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Green Flame Rising (Exalted vs Dresden Files)

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Degorium said:
I do understand the concern but at this point as long as we don't mess around we can slam into Sandra at just shy of Mach 1 pull her into the sky and kill her and then round up her subjects from the information we get from her corpse and her possessions. Without her there's no organization or coordinated attacks. Never mind the fact that she's still trying to kill a significant portion of the United States and throw the world in the chaos as California the 5th largest economy in the world is destroyed causing an economic death spiral not seen since the Great Depression.
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No we cant.
For one thing, we cant make that speed. For another, on a purely narrative basis, I hope you dont seriously expect that the QM is going to have our 4-man warparty composed of 2x Exalts, a Demon and a Mage face a single mortal Outsider cultist.


Let me repeat this one more time
Sandra has had more than six months of preptime. She has demonstrated mind control, and she can use veils, which means that detecting her to even try to hit her is a non-trivial affair in combat.

Any combat with her, based on what we know of her base capabilities, needs
  • IPM(mental protection): 1wp
  • All Things Betray(Perception and Initiative booster): 1m
  • Hellscry Chakra(improved perception against Creatures of Darkness): 1m
  • VLE(soak): 1m
  • Steelskin(soak): 1m
  • Melee Excellency x2: 2m
Thats bare minimum 6m to fight a boss.
I havent included Windborn Stride (1m) or if we need to pop Shintai(2m, 2wp) or have a need for other charms like our perfect defense (1-2m) or MHM(1m).

We have very little margin of error at 9/15m.Certainly not enough to be spamming Crown questions.

None of this scenario accounts for any minions or allies she has available either.
If she's doing shit like walking around with pocket Outsiders in bottles like Peabody did at the final confrontation of Turn Coat, or can do what duke Skavis did to go Outsider Inside(TM), or can pop an emergency teleport, all bets are off.
 
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uju32 said:
  • IPM(mental protection): 1wp
  • All Things Betray(Perception and Initiative booster): 1m
  • Hellscry Chakra(improved perception against Creatures of Darkness): 1m
  • VLE(soak): 1m
  • Steelskin(soak): 1m
  • Melee Excellency x2: 2m
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We don't need the vast majority of that.

Sure we could use all the boosters, but realistically VLE and one Excellency might be all we need for a near-mortal and whatever guards she has.

We go in with a party, all of which have a Sight-ability and three of the four can hit hard as well.

Topping of Essence makes things technically safer, but allows Sandra to activate her next set of plans.
 
One thing I feel necessary to say is that if Sandra's plan goes off that's it for civilization. A large portion of the world's food product comes out of this region of the United States. The fifth largest economy in the world exist in this part of the United States. Millions upon millions of people live and work in this part of the United States. The collapse and desertification of this part of the United States would spell the possible collapse of the country and the definite collapse of the world economy. If this plan gets anywhere near close to successful billions of people will die without fail. The Masquerade will fall and hundreds of millions of people will pay the price of our failure.

This may seem like fear mongering but it's really not my intent it's the truth of the matter. So I do not think it imprudent for people to want to dispatch of Sandra immediately, and I would like people who are voting to wait and wait and wait to kind of remember that if we're wrong about the timing or she manages to somehow finagle her timing a little bit billions of people get fucked. That doesn't just say immediately vote to rush this vote but it's like we do need to take action soon here.
 
Artemis1992 said:
We don't need the vast majority of that.

Sure we could use all the boosters, but realistically VLE and one Excellency might be all we need for a near-mortal and whatever guards she has.

We go in with a party, all of which have a Sight-ability and three of the four can hit hard as well.

Topping of Essence makes things technically safer, but allows Sandra to activate her next set of plans.
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Yes, we very much do.

That kind of thinking is why we spent the night trying to heal, and why we still have 1 point of Agg damage on our health track.
Near-mortals are not created equal, and someone who has been working for the highest ends of the Outsiders has access to Resources.


