The Void
[X] Plan Subtle Ambush
- Location
- The Bayou, Everglades
But it also might not. Do we know if the Abominites know about the risks? Because otherwise, so far I'm not seeing a lot off reasons why they wouldn't immediately summon it. Or summoned it in advance.
Well, I still think a more subtle approach will be less likely to set off the MAD phase. And keeping our predictions secret, vs. shaving off more escorts seem like they'll be of equal help in destroying the second wave of enemy armies, or a lot of battleships.
Not pears?
It's much less likely.
What do you mean?
And what about the MAD phase? How desperate do you think the enemy will become if they figure out that we can predict them?
And can we trim enough of the enemy landing forces / disrupt them enough to prevent first circle angyls if we let the second wave land? Or even just with the first wave alone?
- Location
- Germany
[X] Plan Wreck the Fleet
[X] Plan Wreck the Fleet
The plan bonus seems to me to be a matter of unstable equilibrium. The more we hurt them early on and the less we suffer doing so will help us more in the long run than conserving it for a knockout blow at the end would.
Our advantages on the ground are greater than our advantages in space, so I'm okay letting them land the first round of invaders.
The plan bonus seems to me to be a matter of unstable equilibrium. The more we hurt them early on and the less we suffer doing so will help us more in the long run than conserving it for a knockout blow at the end would.
Our advantages on the ground are greater than our advantages in space, so I'm okay letting them land the first round of invaders.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
I know I made the point on the last page that I don't know if they know what the potential side effects of rousing Avernus might be.
Evidently if they do know they don't consider it bad enough to not try.
We also have to consider that if they do summon it and the Deep One gets involved we maybe caught in the cross fire between an Alpha Plus and a Greater Demon.
Still there's likely consequences for summoning it which is why its a MAD option.
As for not summoning it in orbit well simple enough, but summoning a greater demon of any level isn't done lightly and when they do they're on a timer. Barring extraordinary circumstances Greater Demons can't hang around long and they likely don't want to waste too much time in orbit.
On the surface as well summoning the demon isn't going to be quick...well unless they sacrifice their entire army at once.
Nah.
Too obvious.
I don't know about desperate, but certainly angry
I wouldn't say they're desperate until we've taken down their Mass Conveyors cause that's their main way of getting people down gone.
- Location
- The Bayou, Everglades
Being subtle isn't - for my part - about getting later knock-out blows. It's about not provoking the enemy into take drastic measures until we've made it much harder for them to attempt those measures.
I think wreck the fleet helps with that too.
Their drastic options are:
Battleship ramming - A favorable exchange at this stage will help our fleets support our anti-orbital city defenses with this.
Summoning Angyls - Avernus is probably one of the best places to fight an Archangyl.
I think sucker punching them at the beginning will be worth it.
- Location
- United States
How would them knowing we know their plans let them better protect the second wave? Especially with their light forces shredded?
We are at a big enough disparity that we need every advantage that we can get, and we need to exploit them mercilessly.
We know the situation as it currently stands. We have a good opportunity to inflict massive damage. And a good plan executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. Especially when that good plan now will snowball heavily.
[X] Plan Wreck the Fleet
- Location
- The Bayou, Everglades
We'd primarily be hitting the escorts, which wouldn't help much in keeping them from taking Dis' void-space, because they are less important in direct confrontations than the big battleships and cruisers.
That doesn't make it a good thing, just slightly less of a terrible thing - or perhaps a non-issue. More to the point, wrecking the fleet is unlikely to prevent this issue.
But we need to inflict sufficient damage. Simply removing the escorts and a few heavy ships and transports isn't sufficient to prevent a MAD phase in the short term.
And if the enemy realises this, what will they do then? Can we prevent them from doing that later if we go easy on them now?
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- Location
- United States
Based on their numbers, there is no way we can stop them if they decide to go MAD. We would have to rely on Avernus pulling some hax for us. Our only chance is to inflict sufficient casualties on them so we can force them out.
and that means letting our admiral do what he does best with all the advantages we can give him.
Shard
One and Many
- Location
- Malaysia
Worth noting: The difference in bonus is basically a doubling in effectiveness.
[X] Plan Wreck the Fleet
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but (from my understanding) DAoT tech gives us a noticeable range advantage. It seems like the only way they really have to counter us chipping them to death is to use light units to hamper our bigger ships from being able to safely kite. Also, because of their specific Chaos alignment, they are very by the book and unlikely to change their plans radically. So we may as well abuse their weaknesses and go for massive damage from the start.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but (from my understanding) DAoT tech gives us a noticeable range advantage. It seems like the only way they really have to counter us chipping them to death is to use light units to hamper our bigger ships from being able to safely kite. Also, because of their specific Chaos alignment, they are very by the book and unlikely to change their plans radically. So we may as well abuse their weaknesses and go for massive damage from the start.
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A Plot Foiled...
Shard
One and Many
- Location
- Malaysia
A Plot Foiled...
...?
Many decades ago, upon the planet Avernus, a phenominally skilled Beta-level psyker awoke to her power. She went undiscovered for long enough that she fell to the whispers of the Chaos God Tzeentch.
The God spoke of threats, eventually plying her to his ways, and thus she did his bidding, or at least believed she did. Tens of millions died to her weaving of fate, and the plots did not end there - His desire to see Avernus wiped clean of human life nearly succeeded in spite of her death, only foiled at the last moments.
But that desire never died.
---
A thought had long thought Herrion since the dramatic failure of Valinor's initial naval attacks upon the so-called 'Trust'. Certainly, they had a Seer-Witch, skilled to an extreme degree.. or did they? None in the Old Imperium, he was told, truly possessed the talent to such a degree.
Or was it something more nefarious?
Avernites were already xeno-lovers, he knew. Would it really be a stretch to say they were Eldar-Thralls? One of Humanity's oldest foes, they had Farseers who could well have orchestrated the disasters they had suffered at the hands of this 'Trust'. It would explain much.
---
Magan was but one of many, many attempts. He was, however, distinguished by being the most successful of them all in infiltrating Valinor. The majority of the infiltrators had been caught out, and the greater part of those who had succeeded did not find purchase upon the important areas. Magan, gifted as he was by Tzeentch, had the ear of a Marshal.
It was not an easy road.
Countless tribulations, sacrifices in the name of his God.. maintaining his cover with Angyls and Diviners around, all while climbing the ranks as high as he could. It would have been impossible to 'prove' his loyalty to the Emperor if he did not know of his own, true, purpose in Tzeentch's plans.
A completely unbelievable purpose.
---
And yet, however much they searched, they'd never quite found the Eldar presence to confirm his suspicions of filthy Xenos interference. But then the Eldar were a crafty species. It was entirely possible that they were indeed present, but hidden well.. or, even upon that blasted planet, out of reach to investigation.
Still, it demanded he seek alternate reasons.
How else might they have achieved the successes in the ambushes, though?
---
He was to ensure that Valinor's attack upon Avernus... succeeded.
Whenever he rested, his mind subconsciously mulled over why Tzeentch desired such a thing. Why? Weaken the Imperial Trust by eliminating one of it's core worlds? It was a heretical.. Saint of the millennia-dead Emperor, somehow, that had emerged through the warp somehow. Probably something very complicated and involving countless plots.
Whatever it was, he knew that the Crusade was about the best chance of annihilating the colony, which was a most grievous danger.
This invasion, though, needed help if it was ever going to succeed. Already, from what was whispered to him, disaster beckoned for the fleet. They were, after all, too static, too bound in the plans they made to deviate from them. So much unlike those who served the Changer of Ways.
---
Incompetence? He'd have spotted that long ago.
Sheer luck? Improbable, given their many diviners.
A traitor? They'd have found them long ago..
---
Valinor's battle in the Avernus system went far worse for them than it had any right to. Cruisers, slipping through patrol nets to unleash terrible alpha strikes upon unsuspecting ships before disappearing. Escort-grades, scouting for ambushes, found themselves declaring places clear only to suffer an locally-overwhelming attack from multiple vectors.
Suffering a death by a thousand cuts, they persevered onwards, as their enemies eluded any attempt to force a decisive battle.
It was all very much like their first, probing strikes upon the Imperial Trust planets. The first attacks showed promise, and the follow-up was ruthlessly and brutally annihilated, like their foes... knew exactly what they were going to do. The hallmarks of a fight with utter informational disparity were all plainly present.
---
..or could they?
---
"It's as if they knew exactly what we were going to do." The Rear Admiral said, frustrated.
"I believe they did." Herrion replied, decisively.
"Impossible. We spoke of them only in warded rooms, guarded by Angyls." Another Admiral added.
"And they have tried, but failed to bypass them." A fourth person added.
"It is, because we have a traitor among our ranks." The Lord-General answered, conclusively.
---
Their armies and fleets were massive. It was impossible for all of them to be assuredly be loyal, even with Angyls to patrol them, witches to scour their minds for traces of disloyalty.. and other methods. In fact, they regularly caught infiltrators from elsewhere attempting to gather information from them.
In was not entirely out of the question that one of those many infiltrators had.. gotten lucky, so to speak.
Given that they were attacking a planet held in thrall by The False Saint.. was it truly so improbable, that one of his might have succeeded in finally reaching somewhere where they had access to privileged information? A clever way to evade all defences... and it was, after all, traitors serving false gods that had brought their Old Imperium down. Fitting.
But that game would end now.
---
"Their Witch, he must have gotten the plans. That's why it turned out this-" Magan spoke.
"He?"
Magan paled.
---
Fin.
...?
Many decades ago, upon the planet Avernus, a phenominally skilled Beta-level psyker awoke to her power. She went undiscovered for long enough that she fell to the whispers of the Chaos God Tzeentch.