Dresden is not going to open his Sight in the presence of an Outsider-touched mortal.
That shit is the sort of thing that breaks minds.
And Dresden does not currently have the several years of experience that allowed him to compensate in canon.


Lash has 5 dice of Per + Awareness, and Lydia has 3. We've seen her try to look through Sandra's veil, and she only had limited success. If Vito Malvora had an Investment that was able to contest the activation of an Exalted charm when we tried to view his aura, then you can be damn sure that a deep penetration agent like Sandra has something similar, if not better.


Narratively, there is essentially zero chance that a war party of 2x Exalts, a Demon and a Mage have been chasing a solo mortal cultist around. Or that we'll corner her alone; the QM has suggested she is likely to be taking precautions to that regard.

Please, stop underestimating the woman. They dont send the B-team to try to break open a Hellgate.
 
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[X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
-[X] Search the apparent cultists for cellphones, wallets and any documents
-[X]Have Lash talk to Silk while Molly is busy
-[X] Call the Library back and update them, with emphasis on your being unable to tell if the perps were enthralled, and make it clear you are willing to make arrangements if they are
-[X]Go around the corner with Lydia and vanish into a bottle of perfume/bleach before the Feds get here
-[X]Have Lash take point on any diplomacy until Molly's anima banner fades and she can safely return
[X] STUNT: "...So no casualties we can tell." You speak into your phone as you squat over the unconscious bomber, telekinetic appendages going through his pockets and arraying the contents in in front of you with the others. "Gonna need EOD to enter and decontaminate the premises, and maybe a evacuation of the neighborhood, but noone's dead. Id like to talk to the perps before they go into custody and.." You catch a glimpse of yourself in a window, and realize with a start that you're still glowing. "Oops. A small complication."
 
Current state of the tally. Vote still open.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Feb 1, 2024 at 9:49 AM, finished with 80 posts and 18 votes.
  • [X] Ignore the cultists, track down Sandra using your available foci
    -[X] Search the cultists for anything useful, from unused grenades to cellphones, documents, etc.
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    -[X] Search the apparent cultists for cellphones, wallets and any documents
    -[X]Have Lash talk to Silk while Molly is busy
    -[X] Call the Library back and update them, with emphasis on your being unable to tell if the perps were enthralled, and make it clear you are willing to make arrangements if they are
    -[X]Go around the corner with Lydia and vanish into a bottle of perfume/bleach before the Feds get here
    -[X]Have Lash take point on any diplomacy until Molly's anima banner fades and she can safely return
    [X] STUNT: "...So no casualties we can tell." You speak into your phone as you squat over the unconscious bomber, telekinetic appendages going through his pockets and arraying the contents in in front of you with the others. "Gonna need EOD to enter and decontaminate the premises, and maybe a evacuation of the neighborhood, but noone's dead. Id like to talk to the perps before they go into custody and.." You catch a glimpse of yourself in a window, and realize with a start that you're still glowing. "Oops. A small complication."
    [X] Grab the cultists and pass them to Sanctuary as soon as you are out of sight and earshot
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    [X] Plan: Witch Hunt
    -[x] Run the pockets of the cultist for anything useful.
    -[x] Take off for the school before the authorities get here. Travel in the perfume bottle of bleach while driving to the school.
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Degorium said:
One thing I feel necessary to say is that if Sandra's plan goes off that's it for civilization. A large portion of the world's food product comes out of this region of the United States. The fifth largest economy in the world exist in this part of the United States. Millions upon millions of people live and work in this part of the United States. The collapse and desertification of this part of the United States would spell the possible collapse of the country and the definite collapse of the world economy. If this plan gets anywhere near close to successful billions of people will die without fail. The Masquerade will fall and hundreds of millions of people will pay the price of our failure.