The God spoke of threats, eventually plying her to his ways, and thus she did his bidding, or at least believed she did. Tens of millions died to her weaving of fate, and the plots did not end there - His desire to see Avernus wiped clean of human life nearly succeeded in spite of her death, only foiled at the last moments.
But that desire never died.
---
A thought had long thought Herrion since the dramatic failure of Valinor's initial naval attacks upon the so-called 'Trust'. Certainly, they had a Seer-Witch, skilled to an extreme degree.. or did they? None in the Old Imperium, he was told, truly possessed the talent to such a degree.
Or was it something more nefarious?
Avernites were already xeno-lovers, he knew. Would it really be a stretch to say they were Eldar-Thralls? One of Humanity's oldest foes, they had Farseers who could well have orchestrated the disasters they had suffered at the hands of this 'Trust'. It would explain much.
---
Magan was but one of many, many attempts. He was, however, distinguished by being the most successful of them all in infiltrating Valinor. The majority of the infiltrators had been caught out, and the greater part of those who had succeeded did not find purchase upon the important areas. Magan, gifted as he was by Tzeentch, had the ear of a Marshal.
It was not an easy road.
Countless tribulations, sacrifices in the name of his God.. maintaining his cover with Angyls and Diviners around, all while climbing the ranks as high as he could. It would have been impossible to 'prove' his loyalty to the Emperor if he did not know of his own, true, purpose in Tzeentch's plans.
A completely unbelievable purpose.
---
And yet, however much they searched, they'd never quite found the Eldar presence to confirm his suspicions of filthy Xenos interference. But then the Eldar were a crafty species. It was entirely possible that they were indeed present, but hidden well.. or, even upon that blasted planet, out of reach to investigation.
Still, it demanded he seek alternate reasons.
How else might they have achieved the successes in the ambushes, though?
---
He was to ensure that Valinor's attack upon Avernus... succeeded.
Whenever he rested, his mind subconsciously mulled over why Tzeentch desired such a thing. Why? Weaken the Imperial Trust by eliminating one of it's core worlds? It was a heretical.. Saint of the millennia-dead Emperor, somehow, that had emerged through the warp somehow. Probably something very complicated and involving countless plots.
Whatever it was, he knew that the Crusade was about the best chance of annihilating the colony, which was a most grievous danger.
This invasion, though, needed help if it was ever going to succeed. Already, from what was whispered to him, disaster beckoned for the fleet. They were, after all, too static, too bound in the plans they made to deviate from them. So much unlike those who served the Changer of Ways.
---
Incompetence? He'd have spotted that long ago.
Sheer luck? Improbable, given their many diviners.
A traitor? They'd have found them long ago..
---
Valinor's battle in the Avernus system went far worse for them than it had any right to. Cruisers, slipping through patrol nets to unleash terrible alpha strikes upon unsuspecting ships before disappearing. Escort-grades, scouting for ambushes, found themselves declaring places clear only to suffer an locally-overwhelming attack from multiple vectors.
Suffering a death by a thousand cuts, they persevered onwards, as their enemies eluded any attempt to force a decisive battle.
It was all very much like their first, probing strikes upon the Imperial Trust planets. The first attacks showed promise, and the follow-up was ruthlessly and brutally annihilated, like their foes... knew exactly what they were going to do. The hallmarks of a fight with utter informational disparity were all plainly present.
---
..or could they?
---
"It's as if they knew exactly what we were going to do." The Rear Admiral said, frustrated.
"I believe they did." Herrion replied, decisively.
"Impossible. We spoke of them only in warded rooms, guarded by Angyls." Another Admiral added.
"And they have tried, but failed to bypass them." A fourth person added.
"It is, because we have a traitor among our ranks." The Lord-General answered, conclusively.
---
Their armies and fleets were massive. It was impossible for all of them to be assuredly be loyal, even with Angyls to patrol them, witches to scour their minds for traces of disloyalty.. and other methods. In fact, they regularly caught infiltrators from elsewhere attempting to gather information from them.
In was not entirely out of the question that one of those many infiltrators had.. gotten lucky, so to speak.
Given that they were attacking a planet held in thrall by The False Saint.. was it truly so improbable, that one of his might have succeeded in finally reaching somewhere where they had access to privileged information? A clever way to evade all defences... and it was, after all, traitors serving false gods that had brought their Old Imperium down. Fitting.
But that game would end now.
---
"Their Witch, he must have gotten the plans. That's why it turned out this-" Magan spoke.
"He?"
Magan paled.
---
Fin.
- Location
- Leicester UK
I really don't want to give the Crusade a reason to say fuck it and pull all the insane aces they have as soon as they can, they may be willing to all die to kill Lin but if they don't think it's necessary they wont throw away what they don't think they have too so will hold back a bit and give us more time to wear them down in space and on the ground and give us more control over any doomsday stunts they have prepared.
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RogueInquisitor
Unexpected!
[X] Plan Subtle Ambush
- Location
- England
[X] Plan Subtle Ambush