This may seem like fear mongering but it's really not my intent it's the truth of the matter. So I do not think it imprudent for people to want to dispatch of Sandra immediately, and I would like people who are voting to wait and wait and wait to kind of remember that if we're wrong about the timing or she manages to somehow finagle her timing a little bit billions of people get fucked. That doesn't just say immediately vote to rush this vote but it's like we do need to take action soon here.
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So, and bear with me here, follow your line of reasoning to its conclusion

You are the executive head of the Outsider conspiracy. You want to break a Hellgate and blow up half a continent.
Do you send a scrub, or do you send your best? Do you give them a tight budget where you nickel and dime them, or a blank check for whatever resources they think necessary?

And when Ms Super Agent gets to the city as far back as August 2006, as documented by multiple people.Does she sit on her hands and do nothing, or does she spend that time setting up contingencies in the event of interference or pursuit by Bigger Fish?


Hell, I will remind you that she essentially baited us all to follow her last night after the RPG ambush on the Strip.
She was that confident, despite what intel she has gotten from her bosses.
We know very little about her abilities, just that she's cagey about showing them in public.

Maybe treat her with the respect and wariness that she's earned?


PS
We are not wrong about the timing.
The Crown said we had until Sunday 12am, some 30+ hours from now.
Thats a hard number.
 
uju32 said:
So, and bear with me here, follow your line of reasoning to its conclusion

You are the executive head of the Outsider conspiracy. You want to break a Hellgate and blow up half a continent.
Do you send a scrub, or do you send your best? Do you give them a tight budget where you nickel and dime them, or a blank check for whatever resources they think necessary?

And when Ms Super Agent gets to the city as far back as August 2006, as documented by multiple people.Does she sit on her hands and do nothing, or does she spend that time setting up contingencies in the event of interference or pursuit by Bigger Fish?


Hell, I will remind you that she essentially baited us all to follow her last night after the RPG ambush on the Strip.
She was that confident, despite what intel she has gotten from her bosses.
We know very little about her abilities, just that she's cagey about showing them in public.

Maybe treat her with the respect and wariness that she's earned?


PS
We are not wrong about the timing.
The Crown said we had until Sunday 12am, some 30+ hours from now.
Thats a hard number.
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One she's under a veil that we literally couldn't see through lash had to tell us she was there. So she wasn't baiting us or if she was she was overestimating us which you know ughh.

Two there is a point where weariness tips over into cowardice. At a certain point we're just going to have to accept that we're an exalt we can only be in one place at one time. So trying to catch every little loose end and every little bit of Advantage is doomed to fail. There is a timeline that she's trying to hit here that question was before the failed attack at the Xanadu. I'm not saying she can run up the time to happening in a couple of hours but there is still the obvious point where it is better to hit her before she begins rather than try and stop her in progress.
 
Degorium said:
One she's under a veil that we literally couldn't see through lash had to tell us she was there. So she wasn't baiting us or if she was she was overestimating us which you know ughh.

Two there is a point where weariness tips over into cowardice. At a certain point we're just going to have to accept that we're an exalt we can only be in one place at one time. So trying to catch every little loose end and every little bit of Advantage is doomed to fail. There is a timeline that she's trying to hit here that question was before the failed attack at the Xanadu. I'm not saying she can run up the time to happening in a couple of hours but there is still the obvious point where it is better to hit her before she begins rather than try and stop her in progress.
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She approached a party with a wizard of the White Council.
One who is infamous for his dealings with the Fae at that, who basically veil as easily as they breathe.
I dont think noticing her AFTER the attack failed was a coincidence.


Cowardice? Says who? We killed a war god/godmonster in a duel. We have zero reason to prove anything to anyone.
Our father himself is explicit that Knights of the Cross will typically try to avoid engaging Denarians at less than 3 Knights to one Denarian odds. Because its simply good sense.

Recklessness is not bravery.
Artemis1992 said:
That's a hard number based on plans at the time.

Sandra can try to change the timeline in response to our actions.
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Doubt that very much, else she would already be done.

Its a Hellgate. A major mystical site that required a major ritual sealing back in pre-history.
You cant just open them willy nilly on any day of the week. Any more than you can perform a Darkhallow on any day at random.
Those sorts of things cannot be rushed.

Especially not a Hellgate with a Sin-Eater sitting on it.

EDIT
If she could accelerate matters, her response to Molly being in town would not have been an RPG assassination, it would have been just ignoring us, speeding up the ritual and finishing it. And letting the Outsider incursion handle us.
The attack on us is prima facie evidence that its not a date that can be shifted.
 
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uju32 said:
Doubt that very much, else she would already be done.

Its a Hellgate. A major mystical site that required a major ritual sealing back in pre-history.
You cant just open them willy nilly on any day of the week. Any more than you can perform a Darkhallow on any day at random.
Those sorts of things cannot be rushed.

Especially not a Hellgate with a Sin-Eater sitting on it.
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For all we know killing the Sin Eater is enough to cause an opening, regardless of any rituals.

The only question then would be how she gets enough firepower to do so.
 
Artemis1992 said:
For all we know killing the Sin Eater is enough to cause an opening, regardless of any rituals.
The only question then would be how she gets enough firepower to do so.
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If you're not an Exalt, immortal spirits in the Dresdenverse can only be killed at Halloween.
Its January, not October.
Thats probably beyond Sandra right now. Probably.


The description in the book was that the hellgate was sealed, then the Sin-Eater was summoned to keep the seal intact.
I don't know exactly what that is. It could be an entity, or simply a point of contact with some horrible Beyond. I do know that the last time it broke through, it scarred Death Valley into the very crust of the Earth. The gate, for lack of a better term, was sealed between its world and ours sometime in pre-history, perhaps by powerful shamans in the Anasazi or their ancestors.

I only know that, whoever it was, they also summoned something to deal with the problem and keep the seal intact, a demon in every sense of the word. It demanded a high price for its service—the continual direction of corruptive power right into its black heart for eternity. There has always been one person, the demon's contact with the mortal world, responsible for making sure this happens.
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Sandra has to displace the guardian, then blow open the door as well.
 
uju32 said:
She approached a party with a wizard of the White Council.
One who is infamous for his dealings with the Fae at that, who basically veil as easily as they breathe.
I dont think noticing her AFTER the attack failed was a coincidence.


Cowardice? Says who? We killed a war god/godmonster in a duel. We have zero reason to prove anything to anyone.
Our father himself is explicit that Knights of the Cross will typically try to avoid engaging Denarians at less than 3 Knights to one Denarian odds. Because its simply good sense.

Recklessness is not bravery.

Doubt that very much, else she would already be done.

Its a Hellgate. A major mystical site that required a major ritual sealing back in pre-history.
You cant just open them willy nilly on any day of the week. Any more than you can perform a Darkhallow on any day at random.
Those sorts of things cannot be rushed.

Especially not a Hellgate with a Sin-Eater sitting on it.

EDIT
If she could accelerate matters, her response to Molly being in town would not have been an RPG assassination, it would have been just ignoring us, speeding up the ritual and finishing it. And letting the Outsider incursion handle us.
The attack on us is prima facie evidence that its not a date that can be shifted.
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I'm not getting what you're talking about being a ritual site the only thing we know about the Hellgate seal is that a black exaltation is there and so is the sin eater and from what we have been told so far the sin eater is the thing keeping it closed not any ritual or mystical site.

Another thing is the cowardice as far as the angle comes in has nothing to do with proving ourselves to anybody. When you let fear of disadvantage dictate your course of action you are falling to cowardice. Courage is to move forward in the face of fear. Cowardice is to withdraw to endlessly prolong and move away in fear. That is what I mean by there is a point where wariness becomes cowardice. I do not believe that we needed to go right now I would prefer it and I think it is a sound tactical decision but it is not necessary at this moment.

You are correct that recklessness is not bravery but there should be some kind of urgency at very least in character because we know the stakes and this is extremely fucked.

Past exploits of courage and bravery do not exempt to you from showing or falling to cowardice or being a coward even. You could be a Slayer of War gods and fail to talk to your parents in an awkward situation. These things can both be true and the person who does both these things is both courageous and a coward in those individual instances. Now coward may seem a harsh word but notice I said awkward not bad or dangerous just awkward.
 
[X] Ignore the cultists, track down Sandra using your available foci
-[X] Search the cultists for anything useful, from unused grenades to cellphones, documents, etc.
 
uju32 said:
If you're not an Exalt, immortal spirits in the Dresdenverse can only be killed at Halloween.
Its January, not October.
Thats probably beyond Sandra right now. Probably.


The description in the book was that the hellgate was sealed, then the Sin-Eater was summoned to keep the seal intact.

Sandra has to displace the guardian, then blow open the door as well.
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Wait a second she doesn't have to kill shit the seal is being held closed by the fucking sin eater if she can do a banishment ritual on it the gate flies open because it's necessary for the seal to stay closed God damn it. That's what she's trying to do. Meave mentioned the Sin eater is growing weary a successful terror attack on the main strip of Vegas cuts the flow of sin to the sin eater. Making an already tired entity hungry as well then a good banishment ritual performed after a successful terror attack means that she can immediately cause the gate to fall open because the sin eater is the thing keeping it shut then necrotic Essence pours out and desertifies the region as the Abyssal exaltation escapes.
 
Degorium said:
I'm not getting what you're talking about being a ritual site the only thing we know about the Hellgate seal is that a black exaltation is there and so is the sin eater and from what we have been told so far the sin eater is the thing keeping it closed not any ritual or mystical site.
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There is no Black Exaltation there.
I provided the original information from the DFRPG previously; I quote:
I don't know exactly what that is. It could be an entity, or simply a point of contact with some horrible Beyond. I do know that the last time it broke through, it scarred Death Valley into the very crust of the Earth. The gate, for lack of a better term, was sealed between its world and ours sometime in pre-history, perhaps by powerful shamans in the Anasazi or their ancestors.

I only know that, whoever it was, they also summoned something to deal with the problem and keep the seal intact, a demon in every sense of the word. It demanded a high price for its service—the continual direction of corruptive power right into its black heart for eternity. There has always been one person, the demon's contact with the mortal world, responsible for making sure this happens.
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Gate was sealed.
THEN the Sin-Eater was summoned to sit on and guard the seal.

Our closest current guess for the location of the Abyssal Exaltation is in the South Pacific.

Degorium said:
Another thing is the cowardice as far as the angle comes in has nothing to do with proving ourselves to anybody. When you let fear of disadvantage dictate your course of action you are falling to cowardice. Courage is to move forward in the face of fear. Cowardice is to withdraw to endlessly prolong and move away in fear. That is what I mean by there is a point where wariness becomes cowardice. I do not believe that we needed to go right now I would prefer it and I think it is a sound tactical decision but it is not necessary at this moment.
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Acting for fear of being otherwise thought a coward is in itself cowardice.

Degorium said:
You are correct that recklessness is not bravery but there should be some kind of urgency at very least in character because we know the stakes and this is extremely fucked.

Past exploits of courage and bravery do not exempt to you from showing or falling to cowardice or being a coward even. You could be a Slayer of War gods and fail to talk to your parents in an awkward situation. These things can both be true and the person who does both these things is both courageous and a coward in those individual instances. Now coward may seem a harsh word but notice I said awkward not bad or dangerous just awkward.
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We know the stakes, we have a timeline.
Haste is not speed.

Again, see above.
The day we start making decisions for fear of being thought a coward would be hard evidence of cowardice.
Deliberate action in the face of a threat of unknown dimension is not cowardice.
 
OK, it's getting late and I really do have to close this. Looks like Silk will have to handle this

That said I will include the call to the Library so she is not hung out to dry
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Feb 1, 2024 at 11:10 AM, finished with 90 posts and 18 votes.
  • [X] Ignore the cultists, track down Sandra using your available foci
    -[X] Search the cultists for anything useful, from unused grenades to cellphones, documents, etc.
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    -[X] Search the apparent cultists for cellphones, wallets and any documents
    -[X]Have Lash talk to Silk while Molly is busy
    -[X] Call the Library back and update them, with emphasis on your being unable to tell if the perps were enthralled, and make it clear you are willing to make arrangements if they are
    -[X]Go around the corner with Lydia and vanish into a bottle of perfume/bleach before the Feds get here
    -[X]Have Lash take point on any diplomacy until Molly's anima banner fades and she can safely return
    [X] STUNT: "...So no casualties we can tell." You speak into your phone as you squat over the unconscious bomber, telekinetic appendages going through his pockets and arraying the contents in in front of you with the others. "Gonna need EOD to enter and decontaminate the premises, and maybe a evacuation of the neighborhood, but noone's dead. Id like to talk to the perps before they go into custody and.." You catch a glimpse of yourself in a window, and realize with a start that you're still glowing. "Oops. A small complication."
    [X] Grab the cultists and pass them to Sanctuary as soon as you are out of sight and earshot
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    [X] Plan: Witch Hunt
    -[x] Run the pockets of the cultist for anything useful.
    -[x] Take off for the school before the authorities get here. Travel in the perfume bottle of bleach while driving to the school.
Click to expand...
 
uju32 said:
There is no Black Exaltation there.
I provided the original information from the DFRPG previously; I quote:

Gate was sealed.
THEN the Sin-Eater was summoned to sit on and guard the seal.

Our closest current guess for the location of the Abyssal Exaltation is in the South Pacific.


Acting for fear of being otherwise thought a coward is in itself cowardice.


We know the stakes, we have a timeline.
Haste is not speed.

Again, see above.
The day we start making decisions for fear of being thought a coward would be hard evidence of cowardice.
Deliberate action in the face of a threat of unknown dimension is not cowardice.
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Cowardice has nothing to do with how people think of you. I'm not recommending action because I think not to act would make her a coward. Please stop trying to represent it like that. I didn't say that your point of being wary and taking deliberate action was cowardice.

I said taking too many of those actions when we know we have a specific deadline is cowardice. There is nothing to do with proving ourselves that's like saying self-esteem arises from other people. There's a saying my dad taught me slow is smooth smooth is fast, but your insistence on going at the last possible moment reeks of fear.
 
Degorium said:
Wait a second she doesn't have to kill shit the seal is being held closed by the fucking sin eater if she can do a banishment ritual on it the gate flies open because it's necessary for the seal to stay closed God damn it. That's what she's trying to do. Meave mentioned the Sin eater is growing weary a successful terror attack on the main strip of Vegas cuts the flow of sin to the sin eater. Making an already tired entity hungry as well then a good banishment ritual performed after a successful terror attack means that she can immediately cause the gate to fall open because the sin eater is the thing keeping it shut then necrotic Essence pours out and desertifies the region as the Abyssal exaltation escapes.
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Banishing something the size of a Sin-Eater is neither easy nor quiet.
And the seal is independent from the Sin-Eater; you need to deal with the Sin-Eater, THEN the seal itself.
Neither is likely to be quick, easy or quiet.

No, that doesnt work.
The Sin-Eater has been here for thousands of years. Vegas was literally established in 1905, and didnt get big enough to be a significant source of power for decades. A terror attack aint gonna do shit.

DragonParadox said:
OK, it's getting late and I really do have to close this. Looks like Silk will have to handle this

That said I will include the call to the Library so she is not hung out to dry
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Feb 1, 2024 at 11:10 AM, finished with 90 posts and 18 votes.
  • [X] Ignore the cultists, track down Sandra using your available foci
    -[X] Search the cultists for anything useful, from unused grenades to cellphones, documents, etc.
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    -[X] Search the apparent cultists for cellphones, wallets and any documents
    -[X]Have Lash talk to Silk while Molly is busy
    -[X] Call the Library back and update them, with emphasis on your being unable to tell if the perps were enthralled, and make it clear you are willing to make arrangements if they are
    -[X]Go around the corner with Lydia and vanish into a bottle of perfume/bleach before the Feds get here
    -[X]Have Lash take point on any diplomacy until Molly's anima banner fades and she can safely return
    [X] STUNT: "...So no casualties we can tell." You speak into your phone as you squat over the unconscious bomber, telekinetic appendages going through his pockets and arraying the contents in in front of you with the others. "Gonna need EOD to enter and decontaminate the premises, and maybe a evacuation of the neighborhood, but noone's dead. Id like to talk to the perps before they go into custody and.." You catch a glimpse of yourself in a window, and realize with a start that you're still glowing. "Oops. A small complication."
    [X] Grab the cultists and pass them to Sanctuary as soon as you are out of sight and earshot
    [X] Wait for the feds and try to negotiate a solution that ends with the domestic terrorists in custody and you with your answers from a few minutes of questioning
    [X] Plan: Witch Hunt
    -[x] Run the pockets of the cultist for anything useful.
    -[x] Take off for the school before the authorities get here. Travel in the perfume bottle of bleach while driving to the school.
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You're too kind.
People keep fucking up and imposing on your generosity as a GM. Once in a while you really should let us eat the consequences of dumbass decisions.
 
uju32 said:
Hell, I will remind you that she essentially baited us all to follow her last night after the RPG ambush on the Strip.
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For the recoed that may not have been bait. She was veiled and could've thought that we'd be too distracted by grenades going off and our attackers along with the panic generated by explosions on a populated street to notice her veiled self. People just assumed so to be safe.
 
BoredMan said:
For the recoed that may not have been bait. She was veiled and could've thought that we'd be too distracted by grenades going off and our attackers along with the panic generated by explosions on a populated street to notice her veiled self. People just assumed so to be safe.
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Could, but I doubt it.
The timing was too convenient, and the best Perception + Awareness pool on our side was Lash rolling Perception 3 + Awareness 2, which doesnt even rise to mortal expert levels IIRC.

And note that she didnt come closer; she was essentially in the same spot with civilian shields all through the event.
But Lash didnt notice her when everything appeared to be calm, but suddenly did after multiple RPGs explode from the other side of the street?

I have too healthy a respect for the capabilities of a woman who essentially thumbed her nose at Michael and Harry both in their own city to not view the timing with suspicion.
 
uju32 said:
I have too healthy a respect for the capabilities of a woman who essentially thumbed her nose at Michael and Harry both in their own city to not view the timing with suspicion.
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Why would she have come closer if her goal was to see the outcome? Anyway all I'm saying is that it could've been either case.
 
uju32 said:
You're too kind.
People keep fucking up and imposing on your generosity as a GM. Once in a while you really should let us eat the consequences of dumbass decisions.
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Geez. Just because people aren't going along with your vote or don't agree with your logic doesn't mean they are making dumbass decisions.
 
BoredMan said:
Why would she have come closer if her goal was to see the outcome? Anyway all I'm saying is that it could've been either case.
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Thats my point: she didnt come closer.
Yet she was detected in a more chaotic scene than the previous one, where she went unnoticed.

My personal impression(and note, this is my opinion) is that she triggered the attack, saw it fail, then let her veil fail just enough to be plausibly detected in order to bait us to follow into a fallback ambush.
Which was why I balked at following her. No way that was going to turn out well.

BoredMan said:
Geez. Just because people aren't going along with your vote or don't agree with your logic doesn't mean they are making dumbass decisions.
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Not the first time votes I didnt agree with have passed.
No big deal there.
But this one, and critically some of the arguments for it, were basically taking the piss IMO.

My opinion, at least.
 
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